How can Protestants be forgiven for sins? (Please, any adivce appreciated)

[rcwitness]

My understanding of the way that Protestants (and I actually mean those Christians who were raised in communities separated from full Communion with the Church) is the same principle as the Catholic Teaching. And that is that when a believer sins to the point of destroying their relationship with Jesus, the Holy Spirit is urging/convicting them to confess their sins to the “body” of Christians whom they have sinned against, since all sin creates harm to the whole body.

When a Protestant, in the knowledge which he/she is convicted in, make an honest effort to witness to his/her pastor (or whoever was harmed) without keeping their sin secret, then they are acknowledging what sin is, who it harms, and why they need forgiveness from their brothers and sisters.

The essence is that God is among the brotherhood, and we don’t sin against God alone. He promised to be one with us.

I think most Protestants should know that Jesus’ commission to the Apostles to forgive sins, or they will be retained, is the basis of our Sacrament (John 20).

And another Scriptural example is found in 2 Corinthians 2

But if any one has caused pain, he has caused it not to me, but in some measure—not to put it too severely—to you all. For such a one this punishment by the majority is enough; so you should rather turn to forgive and comfort him, or he may be overwhelmed by excessive sorrow. So I beg you to reaffirm your love for him. For this is why I wrote, that I might test you and know whether you are obedient in everything. Any one whom you forgive, I also forgive. What I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, has been for your sake in the presence of Christ, to keep Satan from gaining the advantage over us; for we are not ignorant of his designs.

When Paul says "What I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, it has been for your sake in the presence of Christ", it actually translates “in the Person of Christ”. Jesus actually forgives through the Apostle, Bishop, priest.

 

[Wannano]

My understanding of the way that Protestants (and I actually mean those Christians who were raised in communities separated from full Communion with the Church) is the same principle as the Catholic Teaching. And that is that when a believer sins to the point of destroying their relationship with Jesus, the Holy Spirit is urging/convicting them to confess their sins to the “body” of Christians whom they have sinned against, since all sin creates harm to the whole body.

When a Protestant, in the knowledge which he/she is convicted in, make an honest effort to witness to his/her pastor (or whoever was harmed) without keeping their sin secret, then they are acknowledging what sin is, who it harms, and why they need forgiveness from their brothers and sisters.

The essence is that God is among the brotherhood, and we don’t sin against God alone. He promised to be one with us.

I am understanding from this that a Protestant does NOT have to join the CC in order to have his sins forgiven and attain salvation from God. Is that what you meant?

 

[rcwitness]

I am understanding from this that a Protestant does NOT have to join the CC in order to have his sins forgiven and attain salvation from God. Is that what you meant?

Yes. The Catechism acknowledges this, right? It is possible. Of course, if there is interior knowledge that the Catholic Church is divinely instituted by Christ, and has guided her in her Teachings, then that person can no longer be ignorant of the call to Communion with her. Protestantism should be a stage of Christian initiation for those raised in those communities. The goal is Communion with Jesus’ Body and Blood. There is only one loaf.

 

[Wannano]

:TE=rcwitness;14844254]Yes. The Catechism acknowledges this, right? It is possible. Of course, if there is interior knowledge that the Catholic Church is divinely instituted by Christ, and has guided her in her Teachings, then that person can no longer be ignorant of the call to Communion with her. Protestantism should be a stage of Christian initiation for those raised in those communities. The goal is Communion with Jesus’ Body and Blood. There is only one loaf.

 

[rcwitness]

:TE=rcwitness;14844254]Yes. The Catechism acknowledges this, right? It is possible. Of course, if there is interior knowledge that the Catholic Church is divinely instituted by Christ, and has guided her in her Teachings, then that person can no longer be ignorant of the call to Communion with her. Protestantism should be a stage of Christian initiation for those raised in those communities. The goal is Communion with Jesus’ Body and Blood. There is only one loaf.

My point, is that it’s not necessarily a yes or no answer. Yes, a non-Catholic can be forgiven mortal death of sins. But it depends on Christ’s judgment of their heart, and whether or not they know that God instituted forgiveness through Bishops and the priests under their care. If they follow the essence of that principle, which is acknowledging their harmful sin to the body, and confess to brothers and sisters in their community (not attempting to conceal their sin), then that is accomplishing what the law is intended for, even though their is an imperfect application.

That is the way I understand the Teaching and how it may relate to non-Catholic believers in the Father.

 

[rcwitness]

Remember this principle also:

James 4
Whoever knows what is right to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.

 

[Reuben_J]

I don’t want to go off track either, however, I will quote one important verse for your consideration. Acts 4:12 Peter speaking of Jesus Christ says, “Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.”

Agreed.

And neither it is in conflict with what I said.

It is a matter of how to harness this grace efficiently. Jesus tells us how to do it in His Church. People can call Jesus but not do it as how He wants it done may not be saved, for those who call him Lord, Lord, may not be just enough. The Church is the bulwark against false teaching; it is where we get the truth in how to do it right.

 

[steve_b]

I have no idea why other threads are shut down so soon because they are off topic.

How can Protestants be forgiven for sins? Well, you have the one and only answer apparently, that is simply, they must join the Catholic Church.

This thread may as well be shut down now because it has been answered with apparently the only true answer. Anything else will be off topic!

For clarification
I was responding to the point being made by several on this thread that what was being said was, the opinion of your church as in the Roman Catholic Church.

Since the Catholic Church is the only Church Jesus established on Peter and those in perfect union with Peter, John 17:18-23] then what is being acknowledged by those , who have chosen NOT to be perfectly united to His Church, nor be guided by that Church and her teachings, then they are opposed then to THAT prayer of Our Lord, and they are also opposed to Our Lord’s statement, “those who listen to you listen to me but those who won’t listen to you won’t listen to me or the one who sent me”.

No Church document says that once someone has been educated on the truth, that it is perfectly fine to be divided from the Catholic Church for their salvation.

If you think that point is wrong, then please quote the passage…“properly referenced”

And for the record, that also addresses the point of the thread , how are Protestants forgiven for sins.

 

[rcwitness]

For clarification
I was responding to the point being made by several on this thread that what was being said was, the opinion of your church as in the Roman Catholic Church.

Since the Catholic Church is the only Church Jesus established on Peter and those in perfect union with Peter, John 17:18-23] then what is being acknowledged by those , who have chosen NOT to be perfectly united to His Church, nor be guided by that Church and her teachings, then they are opposed then to THAT prayer of Our Lord, and they are also opposed to Our Lord’s statement, “those who listen to you listen to me but those who won’t listen to you won’t listen to me or the one who sent me”.

No Church document says that once someone has been educated on the truth, that it is perfectly fine to be divided from the Catholic Church for their salvation.

If you think that point is wrong, then please quote the passage…“properly referenced”

And for the record, that also addresses the point of the thread , how are Protestants forgiven for sins.

For a matter which is very grey, you are painting a solid black picture.

 

[MichaelP3]

For a matter which is very grey, you are painting a solid black picture.

Pretty pretty black indeed. Emphasis on the “black”!

 

[rcwitness]

Pretty pretty black indeed. Emphasis on the “black”!

The are many aspects for a non-Catholic Christian to discern when confronted with Catholic Teaching. Sometimes it’s terrible examples of Catholics, sometimes mixed messages from leaders, sometimes an improper understanding, etc.

 

[MichaelP3]

The are many aspects for a non-Catholic Christian to discern when confronted with Catholic Teaching. Sometimes it’s terrible examples of Catholics, sometimes mixed messages from leaders, sometimes an improper understanding, etc.

True. Very true. But when you are on a Catholic Answers forum with loads of Catholics you would expect some corrections.

 

[Wannano]

For clarification
I was responding to the point being made by several on this thread that what was being said was, the opinion of your church as in the Roman Catholic Church.

Since the Catholic Church is the only Church Jesus established on Peter and those in perfect union with Peter, John 17:18-23] then what is being acknowledged by those , who have chosen NOT to be perfectly united to His Church, nor be guided by that Church and her teachings, then they are opposed then to THAT prayer of Our Lord, and they are also opposed to Our Lord’s statement, “those who listen to you listen to me but those who won’t listen to you won’t listen to me or the one who sent me”.

No Church document says that once someone has been educated on the truth, that it is perfectly fine to be divided from the Catholic Church for their salvation.

If you think that point is wrong, then please quote the passage…“properly referenced”

And for the record, that also addresses the point of the thread , how are Protestants forgiven for sins.

John 17:18-23 doesn’t even mention Peter or the church. Your method of reasoning is so akin to that of a Jehovah’s Witness. Take a verse out of context and maliciously apply it in false accusations against people who interpret Scripture differently than yourself. You are actually bearing false witness against your neighbor.

 

[rcwitness]

John 17:18-23 doesn’t even mention Peter or the church. Your method of reasoning is so akin to that of a Jehovah’s Witness.Take a verse out of context and maliciously apply it in false accusations against people

I can understand being offended. That is a very harsh, cut and dry accusation.

who interpret Scripture differently than yourself.

There should not be “various interpretations” of valid Communion at all, however. And that is the heart of the matter. The Church should be able to settle matters of the faith. Catholicism has a means to do so, and in the Church worldwide.

You are actually bearing false witness against your neighbor.

That’s assuming he is wrong. Which I don’t think it’s that black and white. I think he is wrong to portray it so black and white. And I’ll go with MichaelP3 and say BLACK!

 

[MichaelP3]

Seeing that this thread has already gone off topic I would like to ask a question?

It has been stated here numerous times and very “according” to the Catechism", I agree. That “When you know Jesus established the Catholic Church and so forth and still reject it… you cannot be saved”. Well what does “know” in this instance mean? Knowing the kettle in front of you is boiling the water or just apparently reading that (as Catholics would state Mat 18.16) or saying it is the teaching. That is not knowing in any sense unless you were actually there. That is faith. And faith is a very special thing. So please don’t confuse knowing with faith. You believe in the Catholic or whatever teachings. If you say you know it well good for you. Somewhere you are taking something by faith.

Well anyway. All Protestants are pretty good on that teaching. Because actually KNOWING " That Jesus created the Catholic Church as THE CHURCH" and rejecting it well that would not make sense for anyone. It is a question of faith.

So can that poster please stop that. It is irrelevant!

 

[Wannano]

I can understand being offended. That is a very harsh, cut and dry accusation.

There should not be “various interpretations” of valid Communion at all, however. And that is the heart of the matter. The Church should be able to settle matters of the faith. Catholicism has a means to do so, and in the Church worldwide.
That’s assuming he is wrong. Which I don’t think it’s that black and white. I think he is wrong to portray it so black and white. And I’ll go with MichaelP3 and say BLACK!

It is a harsh, cut and dry accusation in response to a harsh, cut and dried accusation that people are OPPOSED to the prayer of Jesus found in those mentioned verses. I have often heard sermons encompassing these verses and never once heard any opposition to them. His accusation is false and I think these kinds of statements are serious.

 

[Peebo]

True. Very true. But when you are on a Catholic Answers forum with loads of Catholics you would expect some corrections.

There is a poster on this thread…Don Ruggero who has answered this topic…I believe he is a priest…and possibly an academic as well…maybe you would probably do well to read what he has to say and not rely on other posters…

 

[MichaelP3]

There is a poster on this thread…Don Ruggero who has answered this topic…I believe he is a priest…and possibly an academic as well…maybe you would probably do well to read what he has to say and not rely on other posters…

Very good observation.

But this is still a Catholic forum with so many self proclaimed "apologists “. Funny they never care to " bud in”. (this is the non-Catholic forum section. Isn’t it where Catholic teaching is supposed to be explained CORRECTLY " by Catholics ?)

Btw. If you read all you would realise I have responded to this priest and have much appreciation for his views. if this is your feeling Peebo then correct these statements without waiting for the Clergy! Thats my whole point. It doesn’t help to say it is but only one person… 100s read these without batting an eye.

 

[ajcstr]

But this is still a Catholic forum with so many self proclaimed "apologists “. Funny they never care to " bud in”. (this is the non-Catholic forum. Isn’t it where Catholic teaching is supposed to be explained CORRECTLY " by Catholics ?)

Most of us do our best. I for one pretty much always preface my remarks with “I believe” or “As I understand it”. Some of the questions here get pretty deep and are not always straightforward. This thread is a perfect example. I know how a Catholic can be forgiven for sins, beyond that I’m speculating.

 

[rcwitness]

Most of us do our best. I for one pretty much always preface my remarks with “I believe” or “As I understand it”. Some of the questions here get pretty deep and are not always straightforward. This thread is a perfect example. I know how a Catholic can be forgiven for sins, beyond that I’m speculating.

Very true. It’s not fair to demand an answer to what will happen if we don’t do what the Church Teaches. Especially when that person grew up, learned about Jesus, and was Baptized in a different Church.