https://www.quora.com/What-do-Protestants-and-Catholics-think-of-Mormons/answer/James-Hough-1

[SunshineGrandma]

He deserves a gold medal in mental gymnastics.

Thank you. I really enjoy discussing and debating religion here!

 

[ColorMomma]

So much hubris here. It seems you delight in being contrary.

 

[CaptainPrudeman]

Let’s try. If you’re willing, I’d love to start discussing this in PMs. I hope I can accurately represent Catholicism for you.

 

[Fauken]

I would suggest that the three of you must have felt the WEIGHT of his apologetic and thus you claimed it was not in the Bible and could not be true. I further suggest that if it is in the Bible, you recognize it as evidence for “eternal marriage.”

More like some of us had work the next day and needed to go bed.

That aside, I admit I blundered. It does refer to eternal life. But it does not refer to eternal marriage. @Stephen168 put it more eloquently than I could:

Husbands and wives should live together in such a way that they help each other get to heaven. There is nothing in this verse or Christian teaching that claims “marriage” continues in heaven. In fact reason would tell us that it is pointless.

There is nothing in that verse that shows marriage is eternal. How one can make that jump is beyond me, and I see no logic in it.

 

[SunshineGrandma]

Is it anyone’s job to convince us of anything?

Or is it our job to have the humility to accept the teachings of the Church established by Jesus, even if we don’t yet “get it”?

The Mormon definition of God does not coincide with the Jewish teaching about God. Isn’t Christianity the fulfillment of Judaism?
Do you also believe that Jesus and Lucifer were bros?

 

[lokisuperfan]

I wouldn’t mind that, but I don’t think it’ll do much. Like I said, I’ve been stuck on this since I was 4.

 

[CaptainPrudeman]

There’s always time to learn. I’ll PM you after mass and we can start discussing.

 

[lokisuperfan]

I delight in standing up for what I believe in, and if that happens to be contrary to popular belief, so be it.

 

[SunshineGrandma]

Your experience in Utah is so similar to mine.

The “if you’re not Mormon then you should be” permeated everything. Neighborhood walk-abouts became time for us to go to the movies, IKEA, anything to escape the not-so-veiled attempt at proselytizing.

Good for you walking out of the car dealership. I walked out of a used car dealership in Utah recently when they totally lied to me about their fees. Went to car max instead.

Every time I purchased a car, piece of furniture or scheduled the plumber, they wanted my husband to be there. Ugh.

We knew a few nice people. Other than that, we were on our own. My husband says it was like living on an island.

Congratulations on getting your degree as a single mom with three small children!! That is a wonderful accomplishment.

 

[SunshineGrandma]

Who says it popular?

When was Christianity and the teachings of the Church ever popular?

I suggest you read about early Church history- all of it. Not handpicked selections.

 

[lokisuperfan]

Is it anyone’s job to convince us of anything?

Or is it our job to have the humility to accept the teachings of the Church established by Jesus, even if we don’t yet “get it”?

I don’t know about you, but I personally don’t enjoy putting my faith in things I don’t understand.

Mormon definition of God

Are you referring to the Trinity, or their definition of God in general?

Do you also believe that Jesus and Lucifer were bros?

Yes, I do. But that they are brothers does not make them any less different, nor does it make Lucifer any less evil. Siblings can be quite different, and this is no exception.

 

[lokisuperfan]

When was Christianity and the teachings of the Church ever popular?

I’d say they’re pretty popular now. According to this, Christians make up 31.5% of the world’s population, making it the most popular religion in the world.

Top 10 Largest Religions in the World in 2023 - Largest Religions History

 

[SunshineGrandma]

Which is proof the Holy Spirit has protected His Church, as promised.

How could Christianity have grown if it all fell into apostasy?

Anyway, I was referring to the thousands upon thousands of people who have been martyred for their faith. Ever heard of Nero?

 

[SunshineGrandma]

I don’t look at religion as enjoyment. This isn’t based on emotion and warm feelings in my heart. It’s a byproduct of obedience, humility (constantly working on it!) and study.

If you have a complete understanding of the Mormon trinity, then explain it to me so I can understand it too.

-Explain how the God of the Old Testament and Judaism is different than the God of Mormonism.

-Explain how Mormonism can claim to be a Christian religion and yet, is not the fulfillment of Judaism.

-Explain how the Trinity in the Book of Mormon is different than the Trinity taught by Joseph Smith (I’ve been waiting years for an explanation!!)

-Explain how Joseph Smith came to know that God the man had sexual relations with Mary and other women (?) and had many children including Jesus and Lucifer.

-Explain how Jesus said the Holy Spirit would stay with his church until the end of time, but then it didn’t happen. Was Jesus wrong? The Holy Spirit went on vacation?

-Explain where the Holy Spirit went during the Great Apostasy

Thanks!!

 

[lokisuperfan]

I don’t look at religion as enjoyment. This isn’t based on emotion and warm feelings in my heart. It’s a byproduct of obedience, humility (constantly working on it!) and study.

I more so view religion as a safe haven from life’s problems, that whenever I need guidance or help I can look to God. I truly see God as my father and I treat him as such. Religion isn’t all warm feelings for me as much as it is just guidance on how to live my life. The beliefs don’t matter to me as much as the social guidance religion gives (as I said in an above post, I have a social disorder, so guidance is something that is much needed for me in that area, and the rules of religion helps me to better understand how I should live my life).

As for the questions, I would be happy to attempt them, but I think you should go to someone more qualified than a high school freshman before asking me.

 

[SunshineGrandma]

I’m asking you because you said you understood it and it is the reason for your wanting to be Mormon. That level of understanding is extremely rare.

I’ve already asked the missionaries and other Mormons so you’re my last hope.

I think as a freshman in high school you can give me a simple and basic explanation- which would be perfect.

Fire away!

 

[lokisuperfan]

I’ll do my best then…

-Explain how the God of the Old Testament and Judaism is different than the God of Mormonism.

They’re not different in the sense that they both believe in a benevolent God who wants the best for his creation (as opposed to the Aztecs’ gods for example, who required human sacrifice and the destruction of their creation). The main difference people think of is the LDS believe in the possibility that God could have walked the earth as a man, the same as one of us, and earned his deification through obedience and good deeds. We also sometimes refer to God as Elohim, but they’re the same person and Elohim is not separate from God, it’s just another name for him.

-Explain how Mormonism can claim to be a Christian religion and yet, is not the fulfillment of Judaism.

Well…here’s the definition of Christianity:

Chris·ti·an·i·ty

[ˌkrisCHēˈanədē]

NOUN

1. the religion based on the person and teachings of Jesus of Nazareth, or its beliefs and practices.

The LDS do believe in Jesus and follow his teachings, so they ARE Christians by the dictionary definition. Most Catholics seem to have a different opinion, but there’s not much I can do about that other than state facts.

And do you want me to explain the Trinity from the LDS perspective or just compare the BoM to Joseph Smith’s teachings?

 

[lokisuperfan]

-Explain how the Trinity in the Book of Mormon is different than the Trinity taught by Joseph Smith (I’ve been waiting years for an explanation!!)

Joseph Smith teaches the “God was an exalted man” theory, that God once walked the earth like all of us and earned his deification.

Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 345; “ God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret. If the veil were rent today, and the great God who holds this world in its orbit, and who upholds all worlds and all things by his power, was to make himself visible,—I say, if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form—like yourselves… ” – General Conference, April 1844

And the BoM teaches similarly to Catholicism that they are one in the same…

2 Nephi 31:21; “ And now, behold, this is the doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen. ”

I’m not sure why these views contradict, but the LDS church follows Joseph Smith’s teachings over the BoM. I’m not a member of the church officially, so I’m not qualified at any level to answer why that is.

 

[Stephen168]

In 1830, Joseph Smith published the Book of Mormon which contained Trinitarian language.
Book of Mormon page 25:

And he said unto me, Behold, the virgin whom thou seest, is the mother of God, after the manner of the flesh. … And the angel said unto me, behold the Lamb of God, yea, even the Eternal Father!

Clearly God and Christ are one.

In1831, the Book of Moses was written via “revelation.” In it references to God are singular.

I am the Beginning and the End, the Almighty God; by mine Only Begotten I created these things; yea, in the beginning I created the heaven, and the earth upon which thou standest.

In the 1832, version of the first vision, Joseph Smith said he was 16 and saw the Lord [Jesus Christ].

In 1834, the Mormon leadership, Joseph Smith, Oliver Cowdery, Sidney Rigdon, and Frederick G. Williams wrote Lectures on Faith which were included in the 1835 Doctrine and Covenants (Mormon scripture).
Lectures on Faith-1834:

There are two personages who constitute the great, matchless, governing and supreme power over all things—by whom all things were created and made, that are created and made, whether visible or invisible: whether in heaven, on earth, or in the earth, under the earth, or throughout the immensity of space—They are the Father and the Son: The Father being a personage of spirit, glory and power: possessing all perfection and fulness: The Son, who was in the bosom of the Father, a personage of tabernacle, made, or fashioned like unto man, … And he being the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth, and having overcome, received a fulness of the glory of the Father—possessing the same mind with the Father, which mind is the Holy Spirit, that bears record of the Father and the Son, and these three are one, or in other words, these three constitute the great, matchless, governing and supreme power over all things:

Clearly the Father is a spirit, and the Father and Son and maybe the Holy Spirit are one.

In 1834, Mormonism taught that there was one God which consisted of the Father and the Son and maybe the Holy Spirit. The authority of the Mormon Church was led by the First Presidency and there were no Mormon Apostles.

In the 1835 accounts of the first vision, Joseph Smith said he was 14 and saw two personages. It seems the break from orthodoxy is becoming more strained. Also, Joseph Smith invented the Mormon Apostles as the traveling missionary leadership under the Standing Council and First Presidency.

 

[Stephen168]

In 1835, Joseph Smith translated papyrus into the Book of Abraham. In it references to God are plural.
Book of Abraham Chapter 4:

And then the Lord said: Let us go down. And they went down at the beginning, and they, that is the Gods, organized and formed the heavens and the earth.
And the earth, after it was formed, was empty and desolate, because they had not formed anything but the earth; and darkness reigned upon the face of the deep, and the Spirit of the Gods was brooding upon the face of the waters.
And they (the Gods) said: Let there be light; and there was light.

The 1837 Book of Mormon added the phrase “the son of” as in "the Mother of the son of God,” to the Book of Mormon

In the 1838, version of the first vision, Joseph Smith said he was 15 and saw two Personages, one introduced the other as his Son (The Father and Son by implication).
It is clear that Joseph Smith no longer believed that the Father and the Son are one, but two separate Gods.

In 1843, Joseph Smith had a ‘revelation’ to say, “The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit. Were it not so, the Holy Ghost could not dwell in us.”

In 1844, Joseph Smith claimed God was once a man.

Mormonism had now apostatized against Christianity. They no longer worship one God of spirit. They worship a God of flesh and bone who was once a man, while also believing in many gods; the Son, the Holy Spirit, and individual Mormons who can become god. The Divine Nature is gone, so the words ‘begotten’ and ‘son of God’ now have a different meaning in Mormonism.

In 1844, after Joseph Smith’s death, Brigham Young used his position as the senior Apostle to take control of the Mormon Church.

In 1920, the Lectures on Faith were removed from Mormon scripture.