Infertility

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And in a certain sense, petitioning them to do as you ask, is petitioning them to continue walking the evil path they started on by them selves.
I don’t understand your meaning; the matter is precisely the opposite of what you suggest: The evil was creating these people in test tubes and keeping them frozen in fridges. The mother finally accepting her child in her womb would be the end of the evil.

And again – I wonder why you are not getting this – the Church has taught that children have a right to their natural parents. Hence taking the child and inserting him into another’s uterus before his mother has definitively forsaken him is in fact evil (or ‘an evil’). Thus we must petition the parents to give the child what is rightfully his before finally making that end impossible for him (by placing him in the uterus of another).

Really, it is a straightforward concept. Perhaps you are hesitant because you don’t like the thought of trying to contact the child’s parents.
 
I don’t understand your meaning; the matter is precisely the opposite of what you suggest: The evil was creating these people in test tubes and keeping them frozen in fridges. The mother finally accepting her child in her womb would be the end of the evil.

And again – I wonder why you are not getting this – the Church has taught that children have a right to their natural parents. Hence taking the child and inserting him into another’s uterus before his mother has definitively forsaken him is in fact evil (or ‘an evil’). Thus we must petition the parents to give the child what is rightfully his before finally making that end impossible for him (by placing him in the uterus of another).

Really, it is a straightforward concept. Perhaps you are hesitant because you don’t like the thought of trying to contact the child’s parents.
Uh, I don’t think you’ve completely identified the sin… Implantation, because it is every bit as unnatural is also a sinful act. In the case of a snowflake adoption the evil of implantation is tolorated, because otherwise this embryo would have no chance.

In the senario you suggest, the parents already engaged in the evil act of creating them to start with. By continuing with implantation you are continuing the evil act, adding one more evil act on top. Of course only God is the perfect judge of mind and heart, but I don’t know that I see continuing with evil acts in a chain of evil acts as pennance or not.

More over, I don’t know that “the right to be raise by your birthparents” is as important as you seem to suggest. We are saved by adoption, and there has never been any moral issue with regard to adoption in the way you describe. If what you describe is an issue with snowflake adoption, it most certainly is for regular adoption too. Yet no one, and I mean no one suggests you should, before signing adoption papers, hunt down the birth parents and first try to convince them to take back their children. That just isn’t a moral teaching of the Church. If the child is up for adoption, adopt it. That is a corperal work of mercy, as is generally beleived right now of snowflake adoption.

I would say the same thing, if the embryo is up for adotpion, just adopt it. I would actually urge perspective adoptive parents to not hunt down the so called “natural parents” and do as you describe. Not only is there no moral requirement (certainly from where I sit), but more over you will create a real legal nightmare.
 
I don’t think implanting a child back where he should have been to begin with is an evil. Anyway, I suppose there’s nothing left to say, and perhaps this conversation was a little off-topic (or perhaps not; I haven’t read through the many pages of this thread to know for sure) …
 
Hello, maybe this has been discussed here before but I don;t think that I can read the whole thread. How expensive is adoption? I heard that it is not cheap so I would like to start saving up. Thank you!
 
Hi! My preliminary research shows that if you are wanting to adopt a newborn it is going to cost $18,000-$20,000+ domestically and even more actually if you go out of country :eek:

BUT if you are willing to adopt an orphan from your state or county in can be virtually free. However in this case the child will most likely be older, have some sort of special need or both.

Anyone with more info or experience feel free to correct anything that I say-I’ve only been researching a few months but it seems that infant adoption is usually big business and for profit…I don’t know how we will ever afford that : (
Also I want to adopt an orphan, to help and make a difference, but also there is a part of me that will always long to know what it is like to hold my baby-whether biologically or not. Sigh.
 
I am new to this website, and fairly new to the Catholic Faith. I have always been Christian, but only recently decided to convert and I am in the the RCIA process at the moment.

My husband and I were blessed 6 1/2 years ago with our amazing little girl, and I truly cherish her every day. However, we’ve also been struck with the challenge of infertility for the past 5 years. We thought that since our daughter was so easy to conceive that we would have no problem conceiving a second child…5 years later we still are not pregnant, and a I have a crazy cycle due to PCOS. I am struggling very much right now emotionally over our inability to have a second child. Everyone around us seems to be getting pregnant, and I try hard not to feel envious, but I can’t help but wonder "why?’, why not us?

I so badly want another child, and I have brought up adoption, but my husband doesn’t think he could love a child that wasn’t biologically ours as much as he loves our daughter.

So I am posting to ask for your prayers, to please pray with and for my husband and I to be blessed with the gift of another child, or to experience a sense of peace in knowing that God has his hand on us, and that we can come to peace with what God decides for our family.

My prayers are with all of you as well.
 
I really have not told my DH or anyone else. My sister just had a baby this past weekend. And as silly as this sound I am very happy for her but very very heartbroken for myself. Please send out prayers for me today that I may over come my over whelming sense of saddness and aloneness right.
My prayers are with you, I feel your pain, as I also thought I had come to terms with my situation, only to have a good friend tell me she was pregnant with her 4th child yesterday, and I was overcome with sadness and coudln’t help but cry. I am truly happy for her, but it was almost like with that news my heart was ripped open. I pray you find peace in God, and that you feel Him in your life, to know that you are never alone, and He is always there to embrace you and comfort your tears.
 
I am new to this website, and fairly new to the Catholic Faith. I have always been Christian, but only recently decided to convert and I am in the the RCIA process at the moment.

My husband and I were blessed 6 1/2 years ago with our amazing little girl, and I truly cherish her every day. However, we’ve also been struck with the challenge of infertility for the past 5 years. We thought that since our daughter was so easy to conceive that we would have no problem conceiving a second child…5 years later we still are not pregnant, and a I have a crazy cycle due to PCOS. I am struggling very much right now emotionally over our inability to have a second child. Everyone around us seems to be getting pregnant, and I try hard not to feel envious, but I can’t help but wonder "why?’, why not us?

I so badly want another child, and I have brought up adoption, but my husband doesn’t think he could love a child that wasn’t biologically ours as much as he loves our daughter.

So I am posting to ask for your prayers, to please pray with and for my husband and I to be blessed with the gift of another child, or to experience a sense of peace in knowing that God has his hand on us, and that we can come to peace with what God decides for our family.

My prayers are with all of you as well.
You are in my prayers.
 
Prayers for you, Mommy 2adc! I am now on the other side, but I remember the waiting and wondering, “What is my calling?”
 
I am new to this website, and fairly new to the Catholic Faith. I have always been Christian, but only recently decided to convert and I am in the the RCIA process at the moment.

My husband and I were blessed 6 1/2 years ago with our amazing little girl, and I truly cherish her every day. However, we’ve also been struck with the challenge of infertility for the past 5 years. We thought that since our daughter was so easy to conceive that we would have no problem conceiving a second child…5 years later we still are not pregnant, and a I have a crazy cycle due to PCOS. I am struggling very much right now emotionally over our inability to have a second child. Everyone around us seems to be getting pregnant, and I try hard not to feel envious, but I can’t help but wonder "why?’, why not us?

I so badly want another child, and I have brought up adoption, but my husband doesn’t think he could love a child that wasn’t biologically ours as much as he loves our daughter.

So I am posting to ask for your prayers, to please pray with and for my husband and I to be blessed with the gift of another child, or to experience a sense of peace in knowing that God has his hand on us, and that we can come to peace with what God decides for our family.

My prayers are with all of you as well.
I know the feelings about PCOS, as I suffer from the same problem and all that it brings.

I will pray for you! :gopray:
 
Greetings. Newbie on this thread. Cradle Catholic, married nearly 8 years, pursuing adoption for going on 3 years, following 2 years of TTC. Male factor infertility - azoospermia.

Nothing about this is fair or easy. Adopting is not easier than TTC. The choice not to pursue high-tech fertility treatment also isn’t easy. Waiting for the whole process (“trying to start a family”) to finally culminate in a child - isn’t easy. And the fact that we have to go through this while others don’t isn’t fair… but there are other struggles that other people have to endure that we do not. Infertility is not the single most devestating thing that could happen to a person. I think we just tend to think that bc it’s what’s happening to us now, it’s what’s relevant to our lives.

I’m pretty sure I know the answer to this, but there’s no natural/Church-approved treatment for azoospermia, is there?

And to answer the poster who seemed to offend a few folks by poo-pooing the efforts to conceive biologically - I was once in that mentality. I wanted to adopt before we started TTC. When we got our diagnosis, I immediately started researching adoption. I didn’t allow myself time to grieve; I insisted that there was nothing to grieve about. It really wasn’t until we parented our former foster daughter for nearly a year, and then had to see her go back home at the age of 17 months, that I realized what I was missing. She was Hispanic, as is DH (I am Polish). Parenting her made me realize that I was mourning the loss of that ethnic combination that our biological child would have - Polish/Latino. Dealing with DSS made me realize I was mourning the loss of control over making basic parenting decisions without outside influence. Having our fourth “birth” mom change her mind (while we were fostering Baby V) made me realize that I was mourning the nearly guaranteed inevitability of parenthood that comes from a pregnancy. And the constant questions, unsolicited advice, and well-meaning tears from others as they try to comprehend what we’re going through made me mourn the normalcy with which people should be able to start a family.

The point is that infertile people have to grieve, and for a lot of us, trying to pursue different options before moving on to adoption is necessary, even therapeutic.

The other point that someone else mentioned is that adoption is not for everyone. I also used to think that if we just matched up all the women going to abortion clinics with all the infertile couples, we’d have a great big kumba-yah. Having met several birth- and would-be birth mothers (and birth fathers and grandparents), having worked with a family whose child was removed from their home, and having heard some of the comments from people anxious to “get their baby already”, I have come to the conclusion that adoption is not for everyone. First, we keep hearing about “all those children” in need of loving homes… but most people wanting to adopt want a child as young as possible. There is no shortage of willing families for babies in need of loving homes.

Meanwhile, older kids, sibling groups, kids with special medical needs, etc. - these are the children who wait. And to adopt them, it takes a lot more preparation than just a desire to parent. Adoption is for the benefit of the children, not for the parents. The parents benefit as a side-effect. The focus must be on the children, their right to know their history, their right to grieve their biological family, their right to their own ethnic heritage. Children are not a commodity to be acquired, but sadly the excessive cost that it takes to complete the adoption process does make it seem that way. An infertile couple is not automatically a good candidate for adoptive parents. They must grieve their own losses first, and then resolve to take on a different kind of family building and parenting by adopting. They must be prepared to focus on the child, and not try to use the child as a way to make themselves feel better about their infertility. An adopted child doesn’t fix infertility.

But I do wonder - if we are told to be fruitful and multiply, if we are told that children are a blessing, then doesn’t that mean that as married Catholics, we should pursue parenthood, be it the old-fashioned way, or (when that’s unsuccessful) via adoption? Or are some Catholic families not called to be parents afterall?
 
I would assume any non-IVF treatment would be on solid moral ground.
Not quite. For instance, donor sperm. (I’m against that even if the Church would approve it in such a situation as described below.)

Are IUIs ever acceptable? I was under the impression that they are not, though I can imagine utilizing an at-home version and combining it with the marital act to satisfy the whole not-separating-sex-from-procreation requirement.
 
Not quite. For instance, donor sperm. (I’m against that even if the Church would approve it in such a situation as described below.)

Are IUIs ever acceptable? I was under the impression that they are not, though I can imagine utilizing an at-home version and combining it with the marital act to satisfy the whole not-separating-sex-from-procreation requirement.
Ok, I guess I mentally grouped doner sperm with IVF, perhaps it’s not necessary to do full IVF with that treatment.

I only scanned the internet quickly regarding the disorder, it would seem however there are treatments for some forms which can correct the problem. These would be moral I am assuming.
 
I know I probably should really just let this go, not post and go about my day but I haven’t tried posting here. All I want is an answer. I want someone who is accredited to tell me what God wants. I don’t know what he wants. I’ve watch 3 children die and with this disease could watch all my children die. It’s a 50/50 coin toss when you aren’t using a PDG pregnancy. I don’t care about discernment. I’ve prayed, talked to clergy and other professionals, I’ve read the books the church reccomends and formed opinion after opinion. I’ve even thought this decision would be easier if I just made the leap and became Luthern.

Now I want someone to tell me point blank. God would ask you to use your fertility to have more children and play that coin toss. He’d ask you to bear the cross of child loss because you don’t really know what the outcome will be and those kids deserve a chance to be born. You have the capability of becoming pregnant. You aren’t rich but could afford a child and many women have come before you with a list of losses a lot longer than yours and they made it though until they conceived a child who lived. Those women let God knit those children together in her womb knowing they wouldn’t make it and you should do the same becuase you can.

Or, someone to look at me and say God would ask you to suffer through using NFP to permenantly delay pregnancy because He doesn’t want anyone to suffer this kind of loss over and over and over until menopause. He would ask you to try and adopt instead. He’d tell you that if you can’t adopt that you should volunteer. If God gave our generation the competancy to discover genetic disorders then it’s ok for you to use that knowledge to ease the pain of multiple child loss. Either way there is still the pain of not conceiving a living child of your own that you would have to overcome. You have to shelve that desire because you know what generations before you did not know and so you don’t have to lose kids over and over until menopause.

That doesn’t mean either choice won’t be hard but there it is. Someone who doesn’t have a book to tell me to read. Someone who doesn’t have some refrence on how to discern. Someone who can say with authority, point blank, that the church and God would teach that I could use NFP to conceive or not to conceive. I don’t know how to read God’s mind but people seem to think I can. I get these things to read that don’t tell me anything about my personal situation and don’t give me a hint about what a woman of God would do. I want someone to tell me what a good; even a great; Catholic woman would do. I don’t want an opinion about what they would do if they were in that situation. I suppose you ladies and gentlemen would understand insensitivity to child loss and not having kids at 30 more than anyone else.
 
verawing, all I have for you is my prayer but rest assured I will give that to you. I’m sorry to read about your pain, I can’t imagine going through what you describe. Pray constantly, I will be praying for you as well. Flee to Christ through the Blessed Virgin in the Rosary.

God bless,
 
Hello Verawang,

I have to say that God answered me this way.

I am married and have kids, I started having issues with mc so my dh said we should do a Donor Egg IVF Cycle. I didn’t want at first cause God doesn’t want that but in the end my dh convinced me (he is not too catholic). So we did it and I didn’t go to communion the whole time. And God’s answer was “NO”. Although I can get pregnant with a good embryo my cycle FAILED so I imagine that was God’s answer to the Egg Donation.

We wanted to do Egg Donation to avoid children disability like you guys.

So we adopted embryos (already little children of God needed a home (womb)). And so we did that and it worked. We got a beautiful healthy baby boy 5 months ago.

So this time God said YES to Embryo Adoption…

that’s the way I took it. I might be wrong but I am still going to go and get the remaining embryos left from our adopted batch and hope for siblings to our son 🙂

Hope that helps.

Hugs
 
Vera–

I wish I could tell you what God wants you to do. I can tell you what we have done. I had 2 miscarriages, my darling baby girl, and 2 more miscarriages. We did so many tests to see what was wrong and finally found that I have immune problems (my body attacks my babies). The treatment is an infusion although my body could still end up making me miscarry. We are choosing to treat that and are hoping I will not have more miscarriages. I haven’t gotten pregnant yet since starting the infusion treatment (did it in November). If I still keep having miscarriages, we plan on pursuing adoption. I think we would still try to have more children naturally, but more miscarriages would be what we would need to feel we should pursue adoption as well.

I am so sorry for what you are going through. NFP to avoid forever is perfectly ok in the situation you describe–losing a child is horrible. Choosing to continue trying to conceive and being open to God’s will is also perfectly ok if you feel emotionally and physically able to handle another loss (although you would hope for the best).

When I reach the point that I feel another miscarriage would be extremely harmful for me mentally, emotionally, or physically, we will avoid using NFP indefinitely.

Prayers,

KG
 
This may seem crass, but have you thought about adopting one person (baby or young child or whomever) into your family for every person God takes to Himself “early”? One adoption per miscarriage? (I don’t know what the emotional dynamics of that situation would be like, though. Perhaps it is a dangerous or unhealthy idea, lending itself as if “a substitute person”, which is, of course, a contradiction in terms.)
 
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