Impeachment Collection

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If Mueller found a smoking gun on Trump, he would have used it, period. Saved us all this confusion and politicking and hacking around. The fact that he left everything up in the air speaks a lot for itself.

If someone is going to make a case that Mueller has integrity, you might tell that to the four men who were wrongfully convicted to cover Whitey Bulger’s role as an informant. Mueller was the assistant US Attorney and then acting US Attorney in charge of Boston office during the 1980’s. While there is no evidence Mueller was directly involved in the case, given his senior position, it is impossible that he knew nothing of what was going on with the FBI at the time. After all, it is known that he did write letters to the parole board opposing clemency for the four convicted men during his tenure and it is known that the informants, including Bulger corrupted the FBI agents involved. How Mueller managed to escape upstairs from that one is nothing short of miraculous.

In 1999, Janet Reno appointed John Durham to investigate FBI corruption in Boston. Durham subsequently sent two FBI agents to prison for their part in covering for Whitey Bulger, but was unable to prosecute Mueller because Reno’s remit did not allow him to go after anyone outside of the FBI. The critical articles in the Boston Globe with more detail are behind a paywall unfortunately so I can’t link them here.
 
LeafByNiggle said:
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Zzyzx_Road:
If someone is going to make a case that Mueller has integrity…
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Mueller did and does have integrity.
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Does he look like a man that has integrity?
Why did he choose to come out and make
his speech?
Why is he caving on from pressure from the
democrats?
 
Finally the key question Mueller keeps dodging: when did he know the dossier was false? Evidence is beginning to suggest he knew it before he took the special prosecutor job. Several people who worked for him sure did know as they were closely connected to the people who used the false dossier to get the FISA warrant.

That Mueller did eventually know the dossier was false and continued with the investigation anyway is gross malfeasance on his part, if not prosecutorial misconduct.

This is what is scaring everyone silly who participated in this scam; that they’re all going to be found out. The CIA and FBI are already pointing fingers at each over this.
 
7_Sorrows said:
Does he look like a man that has integrity?
Why did he choose to come out and make
his speech?
Why is he caving on from pressure from the
democrats?
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Either way, he’s screwed.
He has integrity, he found no collusion and willingly falls on his sword, having failed to deliver to the Democrats what he was supposed to deliver, Trump’s head on a plate, figuratively speaking. The Democrats want his head, he’s screwed.
Or.
He has no integrity, he found no collusion and is now caving into the Democrats and covering himself by throwing everyone else to the wolves in an effort to survive. But the Democrats will still take his head anyway.

He didn’t find the smoking gun so many never Trumpers were absolutely positively sure was there. Have to say Mueller will never live this down. The ultimate political survivor finally hits the dirt.
 
Believe it or not, I try to see past my partisanship on this board, and try to be on my best behavior when interacting with you all.

Some of you, I think, are just here to spit vitriol against the other side, and malign everyone who doesn’t agree with your position.

I enjoy a good intellectual discussion - sometimes we have them here. Mostly, not.
 
JonNC said:
He himself told Barr it could be challenged.

PaulinVA:
Once again, the Mueller Report is a magical document that people read what they want into.
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How does this in contrast with the Starr report. I think it was clear and supported in the Clinton legal transgressions. It said what it said without relying on innuendo
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Theo520 said:
How does this in contrast with the Starr report. I think it was clear and supported in the Clinton legal transgressions. It said what it said without relying on innuendo
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Theo, my comment about the magical Mueller Report was a comment about the readers, not about the writers.

I think the report is very clear. I wish he made a prosecutorial decision, but he didn’t, because in his mind there was no need to.
 
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Zzyzx_Road said:
If Mueller found a smoking gun on Trump, he would have used it, period.
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Where did you get your omniscience? It is clear that the Constitution provided a difficult path to get rid of a president, because of the importance of the office. Mueller performed the investigation according to the DOJ guidelines and policies. And he was loudly praised by everyone, until he failed to exonerate Trump. Of course the pattern keeps repeating itself. As long as anyone toes Trump’s line, he or she is the best, most qualified person for the job. If they dare to contradict him, they become the scum of the Earth.

And the evidence can be used by the other courts, among others the NYSD. The office of the Special Prosecutor may be closed, but the Grand Jury is alive and well.
 
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7_Sorrows said:
Does he look like a man that has integrity?
Why did he choose to come out and make
his speech?
Why is he caving on from pressure from the
democrats?
Click to expand...
The only reason it looks like Mueller is “caving” to the democrats is that Mueller’s position was so badly misrepresented by the far right to begin with. Mueller hasn’t changed his position. But recent clarification of that position makes the continued fiction promulgated by far right untenable. And so they pivot to saying that either Mueller is caving or has been scum all along.
 
Oh? There was a grand jury investigating some foreign firm that defied a Mueller subpoena two months ago?

That tells us nothing about your assertion in Post 194.
 
Mueller didn’t deliver Trump’s head to them, and they won’t forgive that. However, he did do his best to encourage impeachment as his swan song. Pretty weak.
 
Ridgerunner said:
Oh? There was a grand jury investigating some foreign firm that defied a Mueller subpoena two months ago?

That tells us nothing about your assertion in Post 194.
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Read The Article

Others said the grand jury’s continued presence could pose an ongoing headache for President Donald Trump, who since Sunday has misleadingly hyped Barr’s letter about the end of the Mueller probe as a complete exoneration.

“I worked with the prosecutor [Goodhand] in this matter,” said Gene Rossi, a former assistant U.S. attorney in Virginia. “He uses his words very carefully. The use of ‘robustly’ is not bluster or gratuitous. That word strongly suggests that the handoffs from Robert Mueller’s office are alive and kicking and that the Washington U.S. Attorney’s Office could be another troubling front for the president and the White House.”
 
Economist said:
It is sufficient to behave in a manner which is incompatible with the office that the person holds. (Can be the presidency, or the attorney general, or something else).
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Source.
Your definition here makes impeachment a sort of recall process. That’s not what it is supposed to be. “High crimes and misdemeanors” is a necessary precondition. The fact that some people don’t like his behavior isn’t enough.
Economist said:
But, of course in this case the problem is almost too easy. Lying to the American people (many times every day), tax related crimes, insurance fraud, and many others. That is why Trump fights tooth and nail to keep his affairs out of the public eye. Though it looks like that he losing.
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So, now lying to the American people is the threshold? Then every elected official in Washington should be impeached.
As for tax crimes, etc, you have no proof. In fact, on taxes, if he was committing these, the IRS would know, far better than you, I might add. I would fight to keep my tax information, too, because it is none of your business.
Economist said:
The good news for him is that the democrats are impotent. One cannot play nicely when the opponent does not respect the rules. Yes, it means to stoop down to the same level, but sometimes the end does justify the means.
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True. I hope Republicans never stoop as low as the Democrats have the last two years. The Russia collusion hoax, the brutal character assassination on Kavanaugh, it’s ongoing attacks on American sovereignty, and individual rights.
 
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PaulinVA said:
Theo, my comment about the magical Mueller Report was a comment about the readers, not about the writers.

I think the report is very clear. I wish he made a prosecutorial decision, but he didn’t, because in his mind there was no need to.
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By definition, if it made no determination about prosecution, it was not clear. A determination of prosecution was his job.
 
JonNC said:
True. I hope Republicans never stoop as low as the Democrats have the last two years. The Russia collusion hoax, the brutal character assassination on Kavanaugh, it’s ongoing attacks on American sovereignty, and individual rights.
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Or, conversely, one could say that I hope what’s left of the Republican party after supporting a President who daily denigrates the office and lies to the American people on a daily basis and nominates unqualified partisan hacks to positions of great importance will someday find it’s soul and repudiate the last three years.

See, your opinion is just an opinion.
JonNC said:
By definition, if it made no determination about prosecution, it was not clear. A determination of prosecution was his job.
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Like to see where that is in the Special Counsel regulation. I think he was tasked with providing a report to the AG.
 
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