C
cathopologist
Guest
Muslims in Malaysia certainly feel Christians have no right to use the word Allah. It seems “Allah” has been copyrighted.
- Status
P
paarsurrey
Guest
W
WarriorAngel
Guest
The name in Hebrew [the ancient language] is Yahweh.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/audiences/alpha/data/aud19870701en.html
Abba is an Aramaic word which is preserved in the Greek text of Mark’s Gospel (14:36).
“No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and any one to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.” In other words, the term Abba not only manifests the mystery of the reciprocal bond between Father and Son, but summarizes in a certain way the whole truth about God’s intimate life in the depths of the Trinity, that mutual knowledge of Father and Son which gives rise to the spiration of eternal Love.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yahweh
Various Early Christian Greek transcriptions of the Hebrew Divine Name seem to point to “Yahweh” or similar.
Evidence from very old scrolls
The discovery of the Qumran scrolls has added support to some parts of this position. These scrolls are unvocalized, showing that the position of those who claim that the vowel marks were already written by the original authors of the text is untenable. Many of these scrolls write (only) the tetragrammaton in paleo-Hebrew script, showing that the Name was treated specially. See this link.
As said above, the Aleppo and Leningrad codices do not use the holem (o) in their vocalization, but it is used in a few instances, so that the (systematic) spelling “Yehovah” is more recent than about 1000 A.D. or from a different tradition. Nevertheless, this spelling does appear in both codices.
From the article: “Most scholars acknowledge that the Tetragrammaton was probably pronounced as Yahweh.”
A shortened form of the divine name, “Yah,” appears four times in the book of Revelation in the word “Hallelujah,” which means "Praise Yah.’ Revelation 19:1, 3, 4, 6.
Basically, the Catholic Church [the single only Church in existence since Christ built it] never used the term Allah. Jesus never introduced the use of Allah, and only Abba.
So even ‘IF’ the Aramaic used the term Allah, Christ never did.
Its not written as such in the Bible.
Either the use of Yahweh or Abba. [Or Adonai which means Lord]
P
paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
1.I think you don’t have anything written down or dictated from Jesus.
2.Catholic Arabic NTBible uses the word Allah frequently. You may ask any Arabic speaking Catholic in this connection.
3.Jews have no objection that YHWH and Allah are the same in attributes.
4.Syro Nasrani Christians of Kerala India have no objection that YHWH and Allah are the same.
It is the attributes which matter much not the name.
May GodAllahYHWH bless you!
I love Jesus
Thanks
S
swariffin
Guest
The teaching of Jesus was written down by the gospel writers. John even admit that such teaching was so much that if all of those teachings must be written down, the world is not enough to keep all of those writings.
P
paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
Well that is John’s and other writers usual exaggeration. Jesus himself never claimend it.
Yes, the anonymous writers did wrote the same till they were named in their names perhaps without their permission for creditibilty reasons, in my opinion.
I would have believed them if Jesus would have written them or dictated them; but he obviously could not do that as he was there in India, didn’t know what is being written and attributed to him in his absence.
One could differ with me; no compulsion.
I love Jesus
Thanks
S
swariffin
Guest
You never answer my question. Where in the Quran said Jesus live in India. Quran even said that Jesus was NEVER BEEN crucified. You said that Jesus WAS CRUCIFIED, but escape death from the cross. You are even betraying your own Quran.
P
paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
I will first quote the verses from Quran and give their explanation:
[4:157] And because of their disbelief and their uttering against Mary a grievous calumny,
[4:158] And their saying, ‘We did kill the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah;’ whereas they slew him not, nor crucified him, but he was made to appear to them like one crucified; and those who differ therein are certainly in a state of doubt about it; they have no definite knowledge thereof, but only follow a conjecture; and they did not convert this conjecture into a certainty;
[4:159] On the contrary, Allah exalted him to Himself. And Allah is Mighty, Wise.
alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?ch=4&verse=157
Almighty God says in the Holy Quran: The Jews neither murdered Jesus, not did they kill him on the Cross; no, they only suspected that Jesus had died on the Cross; they did not have proof which could have convinced and satisfied them that Jesus (on whom be peace) had really died on the Cross.
In these verses Almighty God states that although it is true that Jesus was apparently placed on the Cross, and that they were determined to kill him; yet, it is wrong for Jews and Christians to suppose that Jesus did really die on the Cross. No, God created circumstances which saved Jesus from death on the Cross. Now, if one were just, one must say that what the Holy Quran had said against Jews and Christians turned out ultimately to be true.
Investigations of a very high standard to-day have proved that Jesus had really been saved from death on the Cross. A study of the records shows that the Jews have never been able to reply to the question: How was it that Jesus died within two or three hours when his bones were not broken?
This has led the Jews to put in another plea – that they killed Jesus by the sword, whereas the ancient history of the Jews does not show that Jesus was killed by the sword. The majesty and power of the Divine Being made it dark in order that Jesus might be saved. There was an earthquake. Pilate’s wife saw a vision. The Sabbath night was about to fall, when it was improper to let a crucified body remain on the Cross.
The magistrate, because of the terrible dream, became disposed towards the release of Jesus. All this was brought about simultaneously by God to save Jesus. Jesus himself was made to go into a swoon that he might be taken for dead. Through terrible signs like the earthquake, etc. there were produced in the Jews cowardice, and fear, and also fear of heavenly punishment. There was also the fear lest the corpses should remain on their crosses during the Sabbath night.
Again, the Jews, seeing Jesus in a swoon, thought that he was dead. It was dark. And there was an earthquake and great excitement. They also became anxious about their homes – how must the children be feeling in that darkness and earthquake? There was also a terror in their hearts that if this man was a liar and a Kafir, as they thought he was, why were mighty signs manifested at the moment of his suffering – signs which had not been manifested before.
They were so upset that they no longer were in a position to satisfy themselves whether Jesus had really died, or what exactly his condition was. What had come about, however, was a Divine Design to save Jesus. This is hinted at in the verse… i.e., the Jews did not kill Jesus – God made them believe that they had killed him. This circumstance encourages the righteous to place great trust in God, that God can save His servants as He pleases.
alislam.org/library/books/jesus-in-india/ch2.html
I love Jesus and won’t like to see him dieing a miserable death on Cross; one may however differ with with solid reasons, no compulsion
Thanks
R
ronyodish
Guest
paarsurrey,
It is not about what you like, it is about the historical truth. Jesus died a harsh death for your sins, my sins, and the sins of the world. I present you the Truth:
God bless,
Rony
S
sambos671
Guest
I don’t understand how you can preferance the Koran with regard to what Jesus actually said to that of the apostles. The apostles were there with him. Mohammed wrote the Koran almost 500 years later with no direct access to Jesus or Jersusalem (except in a vivid dream) Most historical studies go to the closest source. In this case it would be the Apostles rather than the prophet of Islam. Allah was never used by Christians and I’ve never read the Catholic bible you’re talking about but there are paraphrased bibles which is not the same thing as a translation.
P
planten
Guest
Rony, the picture you have posted is not that of Jesus. It is some representation of a scene. So it could be called fiction. There is some person on the cross whose hands are just tied up, no iron rod put through the palm or the through the wrist.
It appears that some one has acted or enacted the scene. Why it was necessary to do that? Was it to follow in the footsteps of Jesus? Surely not. The cross was not the only part of Jesus life. There were many other things that Jesus did, the way he lived, the way he talked, the way he preached, The way he ate things.
Why not that one in the picture on the cross chose to live like Jesus lived. Was that man circumsized like Jesus? Did he pray like Jesus? Did he call the father like Jesus? Did he pray to the Lord like Jesus used to do?
There are so many questions which need to be answered just by the look at that photo. And we do not have any answer to those questions. I cannot ask the person in the photo. But I can ask you all those questions because you seem to have been much (affected) attached to the cruel scene.
I am quite sincere in asking all these things. We believe it was very bad that was done with the man of God (Jesus) and those who did it, they paid high price too. So that should be enough.
P
paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
I think it is not difficult to understand.
Muhammad never wrote or authored Quran. Allah read it to Muhammad through an angel and Muhammad memorised it by heart. OK
Allah’s witnessing as mentioned in Quran to this effect is acceptable to us the Muslims. Allah is All-Seeing and All-Observing, he knew what happened to Mary and Jesus. We have to accept Allah’s lone witnessing in this case.
I elaborate it further.
Mary conceived a child without the touch of a man; this has been mentioned in Quran by lone witnessing of Allah. We all Muslims therefor accept it only on witnessing of Allah, we don’t ask for any further witnessing, as it not required logically.
If we Muslims deny lone witnessing of Allah in the case of Mary, then we would be thinking like the Jews thought; and they held Mary in doubt, you know of.
I think it is now crystal clear to you; however you may keep believing what satisfies you most but with solid reasons, no compulsion.
I love Jesus and Mary
Thanks
S
sambos671
Guest
Joseph Smith makes a similar claim. I don’t believe him either. I think you may say to me because its in your book “Say to the unbeliever you do not believe what I believe nor do I believe what you believe. You will never believe nor will I believe what you believe. You have your faith and I have mine.” Well, thats as much of that particular section that I remember. And I will review the Allah - Tribal Moon God further because I think there is some evidence of this. That the prophet chose the major deity (from the many) from the City that is now Mecca. You know as I study history many Islamic nations relied heavily on science. Why not so much now? Also they protected some of the works of Greek philosophers. why not now?
D
doughnut
Guest
i find it rather curious that these statements (either written like this, or variations somewhat, but more or less the same meaning) was found in almost every of his posts, and his continuous disregard to christians’ perspective of interpretation (simply dismissing it without much thought) simply inteprets that the poster is telling everyone time and time again,
He is the one that “keeps believing…and no compulsion” to hear what the rest of the world says.
if he seriously does not mind what others believe, why did he come up to this thread and kept on repeat his views, again and again…when it was clearly not accepted. shouldn’t he leave it as it is in that case, if he is not here to discuss, as was evident in his postings, more like trying to “teach”.
(I was reading every entry and was entertained…)
S
sambos671
Guest
As I’ve shown its what his book teaches. When confronted with a good argument disregard it.
B
bankerdavid
Guest
1.Were you there to know what Jesus claimed? John said that Jesus did claim it.
2. The problem is, this is your opinion, which really doesn’t have any authority.
3. Jesus never went to India. There’s too much literature against this theory. Prove it.
2. The problem is, this is your opinion, which really doesn’t have any authority.
3. Jesus never went to India. There’s too much literature against this theory. Prove it.
W
WarriorAngel
Guest
If you love Jesus - then really know what He has said.
Muhammad contradicts everything He has said…
Everything.
Jesus said - one man - one woman - is what marriage is.
Mohammad said - many wives.
Jesus said - turn the other cheek.
Muhammad said - hide and ambush them and behead them.
Jesus said - those who scandalize the innocent will be akin to having a milstone around their neck and thrown to the depths of hell.
Muhammad said - I was told to marry a 6 year old child and have sex with her at age 9. [innocent child]
Jesus said to follow Him you must take up your cross.
Mihammad said - pillage and conquer.
Jesus said - love your wives more than yourself and die for her.
Muhammad said - wives are not even equal to men.
Jesus said - die for Him [peaceably]
Muhammad said - kill them.
Jesus said NO other prophets would come after Him.
Muhammad said he was a greater prophet.
Jesus said do not follow any prophet or christs after Him.
Muhammad said he was greater than Jesus.
Jesus said no one can come to the Father but through Him.
Muhammad said he was greater.
AND NOW FOR A REAL CRITIQUE between the two…
read the site.
answering-islam.org/Silas/founders.htm
Here are some quotes …to get ya started.
SOME OF THEIR LAST WORDS
JESUS: “Father forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.” Luke 23:34. (said while dying on the cross at Calvary after being betrayed and sentenced to die for no legitimate reason).
MUHAMMAD: “May Allah curse the Jews and Christians for they built the places of worship at the graves of the prophets.” Bukhari, Vol. 1, #427 [Muhammad had been poisoned years earlier by a Jewish woman whose husband was killed by the Muslims and the poison had slowly worked its effect. He said this while dying in the arms of his wife Aisha].
PUNISHING SINNERS WHO WERE WILLING TO REPENT
JESUS
From John 8:2-11
At dawn He (Jesus) appeared again in the temple courts, where all the people gathered around him, and he sat down to teach them. The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group and said to Jesus, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?” They were using this question as a trap in order to have a basis to accuse Him.
But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with His finger. When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her.” Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground.
At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there. Jesus straightened up and asked her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?” “No one sir”, she said. “Then neither do I condemn you,” Jesus declared. “Go now and leave your life of sin.”
MUHAMMAD
From the Hadith of Abu Dawud, #4428
“Buraidah said: “A woman of Ghamid came to the Prophet and said: “I have committed fornication”, He said: “Go back”. She returned and on the next day she came to him again, and said: “Perhaps you want to send me back as you did to Maiz b. Malik. I swear by Allah, I am pregnant.” He said to her: “Go back”. She then returned and came to him the next day. He said to her: “Go back until you give birth to the child.” She then returned. When she gave birth to the child she brought the child to him, and said: “Here it is! I have given birth to it.” He said: “Go back, and suckle him until you wean him.” When she had weaned him, she brought him to him with something in his hand which he was eating. The boy was then given to a certain man of the Muslims and he (the prophet) commanded regarding her. So a pit was dug for her, and he gave orders about her and she was stoned to death. Khalid was one of those who were throwing stones at her. He threw a stone at her. When a drop of blood fell on his cheek, he abused her. The prophet said to him: “Gently, Khalid. By Him in Whose hand my soul is, she has repented to such an extent that if one who wrongfully takes an extra tax were to repent to a like extent, he would be forgiven”. Then giving command regarding her, prayed over her and she was buried.””
P
planten
Guest
**One man - One woman is the best way. But it should not be extremely strict because conditions vary. Conditions demand sometime that a man may have to marry more than one.
The only other solution would be to divorce the first wife which is also not good. The church is against the divorce too. But in mathew ch.19 it is allowed under special circumstances. There is a case in which a divorce may be necessary.
Would the christians (Catholics) please admit that there is an exception to the rule of “No divorce”??**
The only other solution would be to divorce the first wife which is also not good. The church is against the divorce too. But in mathew ch.19 it is allowed under special circumstances. There is a case in which a divorce may be necessary.
Would the christians (Catholics) please admit that there is an exception to the rule of “No divorce”??**
S
swariffin
Guest
According to Quran it is clear that JESUS NEVER EVEN BEEN CLOSE TO THE CROSS. You said that Jesus SURVIVED THE CRUCIFIXION. In that case you said that JESUS WAS NAILED TO THE CROSS.
I hope that you can figure out the difference of never been close to the cross as opposed to was actually nailed to the cross. If you can’t understand me, I need help from somebody who can translate my posting into Urdu language for you, and have you realize that you are against your own belief in Quran.
S
swariffin
Guest
That is why we believe the story of Jesus from the contemporary witness, rather than someone 567 years later who never even step his foot on the land of Galilee, and creating some fancy story about Jesus.
- Status