I would like to discuss the theology on Mary

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I think you misunderstand grace and sin.

Romans 6:1 What shall we say, then? shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

You cannot be full of grace and still sin.

As for your scripture, “if anyone claims to be without sin the truth is not in him”, the Blessed Virgin did not claim to be without sin. God proclaimed it, when He called her by the name He knows her by (Kecharitomene).
Yes this is a popular debate within the Christian community. To say we rest in grace and yet we still sin makes some ppl believe that they are clearly within sin they are perfect. But to continue is sin does that mean we never sin again? or does it mean to strive not to sin? I cannot honestly say I am without sin that I never sin can you?
 
Much of what said about the burning bush the morning star and ect. brings an issue. All of that is simply an interpretation or view of what the scriptures mean which means it is not solid it cannot be proven as absolute truth because the scriptures do not in any way say all of this but our interpretations can
You forget that the saints which had interpreted these passages had the Holy Spirit in them when they had addressed these issues. Jesus said the Holy Spirit will lead you into truth. The Holy Spirit than is the Holy Tradition which you will need to help you interpret the Holy Scriptures and certain doctrines. Without the Holy Spirit the Church will enter into certain heresies. The Holy Spirit will raise certain saints which will help the Church to know what truths there are to help defeat any teachings contrary to it. In the West we see this in the Magesterium of the Church which the Pope presides in and in the East it is more the same as the Patriarchs and the Bishops confirming what the saints has passed on to us. The Church Fathers have given us a wealth of interpretation as do the present apostles and disciples who follow in their footsteps who have the same Holy Spirit in them. To ignore this is to ignore the Holy Spirit.
 
I think it’s important to point out who has the authority to teach. I myself struggled with the Marian Doctrines as a Pentecostal prior to my conversion. However, she was not my biggest issue, mine was authority.

Once you come to the understanding that no other church has the authority to teach accept the Catholic Church, and that she is guided by the Holy Spirit. And that the gates of hell shall not prevail against her, just as they have not in the last 2000 years. Everything else fell into place.

We as Catholics have both Sacred Scripture, and Sacred Tradition to rely on for our beliefs. Through Apostolic Succession, we know that Marian devotion has been around for many centuries, and that we are to view her as our mother, the queen of heaven.

In regards to her being sinless, she still required a saving grace through her son Jesus Christ, through whom all things were created. I like how Steve Ray put it, if you were walking down the road and about ready to fall into a hole and I reached out and saved you from falling. That was an act of saving you before something terrible happened to you. Just as I could have helped you out of the hole once you fell in. Salvation took place prior to, instead of post fall.

Welcome to Catholic Answers Forum, this is a wonderful site.:clapping::tiphat:
 
I love Our Blessed Mother very much because I know Jesus loved her too. She was the chosen one. God chose her to be the mother of our Savior. She was there from the moment our Lord was born into this world up to the moment where Jesus died , she was there at the foot of the cross.

St. Joseph is another person whom I admire very much too. He was also chosen to be Our Lord’s earthly father. So many things to be admired about the Holy Family if we try to analyze their lives…Both the Blessed Mother and St Joseph deserve our love and respect for raising Our Lord…

As Catholics, we believe that Our blessed Mother and St. Joseph are in heaven with Our Lord. We give them reverence and honor with the hope that one day we wil be with them with all the saints enjoying Our Lord’s presence… God bless !
 
Actually yes the scriptures did say that mary was a sinner as I posted earlier the scriptures say if anyone claims to be without sin the truth is not in him, I have scripture to prove my point and I test all my beliefs with scripture so this is why I am asking for scripture for yours
Not quite. Your scripture states that he who claims he is sinless is lying. The people here can correct me if I’m wrong, but Mary herself never claimed to be sinless; she simply was. The salutation the angel gave her in Luke is one that has never been given to anyone in the course of the Bible, even human history. It wasn’t declared by her or by another mortal human, but an archangel. Her sinlessness was not because of what she did or did not do, but by God himself. How could a sinful woman hold and nurture God in her womb? Sin and God’s nature are like water and oil; they cannot and do not mix.
 
(Luke 1:46-55) The Magnificat

My soul magnifies the Lord,
and my spirit rejoices in God my Savior,
for he has regarded the low estate of his handmaiden.
For behold, henceforth all generations will call me blessed;
for he who is mighty has done great things for me,
and holy is his name.
And his mercy is on those who fear him
from generation to generation.
He has shown strength with his arm,
he has scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts,
he has put down the mighty from their thrones,
and exalted those of low degree;
he has filled the hungry with good things,
and the rich he has sent empty away.
He has helped his servant Israel,
in remembrance of his mercy,
as he spoke to our fathers,
to Abraham and to his posterity for ever.
 
The Hail Mary is a well-loved and beautiful basic Catholic prayer. It’s one of the essential prayers to Virgin Mary. It combines two lines from Scripture (Lk 1:28 and Lk 1:42) with a humble request for Mary to pray for us.

Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.
 
“Because of Mary’s singular cooperation with the action of the Holy Spirit, the Church loves to pray in communion with the Virgin Mary, to magnify with her the great things the Lord has done for her, and to entrust supplications and praises to her.” (Catechism, 2682)

The Angelus
V — The Angel of the Lord declared unto Mary.
R — And she conceived by the Holy Spirit.

V — Behold the handmaid of the Lord.
R — Be it done unto me according to thy word.

V — And the Word was made Flesh.
R — And dwelt among us.

V — Pray for us, O Holy Mother of God.
R — That we may be made worthy of the promises of Christ.

Pour forth, we beseech Thee, O Lord, Thy grace into our hearts, that we to whom the incarnation of Christ, Thy Son, was made known by the message of an angel, may by his passion and cross be brought to the glory of his resurrection. Through the same Christ our Lord.

Amen.
 
Actually yes the scriptures did say that mary was a sinner as I posted earlier the scriptures say if anyone claims to be without sin the truth is not in him, I have scripture to prove my point and I test all my beliefs with scripture so this is why I am asking for scripture for yours
A question: Why do you test all your beliefs with Scripture? Is that in the Bible somewhere?
 
Yes but it in no way indicates that she was without sin, it’s obvious she was blessed among women but grace doesn’t mean sinless, we are living in the period of grace we are always forgiven and his grace is endless but we are still sinners we still have sin but we are seen in God’s because of jesus as pure clean and spotless
Does it really matter if she was sinless or not?? …The point is Jesus loved his mother and we should too…She deserved our reverence and respect just like how we would treat any mother of our friend…
 
**It is required **to pray to Mary and the saints because we believe in the Communion of Saints. If you, as a Christian, ask your living friends to pray for you, then you also believe in the Communion of Saints, and if you, as a Christian, believe that at least a few people are indeed in Heaven, then you believe in Eternal Life and saints in Heaven. Therefore, why should we not ask the living to pray for us to God? Do they not help us along our way in the spiritual journey?
 
I think it’s important to point out who has the authority to teach. I myself struggled with the Marian Doctrines as a Pentecostal prior to my conversion. However, she was not my biggest issue, mine was authority.

Once you come to the understanding that no other church has the authority to teach accept the Catholic Church, and that she is guided by the Holy Spirit. And that the gates of hell shall not prevail against her, just as they have not in the last 2000 years. Everything else fell into place.

We as Catholics have both Sacred Scripture, and Sacred Tradition to rely on for our beliefs. Through Apostolic Succession, we know that Marian devotion has been around for many centuries, and that we are to view her as our mother, the queen of heaven.

In regards to her being sinless, she still required a saving grace through her son Jesus Christ, through whom all things were created. I like how Steve Ray put it, if you were walking down the road and about ready to fall into a hole and I reached out and saved you from falling. That was an act of saving you before something terrible happened to you. Just as I could have helped you out of the hole once you fell in. Salvation took place prior to, instead of post fall.

Welcome to Catholic Answers Forum, this is a wonderful site.:clapping::tiphat:
ok, while I may not agree about mary being sinless I respect your beliefs, Ty everyone for discussing this matter with me I learned a lot. btw when you say the Catholic church is the only one that has the authority to teach what did you mean? Like does that mean no one outside of the church should teach? And where does this authority come from?
 
I think it’s important to point out who has the authority to teach. …
Yes, acknowledging and accepting authority is key. I accept that the Bible is scripture because I accept that Christ Himself established a Church with authority to teach and therefore declare a canon of scripture.

Without accepting the authority of the Catholic Church, I have no reason to believe it is anything other than an interesting collection of books.

No where in the Bible does it declare it is the single source of faith or a complete repository of it. In one of the epistles a community is urged to abide by the teachings that were passed on by word of mouth and letter, neither is stressed as being more important than the other. One of the gospels ends with the statement that not all that Jesus did was written down.

An interesting read is “Faith of the Early Fathers” edited and translated by Jurgens (sp?). It highlights how closely the early Church’s beliefs and practices align with the Catholic Church today. For example, it convinced me that the earliest Christian’s believed in the Real Presence in the Eucharist.
 
**It is required **to pray to Mary and the saints because we believe in the Communion of Saints. If you, as a Christian, ask your living friends to pray for you, then you also believe in the Communion of Saints, and if you, as a Christian, believe that at least a few people are indeed in Heaven, then you believe in Eternal Life and saints in Heaven. Therefore, why should we not ask the living to pray for us to God? Do they not help us along our way in the spiritual journey?
I’ve never heard that it was required to pray to Our Blessed Mother. Either way, I still do it by praying the rosary and meditating on each mystery. The rosary is such a wonderful prayer where we can meditate on Christ’s life from the moment of his birth up to the moment of his death.

You mentioned about the Communion of Saints…This is a very interesting topic. I’ve always wondered…once a soul is release from Purgatory and then is already with Our Lord in heaven, are they already considered Saints?
 
ok, while I may not agree about mary being sinless I respect your beliefs, Ty everyone for discussing this matter with me I learned a lot. btw when you say the Catholic church is the only one that has the authority to teach what did you mean? Like does that mean no one outside of the church should teach? And where does this authority come from?
It just means that the Catholic Church has been around for over 2000 years. They have the original interpretation of the bible because it is guided by the Holy Spirit… When Luther broke away from the Catholic Church, he started making his own interpretation which was not guided by the Holy Spirit…This separation called the Protestants eventually separated to more and more division because as we believe each protestants just interprets the bible for their own convenience… An example of interpreting the bible for one’s convenience is the belief Once saved…always saved…Catholics believe that we have To work out our own salvation…Sure Jesus came here to save us By showing us the way…but we still have FREE WILL…are we going to respond to his call?? Are we going to follow Him??
 
It just means that the Catholic Church has been around for over 2000 years. They have the original interpretation of the bible because it is guided by the Holy Spirit… When Luther broke away from the Catholic Church, he started making his own interpretation which was not guided by the Holy Spirit…This separation called the Protestants eventually separated to more and more division because as we believe each protestants just interprets the bible for their own convenience…
lol i’m not gonna lie that sounds a lot like the issue we Christians have. See we Christians all seem to believe that our view and our interpretation is from the holy spirit, the ironic part is that based on that hundreds of denominations exist each according to the different views and beliefs and understanding of the bible and supposedly each one is holy spirit inspired and the truth while the others aren’t.

See each verse in each scripture can easily have at least three different interpretations, and ppl have it in their minds that they are correct and many are very stubborn and will not accept the fact they may be wrong and because of this there is much debate and little learning.

As for me I am still a babe in Christ I am only three years into this, So when I read the bible I go into it with an open mind and open heart, I go into it with a breakable and learnable heart even if that means my views and my beliefs end up being proven wrong.
 
See each verse in each scripture can easily have at least three different interpretations, and ppl have it in their minds that they are correct and many are very stubborn and will not accept the fact they may be wrong and because of this there is much debate and little learning.
This is why Jesus, in His wisdom, gave us not a book, but a Church. The Church, in turn, gave us not only the written Sacred Scriptures, but also a way to interpret them! We have a living Magisterium, through the authority granted to the Apostles, and carried on to this modern day by Apostolic Succession. The reason Protestants have so much trouble interpreting the Scriptures is because they have no infallible authority to guide them and they have lost the protection of the Holy Spirit giving to the Church to ensure correct teachings in faith and morals.
 
lol i’m not gonna lie that sounds a lot like the issue we Christians have. See we Christians all seem to believe that our view and our interpretation is from the holy spirit, the ironic part is that based on that hundreds of denominations exist each according to the different views and beliefs and understanding of the bible and supposedly each one is holy spirit inspired and the truth while the others aren’t.

See each verse in each scripture can easily have at least three different interpretations, and ppl have it in their minds that they are correct and many are very stubborn and will not accept the fact they may be wrong and because of this there is much debate and little learning.

As for me I am still a babe in Christ I am only three years into this, So when I read the bible I go into it with an open mind and open heart, I go into it with a breakable and learnable heart even if that means my views and my beliefs end up being proven wrong.
Anyway it is best to focus on unity and not division. We are all God’s Children…Christians, Muslims, Jews…I saw an add just the other day that says:

Life is Simple
Love God
Love Others

😉 God bless
 
lol i’m not gonna lie that sounds a lot like the issue we Christians have. See we Christians all seem to believe that our view and our interpretation is from the holy spirit, the ironic part is that based on that hundreds of denominations exist each according to the different views and beliefs and understanding of the bible and supposedly each one is holy spirit inspired and the truth while the others aren’t.

See each verse in each scripture can easily have at least three different interpretations, and ppl have it in their minds that they are correct and many are very stubborn and will not accept the fact they may be wrong and because of this there is much debate and little learning.

As for me I am still a babe in Christ I am only three years into this, So when I read the bible I go into it with an open mind and open heart, I go into it with a breakable and learnable heart even if that means my views and my beliefs end up being proven wrong.
You can start learning or praying the Our Father and Glory Be (to the Father) prayers
if you are with Catholics…
It is best to focus on the things we agree on or what unites us…
 
You can start learning or praying the Our Father and Glory Be (to the Father) prayers
if you are with Catholics…
It is best to focus on the things we agree on or what unites us…
Oh Father and I talk all the all day every day I have enjoyed our conversations so much and I have learned so much just from talking with him. You know if I could describe the church and the body of believers I would imagine a human body, Jesus is the head and we are the rest of the body each body part is different and does different things much like how we are all different and have different skills and roles in the church and for God’s kingdom.

Now the human body in order to function correctly needs all of it’s parts to be working towards one goal and that’s to keep the body healthy and working the body needs to be in unity to function correctly. If my right foot was doing what I needed it to do by going forward by left foot is trying to go all sorts of directions and my right arm is is stable and working but my left is in a frenzy flailing about then I have a serious problem I cannot be very effective in anything.

And I liken all of God’s believers to this as well, in order for the church to be effective we all need to be working in unity
 
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