C
chevalier
Guest
Tinajo, not to beat a dead horse, but asking someone on your knees is a strong customary form of supplication. Now, before we proceed, please realise this is pretty much an academic discussion. I’m giving my reasons why I disagree with certain etiquette being thought obligatory, not criticising what anyone may have done. 
So, basically, you don’t kneel down when you simply ask what the decision will be. Asking on one’s knees is a millennia-old customary form of supplication and there’s no doubt as to the meaning of this gesture. The only question is whether it’s meant as such or not really. In the latter case, why pretend?
My solution to this problem would be either to
Think if a National Guard commissioned officer (roughly what a knight was about) decided that even though there’s still the governor on the top of his ladder, he’s now also going to take orders from the governor’s niece, effective immediately. Or imagine the government going poof and petty warlords swearing loyalty to the women they desire on the account of their being drop-dead pretty and well-bred. I’m afraid that there is a strong possibility that the custom of kneeling down to a woman when proposing comes from those customs rather than from the special respect and reverence we connect it with. As I said in previous posts, nothing wrong with a petty lord, to whom commoners knelt, kneeling to women of his own class in addition to kneeling to both men and women of his higher classes - especially with kneeling on one knee being more or less what saluting first is today. But something was wrong with those guys bleeding each other to death to gain notice from a wealthy heiress or a well-bread supermodel.
By the way, a hundred years ago, people knelt to their parents, senior clerics and royals (by extension any more-or-less-ruling aristocrats). In that context, perhaps going down on one knee when proposing wasn’t odd. These days, well… mixed feelings.
So, basically, you don’t kneel down when you simply ask what the decision will be. Asking on one’s knees is a millennia-old customary form of supplication and there’s no doubt as to the meaning of this gesture. The only question is whether it’s meant as such or not really. In the latter case, why pretend?
My solution to this problem would be either to
- kneel down and ask in that form, if one really wants to ask the woman to marry him rather than simply whether she’s ready and decided, thus showing that one values her above oneself, that it is more than one deserves, that she will do one a great honour by accepting, or:
- make arrangements at the table after a head-to-head making sure both persons conform to the Catholic teaching on marriage, have a mutually compatible vision of the future life together.
Think if a National Guard commissioned officer (roughly what a knight was about) decided that even though there’s still the governor on the top of his ladder, he’s now also going to take orders from the governor’s niece, effective immediately. Or imagine the government going poof and petty warlords swearing loyalty to the women they desire on the account of their being drop-dead pretty and well-bred. I’m afraid that there is a strong possibility that the custom of kneeling down to a woman when proposing comes from those customs rather than from the special respect and reverence we connect it with. As I said in previous posts, nothing wrong with a petty lord, to whom commoners knelt, kneeling to women of his own class in addition to kneeling to both men and women of his higher classes - especially with kneeling on one knee being more or less what saluting first is today. But something was wrong with those guys bleeding each other to death to gain notice from a wealthy heiress or a well-bread supermodel.By the way, a hundred years ago, people knelt to their parents, senior clerics and royals (by extension any more-or-less-ruling aristocrats). In that context, perhaps going down on one knee when proposing wasn’t odd. These days, well… mixed feelings.
)
Princess Di had a sapphire, I believe, for her engagement ring? I think that gemstones are the new engagement ring style now…If I had to do it over, I might go that route. Yellow sapphires are so pretty, too.:heaven:
