I'm getting tired of hearing from Protestants that we worship Mary and the saints!

[Scientiphic]

**Pixie what a really nice thing to say:thumbsup: You are wrong, but it was nice of you to think that.
I think Fr John Corapi expressed it best when he said “All protestants are heretics”
During your swim did they cover excommunication? If you don’t follow the beliefs of the Catholic Church you can be removed from the Body of christ. even if baptised. Some Protestants say they believe OSAS, but even they know that isn’t true! If you commit an grave or mortal sin, such as abortion , you automatically remove yourself from the body of Christ. Do you agree with that? You can look it up if you desire. I wouldn’t lie to you.

If you have been baptized in the Name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, you are a christian. not necessary member of any Church. Yes, you could be saved through the authority of the Catholic Church and yes there are more that “Roman” Catholics in the Catholic Church. We consider them all brothers. They are “real” Catholic, as are we. Some of our belifts differ but not the ones that decide if you are saved or not.
Heretics can’t be saved without the mercy of the Catholic Church because God gave the Church the authority to tie or untie sins even heresy! Prasee to God! Protestant go against God’s real church and therefore aren’t recognized even though they have been baptised. Why some never ate The body or drank the Blood of Jesus as He personally commanded that they must do to have eternal life~:tsktsk: . How could they be saved knowing He commanded them to do it and not do it?
Now I know it seems harsh, and you want to be nice. Because you are a nice person. That is commendable! :flowers: That is really charitable, however, I don’t think it is fair to them.
God wants us to try and get them to realize that they are wrong. There salvation depends on it! We are not being correct if we say. they are saved when in fact they were called but did not answered Jesus. They probably won’t be recognized by Jesus later. He said that in the Bible. I really try not to judge anyone, that isn’t my job. :dts: I just attempt to open their eyes, and love them. no matter what they call themselves and how close to the devil they may be because of their false beliefs they still deserve our love!
God Bless**

RobGentner, Heretics by whose standard??? Anyway, I’m just going to reply you using Scripture.

Acts 4: 10 It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed. 11He is " ‘the stone you builders rejected, which has become the capstone.[a]’** 12Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."

It is NOT simply baptize in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, it is specifically…JESUS.**

 

[Pixie_Dust]

**Pixie what a really nice thing to say:thumbsup: You are wrong, but it was nice of you to think that.
I think Fr John Corapi expressed it best when he said “All protestants are heretics”
During your swim did they cover excommunication? If we don’t follow the beliefs of the Catholic Church we can be removed from the Body of christ. even if baptised. Some Protestants say they believe OSAS, but even they know that isn’t true! If we commit an grave or mortal sin, such as abortion , we automatically remove ourself from the body of Christ. Do you agree with that? You can look it up if you desire. I wouldn’t lie to you.

If you have been baptized in the Name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, you are a christian. not necessary member of any Church. Yes, everyone could be saved through the authority of the Catholic Church and yes there are more that “Roman” Catholics" in the Catholic Church. We consider them all brothers. They are “real” Catholic, just as we are. Some of our beliefs differ but not the ones that decide if you are saved or not. Like with the Heritics! The heretics can’t be saved without the mercy of the Catholic Church because God gave His Church the authority to tie or untie sins her on earth. Yes, even heresy! Praise to God! As they stand now all 59,999 christian denominations that go against God’s real church and may be damned even though they have been baptised. Why some of them never ate The Body or drank the Blood of Jesus as He personally commanded that they must do to have eternal life~:tsktsk: . How could they realy expect to be saved Bu denying that Jesus said that? He commanded them to do it and because of being blinded by the devil they refuse to believe it even though they read it. How foolish is that?
Now I know it seems harsh, and you want to be nice. Because you are a nice person. That is commendable! :flowers: That is not really charitable, I don’t think it is fair to them. I believe that
God wants us to try and get them to realize that they are wrong. To help them be saved to eternal life! Their salvation depends on it! We are not being correct if we say that they are saved when in fact they were called but did not answered Jesus. They probably won’t be recognized by Jesus later. He said that in the Bible. I really try not to judge anyone, that isn’t my job. We have to leave that to God and His mercy to perhaps forgive their rejection of His Church here on earth. :dts:
I think my job is just to attempt to open their eyes the best I can, and to love them. No matter what they call themselves , or how very close to the devil they may be because of their false beliefs, they still deserve our love!
God Bless**

According to the Catechism, all baptized believers are to be considered members of the Catholic Church, albeit imperfectly. There is some Truth taught in non-Catholic faith communities, they just lack the fullness of Truth. I’d give you the paragraph numbers, but I haven’t the time right now.

Today’s Protestants are not formal heretics for the most part, (some ex-Catholics may not even qualify as formal heretics, given the lousy catechesis of the 60s and 70s) since they did not, with full knowledge and full consent, choose to walk away from the Catholic Church in favor of someone else’s private interpretation. Most Protestants have NO idea that the Catholic Church is the one Christ founded. They just know they grew up Baptist, Methodist, etc…

 

[RobGentner]

RobGentner, Heretics by whose standard??? Anyway, I’m just going to reply you using Scripture.

Acts 4: 10 It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed. 11He is " ‘the stone you builders rejected, which has become the capstone.[a]’** 12Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."

It is NOT simply baptize in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, it is specifically…JESUS.**

**Scientiphic, I agree with you that is isn’t just the baptize even though the bible says it is. But the bible also says it isn’t probably because the Bible was written to reveal things to the Church, not the individual members of the Church. I will type the rest slowly for you.:compcoff: Heretics by HIS church’s standard! Boy, that was easy. :egyptian: Jesus has just one ONE body. Why would He want to fight with himself?:slapfight: Another easy one. shaw: He wouldn’t. Who would Jesus want to fight against? Who would He want to battle against? Tick…tock…tick…tock, Yup you got it the Devil. So every church that left the true church has the Devil as their head. Now you understand? It is so easy when your mind is not corrupted by religious error. Of course Jesus couldn’t have more then one because He only established ONE Church. You know that it seems you rreasdf the bible. Look up false teaching and you may be suprised and have you eyes open. Anyone who isn’t a member of Jeus’ church and attempts to make his own imitation church appear to be the true church is a Heretic by anyones standard.

God Bless! Remember Jesus really does love all of us. **

 

[RobGentner]

According to the Catechism, all baptized believers are to be considered members of the Catholic Church, albeit imperfectly. There is some Truth taught in non-Catholic faith communities, they just lack the fullness of Truth. I’d give you the paragraph numbers, but I haven’t the time right now.

Today’s Protestants are not formal heretics for the most part, (some ex-Catholics may not even qualify as formal heretics, given the lousy catechesis of the 60s and 70s) since they did not, with full knowledge and full consent, choose to walk away from the Catholic Church in favor of someone else’s private interpretation. Most Protestants have NO idea that the Catholic Church is the one Christ founded. They just know they grew up Baptist, Methodist, etc…

**Pixie, As stated 100% of what you said is correct. I applaude you. :clapping: The only minor thing I might argue with you was about is the " may not qualify as formal heretics" remark. I am sorry, they are heretics/ There isn’t gray in this matter. You are still trying to be nice. My dear, that isn’t a sin! We need nice people!

God Bless. and remember no only to be kind. But atempt to help out brothers and sisters find the River!**

 

[adrift]

I came across this and it made me think of worship. Am i wrong to think this?

Yes you are wrong. Worship is to God nowhere do I find in the prayer belief that Mary is God therefore it is not worship.

 

[Cinette]

Yes you are wrong. Worship is to God nowhere do I find in the prayer belief that Mary is God therefore it is not worship.

:ehh: My husband worships me I guess!! :blushing: :hypno: :yyeess:

 

[neweyes]

Believing that Mary was the only human being apart from Jesus who was sinless would make her divine. And when people pray the rosary, they are indeed praying to Mary. So how can Catholics say that they don’t pray to Mary?

P.S. My Catholic relatives have told me that they do seek her in prayer, and ask her to help them.

 

[sambos671]

Believing that Mary was the only human being apart from Jesus who was sinless would make her divine. And when people pray the rosary, they are indeed praying to Mary. So how can Catholics say that they don’t pray to Mary?

P.S. My Catholic relatives have told me that they do seek her in prayer, and ask her to help them.

Catholics do pray to Mary. They don’t think she is divine. But they look at it like this. There is a pit you and I are saved out of the pit (sin) but Mary was stopped before she fell in so we are both saved by the same Jesus. Catholics pray to Mary because they believe she is still a part of the Body of Christ and had a better understanding of our needs and Gods will so prays accordingly. Do you think when you die and go to heaven your ministry will stop? Catholics say no it continues.

 

[Leeann]

RobGentner:
Scientiphic, I agree with you that is isn’t just the baptize even though the bible says it is. But the bible also says it isn’t probably because the Bible was written to reveal things to the Church, not the individual members of the Church

And that is what you have been taught about the bible…by the “Church”… and therefore you believe it to be true, however that in itself does not make it true.

The books of the Old Testament itself, for instance, were not written just to reveal things to the “Church”.

RobGentner:
I will type the rest slowly for you.:compcoff: Heretics by HIS church’s standard! Boy, that was easy. :egyptian: Jesus has just one ONE body. Why would He want to fight with himself?:slapfight: Another easy one. shaw: He wouldn’t. Who would Jesus want to fight against? Who would He want to battle against? Tick…tock…tick…tock, Yup you got it the Devil. So every church that left the true church has the Devil as their head. Now you understand? It is so easy when your mind is not corrupted by religious error.

Any organization or individual for that matter, that claims that they alone have the sole right to God’s word and its interpretation is either lying and has been corrupted as you say by “religious error” and is being misled by the devil - or is a fool.:sad_yes:

RobGentner:
Of course Jesus couldn’t have more then one because He only established ONE Church. You know that it seems you rreasdf the bible. Look up false teaching and you may be suprised and have you eyes open. Anyone who isn’t a member of Jeus’ church and attempts to make his own imitation church appear to be the true church is a Heretic by anyones standard.

And anyone that claims that the Catholic church, as we know it today, is the one true church that Jesus established, has indeed been blinded by a LOT of “religious error”, as is evident when some of their adherents are confused about the teachings and dogmas that have been instituted over the centuries, in some cases to the point of placing all their faith and focus on Mary, and their “implicit faith” in the “Church”…instead of on God….where it should be.

 

[davidv]

Believing that Mary was the only human being apart from Jesus who was sinless would make her divine. And when people pray the rosary, they are indeed praying to Mary. So how can Catholics say that they don’t pray to Mary?

P.S. My Catholic relatives have told me that they do seek her in prayer, and ask her to help them.

Is a newborn sinless?
Are they divine?

How does sinlessness equal divinity?

 

[neweyes]

Thanks for your response.

Mary was stopped before she fell in

I don’t believe the Scriptures ever said that.

Catholics pray to Mary because they believe she is still a part of the Body of Christ and had a better understanding of our needs …

Only God knows my heart and my thoughts. If Mary understands my needs, then she would have to be divine.

Do you think when you die and go to heaven your ministry will stop? Catholics say no it continues.

I think there is work that God wants us to do when we serve Him in heaven, but the ministry work I do now will stop. (At least I hope I am not still writing blogs, newsletters and press releases in heaven! )

 

[neweyes]

Is a newborn sinless?

No, a newborn inherits this sinful fallen world by birth.

Are they divine?

only when they are sleeping!

(kidding)

 

[sambos671]

Thanks for your response.

I don’t believe the Scriptures ever said that.

Only God knows my heart and my thoughts. If Mary understands my needs, then she would have to be divine.

I think there is work that God wants us to do when we serve Him in heaven, but the ministry work I do now will stop. (At least I hope I am not still writing blogs, newsletters and press releases in heaven! )

Scriptures don’t specifically say that no. But Niether does is specifically menitons the Trinity. also why would God require Samsons mother to remain in the Nazerite vow but it was Samson who was to have it not her? Same principle? Mary knows us because she struggled and understands our predicament not because she can read your mind. God will have you ministering in ways you cannot even imagine.

 

[neweyes]

Samb, I am enjoying the discussion very much. I want to confess that I find this statement…

Scriptures don’t specifically say that no. But Niether does is specifically menitons the Trinity.

…very frustrating as a non-Catholic because it seems that we could go round and round forever on that semantic. Trinity just means Father, Son, Holy Spirit–and we all know it’s in there.

Mary knows us because she struggled and understands our predicament …

Mary struggled yes, as did many saints throughout history. But it is Jesus who knows us and knows our predicament.

God will have you ministering in ways you cannot even imagine.

That fills my heart with joy!
Your sister in Christ,

Neweyes

 

[Cinette]

The Hail Mary

Believing that Mary was the only human being apart from Jesus who was sinless would make her divine. And when people pray the rosary, they are indeed praying to Mary. So how can Catholics say that they** don’t pray to Mary?

P.S. My Catholic relatives have told me that they do seek her in prayer, and ask her to help them.

Hail Mary full of grace, the Lord is with thee (this was said to Mary by the Angel Gabriel at the Announciation)

Blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of your womb, Jesus (part of Elizabeth’s greeting when Mary visited her)

Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. AMEN

The prayer is what is known as an intecessory prayer - it begins with the two passages (found in Luke) and then our petition.

This is what we recite on certain beads during the rosary. At the same time we medidate on the gospels and most of the meditations are to do with Jesus’ life when he was here on earth. There are decades of the rosary divided into Joyful, Sorrowful, Glorious Mysteries and the Mysteries of Life - all very Biblical

But certain Protestants pound on us calling us worshippers of Mary etc. etc. However, there are certain Protestants ie Anglicans and Mothodists who also love Our Blessed Mother and also pray the rosary. They understand and share our love for Mary.

 

[I_am_Me]

Hail Mary full of grace, the Lord is with thee (this was said to Mary by the Angel Gabriel at the Announciation)

Blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of your womb, Jesus (part of Elizabeth’s greeting when Mary visited her)

I see it says among women and not above women. Deb

 

[sambos671]

Samb, I am enjoying the discussion very much. I want to confess that I find this statement…very frustrating as a non-Catholic because it seems that we could go round and round forever on that semantic. Trinity just means Father, Son, Holy Spirit–and we all know it’s in there.
Mary struggled yes, as did many saints throughout history. But it is Jesus who knows us and knows our predicament.

That fills my heart with joy!
Your sister in Christ,

Neweyes

Jesus knows and so do the Saints. God often chooses people who have gone through what others have because they can relate how is this any different from the Saints? As far as the Trinity I see your point but how do they relate? The bible doesn’t use the word Homoosious. And yes will you it does fill our hearts with Joy to be in service to the Lord.

 

[Cinette]

I see it says among women and not above women. Deb[/Q

 

[Cinette]

I see it says among women and not above women. Deb

I understand that it was a normal expression of praise used in those days and can be found elsewhere in the Bible.

However, if you look at the passage in Luke you will see that immediately afterwards Elizabeth says “…And why has this happened to me, that the mother of my Lord comes to me?” (Luke 1:43) You will recall that when she saw Mary the baby in her womb leapt for joy and Elizabeth (thru the inspiration of the Holy Spirit) made that significant greeting especially the one I just quoted. By saying this she was calling Mary “Mother of God” certainly a status “above” other women.

 

[justasking4]

RobGentner;4303239]**
Hi JA4,

Can I play? **
Everything is fair game–

They did actually: Rev 12.

Not sure what you mean here. Can you clarify?

Plus I have even heard Protestant minister say things not written in the bible the heretics! How dare they? Since we are the real church we can interpt what our books say and express it anyway we desire get it? You are given no authority to question our Church. That is reserved to God and Him alone. Read the bible you borrowed from us!

Not sure how why you say this in light of the warnings of Scriptures that we are commanded to be on guard against false teachers. We see this for example in 2 Peter 2:1 which says:
But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.

To say i or you have no authority to question our Church is to reject the clear of Scripture. Secondly the Bible does not derive its authority from the Catholic church but from God Himself. It is God alone Who makes it inspired-inerrant and not any church.

Anyway as you copied" “St Lomman, Irish abbot of the 7th century, gave us these Praises of Mary, passed down orally until finally written down in the twentieth century! What a beautiful testimony to Our Lady, going back so many centuries! What a gift of the Irish Church to all of us!”

So I am guessing that they are " Praises of Mary". The human creature created by God to bear His only son Our Lord and Master. Keep insulting His mother You will really understand how mush he loves His mother, as Much as We do ours!

Who is the “he” that you are referring to here? Is it the Lord Jesus?

Show just a little respect for the Mother of you God, Don’t worship her. Just remember she is above all other creatures created by God and deserves our respect.

Where in Scripture do we find that she alone is above all other creatures? It is true she was blessed in her role but that does not mean she is above all. The Lord Jesus never exalts her like this. In fact when He had a chance to praise her as such in Luke 11:27-28 He does not and instead says those who are blessed who hear the Word of God and observe it.

And if yuo pray to her she might have her Son talk to the father for you! Like the say it can’t hurt. Only Holy water burns nonbelievers I am told, not prayers

Why pray to her when the Scriptures never command such a thing?

PS PeterJ gets angry at me! So don’t tell him I replied to your posting OK? Thanks Buddy!