I went to a Ukrainian Divine Liturgy, but the people were pushy

[XtusVictor]

I am sorry to hear that…I have been to more the a half dozen Orthodox churches and never had any problems. I have told the priests I am Catholic and they express the view that our respective churches are sisters…

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius

Alexius,

I am sure it was easier for the Orthodox to embrace you when you let them know that you dont actually hold the Catholic faith but were merely “in commuinion with Rome.”

 

[Irish_Melkite]

when someone falls asleep in the Lord, you may have the Byzantine/Greek Catholic priest(s) and an Orthodox priest or two go to the funeral services.

Matt,

Similarly to what you describe, in the area of Boston in which the Melkite Cathedral is situated, there are Antiochian Orthodox, Maronite, and Syriac Orthodox parishes. It is not uncommon that one will find priests from each of the churches at the wake of a prominent member of the Lebanese or Syrian communities - regardless of the parish to which he belongs, or the wake of a parishioner from one of the churches who has family in 2, 3, or even all 4 parishes.

When Patriarch Gregory last came to Boston, the pastor of the Syriac Orthodox parish was waiting at the Eparchial residence on the Patriarch’s arrival there from the airport and was the first to pay honor to him.

A couple weeks ago, when we celebrated St Barbara’s Feast with the traditional ceremonies, followed by a hufle, one could readily have found a clergyman of whichever parish one desired, as all were seated together at one table in the Cathedral hall with Archbishop Cyril. This has been the way of the Eastern and Oriental communities in Boston for the past four decades, in my experience, and long before that. In perusing a 1942 program booklet, produced on the occasion of the Melkite parish celebrating its new temple, the advertisement section was replete with warm messages of congratulations and goodwill from the other Eastern and Oriental clergy, Catholic and Orthodox, in the area.

I believe that I’ve spoken previously about the situation in the early years of the 20th century, when a single church from one of the Middle Eastern Churches, Catholic or Orthodox, was often the only one of that ethnicity in a city or town for a period. Commonly, the parish would serve the pastoral needs of all the Arab Christians, until such time as their own priests became available. I had occasion to read an anniversary program from a Melkite parish in the mid-West which included congratulatory messages from two Orthodox parishes in the same city; both were phrased in warm terms and contained references to the Melkite parish as their “mother parish”. A reading of the parish history spoke of how their Orthodox brethren worshipped with the Melkites until priests of their own Church were assigned and how vesture, liturgical accoutrements, and even worship space were loaned for their use until the parishes became established.

I’m well aware that the history of relations between Slav Churches on either side of the fence was not always so rosy as this and I am thankful for the relationships that our Churches have had - but, I think the rancorous attitudes described are the exception rather than the norm in this day and age.

Many years,

Neil

 

[XtusVictor]

Matt,

Similarly to what you describe, in the area of Boston in which the Melkite Cathedral is situated, there are Antiochian Orthodox, Maronite, and Syriac Orthodox parishes. It is not uncommon that one will find priests from each of the churches at the wake of a prominent member of the Lebanese or Syrian communities - regardless of the parish to which he belongs, or the wake of a parishioner from one of the churches who has family in 2, 3, or even all 4 parishes.

When Patriarch Gregory last came to Boston, the pastor of the Syriac Orthodox parish was waiting at the Eparchial residence on the Patriarch’s arrival there from the airport and was the first to pay honor to him.

A couple weeks ago, when we celebrated St Barbara’s Feast with the traditional ceremonies, followed by a hufle, one could readily have found a clergyman of whichever parish one desired, as all were seated together at one table in the Cathedral hall with Archbishop Cyril. This has been the way of the Eastern and Oriental communities in Boston for the past four decades, in my experience, and long before that. In perusing a 1942 program booklet, produced on the occasion of the Melkite parish celebrating its new temple, the advertisement section was replete with warm messages of congratulations and goodwill from the other Eastern and Oriental clergy, Catholic and Orthodox, in the area.

I believe that I’ve spoken previously about the situation in the early years of the 20th century, when a single church from one of the Middle Eastern Churches, Catholic or Orthodox, was often the only one of that ethnicity in a city or town for a period. Commonly, the parish would serve the pastoral needs of all the Arab Christians, until such time as their own priests became available. I had occasion to read an anniversary program from a Melkite parish in the mid-West which included congratulatory messages from two Orthodox parishes in the same city; both were phrased in warm terms and contained references to the Melkite parish as their “mother parish”. A reading of the parish history spoke of how their Orthodox brethren worshipped with the Melkites until priests of their own Church were assigned and how vesture, liturgical accoutrements, and even worship space were loaned for their use until the parishes became established.

I’m well aware that the history of relations between Slav Churches on either side of the fence was not always so rosy as this and I am thankful for the relationships that our Churches have had - but, I think the rancorous attitudes described are the exception rather than the norm in this day and age.

Many years,

Neil

Interesting. As a Melkite apparently the “fellow” Catholics in Boston hold no interest for you. Yes, anti-Romanism is the undercurrent of all Melkites. Since you only want o play with the Orthodox. Why not just dox and be done?

 

[Seamus_L]

Most of the UGCC members I’ve met in my life, would not like to be called “Orthodox in Communion”, because many, particularly the elderly have negative memories of the Orthodox Church in there homeland that goes back centuries, Communist oppression, Tsarist oppression etc. They also have there own unique identity that they greatly cherish, and that identity, while predominantly Eastern, does include a few traditions from the West, like the Rosary, Stations Of The Cross (with icons of course) and devotion to Our Lady Of Fatima in the last 50 some years.
In short the UGCC is a fully Eastern Church, that happens to include a few devotions of Latin origin that are much loved by it's faithful.

 

[XtusVictor]

Most of the UGCC members I’ve met in my life, would not like to be called “Orthodox in Communion”, because many, particularly the elderly have negative memories of the Orthodox Church in there homeland that goes back centuries, Communist oppression, Tsarist oppression etc. They also have there own unique identity that they greatly cherish, and that identity, while predominantly Eastern, does include a few traditions from the West, like the Rosary, Stations Of The Cross (with icons of course) and devotion to Our Lady Of Fatima in the last 50 some years.

                       In short the UGCC is a fully Eastern Church, that happens to include a few devotions of Latin origin that are much loved by it's faithful.

Well said, Seamus, this is my experience as well. I love the UGCC clergy and people I know. And they are not the slightest bit anti-Roman. Neither are the Chaldeans who are thrilled to have a Cardinal among them.

 

[The_Iambic_Pen]

Interesting. As a Melkite apparently the “fellow” Catholics in Boston hold no interest for you. Yes, anti-Romanism is the undercurrent of all Melkites. Since you only want o play with the Orthodox. Why not just dox and be done?

Melkites are just as Catholic as any one in a Latin rite parish. I don’t think the fact they are friendly with the Orthodox takes away from this.

 

[XtusVictor]

Melkites are just as Catholic as any one in a Latin rite parish. I don’t think the fact they are friendly with the Orthodox takes away from this.

But Melkites no longer identify with the Catholic faith. They call themselves “orthodox in communion with Rome.” So, no, the Melkites are actively dissociating themselves from the Catholic Church. I would not be surprised if in the coming generation they do not leave the “Roman Communion” en masse.

And I hold not hopes for a reunion with the East for centuries as their current oppression of Catholics gives no indication of an openness to the will of Christ in John 17.

 

[mgy100]

But Melkites no longer identify with the Catholic faith. They call themselves “orthodox in communion with Rome.” So, no, the Melkites are actively dissociating themselves from the Catholic Church. I would not be surprised if in the coming generation they do not leave the “Roman Communion” en masse.

And I hold not hopes for a reunion with the East for centuries as their current oppression of Catholics gives no indication of an openness to the will of Christ in John 17.

How does this sentiment towards the Melkites, a sui juris church recognized by the Vatican have anything to do with this post? It is uncharitable speculation towards a part of your church.

 

[Alexius]

Alexius,

I am sure it was easier for the Orthodox to embrace you when you let them know that you dont actually hold the Catholic faith but were merely “in commuinion with Rome.”

Well, no I never said that at all. When asked my faith, I said I am Catholic. No qualifications, not even Eastern.