How do Catholics feel about whether countries should ban Niqab/Burka (full face covering) or not?

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Where I live, in the USA, we have a local ordinance that adults cannot wear masks when they are out and about in public. There are exceptions for parades, comic cons, and public hosted holiday events, but we cannot wear them while driving, shopping or jogging, etc
 
It’s exceptional for me to put on a scarf over my face when it’s cold? You do realize that in some parts of USA it’s very cold for several months a year? Please use some common sense.
 
Did you ban them just because, or were they banned for security/safety reasons?
 
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I was actually going to mention those laws, and you beat me to it! Those were the ones originally passed to fight the KKK, right? And then more recently the police enforced those same laws against Antifa.
 
They were created for safety and security concerns. I’ve heard lots of reasons cited including that they impede vision and can lead to driving accidents and pedestrians being hit by cars. Also to discourage robberies and attacks and so people can be identified on security cameras.

Often theifs will not mask up until right before the crime, but could be identified by being caught on security cameras beforehand in the neighborhood etc
 
Banning face covering entirely is a ham-handed approach and it’s disturbing that so many countries (not just in Europe, but in Africa, South America and Asia) are willing to cavalierly infringe on religious liberty in nationwide bans. Other, less intrusive means of checking or ensuring identity — or preventing vision impairment — in certain situations for public safety can be used. On the other hand, someone (woman or man, it doesn’t matter) who believes that they must cover their face in public should not necessarily get to veto public policy for regulations or services that require identification at all times, such as teaching in schools, providing medical services or law enforcement officers.
 
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Seriously I’m still trying to figure out the healthiness of our own cultures mindset. I’ am still struggling to grasp what was going through the mindset of the 60s and 70s, let alone today where all I can describe it like is as if we have turned our countries into giant frat houses.

And if one cannot tell a person from their voice, you don’t really know them anyway.
 
OKComputer said:
I’m worried about it. If they ban the burka, then why not ban a nun wearing a habit?
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The purpose of the ban is to keep people from hiding their faces. Nuns don’t hide their faces.

(Edit: Note that I said “people”. It might be that not everybody wearing a niqab is a woman. Men have been known to escape capture by dressing as women.)

D
 
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Note
Some of these photos are historic, some are re-creations. Not entirely clear which ones are which.
In 1561 St. Theresa of Avila wrote a letter were she outlined the rules for the convents she intended to start. Among other things,she was very explicit about the use of face veils among her nuns: “There will be no more than fifteen nuns in it, who will practice very strict enclosure, never going out or allowing themselves to be seen without veils covering their faces.”
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snarflemike said:
Just adding to the discussion, it could be that many women who feel compelled to wear the burka would be happy to have it banned. If you look at pictures of women from Muslim countries from the 60s, 70s and 80s, they were not wearing it in nearly the same numbers. And in ISIS areas, when ISIS was driven out, many women immediately removed their burkas and even burned them.
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I’m not sure about this…

In Philadelphia, I see a lot of women wearing them now and when I hear them talk, it’s obvious they grew up here. And the vast majority of them are NOT Middle Eastern, they are African American.

When I see Middle Easterners, they usually have the scarf, but the full burka with face covering I usually see is with African American women.

🤷‍♂️
 
I don’t think it should be banned If someone wants to wear it. However they should expect in certain circumstances they may have to remove it, example being through a security check gate at an airport (they could be pulled aside by a female officer in a office if necessary) or by law enforcement for id purposes. It should also not be forced upon women like in some countries.

In my country, the United States, we have the freedom to express our religious beliefs/practices as long as we are not harming another person. Once you start banning these, what’s next?
 
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0Scarlett_nidiyilii said:
OTOH, there was an incident where a child was taken from a day care center by a woman in full burka who wasn’t the child’s mother. I forget all the details, but I believe Mom also wore a burka, so the providers didn’t question it.
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Might be a good idea to, when picking up children from a school or daycare, for the teacher or whomever is in charge to be able to id the parent, so she probably in that situation be required to remove her head covering.
 
Niqab was in the title.
In my ethnic background there is also some Muslims.
I am living in Australia though,and what I mean by “division” here for example in Sydney in Lakemba there is a heavily Muslim area and some women do wear niqab.
It’s not proper division or fighting like for example has happened in France,but still it does create a society where people don’t mix much with each other and only predominantly associate with those of the same religion and mindset.

I don’t mean so much division as in fighting,but more as in extreme culture clash.

I mean isn’t that why there were issues in France places like Sevran- because the culture of Algerian immigrants etc was so different to the “very liberal” French culture?

Whether it’s “taboo” to talk about it or not,i think it does have social implications.
By social implications I mean if a woman just decides that for herself but still respects others lifestyle choices then that’s fine but in some cases it can cause the woman or her husband to think other women who are dressed by “Australia standards” are easy or sloots etc or they can have disparaging opinions on Australian background people (which I’m not by the way but in my background there are Christians and Muslims but the Muslims dress either same as others or are moderate and wear just hijab).

Do I feel as safe as a woman in Lakemba as in Bondi?
If I be honest then not really.
 
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I don’t know what the Catholic way to view this is or even if there is a Catholic way; but I personally am opposed to banning the full covering, because my view is that religious freedom trumps all else and there is no direct threat. I mean if a terrorist wanted to disguise themselves, they might do so in a number of ways besides wearing a burka. The covering is a religious custom (maybe a requirement for very religious Muslim women), and I therefore do not feel it should be tampered with by government.
 
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I know what you mean like who should decide at what point what clothing is extreme and what isn’t.
At the same time,can someone make a healthy informed choice for themselves if these things aren’t discussed openly and from a variety of perspectives?

Then again,I think sometimes when countries ban something it could also be counterproductive-ie:when people are told they can’t do something then more people (women) would want to do/wear it more as form of rebellion/protest?
 
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