How can pro-choice Catholics seriously call themselves practicing Catholics?

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LateCatholic said:
The answer is to fix poverty and give women the resources they need to take care of their babies.
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And when the Dem party had total power…total…they did nothing at all for poor women. Oh, but they did give money to people who could afford new cars in “cash for clunkers”. Well, and they did force insurance of free abortifacients, including for the Little Sisters of the Poor, and threatened them with impossible fines if they didn’t.

The Dem party is fine with poverty, particularly poverty among illegal immigrants. After all, the corporate magnates and Hollywood stars need nannies and gardeners.
 
Your equivocation and qualification matter not.

It is MURDER in each and every instance - for whatever reason, Real or imagined.

You and your ilk cannot escape that - or accept it, apparently.

I shall pray for your soul. May others grant the same favor.
 
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LateCatholic said:
Pro-choice isn’t pro-abortion.
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Of course it is. Nobody believes that “safe, legal and rare” lie anymore. “Pro-choice” people want abortion available for themselves and for the undesirables of the earth. They even promote it in foreign countries, withholding aid if countries won’t adopt liberal abortion laws.

It’s their one true love.
 
This is absolute and pure prevarication. It can be described in no other terms.
You are being less than honest. Why?
 
prayerrider said:
I pray you learn about the Catholic faith. Not to mention fundamental biology.
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Perhaps I was not clear. My point is that if your solution is to hand out pamphlets that say “Chastity before marriage” you are not going to solve the problem of abortion.
We need REAL solutions, not wishful thinking.

Now, I DO agree we need massive sex education in our education system. That would help. But, of course, most people in this forum hate that idea too. This is what frustrates me. You say “chastity before marriage”. Fine. I agree. Let’s educate our people and children so they understand that. You say “Whoa, I didn’t say sex education in school!”. Come on.
 
LateCatholic said:
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phil19034:
The Pro Abortion crowd (Planned Parenthood execs, NARAL, etc) literally believe that MORE abortions will reduce poverty and reduce pollution.
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Pro-choice isn’t pro-abortion.
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Let’s call them anti- lifers. I like that better. 🙂
 
As long as our culture and laws (and the latter influence the former profoundly) treat abortion as just another medical procedure, sex education will only teach young people that abortion is an option for them.

If this country’s leaders got serious about saving the lives fo children, people would follow in increasing numbers. “Hearts and minds” are changed from the top down, not from the bottom up.

And frankly, our own churchmen will have much to answer for when they stand before the Throne of God one day.
 
fj2020 said:
Well, good luck trying to generate any enthusiasm for those Catholic Social Teaching points on this forum!
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Odd as it might seem, most people on this forum believe in subsidiarity, like the Social Encyclicals do. And I have little doubt they are pretty good at private charity. It’s funny. When “what do YOU do for the poor or women with babies” it’s always the prolifers who actually do, not the “safe, legal and rare” folks.
 
And decades of media propaganda to help put them in the wrong direction.
 
And it is human at conception. Obviously, since it is not a badger, or a frog, or a starling, or any other species but Homo sapiens. Human.
Therefore killing even an embryonic human is homicide.
 
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LateCatholic said:
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phil19034:
The Pro Abortion crowd (Planned Parenthood execs, NARAL, etc) literally believe that MORE abortions will reduce poverty and reduce pollution.
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Pro-choice isn’t pro-abortion.
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I was not talking about the average “pro-choice” person. I was talking about the people who love to kill babies.

The abortionists, Planned Parenthood Execs, the people who believe in infanticide, the people who want to exterminate the elderly & sick, etc.

And again, not the blind sheep who fall for this stuff, but the ones who actually kill the babies, sick, & elderly; plus those who make $millions of abortion & euthanasia.

Those people are truly pro-abortion.
 
LateCatholic said:
Perhaps I was not clear. My point is that if your solution is to hand out pamphlets that say “Chastity before marriage” you are not going to solve the problem of abortion.
We need REAL solutions, not wishful thinking.
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The solution to abortion is to not have it. You keep screaming about how us true pro-lifers have no desire to do anything other than stop abortion. How do you know this to be a fact? Have you polled large numbers of pro lifers? Do you have stats or evidence to back up your claim.

So if your daughter missed a few days of her BC pills and got pregnant, would you consider abortion for her? To keep her from ending up as a single mother living in poverty. Would that be your solution? Another save from poverty?
 
phil19034 said:
I was not talking about the average “pro-choice” person. I was talking about the people who love to kill babies.
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I made this point on another thread:
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Across The Country, Protesters Rally To Stop States' Abortion Bans World News
Didn’t Cuomo in NY sign a infanticide law? People in Colorado are putting up billboards recruiting abortion seekers. Their state is open for business. Do these laws and the real possibility of the abortion returning to a state by state issue have the ability to increase the debate about abortion. Is there some removal of the ability to hide behind “Well, there is Roe v. Wade, so it just is what it is and we’re stuck with it.” Are people starting to think “Do I really want my state to be…
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I think the possibility that abortion will return to the states will seperate the hardcore abortion supporter from those on the fence. It’s kind of easy to hide behind “Well Roe is already settled. Things will never change.”
 
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LateCatholic said:
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Benjinho:
So called “free” birth control is not free.
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Free birth control is net zero. It actually probably saves money. Cost is negligible and benefits are massive. The Catholic Church’s position on birth control in Africa has effectively destroyed the continent.
Insurance companies WANT free birth control. Let’s see - cost of treating one AIDS patient for 20 years versus one condom? Or one complex pregnancy?
The concern over free birth control has NEVER been about money.
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That is assuming child care subsidies are also obtained from government welfare, and I don’t see what health insurance companies want as something that is necessarily best for people health-wise. More importantly, I’d like to see the data that supports “free” birth control resulting in net zero or benefit.

I get the HIV comparison from a monetary perspective, but comparing an incurable disease to raising a person is pretty unsettling.

Africa has many causes for its plight, including civil war, lack of infrastructure, and lack of self-sufficiency from centuries of colonization and foreign aid. Not just high birth rates. Not all parts of Africa are in that bad of shape either.

I’d also like to hear what you’ve done for underprivileged children other than advocate for their prenatal deaths.
 
One can be pro life and pro choice at the same time.
I am a Catholic. I am pro life. I pray for an end to abortion all the time.

My friend is not Catholic. He does believe life begins at conception, but believes that life isn’t the important thing but the soul is, and that the soul does not exist until the baby’s first breath.

Our positions are strictly matters of faith. There is no objective position to be held other than theological.

This country is his country and my country and it is not a theocracy.

US law is not God’s law and that is good. Not because all theocracies end up to be the Taliban, but because they inherently rob us of our freedom to NOT choose God.

God gave us the gift of free will so not to make us slaves, but to come to love him willingly. Sadly that same gift gives us the choice to commit atrocious sins.

To FORCE people to live by God’s laws by threat of prison or harm would be to rob God.
Free will allows us to give to God the single thing that he does not already have; our love given freely.

I pray my friend finds God. I pray that he makes the PRO LIFE CHOICE should it ever come up.

Instead of working to outlaw and forcefully compel people to not commit this sin or worse to imprison those who commit this sin, I would like to see All of that energy put into the world to make it a place where people would bring children and KNOW that neither they or their child will be shunned, destitute, stigmatized, scandalized, or otherwise judged or discouraged for having a kid in less that’s perfect familial situations.

I pray for an end to abortion.

I pray that it will in every case be the worst possible option on the table for anyone ever so people cease to have a reason to choose it.
 
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