How would you respond to this re: embryonic stem cell research?

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norbert:
Adult stem cells don’t have 100s of uses. They have been used for blood disorders, but there isn’t much hope that they will have use for disorders in other body systems. Embryonic stem cells we know can differentiate into any body tissue - neurons, islet cells, etc - and thus hold real hope for fixing otherwise unfixable problems like spinal cord injury. The belief that adult stem cells are equal to embryonic stem cells is a mistake.
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Stem cells found in the nasal passages are the same as embryonic.
 
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yochumjy:
So why the push for just embryonic? Why not start by exhausting and working with adult and cord blood cells?

And you say that embryos are a clump of indistinguishable cells, but they are more than that. They are a group of cells that are completely separate from the mother and completely describe a human being. They are also the only cells that will grow into what everyone admits is a human. They are not just some group of cells, they are an immature human. As the “cells” mature, they become what EVERYONE considers human. But even in their immature state they ARE human. The embryo is homo-sapien at conception and that classification never changes.
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Soon-to-be discarded frozen embryos at the IVF clinic will never grow into something that everyone considers human. They will defrost and rot in the dumpster out back, doing no one any good.
 
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norbert:
Soon-to-be discarded frozen embryos at the IVF clinic will never grow into something that everyone considers human. They will defrost and rot in the dumpster out back, doing no one any good.
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Once again, your thinking is that death is the only result possible. First of all frozen embryo’s need not be created in the first place. Those that are frozen now, can be implanted.

BTW, were you going to respond to your mis-representation of adult and cord cells?
 
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norbert:
Soon-to-be discarded frozen embryos at the IVF clinic will never grow into something that everyone considers human. They will defrost and rot in the dumpster out back, doing no one any good.
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Are you sure?
 
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norbert:
Yes, 100% sure. Rotten embryos are no help to anyone.
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Were they not frozen properly? Incidentally, the reason Bush supported research on the existing lines was because the crime had already been committed. However, no more crime should happen.
 
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gardenswithkids:
Norbert limits the choices to only killing or killing, but life is a better choice. If I had a few dozen of my own frozen embryos left over in the freezer, I would want them implanted into my womb and held in my arms when they are born.
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Unless you personally can find homes/wombs for these embryos, then the only choice is (a) the garbage can or (b) derive some stem cell lines from them, potentially helping humanity.
 
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buffalo:
Were they not frozen properly? Incidentally, the reason Bush supported research on the existing lines was because the crime had already been committed. However, no more crime should happen.
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It’s no crime to derive stem cell lines from frozen embryos. It’s just not funded by our federal government.
 
norbert said:
www.stemcellresearch.org is not an impartial site. Sorry.
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So, prove them wrong. All we have is some guy on the internet named norbert. You have 0 credentials, just like me. So, prove him wrong. I’ll be interested if you can find an impartial site.
 
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norbert:
It’s no crime to derive stem cell lines from frozen embryos. It’s just not funded by our federal government.
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It isn’t a crime yet, but since it involves taking a human life it should be.
 
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norbert:
Unless you personally can find homes/wombs for these embryos, then the only choice is (a) the garbage can or (b) derive some stem cell lines from them, potentially helping humanity.
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So, the frozen ones have to either dumped immediately, used in research immediately or found a home for immediately? Says who?
There have been frozen embryos that have been saved and implanted.
 
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yochumjy:
So, the frozen ones have to either dumped immediately, used in research immediately or found a home for immediately? Says who?
There have been frozen embryos that have been saved and implanted.
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Frozen embryos no longer needed at the IVF clinic are routinely discarded.
 
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yochumjy:
So, prove them wrong. All we have is some guy on the internet named norbert. You have 0 credentials, just like me. So, prove him wrong. I’ll be interested if you can find an impartial site.
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All I have to do is read the “coalition objectives” -
COALITION OBJECTIVES


  1. *]To advance the development of medical treatments and therapies that do not require the destruction of human life, including the human embryo.
    *]To educate and inform public policy makers and the general public regarding these ethically acceptable and medically promising areas of research and treatment.
    *]To support continuation of federal laws prohibiting the federal funding of research that requires the destruction of human life, including the human embryo.
    • to know that whatever is going to be posted on that site is not going to be in favor of embryonic stem cell research. There are plenty of legitimate sites that discuss the issue without bias, but I don’t really care enough about it to try to find them.
 
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norbert:
All I have to do is read the “coalition objectives” -
COALITION OBJECTIVES


  1. *]To advance the development of medical treatments and therapies that do not require the destruction of human life, including the human embryo.
    *]To educate and inform public policy makers and the general public regarding these ethically acceptable and medically promising areas of research and treatment.
    *]To support continuation of federal laws prohibiting the federal funding of research that requires the destruction of human life, including the human embryo.
    • to know that whatever is going to be posted on that site is not going to be in favor of embryonic stem cell research. There are plenty of legitimate sites that discuss the issue without bias, but I don’t really care enough about it to try to find them.
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  1. So, you have an unfounded opinion you don’t care to substantiate. Not only that, you completely disregard all the science that is coming out of the group because you don’t like their premise. Ahhh, an open minded individual. Why can’t they be right about adult stem cells? Because you say so? You know they have no science behind their papers because you don’t like their objectives? That doesn’t fly scientifically and you know it! You don’t discretic scientific study because you don’t “feel” their objectives line up with yours.
 
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norbert:
Frozen embryos no longer needed at the IVF clinic are routinely discarded.
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That doesn’t mean they have to be. In fact, do they try to find homes for them?
 
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yochumjy:
That doesn’t mean they have to be. In fact, do they try to find homes for them?
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Why should they try to find homes for them? That’s not their job. Why don’t you make it your job?
 
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norbert:
If I had a child sick and suffering with a disease, and I had a frozen clump of cells stored in an IVF clinic to whom I had donated a gamete, I would definitely love my real child more than the frozen clump.
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And are you trying to claim that I don’t love my “real” child? That’s bull and you know it.
 
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