"If you died right now, are you 100% sure you would go to Heaven? (St. Paul wasn't)

[flyersfan1088]

Mans works have absolutely no bearing on ones salvation simply because it is a free gift.
A free gift therefore need not: no recompense.
Freely given, so freely give.

Peace>>>AJ

Again I would ask you to read Matthew 25.
And yes, salvation is a free gift. But we are responsible for how we use that gift. If you doubt that than you should re-read the parable of the talents.

 

[Lampo]

look3467…Some questions for you:

1. Are you “saved”?(using your definition of saved)
2. If you answered yes to question #1, then you are a “true” Christian as opposed to a “superficial” Christian, correct?
3. Do you commit sin?
4. If you answered yes to question #3, what if the next time you sin you IMMEDIATELY drop dead of an aneurysm - do you still go to Heaven?
5. Can a “saved”(your definition again) person go to Hell?
6. If you answered yes to question #5, how?

 

[look3467]

look3467…Some questions for you:

1. Are you “saved”?(using your definition of saved) >>>Lampo

Absolutely!

1. If you answered yes to question #1, then you are a “true” Christian as opposed to a “superficial” Christian, correct?>>>Lampo

The word Christian is a generic term of which anything can happen under that term.
I am a believer in Jesus Christ who takes His promises as dictated by God to wards me and lives under those promises because I have no power of my own to live for God.
If Christ via the Holy Spirit dwells not in me, I am totally nothing.

1. Do you commit sin?>>>Lampo

Yes, and I am accountable for my sins while I am yet alive, but after this life, my soul belongs to the God who purchased it by the blood of Jesus.

1. If you answered yes to question #3, what if the next time you sin you IMMEDIATELY drop dead of an aneurysm - do you still go to Heaven?>>>Lampo

Yes, for the heavenly end of things Jesus bridged the gap, released the prisoners that were held until He came and heavens gate opened to accept souls.
Now, it says the wages of sin is death, meaning that when I die, that is it for sin, and my soul belongs to God.

1. Can a “saved”(your definition again) person go to Hell?>>>Lampo

NO! Neither can an unsaved person as well.
If you study the bible on hell, you will find that Jesus holds the keys.
That means that He broke open the gates of hell (A holding place by the way) and liberated all that were in there awaiting His arrival.
Check it out.

1. If you answered yes to question #5, how?>>>Lampo

Prior to the coming of Jesus hell existed as a holding place because hell was a prison and heaven was locked in.

Psa 107:16 For he hath broken the gates of brass, and cut the bars of iron in sunder.
Heavens gates are a brass and hells gates are as iron.

Isa 45:2 I will go before thee, and make the crooked places straight: I will break in pieces the gates of brass, and cut in sunder the bars of iron:

Job 17:16 They shall go down to the bars of the pit, when our rest together is in the dust.

God was silent at the cross for a span of 1 hour and 40 minutes in answer to Jesus’ plea, so that Jesus would go down to the pit to rescue the prisoners held there.

Psa 28:1 Unto thee will I cry, O LORD my rock; be not silent to me: lest, if thou be silent to me, I become like them that go down into the pit.

No more holding place because God in Jesus did away with them by giving Jesus the keys.

Rev 1:18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

If you believe in Jesus come the first time, then He will come to you a second time into the temple in your heart where He can rest His head.

Mat 8:20 And Jesus saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head.

Yes He does, in our hearts!

Do you have the whole bible in your computor? If not, I use Esword.

Peace>>>AJ

---

 

[look3467]

Again I would ask you to read Matthew 25.
And yes, salvation is a free gift. But we are responsible for how we use that gift. If you doubt that than you should re-read the parable of the talents.

Absolutely, we are responsible, and more so if you have an increase in knowledge.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[look3467]

MAN was responsible for his own fall. If you wish to blame God for giving us freewill, that’s your business.

Why then did Jesus have to pay if we were resposible for obtaining knowledge.

Give it a thought.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[ALLFORHIM]

No, you can’t do that, but you would still go to Heaven in your theology. Wouldn’t being face to face with God in Heaven be even better than doing good works to glorify Him and spreading the Gospel? You can glorify him in Heaven!

Hi Im back:thumbsup: I got crazy with family stuff last night.

I suppose it would be better face to face with God, but I want to bend my will to His and do,on this earth, what He wants me to. Although I do fail sometimes

What’s the punishment?

Well, I suppose it depends on what the sin is. The punishment for me is that horrible rotten feeling I get until I have confessed my sin and fixed any problem I may have created because of it. I some other examples but they are too personal to talk about. God disciplines His children in whatever way He deems necessary to bring them back into fellowship with HIm. Usually I can only see this in hindsight after going through it. Once I have walked through the other side I can clearly look back and see how God worked it all out for my good. You know how difficult it is to see the good until you are out of the situation.

But that’s all. Still no consequences for your sin.

OH MY GOODNESS YES!!! There are always consequences to sin. I am dealing with some now that are too personal to share and I struggle daily and I am suffering for it. I do see what I am doing but my flesh is winning out. Fortunately, the Holy Spirit gives me the power to overcome this sin. I am working on it in baby steps. It involves an unsaved spouse-so it makes this slightly more difficult to conquer–but with God’s help I will do it. Hopefully sooner rather then later:thumbsup:

But if you never get the chance, that’s okay because you are still going to Heaven, right?

Yes–if I dont confess it before I die then that will be burned up and I will lose a reward and Im sure be ashamed in front of My Lord and Savior

Will you point me to the chapter and verse that says this? Paul said, “work out your salvation in fear and trembling.” He also said that HE could be disqualified at the end. If ANYONE in Christianity would think they are saved it would be St. Paul! (Phil. 2:12; 1 Cor. 9:27 respectively

From Christ: John 10:25–29, John 6: 28-29

From Paul:: The whole book of Romans actually lays out the salvation message but specifically
Romans 8: 26–39

I pick out verse 39 where it is says no other created being–Are we created beings? If you say yes(which Im sure you agree ) then we cannot even seperate ourselves from Christ.

You don’t “feel” that you are one of those superficial Christians, right? But you do sin, right? What if it is the “end” IMMEDIATELY after you commit a sin and have NO chance to confess? Then in your theology, were you actually a superficial Christian? You didn’t persevere to the end.

So you are pretty much saying that one unconfessed sin causes someone to go to hell—right?

No I dont believe that because that is not what the bible teaches us.

The problem here is is that you seem to think you have something to do with your salvation so of course it would make sense you think you could lose it.

I, OTOH, believe I had nothing to do with my salvation. My salvation comes from God so if God says He has me I believe Him.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

It sheds more light on purgatory if the WHOLE verse is quoted, not just the last half. In full it reads:

“If any man’s work burn, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved, yet so as by fire”

Now this causes a dilema. Where is this place? It can’t be heaven, since there is no suffering, which the fire symbolizes. Yet it can’t be referring to hell since nobody will be saved from there.

That my friend is at the Bemis Seat of Christ where all the believers are judged .

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Hi,

I thought I would add this from gotquestions.org because it explains it better then I

Question: “How can I have assurance of my salvation?”

Answer: How can you know for sure if you are saved? Consider 1 John 5:11-13 (NLT): “And this is what God has testified: He has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. So whoever has God’s Son has life; whoever does not have his Son does not have life. I write this to you who believe in the Son of God, so that you may know you have eternal life.” Who is it that has the Son? Those who have believed in Him and accepted Him (John 1:12). If you have Jesus, you have life. Eternal life. Not temporary, but eternal.

God wants us to have assurance of our salvation. We cannot live our Christian lives wondering and worrying each day whether we are truly saved or not. That is why the Bible makes the plan of salvation so clear. Believe in Jesus Christ and you will be saved (John 3:16; Acts 16:31). Do you believe that Jesus is the Savior, that He died to pay the penalty for your sins (Romans 5:8; 2 Corinthians 5:21)? Are you trusting Him alone for salvation? If your answer is yes, you are saved! Assurance means to “put beyond all doubt.” By taking God’s Word to heart, you can “put beyond all doubt” the fact and reality of your eternal salvation.

Jesus Himself states this regarding those who have believed in Him: “I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one will snatch them away from me, for my Father has given them to me, and he is more powerful than anyone else. So no one can take them from me” (John 10:28-29 NLT). Again, this gives more emphasis to “eternal.” Eternal life is just that–eternal. There is nobody, not even yourself, who can take Christ’s God-given gift of salvation away from you.

Memorize these passages. We hide God’s Word in our hearts so that we do not sin against Him (Psalm 119:11), and this includes doubt. Take joy in what God’s Word is saying to you: That instead of doubt we can live with confidence! We can have the assurance from Christ’s own Word that the state of our salvation will never be in question. Our assurance is based on God’s love for us through Jesus Christ. Jude 24-25, “To Him who is able to keep you from falling and to present you before his glorious presence without fault and with great joy - to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.”

 

[look3467]

That my friend is at the Bemis Seat of Christ where all the believers are judged .

One question: if Christ died for all our sins, why would He then want to judge us?

Or He died for our sins so that He could judge us?

Something to think about.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[ALLFORHIM]

One question: if Christ died for all our sins, why would He then want to judge us?

Or He died for our sins so that He could judge us?

Something to think about.

Peace>>>AJ

Hi,
He doesnt judge us–he judges our works that we do after we have become saved.

We were saved to do good works that He already planned for us to do. Do you believe this? Ephesians 2:8–10

Those are the works we are judged on. This has nothing to do with our salvation. We have already been saved from eternal damnation–being sent to the Lake of Fire
But we are commanded to live a holy life. That means becoming Christ-like(which is called sanctification)which happens over our lifetime.
We need to live for Christ and show people the love of Christ through our actions and words. We need to spread the gospel message of Christ so more people can be lead to CHrist.
AMEN!!

 

[look3467]

Hi,
He doesnt judge us–he judges our works that we do after we have become saved.

We were saved to do good works that He already planned for us to do. Do you believe this? Ephesians 2:8–10

Those are the works we are judged on. This has nothing to do with our salvation. We have already been saved from eternal damnation–being sent to the Lake of Fire
But we are commanded to live a holy life. That means becoming Christ-like(which is called sanctification)which happens over our lifetime.
We need to live for Christ and show people the love of Christ through our actions and words. We need to spread the gospel message of Christ so more people can be lead to CHrist.
AMEN!!

I concur with this whole post to the T.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[water]

but if I don’t do any works, would I be saved?

 

[ALLFORHIM]

but if I don’t do any works, would I be saved?

:yup: but you will work because you love Christ and want to please God

After I became saved I had this overwhelming urge to want to do things that would make God happy:thumbsup:

I did not have that urge before I was saved

 

[water]

:yup: but you will work because you love Christ and want to please God

the word is “will”, but many have failed to do. Also, some even do the works in Jesus’s name, but Jesus will not recognize who they are. Some members here said because they are not Christians - are they not?

PS: it looks like I am redirecting the thread to some other topic. well, the question of this thread is too general.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

the word is “will”, but many have failed to do. Also, some even do the works in Jesus’s name, but Jesus will not recognize who they are. Some members here said because they are not Christians - are they not?

PS: it looks like I am redirecting the thread to some other topic. well, the question of this thread is too general.

Here is an article from gotquestions.org.

Question: “Is salvation by faith alone, or by faith plus works?”

Answer: This is perhaps the most important question in all of Christian theology. This question is the cause of the Reformation - the split between the Protestant church and Catholic church. This question is a key difference between Biblical Christianity and most of the “Christian” cults. Is salvation by faith alone, or by faith plus works? Am I saved just by believing in Jesus, or do I have to believe in Jesus and do certain things?

The question of faith alone or faith plus works is made difficult by some hard-to-reconcile Bible passages. Compare Romans 3:28, 5:1 and Galatians 3:24 with James 2:24. Some see a difference between Paul (salvation is by faith alone) and James (salvation is by faith plus works). In reality, Paul and James did not disagree at all. The only point of disagreement some people claim is over the relationship between faith and works. Paul dogmatically says that justification is by faith alone (Ephesians 2:8-9) while James appears to be saying that justification is by faith plus works. This apparent problem is answered by examining what exactly James is talking about. James is refuting the belief that a person can have faith without producing any good works (James 2:17-18). James is emphasizing the point that genuine faith in Christ will produce a changed life and good works (James 2:20-26). James is not saying that justification is by faith plus works, but rather that a person who is truly justified by faith will have good works in his life. If a person claims to be a believer, but has no good works in his life – then he likely does not have genuine faith in Christ (James 2:14, 17, 20, 26).

Paul says the same thing in his writings. The good fruit believers should have in their lives is listed in Galatians 5:22-23. Immediately after telling us that we are saved by faith, not works (Ephesians 2:8-9), Paul informs us that we were created to do good works (Ephesians 2:10). Paul expects just as much of a changed life as James does, “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come” (2 Corinthians 5:17)! James and Paul do not disagree on their teaching on salvation. They approach the same subject from different perspectives. Paul simply emphasized that justification is by faith alone while James put emphasis on the fact that faith in Christ produces good works.

 

[rinnie]

Nope, Only God Can Make That Call. I Will Be Judged. My Sins Will Be Told To Me. All I Can Hope For Is He Will Be Merciful And (maybe In A Really Good Mood) That Day. Just Kidding. But Its Not My Call. But I Can Say One Thing, That I Do Believe And I Know That Jesus Payed For My Sins By His Death On The Cross. But Now If I Havent Repented In This World I Will In The Next. And Thats A Fact. He Died So We Can Be Forgiven But Its Our Job To Repent. ]

 

[flyersfan1088]

One question: if Christ died for all our sins, why would He then want to judge us?

Or He died for our sins so that He could judge us?

Something to think about.

Peace>>>AJ

His death made it possible for us to be saved, but it did not guarantee it. Although the redemptive work of Christ is complete, the merits of redemption must still be applied to each person in order for him to be saved. This requires that a person repent (Mt 4:17), believe in Jesus (Rom 10:9), keep the commandments (Mt 19:16-17), and live a life of charity ((1 Cor 13:1-3)

According to Mt 24:13 we must “persevere to the end” in order to be saved. St Paul says the same thing in 2 Tim 2:12. We are warned that we will be “cut off” if we don’t persevere in the kindness of God in Rom 11:22. Hebrews 6:4-6 describes people who are sharers in the Holy Spirit who then fall away from God.

OSAS was not taught by Christ, not taught by the Apostles, not taught by the early Church, not taught by anyone for 1500 years. It was completely unheard of until the Reformation. Please provide ONE quote from an ECF that supports OSAS.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

His death made it possible for us to be saved, but it did not guarantee it. Although the redemptive work of Christ is complete, the merits of redemption must still be applied to each person in order for him to be saved. This requires that a person repent (Mt 4:17), believe in Jesus (Rom 10:9), keep the commandments (Mt 19:16-17), and live a life of charity ((1 Cor 13:1-3)

According to Mt 24:13 we must “persevere to the end” in order to be saved. St Paul says the same thing in 2 Tim 2:12. We are warned that we will be “cut off” if we don’t persevere in the kindness of God in Rom 11:22. Hebrews 6:4-6 describes people who are sharers in the Holy Spirit who then fall away from God.

OSAS was not taught by Christ, not taught by the Apostles, not taught by the early Church, not taught by anyone for 1500 years. It was completely unheard of until the Reformation. Please provide ONE quote from an ECF that supports OSAS.

Why the ECF why not the bible

please see post #108:thumbsup:

 

[Geocacher]

I saw a post about “Being Saved by Faith alone”, this does have a problem, for it seems like “To Be Saved By Faith Alone”, is unto selfishness, where you only need to have Faith without helping others, and be saved. - - NOT

Much of Life itself, is about Helping others, with both Spiritual Needs, and of Physical Needs, and the Spiritual part of helping Others, is best done, by having a Knowledge and understanding of the Scriptures, which helps alot.

So if we do NOT help others in this life, then we cannot easily be saved by Faith Alone, but only God can save these people if he wanted, but I should not Judge, only God.

Doing Our Best in this life is what counts.

 

[flyersfan1088]

Why the ECF why not the bible

please see post #108:thumbsup:

When I said not taught by Christ, I assumed you would realize that this means the Bible:thumbsup:

In #108 you quote gotquestions.org
Since it is an obviously Protestant site, I don’t give it’s personal interpretation of scripture any credence. It’s easy to cherrypick verses to support your side. Only the Catholic interpretation can reconcile ALL verses into one coherent meaning. No Protestant interpretation can even come close.