How are we saved?

[thechristian]

I believe salvation is agift from God “there is nothing you have to do to get it” except accept it thru faith. I believe scripture teaches that.

God loves you…God bless

 

[golfjack]

Catholic’s talk a lot about private interpretation, which they are against. But when their church interprets scripture, it is not private. I guess it is what they call the Magesterium that interprets scripture. What a system, Huh? To me, this is how most cults work. I just don’t understand how anyone could leave their Eternal life in the hands of a churchy group. If they go to the Bible themselves and find some answers about salvation that disagree with Catholic intrerpretation, they then are accused of private interpretation. Ralphy, do you understand this?
Peace, Golfjack

 

[ralphy]

I believe salvation is agift from God “there is nothing you have to do to get it” except accept it thru faith. I believe scripture teaches that.

God loves you…God bless

Amen to that brother. I did just that in 1977, realizing that I was a sinner and needed to be saved. I repented of my sin and turn to Christ and asked Him into my heart and save me. He came in to my heart and took away my sin and gave me a new life. I am now covered by His Blood, and ready to go home to glory to be with Him when he calls, if the rapture does not occur first. Meanwhile I will serve Him as long as I am here. PTL. Ralph

 

[davidv]

Catholic’s talk a lot about private interpretation, which they are against. But when their church interprets scripture, it is not private. I guess it is what they call the Magesterium that interprets scripture. What a system, Huh? To me, this is how most cults work. I just don’t understand how anyone could leave their Eternal life in the hands of a churchy group. If they go to the Bible themselves and find some answers about salvation that disagree with Catholic intrerpretation, they then are accused of private interpretation. Ralphy, do you understand this?

Peace, Golfjack

Where’s the charity?

 

[ralphy]

Where’s the charity?

The Roman catholic church operates through “tradition” first and will accept scripture if it fits in with their tradition. Ralph

 

[Odell]

I’m confused first you say Jesus took away your sin and are now in new life. Then you go on to say your sin is covered by his blood. The bible says his blood takes away the sin of the world not cover it. So are you covered or do you realy have a new nature what one is it

Amen to that brother. I did just that in 1977, realizing that I was a sinner and needed to be saved. I repented of my sin and turn to Christ and asked Him into my heart and save me. He came in to my heart and took away my sin and gave me a new life. I am now covered by His Blood, and ready to go home to glory to be with Him when he calls, if the rapture does not occur first. Meanwhile I will serve Him as long as I am here. PTL. Ralph

 

[davidv]

The Roman catholic church operates through “tradition” first and will accept scripture if it fits in with their tradition. Ralph

Wrong. Please learn what the Church teaches.
CCC Article 84

The apostles entrusted the “Sacred deposit” of the faith (the depositum fidei),45 contained in Sacred Scripture and Tradition, to the whole of the Church. “By adhering to [this heritage] the entire holy people, united to its pastors, remains always faithful to the teaching of the apostles, to the brotherhood, to the breaking of bread and the prayers. So, in maintaining, practicing and professing the faith that has been handed on, there should be a remarkable harmony between the bishops and the faithful.”

And 97

“Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture make up a single sacred deposit of the Word of God” (DV 10) in which, as in a mirror, the pilgrim Church contemplates God, the source of all her riches

 

[golfjack]

Does the Bible speak of a baptism other than water baptism? Let’s look at Acts 8:5, 12: 5. Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them… 12. But when they believed Philip preaching the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and woman.

Were these Samaritans saved? According to Jesus they were. He said, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned ( Mark 16:15, 16).

Therefore, these scriptures in Acts 8:5 and 12 help us to see that if you were saved, you had experienced the working of the Holy Spirit in your life, but have not actually received the infilling of the Holy Ghost. For in these scriptures, we see that the early church believed the Holy Ghost is an experience subsequent to or following salvation.

Has anyone here been filled with the Holy Spirit with the evedence of speaking in tongues?
Peace, Golfjack

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

If you figure that the catholic church is entitled to interpret scripture, then I have a license to interpret scripture, for I am part of the catholic church. I am just not part of the “Roman” catholic church, as I am sure these are the people you are refering to in the above statement. When I quote from the Bible, this is not my interpretation or anyone else’s, it is the Word of God. I also know about Roman catholicism, I have been there and done that. Ralph

Did you receive the imposition of hands through Apostolic succession? Why does scriptures tell us of imposition of hands if we are all allowed to assume an authority in the Church? Show us the scriptures of any one individual that ordains themself to be an authority.

We are all called to a royal priesthood to tell of Christ, we are not all called to ordain ourselves to make eccumenical decisions.

You say the Church cannot interpret scriptures correctly, but you can? Can you not see the arrogance in that statement? Show us the scriptures that grant any individual had infallibility with interpretation?

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Catholic’s talk a lot about private interpretation, which they are against. But when their church interprets scripture, it is not private. I guess it is what they call the Magesterium that interprets scripture. What a system, Huh? To me, this is how most cults work. I just don’t understand how anyone could leave their Eternal life in the hands of a churchy group. If they go to the Bible themselves and find some answers about salvation that disagree with Catholic intrerpretation, they then are accused of private interpretation. Ralphy, do you understand this?

Peace,   Golfjack

Oh, we should not trust the Church Christ built but trust someone 2000+ years later because they have the infallible interpretation through private interpretation? Where do scriptures tell us that YOU have the infallible private interpretation? Most cults are started by those who think they know all truth above everyone else.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Does the Bible speak of a baptism other than water baptism? Let’s look at Acts 8:5, 12: 5. Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them… 12. But when they believed Philip preaching the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and woman.

Were these Samaritans saved? According to Jesus they were. He said, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned ( Mark 16:15, 16).

Therefore, these scriptures in Acts 8:5 and 12 help us to see that if you were saved, you had experienced the working of the Holy Spirit in your life, but have not actually received the infilling of the Holy Ghost. For in these scriptures, we see that the early church believed the Holy Ghost is an experience subsequent to or following salvation.

Has anyone here been filled with the Holy Spirit with the evedence of speaking in tongues?

  Peace,   Golfjack

1Co 12:30 Are all workers of miracles? Have all the grace of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?
1Co 12:31 But be zealous for the better gifts. And I shew unto you yet a more excellent way.

1Co 13:1 If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.

1Co 14:5 And I would have you all to speak with tongues, but rather to prophesy. For greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues: unless perhaps he interpret, that the church may receive edification.

1Co 14:19 But in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that I may instruct others also: than ten thousand words in a tongue.

 

[Philthy]

I really think that you are beyond reach with the word of God, at least by me. My heart goes out to you, for once upon a time I had been where you are now . In Christian love. Ralph

Thanks for remaining objective and not being judgmental Ralph.
May God bless you and keep you…

 

[paul_c]

Catholic’s talk a lot about private interpretation, which they are against. But when their church interprets scripture, it is not private. I guess it is what they call the Magesterium that interprets scripture. What a system, Huh? To me, this is how most cults work. I just don’t understand how anyone could leave their Eternal life in the hands of a churchy group. If they go to the Bible themselves and find some answers about salvation that disagree with Catholic intrerpretation, they then are accused of private interpretation. Ralphy, do you understand this?

Peace,   Golfjack

Private interpretation is when you, as an individual decides what scripture says based on your own biases. The church has passed down its interpretations of the bible through word of mouth for 2000 years. This is done by one generation teaching the next through homilies at mass, through the catechisms and through other tools (including by the way, the scripture). If you are paying any attention at all on this forum, you have seen that the Catholic viewpoint is very, very consistent, even though the respondents here are from around the world. That is not an accident.

The people whose hands we leave ourselves in are taught at seminaries for a minimum of 6 years, learning tradition, scripture and pastoral care. This training is rigorous and requires tremendous commitment and intellect. When they complete it, our priest give up their lives, vowing poverty, celibacy and obedience to proclaiming the gospel. This produces tremendous moral authority.

So who is it that you trust your souls to? What are their credentials in comparison? What did they do to earn your trust?

If we read the bible and come to a conclusion that is different than what the church teaches, we are humble enough to consider that we are the ones who are wrong. In fact, how can any individual know more than the Catholic Church about the faith, with its 2000 year history, support of the Holy Spirit, and its literally millions of priests and theologians studying every angle of the faith. In my own personal case, I have found that any time I have a question of faith, when I study the Catholic position more closely, I find that I agree that the Church was right in its assessment.

 

[ralphy]

Wrong. Please learn what the Church teaches.
CCC Article 84
And 97

I would sooner listen to what God has to say, rather than listen to what the Roman catholic “magesterium” has to say on any subject, as that would be only their own teaching, which has no value to me. Ralph

 

[paul_c]

I would sooner listen to what God has to say, rather than listen to what the Roman catholic “magesterium” has to say on any subject, as that would be only their own teaching, which has no value to me. Ralph

How exactly is God talking to you? How do you know its God.?

 

[davidv]

I would sooner listen to what God has to say, rather than listen to what the Roman catholic “magesterium” has to say on any subject, as that would be only their own teaching, which has no value to me. Ralph

Right!

And your 100% right, 100% of the time, too?

 

[ralphy]

How exactly is God talking to you? How do you know its God.?

God speaks to me through His word, and I am directed by the Holy Spirit. Ralph

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

God speaks to me through His word, and I am directed by the Holy Spirit. Ralph

Hey Ralph,

I hear that same thing from alot of Protestants, but they do not agree on interpretations. How does someone discern which one has the correct interpretation?

 

[EdOsiecki]

Does the Bible speak of a baptism other than water baptism? Let’s look at Acts 8:5, 12: 5. Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them… 12. But when they believed Philip preaching the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and woman.

Were these Samaritans saved? According to Jesus they were. He said, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned ( Mark 16:15, 16).

Therefore, these scriptures in Acts 8:5 and 12 help us to see that if you were saved, you had experienced the working of the Holy Spirit in your life, but have not actually received the infilling of the Holy Ghost. For in these scriptures, we see that the early church believed the Holy Ghost is an experience subsequent to or following salvation.

Has anyone here been filled with the Holy Spirit with the evedence of speaking in tongues?

  Peace,   Golfjack

Hi golfjack, This is ED saying AMEN! AMEN! AMEN! “But have not actually received the infilling of the Holy Ghost” per Acts 8:14-17, AMEN! AMEN! AMEN! again. God Bless" ED

 

[tukfryer]

I did a small search on apostolic succession and came across this article in National Catholic Reporter, passing the baton ncronline.org/node/1862. The main contention I have with laying of hands, Eucharist Catholic only, baby baptism, baptism to receive HS, and other dogma is the apparent necessity of human interaction.

Please just let me make a point if you will bear with me so I can out line it.

The seventy elders Numbers 11:16
16 So the LORD said to Moses: “Gather to Me seventy men of the elders of Israel, whom you know to be the elders of the people and officers over them; bring them to the tabernacle of meeting, that they may stand there with you. 17 Then I will come down and talk with you there. I will take of the Spirit that is upon you and will put the same upon them; and they shall bear the burden of the people with you, that you may not bear it yourself alone.

So Mosses does as the LORD commands but there is an apparent problem.

24 So Moses went out and told the people the words of the LORD, and he gathered the seventy men of the elders of the people and placed them around the tabernacle. 25 Then the LORD came down in the cloud, and spoke to him, and took of the Spirit that was upon him, and placed the same upon the seventy elders; and it happened, when the Spirit rested upon them, that they prophesied, although they never did so again.**
26 But two men had remained in the camp: the name of one was Eldad, and the name of the other Medad. And the Spirit rested upon them. Now they were among those listed, but who had not gone out to the tabernacle; yet they prophesied in the camp. 27 And a young man ran and told Moses, and said, “Eldad and Medad are prophesying in the camp.”
28 So Joshua the son of Nun, Moses’ assistant, one of his choice men, answered and said, “Moses my lord, forbid them!”
29 Then Moses said to him, “Are you zealous for my sake? Oh, that all the LORD’s people were prophets and that the LORD would put His Spirit upon them!” 30 And Moses returned to the camp, he and the elders of Israel.

The text says that 70 were gathered around the tabernacle. All received the Spirit but 2 were not Eldad, and Medad, but it says they were listed. So I dont know how 70 could be at the tabernacle and 2 still be listed but not present but that’s the indication.
It makes no difference in my point that the HS and the LORD are not entirely limited to the actions and choices of men. You can see that Joshua apposed the LORDs selection, the reason can only be explained because they did not fit the prescribed recipe. Mosses accepted it and they were received. In fact Mosses desire was that all the LORD’s people were prophets and that the LORD would put His Spirit upon them! “all”
My point is that the RCC operates under the presumption that it, like Mosses did, make the selection, but errors like Joshua did and refuses to acknowledge that the LORD and Spirit are really the ones that make the choice.

We see a similar case in the NT
Mark 5:25 Now a certain woman had a flow of blood for twelve years, 26 and had suffered many things from many physicians. She had spent all that she had and was no better, but rather grew worse. 27 When she heard about Jesus, she came behind Him in the crowd and touched His garment. 28 For she said, “If only I may touch His clothes, I shall be made well.”
29 Immediately the fountain of her blood was dried up, and she felt in her body that she was healed of the affliction. 30 And Jesus, immediately knowing in Himself that power had gone out of Him, turned around in the crowd and said, “Who touched My clothes?”
31 But His disciples said to Him, “You see the multitude thronging You, and You say, ‘Who touched Me?’”
32 And He looked around to see her who had done this thing. 33 But the woman, fearing and trembling, knowing what had happened to her, came and fell down before Him and told Him the whole truth. 34 And He said to her, “Daughter, your faith has made you well. Go in peace, and be healed of your affliction.”

I can only conclude from this story that the Father, HS, and the ministry “words” of Jesus were at work in this woman.

And Jesus, immediately knowing in Himself that power had gone out of Him, turned around in the crowd and said, “Who touched My clothes? And He looked

around to see her who had done this thing.
Notice how he immediately looked. He did not prescribe this movement of the power but He knows that the Father and HS had. Then when she presents herself He did not rebuke her, He embraced her by calling her Daughter. Your faith has made you well. Jesus is not dogmatic just as Mosses was not, but rather both recognized and embraced the work of the Father and Spirit. I would encourage you to remember these stories next time you met someone that does not meet your recipe. Just as Mosses said “Are you zealous for my sake” … are you zealous for the sake of your church or are you zealous for the LORD. Both Jesus and Mosses were zealous for the LORD not themselves.
I like this verse which is also found in Numbers 11:23 And the LORD said to Moses, “Has the LORD’s arm been shortened?

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.

John 4:23 But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him.

I would say that is just what the woman with the issue of blood was doing.**