If the Catholic Church is wrong, which non-Catholic denomination is right?

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SD_Catholic said:
It has to be those Lutherans:D

SD
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😛 😛 Thanks, SD, for the 😃 .

When bpbasilphx says this
Infalliblity among Protestants rests in the previous pastor, if not in the individual believer.
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I get the feeling he hasn’t read the Lutheran Confessions. It’s another one of those protestants as monolith kind of comments.
Jon
 
Jimmy, if you were asking questions out of sincerity, I’d answer. I don’t get the impression that you are, based on the tone, sarcasm, and snide remarks.

Since you don’t understand what a Strawman fallacy is, I’ll simply say that you are a jerk when it comes to apologetics, and you are a baiter when it comes to argument. You were probably a bully when you were a kid. I hope you weren’t when you were a cop.

It is clear that you are big enough to dish it out - I will assume that you are big enough to take it.

Catholicism is a wonderful tradition and expression of the Christian faith, Jimmy. I have respect for your faith - can you have respect for mine?

I sincerely doubt that you can.
 
Jimmy_B said:
If the Catholic Church is wrong, which non-Catholic denomination is right?

Aren’t different denominations, different because they all hold different beliefs and have different rule-sets?

Why, for instance, would someone here choose to be a Baptist as apposed to being a Methodist?

….Baptist right….Methodist wrong?

I find it interesting that there exist so many Protestant non-Catholics here, who argue the differences between their own denomination and Catholicism but have nothing to say about the differences between, their denomination and other non-Catholic Christian denominations.

What’s up with that?

Is this caused by an inherent trait among all Protestants to continue protesting Catholicism? Is this Protesting, “protesting” of the Catholic Church, something that has been built into these different denominations?

Or…is this simply a case of denial?

Or…a case of being disingenuous?

Maybe, simply… hypocrisy?

How much of this is caused by ego?

You tell me, with all of the differences, which exist among Protestant denominations, why so much attention given to the Catholic faith?

Is this a case of jealousy, or maybe it is because, deep down inside, all Protestants know that the Catholic Church is the true Church started by Jesus Christ.

I believe that, for many, especially “former” Catholics, it is a rebellious act, because they themselves have done something that has caused their own separation from the Church and now they have to rationalize why, they were right and the Catholic Church was wrong.

Please explain why the Catholic Church gets so much attention from non-Catholics. Maybe it is simply because we are the oldest and largest Christian community…You tell me…is that it?

Or….maybe the Devil is in play here….

Finally, it seems to me that Protestants here, are real forgiving and show that Christian charity towards other non-Catholics here but for some reason can’t forgive, respect and be charitable to the other Christians here….the Catholics!

Note: Many of my comments here are of a general nature, and do not apply to everyone.

Your thoughts?
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Speaking for myself. I am here to learn about the Catholic church.
I grew up baptist. That’s the only religion that was allowed to be discussed. When it came to reading, the Holy Bible was the only book to read especially if knowledge of the Lord was desired.
I believe the reason protestants are here wanting to discuss the Catholic church and what’s “wrong” with it is because this website is for Catholics and others wishing to find out about the Catholic church. If someone wants to talk about what’s wrong with the Baptist church they would probably visit a protestant based website. Mainly because protestants would be the ones interested in finding out about the baptist church.
That’s just my opinion of course.
I don’t believe the Catholic church is wrong. There are many things the Catholic church does that I desire in worshiping the Lord.
Unfortunately I can’t get past a few Catholic practices.
Blame it on being brainwashed or maybe the Holy Spirit guiding my way. I don’t know which it is really. I want to go to Catholic mass so bad. Yet there’s a voice that tells me,“They will have statues of Mary all over the place. They will say the hail Mary prayer asking Mary to forgive us our sins now and at the hour of our death.” And that voice says,“That’s not what Jesus taught.”
So I continue to listen to Catholic answers live and EWTN.
I come in here and read what you and others write about your faith.
I don’t say any religion is wrong or even right. I can only say that the word of God is the written word. Jesus is the word.
If I’m going to spend eternity in hell because I clung to what the word of God says. Then I guess I just wasn’t one of the chosen ones. If God himself saved Saul, whom we now know as Paul.
Then I trust God himself can save me too,if he wants.
The bible does also say that he doesn’t want anyone to be lost.
I cling to those words.
 
hays1122 said:
Unfortunately I can’t get past a few Catholic practices.
Blame it on being brainwashed or maybe the Holy Spirit guiding my way. I don’t know which it is really. I want to go to Catholic mass so bad. Yet there’s a voice that tells me,“They will have statues of Mary all over the place. They will say the hail Mary prayer asking Mary to forgive us our sins now and at the hour of our death.” And that voice says,“That’s not what Jesus taught.”
So I continue to listen to Catholic answers live and EWTN.
I come in here and read what you and others write about your faith.
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Have you watched an entire Catholic Mass on EWTN before?
 
Rolltide said:
That seems to be a very fair criticism, but it’s not exactly a point of doctrine. I mean, that doesn’t affect my salvation in any way.

Let me give you a different example.

I know I had you read this news story a couple of days ago:
washingtontimes.com/news/2008/dec/04/anglican-conservatives-propose-constitution/

One group believes that having practicing homosexual bishops and blessing homosexual unions is ok. The other believes it’s a sin. The denomination is splitting over a question of morality. Either homosexual unions are ok, or they aren’t. It can’t be both. So… is one of these denominations practicing a belief that could actually condemn them to hell, because they are unknowingly committing a sin? Whichever side of the issue you’re on, isn’t it critically important?
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I am against gay marriage. My church has never had this problem. We did have 1 incident. I’ll explain it, even though I really dis-trust all of the people here to be half-way respectful about it.

My cousin was the church minister, he was real young considering minister (he was like 30) for about a year he taught then something happened. A woman and a man (married) were having affairs with each other, he told them to stop coming to church or something like that, forgot, their was some rumor about an occult going on too, but anyways. The deacons got together and told him to get outa town (lol too many louis lamour books), and a lot of the church went with him. Most of them people are dead or left the church altogether. I now go to the church, I like the new minister, but their is still a small, faint, but shadowy feeling of distrust I feel towards my family.
Roman_Catholic said:
Although it looks like the OP angered some with this question (or maybe it was how he asked it), I do find it a valid question and one that I have often wondered myself. So if you have an answer or even a comment on it I for one would appreciate reading it.

God bless you
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The OP makes these topics, and asks reasonable questions, but not reasonably. He is baiting protestants into saying anything wrong, no offense to Jimmy, but thats wrong and stupid.
 
ChristianKnight said:
I am against gay marriage. My church has never had this problem. We did have 1 incident. I’ll explain it, even though I really dis-trust all of the people here to be half-way respectful about it.

My cousin was the church minister, he was real young considering minister (he was like 30) for about a year he taught then something happened. A woman and a man (married) were having affairs with each other, he told them to stop coming to church or something like that, forgot, their was some rumor about an occult going on too, but anyways. The deacons got together and told him to get outa town (lol too many louis lamour books), and a lot of the church went with him. Most of them people are dead or left the church altogether. I now go to the church, I like the new minister, but their is still a small, faint, but shadowy feeling of distrust I feel towards my family.
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I am deeply sorry to hear about the problems that your church has had.

The point I was trying to make before about moral relativism applies to that split within the Episcopalians. I was trying to show how among some Protestant groups, this can be a real problem. (Of course, that does not apply to ALL denominations, but one has to be really careful about relativism, because it can tear a group apart.) In general, the unity of doctrine and moral absolutism of the Catholic Church allows our denomination to avoid most such problems.
 
Rolltide said:
I am deeply sorry to hear about the problems that your church has had.

The point I was trying to make before about moral relativism applies to that split within the Episcopalians. I was trying to show how among some Protestant groups, this can be a real problem. (Of course, that does not apply to ALL denominations, but one has to be really careful about relativism, because it can tear a group apart.) In general, the unity of doctrine and moral absolutism of the Catholic Church allows our denomination to avoid most such problems.
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That is the problem, your generalizing. A baptist is nothing like a JW. A mormon is nothing like a Baptist. I mean, that’s like comparing a Muslim to a Hindu cause they both exist in India.
 
Here is the Hail Mary prayer, Hays, because somebody apparently got confused about what it actually says.

"Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our deaths."

See, there is absolutely nothing there about Mary ‘forgiving’ our sins. She can’t. No Catholic believes that she could, does, or ever did. She isn’t God. She doesn’t forgive sins.

Like all people though she can pray. Prayer is simply communication, usually ‘asking’ for or about something. For example, a word like “prithee” (good old Shakespearean English)literally means, “Pray thee (you)” and is understood as asking a person to listen. Nothing more or less with just those words, “pray thee”.

Yes, there are statues of Mary. . .and of Jesus, too. Even a crucifix so that we can ‘remember’ His great sacrifice for us. Of course, when we look at the crucifix we don’t actually think we’re looking at Jesus Himself. And when we look at statues of saints we don’t think they’re the saints themselves. And we certainly do not worship those statues, anymore than you worship your Bible when you go into a church, take it out, and look at it. You don’t confuse your Bible with the Living God, why would you confuse a statue with a real being?

God bless you. Try not to worry and let the devil confuse you with a lot of things that really do not exist in the Church (saint-worship really does not exist.)

Honestly, if Catholics did worship saints, we’d tell you. Heaven knows we don’t hold back on our beliefs, even when people call us ‘cannibals’ for believing in the Real Presence. So why would we lie about other practices? It just doesn’t make sense. Either we worship things but don’t know we do (which is ridiculous, how can you worship something unless you know you’re worshipping it?), or we worship it and lie about it (which again is silly because there is absolutely no reason TO lie about our religious practices), or we don’t worship things (and only worship God), and it’s other people who knowingly or unknowingly are spreading misinformation about Catholics for their own reasons.
 
ChristianKnight said:
That is the problem, your generalizing. A baptist is nothing like a JW. A mormon is nothing like a Baptist. I mean, that’s like comparing a Muslim to a Hindu cause they both exist in India.
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Many Christians would not consider JW’s OR Mormons to be Christian, due to their differing beliefs on the Trinity. However… MOST true Protestants do share some core beliefs in common that differentiate them from Catholics:

Belief in the authority of Scripture alone, rather than Scripture and tradition
Belief in justification by faith alone
Rejection of the Deuterocanonicals / Apocrypha in the Bible
Rejection of all sacraments except Baptism and Communion
Rejection of a celibate clergy
Rejection of intercessionary prayer
Rejection of the pope
Rejection of the use (or very limited use) of statues and images within worship
(and so on…)

When we talk in generalizations about Protestants, this is really what most people mean. It’s not true for ALL groups, but it’s true for MOST groups, and almost every group that holds to these conclusions arose in the 1500s by “protesting” the authority of the Catholic Church and the pope.
 
Jimmy_B said:
If the Catholic Church is wrong, which non-Catholic denomination is right?

Aren’t different denominations, different because they all hold different beliefs and have different rule-sets?

Why, for instance, would someone here choose to be a Baptist as apposed to being a Methodist?

….Baptist right….Methodist wrong?

I find it interesting that there exist so many Protestant non-Catholics here, who argue the differences between their own denomination and Catholicism but have nothing to say about the differences between, their denomination and other non-Catholic Christian denominations.

What’s up with that?

Is this caused by an inherent trait among all Protestants to continue protesting Catholicism? Is this Protesting, “protesting” of the Catholic Church, something that has been built into these different denominations?

Or…is this simply a case of denial?

Or…a case of being disingenuous?

Maybe, simply… hypocrisy?

How much of this is caused by ego?

You tell me, with all of the differences, which exist among Protestant denominations, why so much attention given to the Catholic faith?

Is this a case of jealousy, or maybe it is because, deep down inside, all Protestants know that the Catholic Church is the true Church started by Jesus Christ.

I believe that, for many, especially “former” Catholics, it is a rebellious act, because they themselves have done something that has caused their own separation from the Church and now they have to rationalize why, they were right and the Catholic Church was wrong.

Please explain why the Catholic Church gets so much attention from non-Catholics. Maybe it is simply because we are the oldest and largest Christian community…You tell me…is that it?

Or….maybe the Devil is in play here….

Finally, it seems to me that Protestants here, are real forgiving and show that Christian charity towards other non-Catholics here but for some reason can’t forgive, respect and be charitable to the other Christians here….the Catholics!

Note: Many of my comments here are of a general nature, and do not apply to everyone.

Your thoughts?
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You are wrong again.
 
You seem to me like a smart guy. With that being the case, why don’t you just read your Bible and let your brain work for you and let the Holy Spirit help you to understand it. If you truly did that, you would not be Roman Catholic anymore, I guarantee it.
 
Rolltide said:
Many Christians would not consider JW’s OR Mormons to be Christian, due to their differing beliefs on the Trinity. However… MOST true Protestants do share some core beliefs in common that differentiate them from Catholics:

Belief in the authority of Scripture alone, rather than Scripture and tradition
Belief in justification by faith alone
Rejection of the Deuterocanonicals / Apocrypha in the Bible
Rejection of all sacraments except Baptism and Communion
Rejection of a celibate clergy
Rejection of intercessionary prayer
Rejection of the pope
Rejection of the use (or very limited use) of statues and images within worship
(and so on…)

When we talk in generalizations about Protestants, this is really what most people mean. It’s not true for ALL groups, but it’s true for MOST groups, and almost every group that holds to these conclusions arose in the 1500s by “protesting” the authority of the Catholic Church and the pope.
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JW’s and Mormons are…akward. I don’t care, if they go to heaven, then they must be doing something good.
 
ChristianKnight said:
JW’s and Mormons are…akward. I don’t care, if they go to heaven, then they must be doing something good.
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Well, that’s the question. I could refer you to my friend Excaliber, a former Jehovah’s Witness, who after a year of discussion on here, has decided to convert to Catholicism. (He read his Bible and let the Holy Spirit help him understand things…) He can tell you about his awful experiences of racism and rejection within the headquarters of the JW’s. He was very high ranking.

Yes… the JW’s and Mormons ARE akward. So, are they going to heaven because of their beliefs, or in spite of them?
 
Rolltide said:
Well, that’s the question. I could refer you to my friend Excaliber, a former Jehovah’s Witness, who after a year of discussion on here, has decided to convert to Catholicism. (He read his Bible and let the Holy Spirit help him understand things…) He can tell you about his awful experiences of racism and rejection within the headquarters of the JW’s. He was very high ranking.

Yes… the JW’s and Mormons ARE akward. So, are they going to heaven because of their beliefs, or in spite of them?
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I never said they was, I said if they do go to heaven they must be doing something right. I think you go to heaven based on your personal relatioship with God, not on your church affiliation.
 
ChristianKnight said:
I never said they was, I said if they do go to heaven they must be doing something right. I think you go to heaven based on your personal relatioship with God, not on your church affiliation.
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Well, that’s certainly a part of it, but not all. There are plenty of Catholics who will NOT go to heaven, trust me. Now, that said… if a denomination teaches false things that lead someone away, then church affiliation IS affecting whether or not they go to heaven, isn’t it?
 
Rolltide said:
Well, that’s certainly a part of it, but not all. There are plenty of Catholics who will NOT go to heaven, trust me. Now, that said… if a denomination teaches false things that lead someone away, then church affiliation IS affecting whether or not they go to heaven, isn’t it?
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Yes, but it is not permanently putting them their. I do not think I am gonna go to hell for being a Baptist, I do not think you go to hell for being a Catholic.

I decided to do this cause of Guanophore talking about good qualities, 5 good things about the RCC:
  1. Has Rolltide in it.
  2. Has a long history. (Good and Bad, focusing on good atm)
  3. Huge churches.
  4. Large membership.
  5. Higher % of heavy-devotionals (I believe, not for sure, but I think the RCC has a higher % of people that are actually devoted then Protestant churches in general. Does that mean CAtholics are more devoted? No, but I think they have more that are considering how large they are.)
 
ChristianKnight said:
5 good things about the RCC:
  1. Has Rolltide in it.
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Well, that’s certainly kind of you to say. I assure you, I’m not perfect. lol I also assure you that there are MANY good people within the Catholic Church (and a few bad ones too.)
 
Rolltide said:
Well, that’s certainly kind of you to say. I assure you, I’m not perfect. lol I also assure you that there are MANY good people within the Catholic Church (and a few bad ones too.)
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Well yea, but your a friend, not just a role-model.

btw: What is going on, on EWTN, its awful.
 
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