How do I choose a Church?

[justinthemartyr]

They only read 3 different passages each Sunday.

This is not true.

The Old Testament, the psalms and two readings from the NT including the gospel are read, which all correlate with each other. This ensures that scripture is read in it’s fullest context when covering each set of scriptures every day, 7 days a week 365 days a year at mass. If you were to go to Mass everyday, you would have covered pretty much all of scripture in 1 year. If you would go to mass every Sunday, you would have covered the entire Bible, for the most part, in 3 yrs.

This is far more coverage and 20% more scripture on average than 98% of protestant churches out there cover in 1 or three years periods.

 

[AlegreFe]

They only read 3 different passages each Sunday.

:nope: We read 4 passages from scripture on Sundays.

1. 
   *]Old Testament
   *]Psalm
   *]New Testament Epistle
   *]Gospel
   
   We also have the whole bible in the Mass. All of the Mass is based on Scripture. Heaven comes alive at Mass. The book of Revelation is about the Mass. There are also other scripture passages that are about what we do at Mass.

 

[AlegreFe]

…If you were to go to Mass everyday, you would have covered pretty much all of scripture in 1 year. If you would go to mass every Sunday, you would have covered the entire Bible, for the most part, in 3 yrs.

This is far more coverage and 20% more scripture on average than 98% of protestant churches out there cover in 1 or three years periods.

It’s two years not one. If we go to Mass every single day of the year we would have heard most of scripture in two years. If we only go to Mass on Sundays we would hear most of scripture in 3 years.

 

[emeraldisle]

The dictionary definition of “confess” has within it the method of confessing via a priest. You cannot eliminate that definition just because you want to. I have demonstrated over and over that the dictionary definition of confessing via a priest is equally valid for the quote you gave.

The following is the merriam-webster online dictionary definition of “confess” re sin;

2 a: to acknowledge (sin) to God or to a priest b:

merriam-webster.com/dictionary/confess

This dictionary definition clearly makes the distinction between confessing sin to God and confessing sin to a priest.

Now, one more time, just to be clear: You cannot eliminate the idea of going to a priest from the definition of “confess” in the verse you quoted. The definition of “confess” that includes going to a priest is 100% compatible with the verse. Going by the verse alone, anyone can choose that definition because absolutely nothing in the verse bans that definition.

Ok, who is the priest that you say David refers to in the fifth verse of Psalm 32? Remember Nathan is a prophet not a priest and he was sent by God to go to David to confront him about his sin.

5 So David’s anger was greatly aroused against the man, and he said to Nathan, “As the LORD lives, the man who has done this shall surely die! 6 And he shall restore fourfold for the lamb, because he did this thing and because he had no pity.” 7 **Then Nathan said to David, “You are the man! ** 2 Samuel 12:5-6

You said the following, “The definition of “confess” that includes going to a priest is 100% compatible with the verse”. However I have clearly shown you that your definition of confessing sin to a priest is not compatible with the verse.

I hope you will now see that David confessed his sin directly to the LORD and the LORD forgave him his sin.

I acknowledged my sin to You, and my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,” and You forgave the iniquity of my sin. Psalm 32:5

.

 

[jmcrae]

I hope you will now see that David confessed his sin directly to the LORD and the LORD forgave him his sin.

I acknowledged my sin to You, and my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,” and You forgave the iniquity of my sin. Psalm 32:5

.

David was under the Old Covenant and died at least 1,000 years before Jesus was born, so even if the tearing of the Tabernacle curtain was to signify that people no longer have to confess their sins to holy men, as under the Old Covenant, David could not have been affected by it.

 

[Steven_John]

Jesus did not “do away with” the OT ways. He came to make them perfect. We have to keep in mind the OT for us to understand the NT. If we throw away the OT then we are throwing away our Jewish roots. We need them to stay alive. If we cut off our roots we could stand a chance of dying without our roots. They are our foundation on which we build our faith.
.

Thanks be to Allah some offer truth, may you be blessed

 

[Kay_Cee]

The following is the merriam-webster online dictionary definition of “confess” re sin;

2 a: to acknowledge (sin) to God or to a priest b:

merriam-webster.com/dictionary/confess

This dictionary definition clearly makes the distinction between confessing sin to God and confessing sin to a priest.

Ok, who is the priest that you say David refers to in the fifth verse of Psalm 32? Remember Nathan is a prophet not a priest and he was sent by God to go to David to confront him about his sin.

5 So David’s anger was greatly aroused against the man, and he said to Nathan, “As the LORD lives, the man who has done this shall surely die! 6 And he shall restore fourfold for the lamb, because he did this thing and because he had no pity.” 7 **Then Nathan said to David, “You are the man! **2 Samuel 12:5-6

You said the following, “The definition of “confess” that includes going to a priest is 100% compatible with the verse”. However I have clearly shown you that your definition of confessing sin to a priest is not compatible with the verse.

I hope you will now see that David confessed his sin directly to the LORD and the LORD forgave him his sin.

I acknowledged my sin to You, and my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,” and You forgave the iniquity of my sin. Psalm 32:5

.

Okay, you still don’t get it.

The word “confess” *already has within it *the idea of going to a priest. If I say, “I confessed my sins to God” *that doesn’t tell which method I used, whether I went directly to God or through a priest. *

In other words, ***the text does not have to specifically mention a priest in order for that to be the method used because the idea of a priest is already present in the definition of the word “confess.” ***If you don’t understand something as basic as the fact that words have connotations, well, I don’t know what to say.

If the verse you quoted definitely eliminated the part of the definition of “confess” that allows one to confess to God via a priest, you would have a case. But it would have to say something like, “I confessed my transgression *directly *to God” or “I confessed my transgressions to God without benefit of a priest.” Otherwise you cannot arbitrarily eliminate that part of the definition.

Am I not free to interpret the Bible as I feel guided by the Holy Spirit? And since the definition of “confess” already has within it the idea of confessing to God via a priest, aren’t I allowed to use that definition? Who are you to tell me I can only use *your *definition of “confess”?

And if you want to continue to argue this, don’t bother arguing with me. Go argue with your dictionary because that’s what you’re disagreeing with.

 

[emeraldisle]

The word “confess” *already has within it *the idea of going to a priest.

The word “confess” in the context of the Catholic religion means going to a priest to confess sin. However the word “confess” in the context of the fifth verse in Psalm 32 does not mean going to a priest. Was Nathan a priest, no; did David go to Nathan, no. I challenge you to show me how the word “confess” in the context of Psalm 32:5 can be interpreted to mean “going to a priest to confess sin”.

Also you stated the following in post #396;

The definition of “confess” that includes going to a priest is 100% compatible with the verse.

So again I challenge you to show me how the word “confess” in the context of Psalm 32:5 can be interpreted to mean “going to a priest to confess sin”.

I acknowledged my sin to You, and my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,” and You forgave the iniquity of my sin. Psalm 32:5

.

 

[Kay_Cee]

The word “confess” in the context of the Catholic religion means going to a priest to confess sin. However the word “confess” in the context of the fifth verse in Psalm 32 does not mean going to a priest. Was Nathan a priest, no; did David go to Nathan, no. I challenge you to show me how the word “confess” in the context of Psalm 32:5 can be interpreted to mean “going to a priest to confess sin”.

No, I’m saying there are two possible interpretations, given that the definition of “confess” allows for two. The verse you quoted does not give enough information to eliminate either interpretation, so you cannot insist only yours is right.

Besides, I’m not interpreting “confess” here in the context of the Catholic religion, since Catholicism didn’t exist at the time David wrote. But, because there were priests in the Jewish faith, you cannot eliminate the idea that he went to a priest.

So again I challenge you to show me how the word “confess” in the context of Psalm 32:5 can be interpreted to mean “going to a priest to confess sin”.

I acknowledged my sin to You, and my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,” and You forgave the iniquity of my sin. Psalm 32:5

.

I have already done that by quoting the dictionary. Do you think the dictionary definition of “confess” doesn’t apply to what David said?

The fact is, you cannot know for certain David meant he confessed directly to God unless you can tell me what was going through his mind at the time. Can you demonstrate for me what he was thinking?

Let’s change the sentence a bit, and I’ll show you what I mean. Let’s suppose a guy named Sam said, “I confessed my sins to Father Bob.”

Now which of the following interpretations of what Sam said tells us exactly what he means?

1. Sam means he confessed his sins to God through Father Bob.
2. Sam means he had committed some sins against Father Bob personally, and he went to him and owned up to them. He confessed to Father Bob only, not to God.

Can’t tell, can you? And the reason you can’t is because ***there’s not enough information in the sentence to tell you which interpretation is correct. ***

And that’s what I’m telling you; ***there’s not enough information in the verse to tell you which interpretation is correct ***which is why you cannot insist that only your one interpretation is correct.

And if you can’t understand something that simple at this point, I’m done arguing with you. Like I said, go argue with your dictionary because that’s what disagrees with you.

 

[emeraldisle]

I have already done that by quoting the dictionary. Do you think the dictionary definition of “confess” doesn’t apply to what David said?

So the dictionary definition of the word “confess” is your evidence for saying that the word “confess” in Psalm 32:5 means David confessed his sin to a priest.

The fact is, you cannot know for certain David meant he confessed directly to God unless you can tell me what was going through his mind at the time. Can you demonstrate for me what he was thinking?

Yes I can because God has revealed it to us in His written word.

I acknowledged my sin to You, and my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,” and You forgave the iniquity of my sin. Psalm 32:5

Let’s change the sentence a bit, and I’ll show you what I mean. Let’s suppose a guy named Sam said, “I confessed my sins to Father Bob.” Now which of the following interpretations of what Sam said tells us exactly what he means?

1. Sam means he confessed his sins to God through Father Bob.
2. Sam means he had committed some sins against Father Bob personally, and he went to him and owned up to them. He confessed to Father Bob only, not to God.

Can’t tell, can you? And the reason you can’t is because ***there’s not enough information in the sentence to tell you which interpretation is correct. ***

In your illustration there is only one sentence however in Psalm 32 there is more than one sentence. If you take the time to read and study all the sentences in Psalm 32 you will understand that the word “confess” in the context of Psalm 32 means David confessed his sin to the LORD. Also while you are doing this Bible study please read 2 Samuel 12 to see the context of the sin mentioned in Psalm 32:5, i.e. who confronted David about his sin.

.

 

[Primrose]

You should start coming to Mass.

Um - so, if you are required to approach with a pure heart, do they provide you with some means of cleansing and purifying your heart beforehand - such as going to Confession, or something?

They say to pray to God, so confess to God. But with me finding the ‘Real Presence’ truth, (I read John 6 in NIV, the Message and NKJV all scream Real Presence to me), I find it too flipant for them to say it doesn’t matter about tradition and doctrine. If that’s the case why do we have rules and God points out that we need them…don’t we!!!

 

[Kay_Cee]

So the dictionary definition of the word “confess” is your evidence for saying that the word “confess” in Psalm 32:5 means David confessed his sin to a priest.

That is not what I said!!! Why don’t you pay attention to what I’m saying?

I said there are two possible interpretations, and going by the verse ***alone ***you cannot tell which of the two it is.

I have said that over and over and over and over and over.

Yes I can because God has revealed it to us in His written word.

I acknowledged my sin to You, and my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,” and You forgave the iniquity of my sin. Psalm 32:5

So now you’re a mind reader? If I said David’s exact words in that quote, could you tell if I meant I confessed to God directly or indirectly?

In your illustration there is only one sentence however in Psalm 32 there is more than one sentence. If you take the time to read and study all the sentences in Psalm 32 you will understand that the word “confess” in the context of Psalm 32 means David confessed his sin to the LORD. Also while you are doing this Bible study please read 2 Samuel 12 to see the context of the sin mentioned in Psalm 32:5, i.e. who confronted David about his sin.

.

There is only one sentence to go by in your verse–which is my point! You can’t tell from the one sentence alone! That’s what I’ve been saying all along!

And I told you I was not going to argue context–you can do that with jmcrae.

I’m through discussing this with you. There’s no point in having a discussion with someone who doesn’t pay attention to what I say.

 

[Kay_Cee]

I hope emeraldisle gets it this time. But who knows. Perhaps emeraldisle’s pride is getting in the way of “getting it.” Or perhaps emeraldisle gets it but does not want to admit that we are right. I would never use that passage to prove that confession should be through a priest after you confess to God.

It’s a good thing that the passage used by emeraldisle is not the only passage in the bible. We Catholics read the bible as a whole and we do not rely on only one passage to prove a belief that we have.

Thanks for trying. I don’t know why he (she?) can’t get something this simple and elementary.

I think he may be under the mistaken notion that if he admits our interpretation is possible, that means his is incorrect. I never said that. I only said two interpretations are possible.

 

[jmcrae]

So the dictionary definition of the word “confess” is your evidence for saying that the word “confess” in Psalm 32:5 means David confessed his sin to a priest.

Well, that, and the fact that David was a Jew under the Covenant of Moses; not a non-denominational fundamentalist Christian.

Yes I can because God has revealed it to us in His written word.

I acknowledged my sin to You, and my iniquity I have not hidden. I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,” and You forgave the iniquity of my sin. Psalm 32:5

This particular Psalm is David’s written word; God wrote the Ten Commandments, but Moses, David, Solomon, and the scribes and the prophets (some of whose names are not even known to us) wrote the rest of the Old Testament.

 

[jmcrae]

They say to pray to God, so confess to God. But with me finding the ‘Real Presence’ truth, (I read John 6 in NIV, the Message and NKJV all scream Real Presence to me), I find it too flipant for them to say it doesn’t matter about tradition and doctrine. If that’s the case why do we have rules and God points out that we need them…don’t we!!!

Welcome to the most exciting journey you will ever take.

Keep reading your Bible, start talking to a priest, and find out how you can come into full holy communion with the Church.

 

[emeraldisle]

I said there are two possible interpretations, and going by the verse ***alone ***you cannot tell which of the two it is.

I have already explained to you that when you look at Davids statement in the context of Psalm 32 and 2 Samuel 12 you will understand that he didn’t confess his sin to a priest but he confessed his sin to the LORD.

So now you’re a mind reader? If I said David’s exact words in that quote, could you tell if I meant I confessed to God directly or indirectly?

Don’t need to be a mind reader, just interpret Davids statement in the context of Psalm 32 & 2 Samuel 12.

There is only one sentence to go by in your verse–which is my point! You can’t tell from the one sentence alone! That’s what I’ve been saying all along!

And I’ve been telling you that Davids statement is set in the context of Psalm 32:5, which is in the context of Psalm 32.

And I told you I was not going to argue context

And this is why you don’t understand what Davids statement means.

.

 

[emeraldisle]

Well, that, and the fact that David was a Jew under the Covenant of Moses; not a non-denominational fundamentalist Christian.

Are you suggesting that David didn’t have a personal relationship with God and that he couldn’t pray directly to God?

This particular Psalm is David’s written word; God wrote the Ten Commandments, but Moses, David, Solomon, and the scribes and the prophets (some of whose names are not even known to us) wrote the rest of the Old Testament.

Are you suggesting that David wasn’t inspired by God?

.

 

[jmcrae]

Are you suggesting that David didn’t have a personal relationship with God and that he couldn’t pray directly to God?

Of course he did, just like any Catholic today has. His personal relationship with God included his Covenant with God, which in his case was the Covenant of Moses.

Are you suggesting that David wasn’t inspired by God?

Of course he was - but God wasn’t using David as a human pen. David was writing in his own words about an event that actually happened in his own life.

 

[emeraldisle]

Of course he did, just like any Catholic today has. His personal relationship with God included his Covenant with God, which in his case was the Covenant of Moses.

So you agree that David was able to pray directly to God and he was able to confess his sins directly to God.

David was writing in his own words about an event that actually happened in his own life.

Make your mind up, was David inspired by God to write what he wrote or did he just write his own thoughts without Gods inspiration.

.

 

[jmcrae]

So you agree that David was able to pray directly to God and he was able to confess his sins directly to God.

David followed the customs of the Jews under the Covenant of Moses in these matters.

Make your mind up, was David inspired by God to write what he wrote or did he just write his own thoughts without Gods inspiration.

He was inspired by God to write his Psalms, just as poets and painters are inspired by sunsets and other beautiful things. God’s was the beauty that inspired David’s human writing.

David was not God’s human pen, though. David wrote what he wanted to write. God has never actually written anything down, except for the Ten Commandments. Everything else in the Bible was written by human beings, including David.

1400 years later, the Catholic Church found that David’s writings do not contradict the Holy Tradition, and included them in what we today call “The Holy Bible.”