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If the Catholic Church is wrong, which non-Catholic denomination is right?
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Rolltide
Guest
The “length” is only for the selection of candidates. As I stated before, it is God that makes the ultimate decision through the use of two miracles. If the miracles occur, then the church knows that its selection was right. If the two miracles never show up, it never says anything again. As examples of cases that are under examination right now, Pope John Paul II has been selected as someone under consideration, but there haven’t been any miracles yet. Mother Teresa has also been selected, but only one of the two miracles needed has occurred so far.
As far as Mary’s case is concerned, that is a mandatory belief of the Catholic faith. We believe that Mary was “assumed” into heaven. She could not experience a normal death, since she was without sin, so she was brought up to heaven, body and soul, like Elijah.
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Rolltide
Guest
Out of curiosity, I’ll ask again. Do you have any opinion on the miracles and appearances of Mary in Mexico, Lourdes, and Fatima?
S
SD_Catholic
Guest
That’s true… and since I don’t, I must rely on what you say… so when you say you don’t care about the history of the Church… and you don’t care about the opinions of the Saints… well then what am I left to think?
SD
J
JRKH
Guest
Since you have NO interest in what the RCC or any other denomination says, then you have NO RIGHT to say that the Catholic Church has no right to declare someone a saint, or to use your words, “judge who is in heaven and who isn’t”.
Since you have no idea of what a saint in the Church is, or how the process works, or any interest in learning the process, or listening to those who can explain it, then you have no right to make ANY statement derogatory to the Church.
I realize that you are only 16 years old and have a lot of learning yet ahead of you, but to sit at your computer and in one sentance declare that you don’t care about RCC history or anyone’s denomination, and then in another sentance declare that the Church has NO RIGHT to do something within it’s own structure, is the Height of Arrogance.
I am sorry to be so harsh on you, and maybe I’m just out of sorts since yesterday was a VERY bad day for DW and I, but frankly, the way your posts are running begins to sound very baiting and trollish. I don’t believe that this is what you are trying to do or be, but this is what it reads like to me.
Peace
James
F
fbl9
Guest
like i said the the use of the word judge is mistaken in the declaration of who is a saint in heaven…
Actually what our Lord is speaking about here is avoiding the i am better then you are type judgements…
one is not to look down on trapped sinners and think to one’s self that they are better then the sinners.i know what it is like to be trapped in sin and i only look to others trapped in sins with mercy and compassion,for i was just like them once.
J
John1
Guest
I agree considerably with your understanding of Matthew chapter 7 I’m always amazed, or shocked, when I see how many people take what Jesus was saying and twist it to mean something that it obviously doesn’t. As far as the question of the OP, I think it would be important to make sure that whichever group of Christians was actually teaching what Jesus was teaching, and not teaching doctrines based on some twisted logic.
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Kenshin
Guest
Guy: So, what religion are you?
Me: Christian
Guy: Yeah, but what religion?
Me: Ugh…
A few words first:
Unfortunately, we live in a time where men are driven by greed, passions, money, and the comforts of the world (not all, but many). The church of Yahshua Ha Mashiach (Jesus the Christ) is no exception. In fact, we are Satan’s very goal, and his greatest achievement has been the infiltration of the Christian faith (1 John 2: 18 &19). Jesus’ very betrayer was one of his closest followers and friends.
No man is beyond the wiles of the devil. None. This includes preachers, priests, church directors, missionaries, mom, dad, etc…the pope included, regardless of his “infallibility”. These influential people in our lives teach what they were taught/what they believe, and the greater their influence, the greater the potential to do good or evil. In the end, our salvation is on us and no one else. Yahshua left it to us to “test the spirits.” So decide for yourself whether who you follow and what you believe is truly of Yahshua. “…Work out your salvation with fear and trembling…”
Many (if not most) people that claim to be Christian are only paying lip service and fall far short of the title. They may have never even picked up a Bible. Sadly, Gandhi said it best, "“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” This is far too true today. We have become complacent, and have aligned ourselves and our faith with that of the the world to the point that the world recognizes us as its own, and not that of the Creator. John 17:13-16. Our greatest example was God Himself, come in the flesh, and we are to model our lives after Him, not what the world demands us to be.
That said, I think the thread/question posed answers itself: none have it right. We are told in the Bible that the closer to Jesus’ 2nd coming we get the more deception there will be, even to the point that the elect would be lost if it were possible. The only way we are to avoid being deceived is to educate ourselves and to know His Word for it is our armor. It is by the Word that Jesus Himself defeated the temptation in the desert, why should we not be the same? Mt 4: 1-11. There are many anti-christs in the world, and many amongst our ranks.1 John 2: 18 &19. Jesus warned us to be ever on guard, for what better place for the devil to lay his traps than from within our “secure walls.”
The true church may not be a denomination at all, but maybe the scattered groups of people that have come together and formed communities with Yahshua and His Word for their foundations and as their very way of life… Possibly they have it more right then us all? Could be
I am assuming we all here are Christians. In the beginning, that was all there was. No roman catholicism, no protestants…Christians (a.k.a. Followers of the man Yahshua the Messiah). This bickering gets us nowhere, does nothing to promote the cause, and plays us right into Satan’s hand. It focus our attention away from the point: the Son of God, our Savior, and our King: Jesus. Given the state of the world today, it’s time for us to put our energies to better use and go spread Christ’s Gospel, not the dogma of religious denominations. Please, let it go, and focus on what matters
Me: Christian
Guy: Yeah, but what religion?
Me: Ugh…
A few words first:
Unfortunately, we live in a time where men are driven by greed, passions, money, and the comforts of the world (not all, but many). The church of Yahshua Ha Mashiach (Jesus the Christ) is no exception. In fact, we are Satan’s very goal, and his greatest achievement has been the infiltration of the Christian faith (1 John 2: 18 &19). Jesus’ very betrayer was one of his closest followers and friends.
No man is beyond the wiles of the devil. None. This includes preachers, priests, church directors, missionaries, mom, dad, etc…the pope included, regardless of his “infallibility”. These influential people in our lives teach what they were taught/what they believe, and the greater their influence, the greater the potential to do good or evil. In the end, our salvation is on us and no one else. Yahshua left it to us to “test the spirits.” So decide for yourself whether who you follow and what you believe is truly of Yahshua. “…Work out your salvation with fear and trembling…”
Many (if not most) people that claim to be Christian are only paying lip service and fall far short of the title. They may have never even picked up a Bible. Sadly, Gandhi said it best, "“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” This is far too true today. We have become complacent, and have aligned ourselves and our faith with that of the the world to the point that the world recognizes us as its own, and not that of the Creator. John 17:13-16. Our greatest example was God Himself, come in the flesh, and we are to model our lives after Him, not what the world demands us to be.
That said, I think the thread/question posed answers itself: none have it right. We are told in the Bible that the closer to Jesus’ 2nd coming we get the more deception there will be, even to the point that the elect would be lost if it were possible. The only way we are to avoid being deceived is to educate ourselves and to know His Word for it is our armor. It is by the Word that Jesus Himself defeated the temptation in the desert, why should we not be the same? Mt 4: 1-11. There are many anti-christs in the world, and many amongst our ranks.1 John 2: 18 &19. Jesus warned us to be ever on guard, for what better place for the devil to lay his traps than from within our “secure walls.”
The true church may not be a denomination at all, but maybe the scattered groups of people that have come together and formed communities with Yahshua and His Word for their foundations and as their very way of life… Possibly they have it more right then us all? Could be
I am assuming we all here are Christians. In the beginning, that was all there was. No roman catholicism, no protestants…Christians (a.k.a. Followers of the man Yahshua the Messiah). This bickering gets us nowhere, does nothing to promote the cause, and plays us right into Satan’s hand. It focus our attention away from the point: the Son of God, our Savior, and our King: Jesus. Given the state of the world today, it’s time for us to put our energies to better use and go spread Christ’s Gospel, not the dogma of religious denominations. Please, let it go, and focus on what matters
K
Kenshin
Guest
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Harland
Guest
Would someone please answer the question. My denomination is the true one because. . . Not that the Catholic Church is not correct because you worship Mary or you have a pope that tells you what to believe and not the bible like my denomination. And my denomination’s bible interpretation is more correct than any of other denominations because we have the Holy Spirit to guide us.
All I see is Catholic bashing. Please answer the question. If you can.
All I see is Catholic bashing. Please answer the question. If you can.
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SD_Catholic
Guest
IT ALL MATTERS!!!.. if it didn’t then the Bible would be a lot shorter and a lot easier to understand… and since it all matters then it also matters if your church teaches ALL these things that matter… certainly there are bigger issues than others but all are important.
SD
J
JRKH
Guest
Kenshin,
Welcome to the forums.
So much truth here. We all would do well to heed some of Jesus words to the Scribes and Pharasees.
Also it is very true that The Church is Satan’s main target and one of his greatest achievements was the “reformation”. While the earlier split of East and West was bad, at least these Churches retained much of their original apostolic identity. The same can certainly not be said for the non-catholic churches in the west.
Also agree with much of this. Of course, as a catholic, I accept that there is a point at which the pope IS protected by “infallibility”, though that does not necessarily apply to his personal words or actions. Just As Jesus told his disciples to do as the Pharasees TOLD them but not what the Pharasees DID. A teaching can be good, even if the teacher is a sinner.
I especially like your reference to “Test the Spirits”. This can be a long process. For while the Bible is the common starting point for a Christians faith, “testing the spirits” can involve much more, including history and our own reason. You are absolutely correct that each must work out their own…
Nicely Put!!
Another quote (don’t know who) said, " it’s not that Christianity has been tried and found wanting, it is that Christiantiy has not been tried."
Again, well put. I highlighted the one statement because it is both the simple and complex of the matter. For in “educating” themselves many more may have found damnation than find salvation. This is why we hold to the firm foundation and bulwark that is His Church rather than relying on our own poor intellect.
I suppose that you could be right here, but the Bible certainly does not support the idea of the Church being disunified and scattered.
Again - I couldn’t agree with you more.
Now if we could just all agree on what the Gospels mean so we can all spread the same one.
Saying that we need to spread the Gospel is a simple statement, but when that Gospel tells us to “Take it (disagreements) to the Church”, which church do we take it to? Especially if, as you say, none have it right.
Peace
James
H
hays1122
Guest
Most anyone who belongs to a church will say that another church is wrong in one way or another.
I have never met anyone who loves their church and loves all the other churches too.
The reason they attend the church they are attending is because they have formed an opinion about that church. I assume the opinion is positive. Or maybe they are just visiting different churches.
Anyway why pick on someone who says they believe their church is “the right one”,when you feel that way about your church.
Other wise you wouldn’t be attending regularly. If you attend at all.
Or a person could also be attending a church only because they were raised to believe that the denomination in question is the right one. I’m sure many people go to church only because they don’t want to get in trouble with their parents or whoever they look up to for guidance.
Like I’ve said before. I’m protestant because that’s what I was raised to be. Many of you are Catholic because that’s what you were raised to be. And on and on it goes,just pick any religion.
One day Jesus will let us know if we were on the right road or not.
And this is why I’m starting to believe in purgatory. Because I won’t know till I die if I was miss lead by my parents. And my mother was miss lead by her parents.
Purgatory sounds like a good option to consider. I hope for purgatory.
I don’t like the other option I have been offered which is straight to the lake of fire with you!
I have never met anyone who loves their church and loves all the other churches too.
The reason they attend the church they are attending is because they have formed an opinion about that church. I assume the opinion is positive. Or maybe they are just visiting different churches.
Anyway why pick on someone who says they believe their church is “the right one”,when you feel that way about your church.
Other wise you wouldn’t be attending regularly. If you attend at all.
Or a person could also be attending a church only because they were raised to believe that the denomination in question is the right one. I’m sure many people go to church only because they don’t want to get in trouble with their parents or whoever they look up to for guidance.
Like I’ve said before. I’m protestant because that’s what I was raised to be. Many of you are Catholic because that’s what you were raised to be. And on and on it goes,just pick any religion.
One day Jesus will let us know if we were on the right road or not.
And this is why I’m starting to believe in purgatory. Because I won’t know till I die if I was miss lead by my parents. And my mother was miss lead by her parents.
Purgatory sounds like a good option to consider. I hope for purgatory.
I don’t like the other option I have been offered which is straight to the lake of fire with you!
J
Jimmy_B
Guest
Hello hays1122,
All good points!
I just wanted to add that I have read posts here, where people attended the Church nearest to their home and that for some, attending another Church may be difficult for the simple reason that there may not be any other Christian Church nearby.
My wife and I travelled to Texas last summer, house shopping and one of our biggest concerns, was finding a house near a Roman Catholic parish…hopefully in walking distance.
It is a lot easier to attend Mass every day, when the Church is located just down the street. My Grandmother lived a couple blocks from here parish and she was a daily communicant. When the whether was nice, she walk to Church.
Thank you for your post.
I hope that you have a Merry Christmas!
C
ChristianKnight
Guest
How is it mistaken? You JUDGE who is in heaven.
LOL, umk. Well, obviously my opinoin doesn’t matter since I have no church affiliation, so I will just stop posting after sunday, I am sure that is good since I am probably gonna get banned before then.
Sorry, but why should I care what they think? I care about the DISCIPLES, not the SAINTS.
Well, if their is no Biblical proof, then I am just not gonna be able to believe it.
S
SD_Catholic
Guest
Why would you get banned? do you have something big planned?
Which Disciples? do you mean Apostles, aren’t we all called to be disciples?
What men collected and assembled the books of the Bible you hold so dear… would you trust the opinions of these men? Do you think they would have kept those books in the Bible if they didn’t agree with what they said… Of course not… it had much to do with how they decided which ones went in and which did not… Now if you have a different opinion about something thats in the Bible over the ones who actually put the books together that made it the Bible, then who’s opinion do you think is more trustworthy? Honestly… just think about that question for 5 minutes before you respond.
SD
L
LilyM
Guest
Or in Kenshin’s case ‘my beliefs about Christ are the correct ones because …’
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look3467
Guest
What if we rephrased your question to read: If the Catholic Church is right, which non-Catholic denomination is wrong?
My understanding is that all churches are in the hands of God to reach the masses because God is given to save it.
If we are to look at humanity as God sees it, we would have to understand why then would He give His Son to be a ransom for all of them, being that there so many different denominations.
If we respect the fact that not all peoples are born with the same belief, we can appreciate the love of God transcending all of them in love.
Jesus commanded us to love God with all our mind, heart and soul, which to many, God is not Jesus, yet their beliefs are in the same God of love.
Note: Radicals are in every belief not motivated by Godly love.
The second Commandment of Jesus to us is to love our neighbor as ourselves which indicates that Jesus wants us to love those who He suffered and died for to.
Therefore, my view is that if you are a Catholic, continue, yet be mindful of exercising Gods love where there is no love.
The same say I about the rest of them.
To God be all the glory, honor and praise!
Peace>>>AJ
My understanding is that all churches are in the hands of God to reach the masses because God is given to save it.
If we are to look at humanity as God sees it, we would have to understand why then would He give His Son to be a ransom for all of them, being that there so many different denominations.
If we respect the fact that not all peoples are born with the same belief, we can appreciate the love of God transcending all of them in love.
Jesus commanded us to love God with all our mind, heart and soul, which to many, God is not Jesus, yet their beliefs are in the same God of love.
Note: Radicals are in every belief not motivated by Godly love.
The second Commandment of Jesus to us is to love our neighbor as ourselves which indicates that Jesus wants us to love those who He suffered and died for to.
Therefore, my view is that if you are a Catholic, continue, yet be mindful of exercising Gods love where there is no love.
The same say I about the rest of them.
To God be all the glory, honor and praise!
Peace>>>AJ
C
ChristianKnight
Guest
No, but I have been warned twice in a day, and I am probably gonna get another one just cause I am tired of this place.
Probably not. Um, no I thought about it for 30 seconds, and I like my opinoin but it would depend on who’s opinoin I think had facts.
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