If Jesus came again in the flesh, would this be reincarnation?

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If Jesus came back to earth in the flesh for ministry, either as part of the apocalypse or for other reasons, would this be reincarnation if he were born and conceived again? Just curious, thanks.
 
The LITERAL definition of the word “reincarnation” derives from Latin, literally meaning, “entering the flesh again”.

This could be termed “reincarnation” if we take a literal translation of the word into English and choose to apply it to the concept without reference to what the word MEANS, yes.
However, because the word has an existing meaning, it should not be applied.

Because that is not what the word means. It is the literal translation of the elements in the word. We do not call all religious sisters “Elizabeth” even though the literal translation is “consecrated to God”. The word has a meaning of its own which is independent of the translation. We should always use words for what they MEAN, not what they can be parsed and translated into.

He would not be reincarnated in the sense the word is usually used, although He would be returning in the Flesh.

Then again; can He be said to be returning if He never left? 😉

~Liza
 
Pieman333272 said:
If Jesus came back to earth in the flesh for ministry, either as part of the apocalypse or for other reasons, would this be reincarnation if he were born and conceived again? Just curious, thanks.
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Born and conceived again? Jesus when He comes in the flesh will come to judge as King. He will not come as a baby but as the glorified resurrected Man that He is.
 
Well, funny you should mention that, because Jesus “returns” in the flesh every single day, at the Consecration of the Mass. We call it the Holy Eucharist, which is the body (flesh), blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ. 🙂
 
Jesus is already “in the flesh” in His Glorified Body. How that Body is in heaven right now is a mystery, but in any case, when Jesus comes again, He will already have a body and has no need for another.

Gem
 
Pieman333272 said:
If Jesus came back to earth in the flesh for ministry, either as part of the apocalypse or for other reasons, would this be reincarnation if he were born and conceived again? Just curious, thanks.

(emphasis added)
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No, Christ will not be “reincarnated”, lol :). Christ was incarnated once, about 2000 years ago. Allow me to quote the Apostle’s Creed:
He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit and born of the Virgin Mary.
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Christ was born as human, once. He was conceived in Saint Mary’s womb, once, and was given a human soul at His conception, once!

Christ died a human death once, for the forgiveness of sins. On the third day, He arose from the dead, and forty days later, was assumed bodily into Heaven!

So, Christ is truly human, and truly God. Saint Paul tells us that one day, all of humanity that died in Christ will also be resurrected. However, each human soul is unique. Each human is given one body and one soul. When Christ Comes again, He will not be conceived again, because He is already human. He has only one mother, Saint Mary, Queen of Heaven - if another woman gave birth to Christ, there would be two Queens :eek:. When he returns, he merely will come down from Heaven, just like He got up there!

This is quite possibly one of the most overlooked facts of our faith, so pay attention!
 
Gem said:
Jesus is already “in the flesh” in His Glorified Body. How that Body is in heaven right now is a mystery, but in any case, when Jesus comes again, He will already have a body and has no need for another.

Gem
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exactly:
Jesus rose from the dead physically.
Jesus ascended into heaven in a physical body.
 
tester said:
exactly:
Jesus rose from the dead physically.
Jesus ascended into heaven in a physical body.
Click to expand...
As a non-Christian, this is one of the things I find most interesting. Let me be clear that I’m not contradicting the validity of the idea, but it’s the part I have the hardest time getting my head around. I follow the resurrection part. Good. Then comes the part about Jesus ascending to a physical place called Heaven. I have a hard time visualizing that. I see Him rising up, up, and then off to where? I think to myself, here is a physical body going up and up, but where does it stop? My mind starts to wander back and forth somewhere between the stratosphere and the Kuiper Belt. In my faith, we see heaven as a state of being that can be achieved, but it’s all in the same place - all around you. Here, there, this life, afterlife. In the Christian iteration it sounds more like a place with human bodies walking around. Is there some theory on where that is? One day the earth will be destroyed by the expanding sun, so I’m thinking it’s not earth, because it won’t be here. Is there any theology on that I can read up on to say where Jesus ascended to, and where all of these resurrected bodies will be accommodated? Will they function like human bodies, using oxygen as fuel for the brain and for locomotion, or are they going to be breathing at all? What will they breathe if it’s not on earth? If they are not breathing and functioning like a human body on earth, why will bodies be needed at all? I haven’t seen anything on it and any help would be appreciated. This part if very confusing to me.

Thanks for the help,

Your friend
Sufjon
 
Sufjon said:
As a non-Christian, this is one of the things I find most interesting. Let me be clear that I’m not contradicting the validity of the idea, but it’s the part I have the hardest time getting my head around. I follow the resurrection part. Good. Then comes the part about Jesus ascending to a physical place called Heaven. I have a hard time visualizing that. I see Him rising up, up, and then off to where? I think to myself, here is a physical body going up and up, but where does it stop? My mind starts to wander back and forth somewhere between the stratosphere and the Kuiper Belt. In my faith, we see heaven as a state of being that can be achieved, but it’s all in the same place - all around you. Here, there, this life, afterlife. In the Christian iteration it sounds more like a place with human bodies walking around. Is there some theory on where that is? One day the earth will be destroyed by the expanding sun, so I’m thinking it’s not earth, because it won’t be here. Is there any theology on that I can read up on to say where Jesus ascended to, and where all of these resurrected bodies will be accommodated? Will they function like human bodies, using oxygen as fuel for the brain and for locomotion, or are they going to be breathing at all? What will they breathe if it’s not on earth? If they are not breathing and functioning like a human body on earth, why will bodies be needed at all? I haven’t seen anything on it and any help would be appreciated. This part if very confusing to me.

Thanks for the help,

Your friend
Sufjon
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Hi Sufjon,

I think, and I’m not a professional, that Jesus either levitated until he was out of sight and then teleported (or otherwise went) to heaven, or did it instantly and disappeared after he flew a little away. Heaven, in my opinion, is not inside of the Universe (for now) and therefore isn’t subject to the laws of the Universe such as the sun’s being needed to make it survivable and the big freeze. Whether it’s a multiverse or some totally non-physical realm is up for debate, and I think either works and it doesn’t really matter.

Now, either way, for the time being in Heaven (or either of the other 2 options), we won’t need our bodies. We’ll be souls - spirits, immaterial, whatever you like to call it. The soul doesn’t need oxygen or food or money or sex or water. That’s the big deal about heaven - God fills all you ever wanted or needed! For us, bodies in that state are useless, as we discarded our old ones and will get new ones when the ultimate resurrection (AKA New Heaven and New Earth) takes place. This is no official teaching, but I think Jesus has his body to show that he is fully God and fully Man, although I doubt he would need oxygen anyway.

You’ll want to cross-check this, but that’s my opinion on the topic.
 
Pieman333272 said:
If Jesus came back to earth in the flesh for ministry, either as part of the apocalypse or for other reasons, would this be reincarnation if he were born and conceived again? Just curious, thanks.
Click to expand...
Of course not. Jesus was human died and rose from the dead. He ascended into heaven in His physical body.
 
Sufjon said:
As a non-Christian, this is one of the things I find most interesting. Let me be clear that I’m not contradicting the validity of the idea, but it’s the part I have the hardest time getting my head around. I follow the resurrection part. Good. Then comes the part about Jesus ascending to a physical place called Heaven. I have a hard time visualizing that. I see Him rising up, up, and then off to where?
Click to expand...
I think the point of Him rising up is to show his followers that he didn’t just move to Milwaukee.
 
Pieman333272 said:
Hi Sufjon,

I think, and I’m not a professional, that Jesus either levitated until he was out of sight and then teleported (or otherwise went) to heaven, or did it instantly and disappeared after he flew a little away. Heaven, in my opinion, is not inside of the Universe (for now) and therefore isn’t subject to the laws of the Universe such as the sun’s being needed to make it survivable and the big freeze. Whether it’s a multiverse or some totally non-physical realm is up for debate, and I think either works and it doesn’t really matter.

Now, either way, for the time being in Heaven (or either of the other 2 options), we won’t need our bodies. We’ll be souls - spirits, immaterial, whatever you like to call it. The soul doesn’t need oxygen or food or money or sex or water. That’s the big deal about heaven - God fills all you ever wanted or needed! For us, bodies in that state are useless, as we discarded our old ones and will get new ones when the ultimate resurrection (AKA New Heaven and New Earth) takes place. This is no official teaching, but I think Jesus has his body to show that he is fully God and fully Man, although I doubt he would need oxygen anyway.

You’ll want to cross-check this, but that’s my opinion on the topic.
Click to expand...
Hi Pieman: What you are saying makes perfect sense to me. I can see Jesus moving from one state of reality to another and I agree that an eternal consciousness like Jesus, you, or me would have no need for a body. On the other hand, what I hear from Christians for the most part is different than that. My understanding is that Jesus Floated up to heaven with His body and that all people who are saved will have their resurrected physical bodies back. I heard this when I was small (like 5 years old) , and I would sit on the swing set at the playground and look up in the clouds for Jesus, Mary and the Lorax walking or floating around in the clouds because I had been told the same ending about all three of them. Anyway, your version makes sense to me, and I appreciate your response.

Your friend
Sufjon
 
Pieman333272 said:
If Jesus came back to earth in the flesh for ministry, either as part of the apocalypse or for other reasons, would this be reincarnation if he were born and conceived again? Just curious, thanks.
Click to expand...
What makes you think that Jesus would not come back “in the flesh”. The purpose of the resurrection was that the flesh lives eternally. Do you think Jesus gave up his body after returning to heaven to sit on the right side of God the Father?

At no time in prophecy has it been recorded that God the Son would be re-born. In fact, it states the opposite; when he returns again he will come in all his glory. He will not be reborn again.

Reincarnation is a nothing but a poor reflection of the true doctrine of resurrection.
 
Sufjon said:
As a non-Christian, this is one of the things I find most interesting. Let me be clear that I’m not contradicting the validity of the idea, but it’s the part I have the hardest time getting my head around. I follow the resurrection part. Good. Then comes the part about Jesus ascending to a physical place called Heaven. I have a hard time visualizing that. I see Him rising up, up, and then off to where? I think to myself, here is a physical body going up and up, but where does it stop? My mind starts to wander back and forth somewhere between the stratosphere and the Kuiper Belt. In my faith, we see heaven as a state of being that can be achieved, but it’s all in the same place - all around you. Here, there, this life, afterlife. In the Christian iteration it sounds more like a place with human bodies walking around. Is there some theory on where that is? One day the earth will be destroyed by the expanding sun, so I’m thinking it’s not earth, because it won’t be here. Is there any theology on that I can read up on to say where Jesus ascended to, and where all of these resurrected bodies will be accommodated? Will they function like human bodies, using oxygen as fuel for the brain and for locomotion, or are they going to be breathing at all? What will they breathe if it’s not on earth? If they are not breathing and functioning like a human body on earth, why will bodies be needed at all? I haven’t seen anything on it and any help would be appreciated. This part if very confusing to me.

Thanks for the help,

Your friend
Sufjon
Click to expand...
the Creator of the universe exists outside of the universe.

you can’t take a spaceship to heaven
 
i think a study of Jewish mysticism would really help here. you notice in the story of Jacobs ladder, he saw angels ascending and descending. what were they ascending, and descending? the ladder was really spheres of existence. the kabbalist understand these concepts very well. it ties in with the tree of life, and the teaching that there are alternate universes that are all really connected. i have also talked to Catholic Priest who state that when we die, the veil is lifted. heaven purgatory and hell may very well be right next to us, but we just cannot see them until we either die, or Christ returns for us. Peace 🙂
 
benidict said:
i think a study of Jewish mysticism would really help here. you notice in the story of Jacobs ladder, he saw angels ascending and descending. what were they ascending, and descending? the ladder was really spheres of existence. the kabbalist understand these concepts very well. it ties in with the tree of life, and the teaching that there are alternate universes that are all really connected. i have also talked to Catholic Priest who state that when we die, the veil is lifted. heaven purgatory and hell may very well be right next to us, but we just cannot see them until we either die, or Christ returns for us. Peace 🙂
Click to expand...
Thanks Benedict - that makes pretty good sense. Kabbalistic thought is very close in many ways to what I know, but it’s a bit more nuanced than mainstream Christian thought from what I can tell. I am trying to dig into mainstream Christian thought, but after several years of studying it, I am finally coming to some conclusions.

Thanks again for your help!

Your friend
Sufjon
 
tester said:
the Creator of the universe exists outside of the universe.

you can’t take a spaceship to heaven
Click to expand...
Hi Tester - this is exactly what I am struggling with. I agree that the Creator of the universe exists outside the causal realm and independently of it. An all-pervasive consciousness that is without beginning or end. My question is this being the case, what need has He for a human body that is specially adapted to life on a planet that has only been around for a short time in comparison with eternity and will only be around a short time longer on the same scale. It follows then that I would wonder what need we would have for these bodies after that point as well. A human body is made up of mostly organs that are of no use whatsoever outside of it’s planetary habitat for which it was designed, and this is a very specific habitat. For instance, in a heavenly realm, what use is there for a stomach, a pancreas, a liver, a heart, lungs and so forth, if the habitat that they were developed to operate in was gone? Without use for the organs, that what use is there for the skeletal system and outer layers of skin that keep them together? Putting our use for them aside, what use would a completely free immortal soul have for the bonds of a cage? This is what I struggle to understand, believe or even find appealing to the intellect. I am being very honest about this.

Your friend
Sufjon
 
Pieman333272 said:
If Jesus came back to earth in the flesh for ministry, either as part of the apocalypse or for other reasons, would this be reincarnation if he were born and conceived again? Just curious, thanks.
Click to expand...
Reincarnation, as I understand it, means that your soul (or spirit) is re-conceived and you are born as a different person from who you were in a prior life. Jesus’ resurection was an absolute defeat of death - because He was resurrected in His own original flesh, not as a different person, but as the same Jesus that was crucified, died and was buried. He was not reincarnated as Jesus 2.0. This same Jesus ascended to heaven and will come again as the same Jesus - not as a new incarnation, but as the same triumphant Jesus that ascended to heaven after the resurrection. So, I don’t think you could call his second coming as a reincarnation, because He was only “incarnated” once.

Peace,
Robert
 
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