I dont see how this doesnt borderline on mary worship

[Mannyfit75]

I think that there is a difference between the two.
In the case of Mary, she is able to hear and understand hundreds of thousands of different prayers in many different languages all of which are being addressed to her at the same time.
In the case of your friend, this would not be possible.

In heaven, they are not limited to time and space. Saints in heaven are granted by God to reveal mysterious to men.

To illustrate, the Prophet Daniel has been given a gift by God to interpret dreams. If God allow him to do so, I have no doubt that God can allow even Mary and other saints to revealed mysteries.

For normal men it is impossible. But for God all things are possible. God can allow saints to have gifts to be able to understand.

 

[Mannyfit75]

True, but he didn’t venerate her. And you didn’t answer my previous point – why do you know that we should go through Mary just because Jesus did?

He honored her and loved her. We believe God’s kingdom is family centered. Those who are believers in Christ are brothers and sisters in Christ. This makes Mary our spiritual mother.

 

[HailMary]

Hello if you’ve been following my threads I am looking into the catholic church and would very much like to get baptized, however every so often i see these red flags… What i read a few minutes ago on another thread raised one such flag, even more so well because it came directly from the mouth of a pope.

ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4a.htm

That link includes this:
"3) Leo XIII, Encyclical, Octobri mense adventante, Sept 22, 1891, *** 24, 1891, 196.

… it is right to say, that nothing at all of that very great treasury of all grace which the Lord brought us–for ‘grace and truth came through Jesus Christ’ [Jn 1.17]–nothing is imparted to us except through Mary, since God so wills, so that just as no one can come to the Father except through the Son, so in general, no one can come to Christ except through His Mother."

how can someone possibly say that noone can come to christ except through mary?

Simple, She who gave birth to the head, gave birth to the Body. Christ is the Head, we are His Body, and Mary is the Neck. You may find this strange at first, but the reality is w/o Mary, there is not God-Incarnate, since He needed a woman to give birth to Him.

 

[mlchance]

Would you care to offer more than just empty rhetoric? How can anything provide more glory than going directly to Christ? I just can’t imagine it, unless you’re saying that somehow, going to Christ isn’t the be-all and end-all of prayer needs.

The criterion for whether the rhetoric is empty is what you can and can’t imagine? How is ignoring the Communion of Saints through which the saints in heaven are united to the Church on earth by the grace of God not at least an implicit attempt to detract from the glory of Christ Jesus?

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[HailMary]

True, but that doesn’t necessarily mean we should do the same.

Yes, it does. Follow Christ’s example.

As St. Augustine puts it:“The world was unworthy to receive the Son of God immediately from the Father’s hands. He has given Him to Mary in order that the world might receive Him from Her…"
Likewise, St. Bernard, puts it:Is it not fitting that grace should return to its Author by the same channel that conveyed it to us?
This channel is the Blessed Mother, Jesus’ Mother and ours.

Sorry PC Master, I trust these saints testimony of Christ, much more than yours. And I will follow their example over yours, since St. Paul teaches, Be imitators of me, just as I also am of Christ.

• 1 Corinthians 11:1*

 

[bobzills]

In heaven, they are not limited to time and space. Saints in heaven are granted by God to reveal mysterious to men.
This more or less supports my point that there is a difference between asking a friend on earth to pray for you, and asking Mary to pray for you.

 

[Mannyfit75]

This more or less supports my point that there is a difference between asking a friend on earth to pray for you, and asking Mary to pray for you.

Who is closer to God, who see him face to face? You or the saints?

Saints, Mary, and the angels see God face to face… It would not hurt to have them pray for us. Paul calls for intercession. They have a deeper insight of God than us. For we are still limited in our thinking.

1** I** desire therefore, first of all,** that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men**: 2 For kings, and for all that are in high station: that we may lead a quiet and a peaceable life in all piety and chastity. 3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour. 1 Corinthians Chapter 2 verse 1-2.

God is God of the living not the dead.

We see that Paul that intercession is good and acceptable. He goes on further.

1. Who will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God, and one mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

Our death does not separate us from the Mystical Body of Christ upon death. Suppose you died now, do you think you would cease to remember your fellow Christians on earth? Surely you would be concern for their well being. You would surely pray for them on their behalf when you die.

Intercession is therefore good and acceptible to God. If it wasn’t, the Church would not recommend it. So my friend, asking Mary and saints to pray for us is good for us. It does not negate God himself, who is the One Lord.