How could the universe and life come into existence without God? How could life evolve without God?

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Freddy said:
One might ask if you have nothing to hide then why are you hiding it?
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Fred, do you have any actual evidence for your rabbit in the rocks argument? If not, please stop just blowing smoke on this thread.
 
o_mlly said:
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Freddy:
One might ask if you have nothing to hide then why are you hiding it?
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Fred, do you have any actual evidence for your rabbit in the rocks argument? If not, please stop just blowing smoke on this thread.
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Why are you asking for evidence about something which you think is impossible? Would seem to be something of a fool’s errand asking for proof that something that lived a few millions years ago if you believe that planet is but a few thousand years old.

Again, I must express incredulity that you hold to a position to which you won’t admit.
 
po18guy said:
The chance of it being chance are so small that basically only an unreasoning mind would obstinately stick to “chance” opinions.
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If the probability is larger than zero, it means it could happen. Especially over very long periods of time.
 
Freddy said:
Why are you asking for evidence about something which you think is impossible? Would seem to be something of a fool’s errand asking for proof that something that lived a few millions years ago if you believe that planet is but a few thousand years old.
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You might have been good at dodge ball but not so much in this forum.

Anything is possible until proven otherwise. And, Rossum is not looking for proof, just actual evidence so he can elevate your dreamworld to something akin to science.

So, do you have any actual evidence to support your rabbit bones in the rocks fantasy?
 
o_mlly said:
So, do you have any actual evidence to support your rabbit bones in the rocks fantasy?
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As I said to Noose, one reaches a point where further responses are a waste of everyone’s time. Please use yours productively.
 
Freddy said:
As I said to Noose, one reaches a point where further responses are a waste of everyone’s time. Please use yours productively.
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Fred, just have to call you out when you post your opinion as fact. I’ll always be there for you.
 
Eric_Hyom said:
try and leave God and religion out of this thread.
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It is impossible to discuss the universe and existence without including God into the conversation. The fact that the universe is comprehensible through the logical language of mathematics is basic proof that the cause of the universe is an Eternal Rational Source. As for religion, every culture since the dawn of humanity has reasoned a creators simply because reason demands it.
 
Gab123 said:
It is impossible to discuss the universe and existence without including God into the conversation.
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I agree with you a 100%. But there is a fair percentage of the world population that would disagree with us. And it is to those that I am asking; what is the strength of your belief founded on?
 
Some estimates of “one in a billion billion” are over-estimates. The one isn’t real. The true estimate is “impossible”.
 
Freddy said:
Would seem to be something of a fool’s errand asking for proof that something that lived a few millions years ago if you believe that planet is but a few thousand years old.
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If you can’t get that nano-diversion off your noodle,
how can you ever convert?

_
 
rossum said:
Your questioning is wrong. With a large population, that same mutation will appear more than once; “if at first you don’t succeed…”
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Evolution is not goal driven, it does not have to succeed at anything. A light sensitive patch in both the predator and the prey should be sufficient. There are no laws in evolution that the eyes in both the predator and the prey; have to advance at about the same rate. There are no goals that the eyes have to evolve 1829 times in both the predator and the prey.

If the predators eye’s were at a stage when they are ten percent more efficient than the prey. Their population would grow at a faster rate than the prey. Then both populations would become extinct.

All this would have to happen for millions of species, evolving separately to each other.

How can this happen without guidance.
 
Eric_Hyom said:
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rossum:
Your questioning is wrong. With a large population, that same mutation will appear more than once; “if at first you don’t succeed…”
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Evolution is not goal driven, it does not have to succeed at anything. A light sensitive patch in both the predator and the prey should be sufficient.
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This indicates a misunderstanding of the process. Evolution doesn’t stop when something is ‘sufficient’.

If, by chance, an organism is born with a very slight adavantage over it’s peers (a slightly better light sensitive patch perhaps) then it will tend to outlive it’s peers and have an increased opportunity to pass on it’s ‘better’ genes. Rinse and repeat and you have a larger and larger group with better light sensing ability. If they then manage to avoid being eaten by a specifc predator and that predator relies on them to survive, then the predator will become extinct.

If one of the predators, by chance, develops a faster method of locomotion, then that might counteract the ability of the prey with the better light sensing ability to avoid being eaten and we’re back to stasis.

Rinse and repeat and we get an arms race. Which will continue until we return to stasis or one species wins out.

There’s no concept of sufficiency in evolution.
 
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Eric_Hyom said:
If the predators eye’s were at a stage when they are ten percent more efficient than the prey. Their population would grow at a faster rate than the prey. Then both populations would become extinct.
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A fox’s eyes are a lot better than a mole’s eyes, yet both foxes and moles continue to exist. A fox can eat many things other than moles. Moles do not use their eyes to avoid foxes, they stay out of sight underground. Ecological relationships are a lot more complex than your simple example. See Predator-Prey Interaction for some examples.
How can this happen without guidance.
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Species sharing a geographical area form part of each other’s environment. Evolution, through natural selection, adjusts species to better fit their environment. That includes adjusting predator or prey to account for changes in the prey or predator. For an example, see Cane toads make snakes adapt to survive.
 
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