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0Scarlett_nidiyilii
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So in other words, you want to hold auditions for the lucky lucky lady who “gets” to marry you.
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Neithan
Guest
Physical health issues could be an impediment to marriage and should be brought up before marrying someone, and those are extreme examples. I hear this “sexual compatibility” thing a lot, especially with non-Catholic women (even Protestants). It’s sad how far gone our culture is. As for your response, if it’s not a health issue, but some sort of matter of taste, it’s a circular argument. Sexual compatibility arises because of past experiences, and what people like to do in bed. They bring this perverted menu of preferences into their relationships (it’s really just sexual baggage) and want to know if the other person will satisfy them. Only someone who has made a habit of fornication would be concerned about this.
So in other words, pre-marital sex creates problems for itself.
So in other words, pre-marital sex creates problems for itself.
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Le_Crouton
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Never said that at all
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Vico
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Le_Crouton
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Fornication is not the same thing as people in a relationship having premarital sex
Fornication is more like hooking up with a stranger
Fornication is more like hooking up with a stranger
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Neithan
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Fornicating is unmarried people engaging in sexual intercourse. “Hooking up” or “pre-marital sex” might be different contexts but both are fornication and grave sins.
You are focussing on rares cases.
For the marriage be valid, the couple should be in physical capacity of be able to perform the marital act.
It is up to the people concern for any problem they are aware to discuss this with a specialist. They are generally followed since a long time, so they know the facts before thinking of marriage.
It is more honest to discuss this with the suitor before any engagenment. in the contrary the validity of marriage can be compromized.
in the first case you quoted, the male is not impotent. (for the most cases, i pressume). So he can marry.
For the second case, it might depend, each situation is different. And not every is conscious of all before trying.
For the marriage be valid, the couple should be in physical capacity of be able to perform the marital act.
It is up to the people concern for any problem they are aware to discuss this with a specialist. They are generally followed since a long time, so they know the facts before thinking of marriage.
It is more honest to discuss this with the suitor before any engagenment. in the contrary the validity of marriage can be compromized.
in the first case you quoted, the male is not impotent. (for the most cases, i pressume). So he can marry.
For the second case, it might depend, each situation is different. And not every is conscious of all before trying.
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Thorolfr
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I agree with this. I think it’s silly to pretend that what people want and expect in their relationship when it comes to sex is totally unimportant. If one spouse has a low sex drive and would be happy having sex once a month while the other would like to have sex every day, I can see how that would cause a big problem after a while.Le_Crouton:
Well, you can discuss it, openly and honestly. It’s not a crazy concern. If a couple discerning marriage has wildly differing ideas of what their sex life will be, they need to hash that out before saying “I do.”
They just don’t need to actually have sex in advance, but laying out expectations and desires is highly advisable.
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TheLittleLady
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The male sexual organs and the female sexual organs are designed by God to be compatible. These organs do not have separate personalities.
A man and a woman would determine if they are compatible as people (in matters of Faith, outlook on life, goals, dreams, how you roll the toilet paper, pets, etc.) and determine if they want to spend a life with that person.
A man and a woman would determine if they are compatible as people (in matters of Faith, outlook on life, goals, dreams, how you roll the toilet paper, pets, etc.) and determine if they want to spend a life with that person.
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TheLittleLady
Guest
It is a pretty common ideal, first came into vogue in the “sexual revolution” of the 60’70’s. Sadly, it has malformed many a conscience.
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TheLittleLady
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These are very rare medical conditions that need to be discussed with expert physicians prior to even considering marriage. The person needs to know if they are going to be able to perform the marital act.
Remember, people who are permanently incapable of the marital act are not free to marry.
Remember, people who are permanently incapable of the marital act are not free to marry.
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Thorolfr
Guest
So, it’s more important for a man and a woman contemplating marriage to talk about how they should roll the toilet paper than to talk about how often they might want to have sex?
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LawyersGunsAndMoney
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Or how they might want to have sex. If you’re in a situation where one person says “I find x act extremely appealing” and the other says “I find that particular act really unappealing”…well, that’s a problem.
They don’t need to plan everything out to the nth degree, but they should make sure they’re on basically the same page.
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fide
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A marriage based on lust with emotional pleasures is a far, far cry from a loving union of two human persons, man and woman.
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Zzyzx_Road
Guest
After many years of observation, I’ve come to realize that discussing “sexual compatibility” is not asking the right question. The most common thread through all the situations I’ve observed and read about is the degree of selfishness on the part of one or both parties. Or more relevant to Christianity, the degree to which one or both spouses were willing to die to themselves for each other was very seriously lacking.
To just discuss sexual compatibility misses the mark; not only that, it is often subject to deception. How many people said one thing to each other and showed something different after the wedding day? Watch what they do, not what they say. It is easy to say couples will find ways to compromise, it is easy for them to say it to each other, but it is actually much more difficult to discern for those who really are in that mindset. To engage in premarital sex says far too little about the capacity of either person to be married.
So the real question for me is not whether she is sexually compatible with me and do we have to try that out before buying, it is: is she willing to die to herself to be married to me? If that is really and truly her mindset, then we will find ways to make the marriage work in the bedroom as well as everywhere else. We will find ways to get past the down periods as well as be happy during the good times. If that is not her mindset, that is a recipe for a miserable marriage and almost certain divorce. I am more than ready to die for my marriage but I would rather live alone than marry someone I am uncertain of. It is not something a prospective fiance and I can just talk the talk about, it is something we have to live for and the courtship is our opportunity to show it to each other. Show, not tell. Without the premarital sex.
Now the OP wanted to know how to respond to the “sexual compatibility” argument in favor of premarital sex. As so many people are in the world, not just of it, one has to cite secular reasons as well as Catholic ones for avoiding premarital sex. I can throw a few out there for consideration: STD’s, pregnancy leading to abortion or children born out of wedlock, the likelihood of divorce anyway, the inability to bond sexually in marriage, etc. We may seek forgiveness and repentance for our sins, but we still have to live out the temporal consequences of those sins. For some, that is a big deal. Having got that out there, one may then introduce the idea of selfishness and lack of, up to the idea of dying to self for each other. The degree to how that discussion goes will tell you a lot about the other person.
To just discuss sexual compatibility misses the mark; not only that, it is often subject to deception. How many people said one thing to each other and showed something different after the wedding day? Watch what they do, not what they say. It is easy to say couples will find ways to compromise, it is easy for them to say it to each other, but it is actually much more difficult to discern for those who really are in that mindset. To engage in premarital sex says far too little about the capacity of either person to be married.
So the real question for me is not whether she is sexually compatible with me and do we have to try that out before buying, it is: is she willing to die to herself to be married to me? If that is really and truly her mindset, then we will find ways to make the marriage work in the bedroom as well as everywhere else. We will find ways to get past the down periods as well as be happy during the good times. If that is not her mindset, that is a recipe for a miserable marriage and almost certain divorce. I am more than ready to die for my marriage but I would rather live alone than marry someone I am uncertain of. It is not something a prospective fiance and I can just talk the talk about, it is something we have to live for and the courtship is our opportunity to show it to each other. Show, not tell. Without the premarital sex.
Now the OP wanted to know how to respond to the “sexual compatibility” argument in favor of premarital sex. As so many people are in the world, not just of it, one has to cite secular reasons as well as Catholic ones for avoiding premarital sex. I can throw a few out there for consideration: STD’s, pregnancy leading to abortion or children born out of wedlock, the likelihood of divorce anyway, the inability to bond sexually in marriage, etc. We may seek forgiveness and repentance for our sins, but we still have to live out the temporal consequences of those sins. For some, that is a big deal. Having got that out there, one may then introduce the idea of selfishness and lack of, up to the idea of dying to self for each other. The degree to how that discussion goes will tell you a lot about the other person.
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0Scarlett_nidiyilii
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No, but that’s what the “I have to have sex first before I marry you to see if you’re good enough in bed” argument boils down to.
An audition.
Eww.
An audition.
Eww.
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LawyersGunsAndMoney
Guest
Sure, but no one is advocating “a marriage based on lust.”
Sexual compatiably is an aspect of marital happiness, but no one is saying it’s the only thing, or even the most important thing.
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TheLittleLady
Guest
It is important to discuss many things. The frequency of sex is going to ebb and flow and change from month to month and year to year.
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TheLittleLady
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The Catechism beautifully addresses this (while “ewwww” is pretty on point!)
2391 Some today claim a “right to a trial marriage” where there is an intention of getting married later. However firm the purpose of those who engage in premature sexual relations may be, “the fact is that such liaisons can scarcely ensure mutual sincerity and fidelity in a relationship between a man and a woman, nor, especially, can they protect it from inconstancy of desires or whim.” Carnal union is morally legitimate only when a definitive community of life between a man and woman has been established. Human love does not tolerate “trial marriages.” It demands a total and definitive gift of persons to one another.
2391 Some today claim a “right to a trial marriage” where there is an intention of getting married later. However firm the purpose of those who engage in premature sexual relations may be, “the fact is that such liaisons can scarcely ensure mutual sincerity and fidelity in a relationship between a man and a woman, nor, especially, can they protect it from inconstancy of desires or whim.” Carnal union is morally legitimate only when a definitive community of life between a man and woman has been established. Human love does not tolerate “trial marriages.” It demands a total and definitive gift of persons to one another.
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Thorolfr
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Yes, it might ebb and flow, but some aspects of it aren’t determined by age or whether someone has a stressful or difficult job. Some of it is biological in that some people just don’t have much sex drive and are close to being asexual while others have a very strong sex drive. That’s just the way they are. There’s nothing wrong with someone being one way or the other, but it probably wouldn’t work out well if the two spouses are at opposite extremes in this regard. It’s certainly worth discussing sex before marriage and if one person says they’re struggling to remain chaste and are looking forward to having a lot of sex after they get married and the other person doesn’t feel the same, maybe they should reconsider whether they are right for each other.
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