How could Satan choose evil?

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I posted a similar thread… Lucifer chose not to obey God despite knowing all of the consequences of his choices (though He had the beatific vision and He knows God).
While we humans, have choices but do not have the full capacity to know the consequences of all our choices…we change and learn as we journey as we live in this temporal life. Lucifer living in the life eternal doesn’t need to learn anymore, he knows what he’s doing but out of his will to be like god he separated himself from him.
 
Yeah, philosophy forum was probably better. Many bright folks over there.

Have you heard of one highly favored piece of speculation by theologians concerning the fall of Satan? Namely, that God showed all the angels, of whom Lucifer was their chief, that in the plan of salvation a mere limited human would be the king, God’s own son. Lucifer in his pride could not accept to worship God as human, despite it being God’s will, and irrevocably chose his way instead. He was cast down, or perhaps more accurately cast himself down.

Of course, if we accept this, we could take your question to the next step - what exactly instilled in Lucifer a sense of pride? Is that something angels are naturally prone to? I suspect we are getting beyond our limits of comprehension here. However, like with most philosophical questions, we must ask ourselves does it even matter what the answer is? If we indulge this idle curiosity/speculation too much, it can lead us astray of the real meaty lesson - to love God, reject Satan, and beware of pride.
 
“Rabbi Simeon then rose and spoke: In meditating, I have perceived that when God was about to create man, then above and below all creatures commenced to tremble.”
-Scholem, Gershom, Ed. (1995). Zohar: The Book of Splendor. Schocken Books: New York.
 
1.Strange how often on these forums a question about good things, like “Why don’t angels speak to us?” is met with answers like, “Well, they’re so far above and beyond us that we can’t really comprehend them.” Yet, when we talk about the fall of Satan, we hear “Well, it’s because they are so filled with pettiness and pride like we are.” Which is it?

1b. Is pride a good or a privation? The problem of arguing that an angelic intellect would “choose” or “will” a privation brings up some weird issues.

2.Still not seeing an answer to why Satan was tempted to his pride when he lived in the presence of God as we are all hoping toward. Is the beatific vision amazing and purifying or not?

3.How can we claim to know any of this stuff? 1/3 of the angels fell with Satan? Says who? Where? How did they learn that? He fell because of x or y? He did not want to serve Christ? Was there a burning bush moment where that stuff was spelled out to someone? I just don’t remember ever learning those things.
 
Neoplatonist said:
1.Strange how often on these forums a question about good things, like “Why don’t angels speak to us?” is met with answers like, “Well, they’re so far above and beyond us that we can’t really comprehend them.” Yet, when we talk about the fall of Satan, we hear “Well, it’s because they are so filled with pettiness and pride like we are.” Which is it?

1b. Is pride a good or a privation? The problem of arguing that an angelic intellect would “choose” or “will” a privation brings up some weird issues.

2.Still not seeing an answer to why Satan was tempted to his pride when he lived in the presence of God as we are all hoping toward. Is the beatific vision amazing and purifying or not?

3.How can we claim to know any of this stuff? 1/3 of the angels fell with Satan? Says who? Where? How did they learn that? He fell because of x or y? He did not want to serve Christ? Was there a burning bush moment where that stuff was spelled out to someone? I just don’t remember ever learning those things.
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Thanks for elaborating on my question, it was clarifying. 🙂

In some ways though, the more I think of it, this is somewhat beyond our understanding. Their choice to rebel against God is tied to their test, which we know nothing about. What do you think?
 
Bahman said:
No, he was the best because he acquired it.
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He did not acquire the light he had; it was given to him from the beginning. But, then he and the angels had a test (will you serve?) and that is when they made their free will decision.
 
Dorothy said:
He did not acquire the light he had; it was given to him from the beginning. But, then he and the angels had a test (will you serve?) and that is when they made their free will decision.
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How do you know these things?
 
How could any of us choose evil if we understood things correctly? I pray for universal salvation.
 
Neoplatonist said:
1.Strange how often on these forums a question about good things, like “Why don’t angels speak to us?” is met with answers like, “Well, they’re so far above and beyond us that we can’t really comprehend them.” Yet, when we talk about the fall of Satan, we hear “Well, it’s because they are so filled with pettiness and pride like we are.” Which is it?

1b. Is pride a good or a privation? The problem of arguing that an angelic intellect would “choose” or “will” a privation brings up some weird issues.

2.Still not seeing an answer to why Satan was tempted to his pride when he lived in the presence of God as we are all hoping toward. Is the beatific vision amazing and purifying or not?

3.How can we claim to know any of this stuff? 1/3 of the angels fell with Satan? Says who? Where? How did they learn that? He fell because of x or y? He did not want to serve Christ? Was there a burning bush moment where that stuff was spelled out to someone? I just don’t remember ever learning those things.
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Revelation 12:4 speaks of 1/3 of the angels fell with Satan (formerly Lucifer which means “Light”).

St. Thomas Acquinas is considered the “angelic doctor”.

Here is a site that explains much…
.
jesus-passion.com/angels.htm
 
Dorothy said:
Revelation 12:4 speaks of 1/3 of the angels fell with Satan (formerly Lucifer which means “Light”).
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Are you suggesting that the Catholic position is to read the book of Revelation as literally true?
 
Neoplatonist said:
Are you suggesting that the Catholic position is to read the book of Revelation as literally true?
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No.

I am far from an expert on the Book of Revelation. It contains many symbols.

I do believe there are clues in there that the Doctors and Fathers of the Church have expanded on.
 
Bahman said:
By you I mean you and that site in general. How do you know? Was it revealed in revelation?
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There are clues in Sacred Scripture, and there are the theological insights of St. Thomas Acquinas who is also a Doctor of the Church due to the writings he contributed.
 
oldcelt said:
I think that was very concise.
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He’s saying that he doesn’t believe that Satan exists and that mythological creatures are said to behave in all sorts of irrational ways. My answer is that Satan could choose evil because he wasn’t as smart as we often imagine him to be.
 
Dorothy said:
There are clues in Sacred Scripture, and there are the theological insights of St. Thomas Acquinas who is also a Doctor of the Church due to the writings he contributed.
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Insight!? People make myth which could be very different from reality.
 
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