Ideas: what do young Catholics need right now? {dating and relationships}

[pianistclare]

Guaranteed 99% mortal sin free!

Yeah, in the modern world, we call those cults.

 

[Xantippe]

A big problem is that this is what the dating pool begins to look like in your 30s:

https://imgur.com/bX9WK6s

My brother is in his early 30s and has complained to me on on numerous occasions that he can’t find anyone. He’s handsome, has decent social skills and a good job. He has no trouble getting a date, it’s simply that most of the women he meets have already started a family. Most of the single women he meets are either recently divorced (still married according to the church) or, if they’re free to marry, have spent the past decade cohabitating. It’s not exaclty the way that most men would desire to start a young family. When you’re late to the table sometimes all you get left with is the scraps.

Love the photo!

There should be some nice widows coming online in the next 10 years or so. But they’ll have families, too…

 

[Sarcelle]

A big problem is that this is what the dating pool begins to look like in your 30s:

https://imgur.com/bX9WK6s

My brother is in his early 30s and has complained to me on on numerous occasions that he can’t find anyone. He’s handsome, has decent social skills and a good job. He has no trouble getting a date, it’s simply that most of the women he meets have already started a family. Most of the single women he meets are either recently divorced (still married according to the church) or, if they’re free to marry, have spent the past decade cohabitating. It’s not exaclty the way that most men would desire to start a young family. When you’re late to the table sometimes all you get left with is the scraps.

It’s a fact of life though. The older one is the more issues and baggage one has. Of course, hopefully we may already have had time to deal with those issues with maturity.

I do not think it is helpful to refer to single people over a certain age as scraps.

 

[Xantippe]

It’s a fact of life though. The older one is the more issues and baggage one has. Of course, hopefully we may already have had time to deal with those issues with maturity.

I do not think it is helpful to refer to single people over a certain age as scraps.

True.

I’m also kind of curious what the amazing single 30-something guys were doing for the past 10-15 years–have they been diligently doing rosaries and searching this whole time?

There’s also the issue that time does not stand still for any of us. Married people also acquire baggage and age-related issues of their own–the crabby old married guys and whiny old married ladies weren’t exactly like that when they were 22, or they wouldn’t have managed to snag each other.

 

[Bataar]

1. On reflection, I get the impression that some of the guys that struggle the most with meeting nice women are guys that 1) work in male-dominated professions and 2) have hobbies and interests that are male-dominated.

If that’s your situation, I suggest working hard on develop some familiarity and ease around women by giving yourself more opportunities for casual, friendly contact with women in low-pressure settings. If you can get comfortable talking to women when it doesn’t really matter, you won’t choke when the right person comes by.

(The same applies to women in female-dominated professions with female-dominated hobbies and interests, of course.)

This is definitely my situation. Pretty much my whole life. I went to an all male high school and from then on, I’ve been pretty much only around other guys. Every job I’ve had and school I’ve gone to has been male dominated. Same with hobbies. Occasionally, someone will bring their wife/girlfriend, but that’s about it. Throw that in with my autism and need to get to know someone over time before really interacting with them and I pretty much am doomed to be single for life.

 

[Xantippe]

This is definitely my situation. Pretty much my whole life. I went to an all male high school and from then on, I’ve been pretty much only around other guys. Every job I’ve had and school I’ve gone to has been male dominated. Same with hobbies. Occasionally, someone will bring their wife/girlfriend, but that’s about it. Throw that in with my autism and need to get to know someone over time before really interacting with them and I pretty much am doomed to be single for life.

Bummer!

 

[Bataar]

That’s why I’ve been trying to figure what I can do to meet people. I pretty much just go to work and go home. That’s about it other than running to the grocery store or something like that. My problem is I generally can’t think of anything to do or any reason to leave the house by myself.

 

[pianistclare]

That’s why I’ve been trying to figure what I can do to meet people. I pretty much just go to work and go home. That’s about it other than running to the grocery store or something like that. My problem is I generally can’t think of anything to do or any reason to leave the house by myself.

Take ballroom dance.
Take a cooking class.
Volunteer at the food bank.
Read to children at the library.

In short, get out in GROUP settings.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

Take ballroom dance.
Take a cooking class.
Volunteer at the food bank.
Read to children at the library.

In short, get out in GROUP settings.

I really don’t know much about ASD except for the textbook stuff, so I may be way off, but I think a lot of people on the spectrum have more difficulty interacting in groups than one on one.

Bataar, how old are you? If you’re still in school, maybe there are smaller niche clubs or groups you could join. There may be a dating site out there for people with autism/Aspergers. Maybe a local meetup group?

Sometimes social awkwardness (no, I’m not equating awkwardness with autism, but it can be one of the challenges people face) can be masked with cultural differences. Maybe dating a recent immigrant, or someone here on a work or school visa would prove easier.

It is definitely harder to meet and connect with people if you’re on the spectrum, but don’t give up hope. Many people do manage to fall in love, get married, and raise a family.

 

[EasterJoy]

A big problem is that this is what the dating pool begins to look like in your 30s:

https://imgur.com/bX9WK6s

My brother is in his early 30s and has complained to me on on numerous occasions that he can’t find anyone. He’s handsome, has decent social skills and a good job. He has no trouble getting a date, it’s simply that most of the women he meets have already started a family. Most of the single women he meets are either recently divorced (still married according to the church) or, if they’re free to marry, have spent the past decade cohabitating. It’s not exaclty the way that most men would desire to start a young family. When you’re late to the table sometimes all you get left with is the scraps.

It is a problem that so many Catholics do not try to find if their first attempt at marriage was valid or not until they decide they’ve found someone they want to marry again. That excludes them from consideration by anyone who takes canon law seriously.

Having said that, there is a certain amount of grieving that follows a divorce, including not wanting to look at the attempted marriage in great detail. That is very hard work to do. If your ex-spouse is bitter towards you, asking them to go through with a petition with a tribunal is a daunting prospect. If you can honestly see that you yourself and your immaturity were part of the problem, it is embarrassing and even brings feelings of shame and worthlessness. Many people put it off until their attraction for a new possibility pushes them into it. Human nature…

I do think that there are many things that are working against valid marriages now, and appreciation of chastity as valuable, attainable, and a real virtue is certainly high on that list.

OK, so what is working for valid marriages. Does 2016 offer any helps in finding a spouse that 1950 did not? Well, the same internet that allows pedophiles to find other pedophiles to talk to surely can be used by isolated Catholics to find other isolated Catholics. The question is how to find a way to “vet” these internet finds with someone in the real world. Is there a way to help people find each other that will shut out the wolves from fitting into sheep’s clothing?

I don’t mean keeping people from buffing themselves up to “put their best foot forward.” People do it in person, they’ll do it online, they’ll do it no matter what. I mean filtering out people who are not even remotely what they are pretending to be.

 

[Burt_Macklin]

It is a problem that so many Catholics do not try to find if their first attempt at marriage was valid or not until they decide they’ve found someone they want to marry again. That excludes them from consideration by anyone who takes canon law seriously.

I know it’s just an anecdote but a big reason that I’ve seen people delay applying for an annulment is that they think it will be easier to beg for forgiveness. They feel their case will be more difficult to turn away when they already have a baby on the way or need to bring an attempted marriage into the church. Taking divorce seriously eliminates a bunch of potential mates when you’re entering the dating game later in life.

 

[Bataar]

I really don’t know much about ASD except for the textbook stuff, so I may be way off, but I think a lot of people on the spectrum have more difficulty interacting in groups than one on one.

Bataar, how old are you? If you’re still in school, maybe there are smaller niche clubs or groups you could join. There may be a dating site out there for people with autism/Aspergers. Maybe a local meetup group?

Sometimes social awkwardness (no, I’m not equating awkwardness with autism, but it can be one of the challenges people face) can be masked with cultural differences. Maybe dating a recent immigrant, or someone here on a work or school visa would prove easier.

It is definitely harder to meet and connect with people if you’re on the spectrum, but don’t give up hope. Many people do manage to fall in love, get married, and raise a family.

I’m actually 37. I’m probably socially awkward, but I’m not generally shy. I’m sure people think I’m shy, but I’m really not. Shy implies a fear. A fear of interacting, a fear of rejection, something like that. I generally don’t interact with people I don’t know. It’s not because I’m afraid of it or anything like that, but rather, I just don’t like it. For me, small talk with a stranger is one of the most unpleasant things there is. This person is a stranger. I have no relationship with them. Why do I care about anything they say at this point? If a person is a stranger, why do I care where they work? Why would I want to spend time and energy asking them a question like that in small talk when the answer they provide will generally have no value in and of itself? Generally, with strangers, you don’t know anything about them so you don’t know what they’re interested in. You don’t know if you have any common interests so there’s nothing relevant to talk about therefore there’s no point in talking to them. I know that’s messed up, but that’s the way my brain works.

The other area people might assume I’m shy is my lack of ability to make eye contact. I know this is a general autistic trait. If I see a woman I find attractive and I’m looking at her and she looks at me, I instantly look away. It’s not because I’m shy or afraid it’s just that it seems so inappropriate. It’s hard to describe but it’s almost as if I’m violating her somehow.

For me to initiate something it would have to work like this: I’d be at some kind of gathering or activity that’s a repeating event. While there, I notice a woman who catches my eye. Because she’s still a complete stranger and I don’t know anything about her other than I find her attractive, I wouldn’t say anything to her. I’d observe her and see how she treats others and how she talks to them. Over the course of repeated events, I’d learn more about her and determine if she is someone I think I’d like. Eventually, if I decide she is someone I’d like things to progress with, I’d know enough about her so when I do strike up a conversation, I’d actually know what to talk to her about.

 

[EasterJoy]

I know it’s just an anecdote but a big reason that I’ve seen people delay applying for an annulment is that they think it will be easier to beg for forgiveness. They feel their case will be more difficult to turn away when they already have a baby on the way or need to bring an attempted marriage into the church. Taking divorce seriously eliminates a bunch of potential mates when you’re entering the dating game later in life.

It only gets harder to find witnesses the longer they wait. I can understand avoidance when the wound is still fresh (which could be a very long time) or wanting to avoid someone who is simply dangerous to be around, but if anything it does get more difficult the longer you wait.

 

[pianistclare]

I really don’t know much about ASD except for the textbook stuff, so I may be way off, but I think a lot of people on the spectrum have more difficulty interacting in groups than one on one.

Bataar, how old are you? If you’re still in school, maybe there are smaller niche clubs or groups you could join. There may be a dating site out there for people with autism/Aspergers. Maybe a local meetup group?

Sometimes social awkwardness (no, I’m not equating awkwardness with autism, but it can be one of the challenges people face) can be masked with cultural differences. Maybe dating a recent immigrant, or someone here on a work or school visa would prove easier.

It is definitely harder to meet and connect with people if you’re on the spectrum, but don’t give up hope. Many people do manage to fall in love, get married, and raise a family.

Yes, but all of those things I listed require focus. The meeting of a young lady would be a happy accident, not a prime objective. I think if one is otherwise occupied, one’s social awkwardness is less obvious.
Be good at something and people notice you and admire you. Therein lies the opening for a introductory convo.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

Yes, but all of those things I listed require focus. The meeting of a young lady would be a happy accident, not a prime objective. I think if one is otherwise occupied, one’s social awkwardness is less obvious.
Be good at something and people notice you and admire you. Therein lies the opening for a introductory convo.

I like your idea too. Nothing wrong with casting a wide net and trying it all.

 

[pianistclare]

I like your idea too. Nothing wrong with casting a wide net and trying it all.

Well, the worst thing that can happen is you learn how to make a mean risotto. While doing the samba.

 

[Norseman82]

I’m also kind of curious what the amazing single 30-something guys were doing for the past 10-15 years–have they been diligently doing rosaries and searching this whole time?

Some were finishing their education or military service. Others may have been discerning whether thay had a vocation to the priesthood.

But the real question is why were you ladies blowing us off and jerking us around when we were pursuing during those years? How many threads do we have on here where a guy in his twenties writes about his worries about finding someone, only they are told empty platitudes about how they need to stop looking, they are still young and have plenty of time, “single vocation”, guilt trips about whether it is “God’s will”, they are desperate and unhealthy, they will find someone when they least expect it, they need therapy, etc., etc. And then if someone follow that advice, they are asked what they have been doing? Are people wonder why people are worried about not beng able to find someone in their 20s?

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-isW2dGUbnhw/UNvEcYS679I/AAAAAAAAAnQ/zpVJ3ogylcU/s1600/pope_facepalm.jpg

Sorry, people, you can’t have it both ways.

 

[Norseman82]

A big problem is that this is what the dating pool begins to look like in your 30s:

https://imgur.com/bX9WK6s

My brother is in his early 30s and has complained to me on on numerous occasions that he can’t find anyone. He’s handsome, has decent social skills and a good job. He has no trouble getting a date, it’s simply that most of the women he meets have already started a family. Most of the single women he meets are either recently divorced (still married according to the church) or, if they’re free to marry, have spent the past decade cohabitating. It’s not exaclty the way that most men would desire to start a young family. When you’re late to the table sometimes all you get left with is the scraps.

Let’s also not forget that the pool is kept at dangerously low levels by people who refuse to make themselves available.

 

[Norseman82]

Nope, nope…nope. Stop. No. Finding matches for singles is not part of his pastoral office. If that is your work, then do it. If you need something particular as help, ask for it, but do not ask him to pretend he’s made himself into the parish matchmaker.

FINDING A WIFE FOR YOU IS NOT HIS PASTORAL RESPONSIBILITY. IT IS NOT HIS WORK TO DO. There is no reason in this world he ought to be encouraging you to marry unless the inclination starts with you.

It doesn’t matter if he has time to play poker twice a week and keeps a rose garden in the yard at the rectory–helping you to find a wife is not his job!!

If your parents chose to home-school you, that is fine, but don’t you dare use the time-consuming reality of that choice to criticize your pastor for not jumping when* you *tell him he needs to hop. If that is how your parents taught you to see the priesthood–which I very much doubt!!–they probably should have left teaching that part of the catechism to someone else.

Be honest, though–you got none of this “philosophy” from your parents, did you?

First, stop shouting at ShadowBoxer and insulting his homeschooling.

Second, how often are we told to “network”. So are we supposed to “network” with everyone except the clergy?

 

[Norseman82]

Add “matchmaker” to the list of the pastoral duties of a parish priest? Why? Because you’re too good for the young women your parents would introduce you to? Because you don’t want the young women that the old ladies in the parish will introduce you to? .

I haven’t had parents since I was 14, and the old ladies in the parish introduce me? Ha! That’s a laugh. Only one person - the parish school principal - talked to to me about her daughter, but she cautioned me that the daughter wasn’t religious, so that killed my interest. Oh, and a neighbor mentioned about someone she knew, but she never followed through.

A parish priest is more likely to have St. Paul’s take on the whole thing:
*I should like you to be free of anxieties. An unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord, how he may please the Lord. But a married man is anxious about the things of the world, how he may please his wife, and he is divided. An unmarried woman or a virgin is anxious about the things of the Lord, so that she may be holy in both body and spirit. A married woman, on the other hand, is anxious about the things of the world, how she may please her husband. I am telling you this for your own benefit, not to impose a restraint upon you, but for the sake of propriety and adherence to the Lord without distraction. *
1 Cor. 7:32-35

Who are you to think a priest should not want an undistracted life for you? Because you think he ought to be concerned about breeding the best Catholics to each other in order to churn out those parishioners and those parochial school students and to fatten up “the envelopes” as you put it? He should fail to aim you towards a life of serving the Lord without distraction for those things? No. Heaven forbid.

It is for the priest to encourage those with the vocation to marriage to actually marry each other, not to drum up vocations to the married life among those who might have been better-suited to a life devoted to the Lord without distraction. If you are bent on getting married, well, if your pastor is biting his lip and not telling you to be careful what you wish for, that is enough. Marriage is rewarding but it difficult, it is not the easiest road in the Christian life nor by any default is it the best road. There is no reason for your pastor to push you into it. Rather, it is for him to help you live that vocation if that is the vocation you and your spouse choose.

You are leaving a lot out, like the part further down in 1 Cor. 7 where St. Paul says that it is better to marry than burn and that to avoid immorality, everyone should have their own spouse. Add to that what God said in Genesis about “it is not good for the man to be alone” and what Christ said about “not everyomne can accept” the teaching about “eunichs for the kingdom of God”. Just because celibacy may be a higher calling, not everyone can handle it, and in fact it is possible that what you call an undistracted life is in fact a distraction (sometines to the point of being an occasion of sin).

EasterJoy, are you married? If so, then why did you choose to live the “distracted life”? (I’m asking rhetorically, so you don’t need to answer).