Hypnagogia/Sleep Paralysis

[ROBO_the_First]

Based on my personal experience, the sleep paralysis is the result of reacting with fear whenever we find ourselves in the hypnagogic (upon going to sleep) and/or hypnopompic (upon waking up) state. Hypnagogia is not necessarily an unpleasant experience. In fact, I had my most profound spiritual experience in this state.

Counterpoint…

Have you ever read up on cataplexy? What you are describing sounds eerily like cataplexy.
A sleep like state while remaining entirely conscious, INITIATED by sudden, extreme emotion (laughter, anger, dread, FEAR).

I have cataplexy…and it can be pretty severe at times. Mine is triggered by extreme laughter.
I have also experienced sleep paralysis, literally THOUSANDS of times. 75-80 percent of the time, fear nor any other emotion is involved for me. Sleep paralysis doesn’t need emotion for onset. I don’t know how many times, it’d kick in when I was reading or something…totally neutral in my emotions.

As someone who has fairly extreme forms of both, it sounds like what you are experiencing is more like cataplexy. Look into it!

 

[Counterpoint]

Counterpoint…

Have you ever read up on cataplexy? What you are describing sounds eerily like cataplexy.
A sleep like state while remaining entirely conscious, INITIATED by sudden, extreme emotion (laughter, anger, dread, FEAR).

I have cataplexy…and it can be pretty severe at times. Mine is triggered by extreme laughter.
I have also experienced sleep paralysis, literally THOUSANDS of times. 75-80 percent of the time, fear nor any other emotion is involved for me. Sleep paralysis doesn’t need emotion for onset. I don’t know how many times, it’d kick in when I was reading or something…totally neutral in my emotions.

As someone who has fairly extreme forms of both, it sounds like what you are experiencing is more like cataplexy. Look into it!

I don’t have narcolepsy and/or cataplexy.

 

[Tous_Logous]

This is a philosophy forum. So, let’s talk about these experiences rationally. Shall we?

I am an occasional sufferer of sleep paralysis, and have been since elementary school. I have experienced “waking dreams” from being stabbed into my shoulder and feeling pain, to being grabbed by a hand on my shoulder. It is a horrifying experience, but usually I am capable of calming myself even when I do not have control of my own body.

A variety of things can cause sleep paralysis: sleeping position can determine sleep paralysis. The last sleep paralysis dream I had, for example, had me lying on my back in bed. I felt like my bed sheets were trying to “choke” me. It’s also possible that I was trying to frantically move my arms and legs around while this experience occurred, giving me the impression that I was being “hugged” by my bed sheets when I really was not. It felt demonic, so I remember calling out to St. Michael the Archangel, even though my poor brain was telling me that I knew it was occurring. Overall I felt like my back was glued to the bed, and moving was extremely difficult.

It’s also likely that sleep paralysis is actually some sort of phenomenon your brain employs so that you do not physically act out on your dreams (I had a roommate who sleep walked in college); your body becomes “paralyzed” so in a sense, your body is protecting you from harming yourself or others.

I also noticed that when I am severely stressed out, I tend to have more violent dreams, especially sleep paralysis dreams. I have actually felt real pain and touch in these dreams; who knows whether it’s actual physical pain or muscle spasm that feel like pain?

So I guess the short answer is: sleep paralysis appears to be biological, caused perhaps by a variety of manmade and natural factors. It’s also possible that they can (or are) supernatural. Or perhaps, a mixture of both. In the case of the supernatural, if SP is demonic, perhaps Satan and his demons find humans easier prey when they are sleeping?

 

[Mr_Clean]

Based on my personal experience, the sleep paralysis is the result of reacting with fear whenever we find ourselves in the hypnagogic (upon going to sleep) and/or hypnopompic (upon waking up) state. Hypnagogia is not necessarily an unpleasant experience. In fact, I had my most profound spiritual experience in this state.

Care to elaborate on this profound spiritual experience?

 

[Bob_Crowley]

Have you ever experienced hypnagogia and/or sleep paralysis? I have. It’s a fairly common experience. So, I would suspect that most of you have.

What is it?

Why is this relevant? Because hypnagogia and/or sleep paralysis are directly linked with the experiences of psychic phenomena and/or the paranormal (encounters with angelic and demonic entities, ghosts, alien abductions, shadow people, out-of-body experiences, visitations from recently deceased relatives, etc.).

This is a philosophy forum. So, let’s talk about these experiences rationally. Shall we?

I had someone (maybe you) try to tell me that an experience of my father visiting me on the night he died was a hypnagogia experience. I’m a bit tired of being told I can’t discern my own experiences. It seems to me you’ve learnt an ounce of religious theory, and are now trying to pot everybody’s spiritual experiences into one panacea.

So I’m going to post the exchange in its entirety and you can turn around and tell me that it was all a hynpgogia experience. Bear in mind though it happened precisely when he died.

It’s going to take several posts to put it all in due to the limits on character counts.

FATHER’S DEATH APPARITION

It had began, precisely, on the 11th January 1979. No, that wasn’t quite true – the background to the scene was set long before that.

But on that night, he had the experience of his father appearing to him in his room. Which was a bit strange – he hadn’t seen his father for six months, and that had been when he had been driving one-way along Ann Street in the city, going from the Valley towards George Street. He had been one of the hundreds of drivers in pre-peak hour traffic, warily watching the lights and other drivers, when suddenly he saw his father walking in the opposite direction on the foot path, on his right hand side. He had resisted the impulse to wave – he couldn’t stand the man. Not what one should think about one’s father, at least not in polite society. But how do you explain vindictive, relentless, stupid cruelty to polite society?

His father didn’t see him, or he was pretty sure he didn’t. And he had looked like death warmed up – his face drawn and pale, with a sort of shadow about it, and an almost demonic cast to the sullen, angry features.

Then he’d driven past and that had been the end of it. Apart from despising him.

The last time he’d seen his father before that was another six months, and that was when the old man had kicked him out of the family home, which was shortly to go under the hammer due to his parents’ divorce.

And that had been the symbolic end of his father’s role as dedicated family man.

True, there’d been a sort of impulse to go and visit him for a few days before his father’s death. He’d resisted it, but if he had to describe it the impulse, the only thing he could have said was that it was sort of “spiritual”, a feeling that just would not go away, quite insistent at times. But hatred and bitterness had won, and he had refused. But the feeling, the persistent impulse to visit – where had it come from? That was one of the reasons he had wanted to turn himself in.

So on the night of the 11th January 1979, his father visited him instead.

He remembered the setting well. It was January, hot in Brisbane, and with the feeling of persecution he occasionally experienced, he had shut and locked all the windows and doors, except for the bathroom window. He didn’t have much choice in one sense – there were no security screens or bars, and all of them opened onto the balcony or back landing. So if they had been open, anybody could have gotten in. And with his hearing loss, he was unlikely to hear somebody unless they made a lot of noise.

The old double bed had a sag in the middle of it. He had spoken to the landlord about it, but the landlord has simply pointed out the lease said “partly furnished”. By which he meant that if Bob wanted a better bed, he could buy it himself. So far he hadn’t, and as a result he always rolled into the middle.

And it really had been hot and humid. He had to get up at 4.30am, since he started work at 6am, and he had a long way to travel. He had tossed and turned, and finally drifted into a fitful sleep, lying face down, which was how he normally started dozing.

Then at some ungodly hour, he’d felt something shaking his back. He shrugged, and tried to go back to sleep. It happened again, almost as though somebody was trying to wake him up.

So he woke up and turned over. Odd – he must have imagined it, as there was nobody there.

Then something misty began to appear in the corner of the room, near the bedroom door. It seemed to sharpen, and his father appeared.

He watched in amazement as his father approached the foot of the bed.

 

[Bob_Crowley]

Continuation

“Hello, Robert” he said. Yet Bob had the sense his father was not really looking at him, but was mainly focused on something behind him, and above his head. His father did glance at him, but then looked up again, almost enthralled.

Bob was startled. “How the hell did you get in here!” he demanded.

The question remained unanswered. “I’ve come to apologize for the way I’ve treated you” his father said. “We had no idea of what you were going through”. He looked at Bob again, then over his head.

Bob was angry. “You mean you had no idea what you were doing to me”, he replied bitterly.

At this his father appeared distraught, shook his head in fear, and held both hands over his face, as though he could not stand what he was seeing.

Then he seemed to recover, and he resumed looking above Bob’s head, as though gazing at something beautiful. Then at times he would again cover his face with his hands, and a tortured, frightened expression would come over his face.

His father looked devastated. “I’ve completely wrecked your life” he burst out. “And I did it deliberately!”

Bob broke the silence. He had been thinking about the years of intense verbal cruelty his father had lavished upon him, and the intense frustration that had resulted.

“Why!!” he demanded.

The answer was almost immediate.

“I was jealous” was the admission. “I didn’t have the same opportunities that you did. And it wasn’t easy for me either, you know. And I didn’t have the chance to see anything like this!”

“I know it wasn’t easy! Why do you think I was so patient! I knew that by the time I was twelve!”

His father looked deeply ashamed, and shocked, as though realizing for the first time just how much his son had understood, and from what an early age.

But his next reply came as a bit of a shock. “You weren’t very patient”.

Bob was taken aback. He’d thought he’d been very patient, considering just how vicious his father’s diatribes had been. He remembered the constant humiliation, the dripping sarcasm, the cruel comments that followed his every little mistake, or child’s effort to do something. Yet here was his father saying he hadn’t been patient.

Not patient? Compared to what? He’d like to know. He wondered how many other people would have put up with so much deliberate contempt for so long, without cracking.

There was another moment of silence, as father and son reflected on their situations, the son facing his father and his father facing something that could not be seen.

 

[Bob_Crowley]

Continuation No. 2

Bob turned around to see what his father was gazing at with such an enraptured expression. But all he could see was the plasterboard, behind which he knew was the brick wall at the end of the building.

He turned back to his father. “What is all this, a dream or something?”

His father looked slightly bemused. “No, it’s not a dream. I died tonight.”

Bob shook his head. “What?”

His father replied again. “I died tonight.”

There was mutual silence.

Then his father raised his hands in front of his face again as thought appalled. Whatever he was looking at seemed to relent, and the enthrallment was back again.

“I served the devil. You do too, but you’ll become a Christian.”

Bob stared at him. “I’m an atheist”.

His father looked bemused again. “You’ll become a Christian. You’re a prophet.”

Bob felt like laughing. “A prophet! You’ve gotta be kidding!”

Bob’s curiousity got the better of him. “So how’s all this supposed to start?”

His father glanced at him, briefly. “You’ll meet a pastor. You’ll think he’s great, but all he’ll do is discourage you even more!”

Now Bob was beginning to get annoyed.

Incidentally I met the pastor four years later and about nine years after than he apologised for discouraging me badly.

 

[Bob_Crowley]

Continuation No. 3

“You know what really gets to me! Because of the way you’ve treated me, I’ve now treated Mary badly”. (Not her real name) But he knew he wasn’t being fully honest – there were two particular instances of behaviour on his part that bothered him.

His father then somehow seemed to be hovering right over him, with the usual bad tempered look on his face, that had been so much a part of him for so long that he did not have a bad temper – he had literally become a bad temper.

“Don’t blame me for that!!” he almost seemed to shout. “That was your decision”.

Bob was afraid for a moment, and he knew his father was right. But it also struck him how quickly his father was on the offensive as soon as he had a particle of ground to justify his stance, as though the twenty years of cruelty he had inflicted were of no consequence. The other bit was, how did his father know what the two instances were? He had never told him about them. Oh, he’d insuated at one stage it was an option, but that was as far as it went.

Then his father disappeared, or seemed to. But as Bob recovered and sat up again, he could see him against the bookcase.

This time his father looked forlorn. “Son, you’ve got to forgive me!”

Bob rebelled. “You treated me like dirt for twenty years, and now you want forgiveness!”

“Son, it’s not for my sake. It’s for your sake. It’s too late for me. All I was expected to do was look after my family, and I didn’t even do that! If you don’t forgive me, you’ll destroy yourself!”

And then it seemed he was running out of time. “Son, you’ve got to keep away from Mary and her mother”.

Bob misheard him. He thought his father said “your mother”. He replied back, “How can I? They’re my responsibility!”

His father answered, in seeming anguish. “Oh, I meant, …she’ll use you!”

It was a long time before Bob understood his father was talking about his girlfriend’s mother, and not his own mother.

And then his father seemed to be desperate. “Son, you’ve got to believe me!” And a look of complete dejection came over his father’s face.

Bob was angry. “Why should I? You’ve spent the whole of my life …”

But he never finished. As he was talking, his father was turning to his right, Bob’s left, as though he could see something in the distance. He seemed to be taking fright, and said “No!”

Then louder “No! No!”

Then finally, he screamed and shook from head to foot and raised his arms in what appeared to be an attempt to ward something off, something hideously frightening, and cried out in sheer terror, “No…. Arrrgh!” It** was so frightening, Bob started to cry out.**
And then his father just disappeared.

And Bob was left staring at the bookcase, in the darkness, alone.

This took place 35 years ago, and I still remember it. In particular I remember the parting scream, and it was sheer, absolute terror.

I’m tired of these bunnies telling us it’s all in our minds.

 

[Mr_Clean]

Thanks for sharing that BC.

Did you?

 

[Counterpoint]

He turned back to his father. “What is all this, a dream or something?”

The fact that you had to ask this question suggests to me that you might have been in the hypnagogic state.

 

[Holly3278]

Is it possible to have partial sleep paralysis? I once woke up when I was a teenager with absolutely no sensation or control in one of my arms. After about an hour had passed I regained the use of it though.

 

[ROBO_the_First]

The fact that you had to ask this question suggests to me that you might have been in the hypnagogic state.

Bit insensitive, no? And he was waking from sleep, which would make this hypnaPOMPIC…not hypnagogic

 

[ROBO_the_First]

Is it possible to have partial sleep paralysis? I once woke up when I was a teenager with absolutely no sensation or control in one of my arms. After about an hour had passed I regained the use of it though.

Possible…I’ve had a few instances where I could seemingly barely move with all my might. I would eventually work my way off of the edge of the bed…seems like gravity does a good job of recovering a fully awake state.

 

[ROBO_the_First]

I don’t have narcolepsy and/or cataplexy.

I thought the same thing for the first 9 1/2 years Ive had it

 

[Counterpoint]

Is it possible to have partial sleep paralysis? I once woke up when I was a teenager with absolutely no sensation or control in one of my arms. After about an hour had passed I regained the use of it though.

That sounds like one of your arms simply “fell asleep.” Sleep paralysis occurs when the mind is completely awake (lucid), but the entire body is asleep (temporarily paralyzed). It takes an incredible act of will power to break away from a state of sleep paralysis. This is why most people find the experience to be unsettling. But it is even more unsettling if you happen to see “demonic” entities who are attempting to assault you while you find yourself in this state.

 

[Counterpoint]

Bit insensitive, no? And he was waking from sleep, which would make this hypnaPOMPIC…not hypnagogic

The difference between “hypnagogic” and “hypnopompipc” is not black and white. If the event occurred shortly after falling asleep during the late evening, then we would categorize it as a hypnagogic experience. But if the event occurred shortly before waking up in the early morning, then we would categorize it as a hypnopompic experience. However, if the event occurred sometime during the middle of the sleep cycle, then whether we categorize it as a hypnagogic or a hypnopompic experience is really subjective. At any rate. it was not clear to me from his story if the event occurred shortly after he had fallen asleep during the late evening or if it occurred shortly before he had awakened during the early morning. (I suspect the event occurred shortly after he had fallen asleep during the late evening and that is what lead me to characterize it as a possible hypnagogic experience.)

 

[ROBO_the_First]

Soon I will post about my own experiences, particularly. At work now (note: overnight shift + narcolepsy = unpleasant), and my brain needs a break for a little while!!

So…as promised…I’m back to share my experiences, as a narcoleptic, with all of this stuff.

First off, I should say that my narcolepsy (specifically, all the scary stuff that comes with it) has actually been a blessing for me! As you may have read in my first post in this thread, it wasn’t until just recently we discovered what it was. All of the freaky things that were happening to me greatly strengthened my relationship with Our Lord. At the time, I swore I was knew I was being attacked by demonic influences…but didn’t know why. Now knowing all Ive learned about narcolepsy(N), I still believe they are demonic in nature…its just now I know WHY I am more susceptible than most. It is my firm belief that this sort of thing is almost always, if not always supernatural (Holy OR demonic). This is actually one of THE main motivating factors in my reversion into the Church about 4 years ago. The frightening things I’ve experienced while in and out of sleep, have shown me beyond a doubt the reality and existence of demons…and the power God has over them. And if demons were real, hell was too. Meaning I could no longer stay in the same state I was in, lest I burn in hell. So it was a tremendous fear of everlasting punishment that brought be to faith. It has since blossomed out of love for Christ…but began from fear.

Again, I had no idea N played any part of this. I have fully accepted all scientific and medical explanations regarding N…feeling that it in no way discounts the spiritual ramifications in the process. I believe that something like N only makes one more sensitive to those spiritual realities/attacks.

Anyways…on to sleep paralysis. Yes, I do experience sleep paralysis. Quite often in fact. Literally hundreds, maybe thousands of ‘episodes’. Hypnagogic, mostly. Its happened in any and every position. Sitting up even. I have yet to SEE any concrete figure, although I have many times seen wavy figures resembling the appearance of shimmering water. A figure began to appear on a few occasions, when I was fully startled awake.

I have had many auditory hallucinations, where I’d hear faint music as if there were a block party going on down the street. Usually its AC-DC, or some other evil music I stopped listening to years ago. This doesn’t happen too often though.

The scariest of all the hallucinations, in my opinion, are the tactile. They are sensing physical touch. Yes I’ve felt things crawl all over me in my bed. Most notably, there’s something that feels like a 30 pound cat, walking all around my bed…crawling on me…and even sitting on me. Ive felt what feels like dozens of creatures on my bed all at once…some do nothing but jump up and down. On many occasions, theyve attempted to inflict harm. There have been occasions when they would go to my joints and I would get dull-yet piercing pain wherever they would go to. More discomfort than pain actually. When these sorts of things occur, it is usually not a good time to fall asleep. But, seeing as they are hypnagogic and I’m falling asleep to begin with, my narcoleptic self can rarely prevent it. When I fall asleep with these demons (that’s sure as hell what they seem like) give me HORRIFIC nightmares. They are ALWAYS trying to tempt me, in one way or another. I’he had SP on many occasions where I felt as if something were trying to arouse me (incubbi/succubi, whatever they are called I KNOW they exist). If I fall asleep at those moments, its like I’m immediately injected into the raunchiest XXX movie ever. In my dreams, I am able to see the offenders. They have the appearance of being fully human, but there’s just something not right. I’ve recalled noticing their skin was rough and scaly, like a lizard. Now i know one can’t be held accountable for what happens in their sleep, so I don’t think that these demons are doing this for the sake of whatever hypothetical sleeping sin they can entice me into, so much as I think they are attempting to condition my conscious self to be more drawn to that sin when awake…knowing full well they can manipulate a persons thoughts through their sub-conscious sleep. This is merely a theory of mine, but full well believe it to be true. It should also be noted that I work at a facility for troubled youth. Specifically, I keep watch of a dorm full of juvenile sex offenders (of the most severe) as they sleep. If anyone has demons attached to them at night, its these kids. I’ve walked down the hall and heard some of the strangest voices coming from these kids as they squirm in their sleep.

Part 1 of 2, to be continued…

God bless!!

 

[ROBO_the_First]

The difference between “hypnagogic” and “hypnopompipc” is not black and white. If the event occurred shortly after falling asleep during the late evening, then we would categorize it as a hypnagogic experience. But if the event occurred shortly before waking up in the early morning, then we would categorize it as a hypnopompic experience. However, if the event occurred sometime during the middle of the sleep cycle, then whether we categorize it as a hypnagogic or a hypnopompic experience is really subjective. At any rate. it was not clear to me from his story if the event occurred shortly after he had fallen asleep during the late evening or if it occurred shortly before he had awakened during the early morning. (I suspect the event occurred shortly after he had fallen asleep during the late evening and that is what lead me to characterize it as a possible hypnagogic experience.)

No disrespect, but it IS pretty black and white. As you are falling asleep-hypnagogic, waking up-hypnapompic. As far as your brain is concerned there are only two states…awake and asleep. Making transition from awake to asleep=hypnagogic…transitioning from asleep to awake hypnapompic. Don’t look at it from perspective of time of day, as we all don’t sleep at night. Also don’t look at it as being one session of lying in bed. For instance, I wake up and fall back asleep usually about twenty times while I’m in bed trying to get my sleep for the day. Its awake-asleep-awake-asleep…that’s how the brain looks at it. That’s why 99% of the time I have SP while falling asleep, and very rarely have it waking up. If the line were blurred, and my brain was confused as to which state I’m in, it’d be more 50/50. If he was jarred awake, it was hypnapompic…if he was falling asleep again, it was hypnagogic.

 

[Mr_Clean]

The fact that you had to ask this question suggests to me that you might have been in the hypnagogic state.

The fact this involved his father who tells him he died (something the son did not know yet) suggest to me it was not a hypnagogic hallucination.

 

[Counterpoint]

The fact this involved his father who tells him he died (something the son did not know yet) suggest to me it was not a hypnagogic hallucination.

I didn’t say he had a hypnagogic hallucination. I said that he was probably in the hypnagogic state.