How much did Adam and Eve know about God?

[truetofaith]

The Book of Genesis can never be taken literal. I can’t even get past chapter 1 to realize that someone cut and paste two different creation stories together. That also means the stories came from two different traditions (Two different authors).

You & others call Genesis a “myth”…

Why didn’t the authors ( inspired by God ) tell it like it really happened?

Why not tell it like you did, about farming & hunting etc. Why would God have a fairy tale at the beginning of His Book?

That would be enough reason to leave the Catholic Church or even Christianity or Judaism!

 

[NM505StKate]

Of course; that was a consequence of the fall. As stated above, Adam & Eve were created in a state far superior to ours and probably had infused knowledge. After the fall their intellects were darkened, and over time many of their progeny distanced themselves further from God; consequently people began to fashion idols in the image of animals, etc. This was a punishment. St. Paul makes this quite clear in his letter to the Romans, ch. 1.

As to the authorship of Genesis, we may admit several authors and sources, provided that we acknowledge Moses as the principal human author and, as it were, the editor (see the response of the Pontifical Biblical Commission from 1906).

Do you have proof of your claim that Adam and Eve were created in a “state far superior to yours”? My bringing up that the ancient Hebrews were polytheistic was to point out that the stories in Genesis may be influenced by these roots. The “We” that is stated in the opening chapters of Genesis may be attributed to the different gods at the time. Baal being one example.

Besides thanks to the advancement of modern science and biology we can determine roughly where the human species came from. Mostly from Africa, heck didn’t we just find a new fossil that is a transitional species. Genesis is a lovely showing of how an ancient group of people believed their world to have came into being and how they came into being.

 

[truetofaith]

Do you have proof of your claim that Adam and Eve were created in a “state far superior to yours”? My bringing up that the ancient Hebrews were polytheistic was to point out that the stories in Genesis may be influenced by these roots. The “We” that is stated in the opening chapters of Genesis may be attributed to the different gods at the time. Baal being one example.

Besides thanks to the advancement of modern science and biology we can determine roughly where the human species came from. Mostly from Africa, heck didn’t we just find a new fossil that is a transitional species. Genesis is a lovely showing of how an ancient group of people believed their world to have came into being and how they came into being.

The “We” refers to the Blessed Trinity!

 

[NM505StKate]

The “We” refers to the Blessed Trinity!

Umm that may have been ret coned in. Again we have archeological proof that the ancient Hebrews/Jewish people were polytheistic, The Old Testament is about the Hebrew/Jewish people so it makes sense, to me at least, that they would be the ones to say what the “we” means. I am just taking an educated guess due to the evidence presented in archeology and anthropology.

 

[truetofaith]

I wish the Apologist would answer these questions …& give the True teaching of the Church.

We are all just speculating!

 

[iohannes13]

Umm that may have been ret coned in. Again we have archeological proof that the ancient Hebrews/Jewish people were polytheistic, The Old Testament is about the Hebrew/Jewish people so it makes sense, to me at least, that they would be the ones to say what the “we” means. I am just taking an educated guess due to the evidence presented in archeology and anthropology.

That the “WE” is retconned is correct. For those that believe that God said “WE” referring to the Trinity. Then you are saying that God revealed the Trinity before Jesus did. And that goes against the Church’s teaching. The Church teaches that the knowledge of God was revealed over time with Jesus being the FINAL revelation. And part of what Jesus revealed was the Trinity. Before Jesus, no one had a clue about the Trinity.

And dude, I am an apologist.

 

[iohannes13]

You & others call Genesis a “myth”…

Why didn’t the authors ( inspired by God ) tell it like it really happened?

Why not tell it like you did, about farming & hunting etc. Why would God have a fairy tale at the beginning of His Book?

That would be enough reason to leave the Catholic Church or even Christianity or Judaism!

In my example, the authors told it like it happened, but in a very pretty way. That is the point of “myth.” It is supposed to teach you about and make sense about life using images and words that will make people connect to the message. Describing the past as a paradise tells you, yes YOU much more (because you associate many things with paradise) then if they simply said, “man life use to be much easier.”

I use to have a book by John Paul II. Man I wish I still had it, and I don’t remember the name. In that book, the Pope wrote that Genesis is a myth.

 

[iohannes13]

Why didn’t the authors ( inspired by God ) tell it like it really happened?

Do you know how “Inspiration” from God works? It’s not a thing where the clouds and sky open up and you hear Him speaking. It’s not Him speaking in your head telling you what to write. It’s not an Angel appearing telling you what God is saying to write. “Inspiration” from God is the same boring inspiration how we all experience it when we use our imagination. It’s not different then the inspiration that musicians, writers, etc. experience. The Authors of Genesis where just following LIFE!!! You see, people first live the event. Then they talk about it (Oral traditions passed down). Then someone finally writes it down before it is forgotten. The Genesis Authors did not experience any Supernatural event or action when they wrote the myths. All they experienced was the desire to write down the stories that had been passed down for possibly generations before the stories were lost. That’s all. Nothing more, nothing less.

A good example of this is one of the Gospels. The author admits this exact same thing. He was inspired to write down the stories he was hearing. God did not tell him to write the Gospel or what to write in it. He wrote down the stories that were handed down.

 

[iohannes13]

Why not tell it like you did, about farming & hunting etc. Why would God have a fairy tale at the beginning of His Book?
QUOTE]

Remember, the point of a myth is for the story to teach you about something in your life. The authors wanted to let you know they had some message for you to learn with that story. The history lesson was not the important thing in their message. Each one of us can learn something different in their story. What do you get out of the that story? My family always used it to prepare me that I needed to find a job when I grew up. Did it matter that the development of farming made life hard. No. That doesn’t matter in my life. What mattered was that I needed to find a job as an adult. That the story says that God created the world in six days…so what. That has no impact on my life. But knowing that I’m here and need to eat, yeah, I guess I need to work even though all I want to do is play.

 

[iohannes13]

Umm that may have been ret coned in. Again we have archeological proof that the ancient Hebrews/Jewish people were polytheistic, The Old Testament is about the Hebrew/Jewish people so it makes sense, to me at least, that they would be the ones to say what the “we” means. I am just taking an educated guess due to the evidence presented in archeology and anthropology.

I think many Hebrews/Jews, like Catholics do, tend to retconn and don’t admit to the polytheism so interpret the “WE” to mean something else based on what they know today.

 

[iohannes13]

As to the authorship of Genesis, we may admit several authors and sources, provided that we acknowledge Moses as the principal human author and, as it were, the editor (see the response of the Pontifical Biblical Commission from 1906).

Archaeology has proven that Moses could not have been the human author or editor of the Old Testament (Genesis). It’s been proven that the Hebrew alphabet did not exist at the time that Moses supposedly lived in Egypt. The Hebrew alphabet begins to show up much later in the Archaeological record. The evidence also shows that the Hebrew alphabet evolved over time. The final version used to write Genesis did not come into existence up until sometime just before or just after the Hebrews were captive in Babylon.

That article dated 1906 that you are relying on is grossly outdated when it comes to everything that has happened since then. Men have walked on the moon you know.

 

[iohannes13]

Why not tell it like you did, about farming & hunting etc. Why would God have a fairy tale at the beginning of His Book?QUOTE]

Oh…by the way, I almost forgot. I think that it is universally accepted that the Book of Job is a “fairytale.” The events nor Job existed. I guess God can write in whatever genre he wants to?

 

[truetofaith]

That the “WE” is retconned is correct. For those that believe that God said “WE” referring to the Trinity. Then you are saying that God revealed the Trinity before Jesus did. And that goes against the Church’s teaching. The Church teaches that the knowledge of God was revealed over time with Jesus being the FINAL revelation. And part of what Jesus revealed was the Trinity. Before Jesus, no one had a clue about the Trinity.

And dude, I am an apologist.

Well Mr. apologist-dude…maybe God wasn’t revealing the Trinity and upstaging Jesus…God only stated a fact …“let Us make man in Our image & likeness” and in so doing, gave a hint about the Trinity which would be completed by Jesus.

 

[truetofaith]

truetofaith;13287870:

Why not tell it like you did, about farming & hunting etc. Why would God have a fairy tale at the beginning of His Book?QUOTE]

Oh…by the way, I almost forgot. I think that it is universally accepted that the Book of Job is a “fairytale.” The events nor Job existed. I guess God can write in whatever genre he wants to?

Wow & you’re an apologist…to me you sound like an atheist!

 

[truetofaith]

The two Book of Genesis authors wanted to teach something about life I imagine. The creation story can fit nicely as a metaphor for growing up. The garden is childhood - carefree, no worries, all you do is play. A paradise. The expulsion from the garden is adulthood - hard times, worry, etc. and you can never return to being a child (re enter the garden). Heck Adam and Eve then had to work to make a living after they were kicked out of the garden. The moral of the story is that you need to get a job when you grow up!!

What happened to sin ? God said Adam & Eve were thrown out of the Garden because they sinned.

 

[iohannes13]

iohannes13;13288941:

Wow & you’re an apologist…to me you sound like an atheist!

The Book of Job is a parable no different than the parables Jesus use to say. We’re the people in His parables real? Nope. The parables are a device to teach a lesson.

Genesis is allegorical/metaphorical. It’s not a history book. It’s not a science book. It’s trying to teach you some lessons too.

 

[truetofaith]

Do you know how “Inspiration” from God works? It’s not a thing where the clouds and sky open up and you hear Him speaking. It’s not Him speaking in your head telling you what to write. It’s not an Angel appearing telling you what God is saying to write. “Inspiration” from God is the same boring inspiration how we all experience it when we use our imagination. It’s not different then the inspiration that musicians, writers, etc. experience. The Authors of Genesis where just following LIFE!!! You see, people first live the event. Then they talk about it (Oral traditions passed down). Then someone finally writes it down before it is forgotten. The Genesis Authors did not experience any Supernatural event or action when they wrote the myths. All they experienced was the desire to write down the stories that had been passed down for possibly generations before the stories were lost. That’s all. Nothing more, nothing less.

A good example of this is one of the Gospels. The author admits this exact same thing. He was inspired to write down the stories he was hearing. God did not tell him to write the Gospel or what to write in it. He wrote down the stories that were handed down.

I learned all about God inspiring the Bible authors in Catholic grammar school. When they were writing the Bible, God made sure there was no error in what they wrote.

 

[iohannes13]

Well Mr. apologist-dude…maybe God wasn’t revealing the Trinity and upstaging Jesus…God only stated a fact …“let Us make man in Our image & likeness” and in so doing, gave a hint about the Trinity which would be completed by Jesus.

Maybe you are just speculating. I just know that YHWH and EL were worshipped as two separate and distinct gods but were eventually combined into one God by the Hebrews. And they also worshipped YHWH’s wife, I can’t remember her name. So maybe they have always worshipped the “Trinity” like Catholics do?

 

[iohannes13]

I learned all about God inspiring the Bible authors in Catholic grammar school. When they were writing the Bible, God made sure there was no error in what they wrote.

How did He do that? What proof is there that He guided them? I know the answer. I just want to see what they taught you.

 

[iohannes13]

What happened to sin ? God said Adam & Eve were thrown out of the Garden because they sinned.

Tell me what sin they committed? Hint: it wasn’t eating a fruit from a tree. God would be pretty harsh to punish them with death just for that don’t you agree?