Is Bill Donohue bad for the Catholic Church?

[distracted]

I don’t think comparing Jesus with Donohue relative to their perceived goodness for the Church is going to fly.

you say i was comparing…

I’m just saying that… well actually i’m saying a few things.

for one, Donahue IS Jesus in a very real sense… since Jesus said that the very least of His brethren (even weak believers … and not sure D fits into this category) are to be considered to be HIm… Ok, so i am paraphrashing… HE said that whatever we do to the least of his brethren we do to Him… so D might as well be Him…

also… if Jesus roamed the world today, he would be treated just like D is being treated by some on this forum…

He would be rejected just like he was 2000 yrs ago… becaues a lot of pepole in the world hate the truth… dont want to hear it…

 

[distracted]

Jesus was against a man leaving and abandoning his wife, was he not?

leaving and abandoning are the same thing… i dont know what you are referring to… but i know Jesus said that we must love HIM more than our family or evern ourselves…

but anyhow.maybe you should explain… I said that i didn’t know much about D.

 

[Guyonthestreet]

hmmm…

i’m not trying to be rude… but can’t help what i was thinking…

You told them to shut up?? literally?

you dont think thats Christian behavior do you?

also… when i am at Mass, i am so into the Presence of JEsus that … a firecracker going off in front of me probably wouldn’t disturb me…

just my thoughts…

I was trying to get into the Presence of Jesus.

I couldn’t though with the distractions being caused by the group of teenagers sitting directly in front of me.

Others around were ‘‘tutting’’ and throwing glances at them but noone was saying anything to them.

Yes, I did tell them to shut up and remember where they were and show some respect.

I said shut up because that’s what I wanted them to do.

I could have said, ‘‘Hi guys, Im really sorry to interject here in your little group discussion while Mass is going on, but do you think, when it’s convenient, you could possible turn it down a little, or perhaps simply focus on the alter and maybe leave the chatting until Mass is finished as you are causing a major distraction to myself and others- if you don’t mind, of course’’

But my style is to keep it short, simple and to the point. I wanted them to show some respect and shut up. So that’s what I told them to do

 

[Tantum_ergo]

If any one of us were to be ‘prohibited from speaking on moral issues’ because we ourselves had at some point been guilty of grave sin of ANY kind. . .

I would venture to say that there would not be one person who could ‘speak’. . .unless he or she were lying to themselves or others in saying they had never been guilty of grave sin!

So the ones throwing stones at Mr. Donahue due to his divorce would probably throw them at me too. How dare I speak about the sanctity of marriage when I am divorced (with a decree of nullity but since ‘everybody knows’ how EASY those are to get, I’m probably guilty of ‘lying’ to get one too). But since the only ‘authority’ these stalwart champions are concerned with is usually their own (in which they pronounce how ‘unfit’, how ‘abrasive’, how ‘bad for the Church’, how horrible these ‘characters’ are etc.), I don’t suppose they’d be interested in anybody but the Lord Christ Himself making a statement about ‘morality’. However, if His statement differed from their opinion, they’d be surprised and horrified. . .that Christ would have made a MISTAKE!

 

[sidbrown]

leaving and abandoning are the same thing… i dont know what you are referring to… but i know Jesus said that we must love HIM more than our family or evern ourselves…

but anyhow.maybe you should explain… I said that i didn’t know much about D.

He is a divorced man. Why is he casting stones at others?

 

[Tantum_ergo]

He is a divorced man. Why is he casting stones at others?

Dear Sid: Read post 124.

Since when does having committed a sin (even a grave one, for which one has apparently sought and received sacramental confession, otherwise I think you would see documentation to the contrary) equate to ‘throwing stones’ by noting wrong actions of others?

You really aren’t going to claim that nobody who has ever been guilty of sin is ‘clean enough’ to be able to make a moral judgment, are you?

 

[sidbrown]

Dear Sid: Read post 124.

Since when does having committed a sin (even a grave one, for which one has apparently sought and received sacramental confession, otherwise I think you would see documentation to the contrary) equate to ‘throwing stones’ by noting wrong actions of others?

You really aren’t going to claim that nobody who has ever been guilty of sin is ‘clean enough’ to be able to make a moral judgment, are you?

Bill Donohue is not the super duper Catholic that some may claim him to be. He has abandoned his wife. And yet he casts stones at liberals at the same time.
Jesus preached against divorce: "When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went into the region of Judea to the other side of the Jordan. Large crowds followed him, and he healed them there. Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?” “Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator made them male and female', and said, For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let no man put asunder”
Divorce means breaking your marriage vows… “till death do us part!” When you say your wedding vows, you are making a lifelong commitment. A promise to God is a promise. Where is your credibility if you break a solemn promise to Almighty God, made in front of the crucifix of Our Divine Lord?

 

[Indyann]

Bill Donohue is not the super duper Catholic that some may claim him to be. He has abandoned his wife. And yet he casts stones at liberals at the same time.
Jesus preached against divorce: "When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went into the region of Judea to the other side of the Jordan. Large crowds followed him, and he healed them there. Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?” “Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator made them male and female', and said, For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let no man put asunder”
Divorce means breaking your marriage vows… “till death do us part!” When you say your wedding vows, you are making a lifelong commitment. A promise to God is a promise. Where is your credibility if you break a solemn promise to Almighty God, made in front of the crucifix of Our Divine Lord?

How do you know that HE abandoned HER? Perhaps she abandoned him and there was nothing he could do about it?

Even though, I think he does good work, he may not be the easiest person to live with. Just doesn’t seem like a warm fuzzy kind of guy. Unless, you have inside info that he left her, your argument is baseless.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Bill Donohue is not the super duper Catholic that some may claim him to be. He has abandoned his wife. And yet he casts stones at liberals at the same time.
Jesus preached against divorce: "When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went into the region of Judea to the other side of the Jordan. Large crowds followed him, and he healed them there. Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?” “Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator made them male and female', and said, For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let no man put asunder”
Divorce means breaking your marriage vows… “till death do us part!” When you say your wedding vows, you are making a lifelong commitment. A promise to God is a promise. Where is your credibility if you break a solemn promise to Almighty God, made in front of the crucifix of Our Divine Lord?

Ah, yes. Setting aside (as Indyann notes) that you have no idea just who abandoned WHOM, you’re still waffling away. And nobody is going ‘super-duper Catholic’ but you. You’re the one putting up a strawman by stating that people who support Mr. Donahue’s right to speak regarding Catholic teaching, even if we might not at times agree with his 'presentation style", are somehow elevating him falsely. Please. Where in Scripture or tradition does it say that those who have committed a grave sin are henceforth ‘not permitted’ to ever make a statement about generalized moral principles or the lack thereof? Are you privy to this man’s mind? Are you his confessor and do you know absolutely that he is NOT in a state of grace at this time???

You seem to be saying, "Bill Donohue did a BAD thing by divorcing his wife. .therefore I will not listen to Bill speak about moral issues even if Bill is simply stating the Catholic position on those issues.’

This type of “thinking” is absolutely and totally unChristian as well as being wildly irrational.

St. Paul (remember him?) went about putting Christians to death. He certainly did a ‘bad thing’ by standing by and watching the injustice perpetuated on St. Stephen, and then he went further and actually was responsible for many Christian deaths. He was so ‘zealous’ for Judaism that he never even thought that being responsible for Christian deaths was even a bad thing, then.

But even though all the Christians (St. Peter, St. James) etc. KNEW of St. Paul’s bad actions ‘before’ his conversion, you don’t see them saying, like you of Mr. Donahue,

“Tsk tsk Paul. We know you SAY you’re a good guy now but YOU HAD PEOPLE KILLED. Bad Paul. Bad, bad Paul. Sorry but we will absolutely not listen to YOU talk about ‘morality’ because you’re a murderer Paul.”

Don’t you see that the above lines I gave (in reference to St. Paul) are exactly what YOU are claiming in attempting to ‘forbid’ Mr. Donahue to speak because of a ‘sin committed’? You’re saying, "one bad action precludes the ability to ‘speak’ on morals’. . . and Scripture itself refutes your position.

 

[distracted]

I was trying to get into the Presence of Jesus.

I couldn’t though with the distractions being caused by the group of teenagers sitting directly in front of me.

Others around were ‘‘tutting’’ and throwing glances at them but noone was saying anything to them.

Yes, I did tell them to shut up and remember where they were and show some respect.

I said shut up because that’s what I wanted them to do.

I could have said, ‘‘Hi guys, Im really sorry to interject here in your little group discussion while Mass is going on, but do you think, when it’s convenient, you could possible turn it down a little, or perhaps simply focus on the alter and maybe leave the chatting until Mass is finished as you are causing a major distraction to myself and others- if you don’t mind, of course’’

But my style is to keep it short, simple and to the point. I wanted them to show some respect and shut up. So that’s what I told them to do

Jesus said that whatever you do the least of His brethren you do to HIm…

 

[sidbrown]

. Where in Scripture or tradition does it say that those who have committed a grave sin are henceforth ‘not permitted’ to ever make a statement about generalized moral principles or the lack thereof?]

John 8:7
Let him who is without sin, cast the first stone.
Donohue has been casting all kinds of stones at liberals, whereas is it true that he himself has taken an oath before God to be with his wife in marriage until death and that he has broken that oath? It seems to me that this reflects on his credibility as a super duper Catholic defending the Catholic teachings against all enemies.

 

[agp2176]

Hmm – well, just when you may think we don’t don’t need someone like Bill Donahue, something like this comes along…

catholicleague.org/release.php?id=1861

FEMINISTS FROM NOW ATTACK CATHOLIC CHURCH

God bless

Tony

 

[Tantum_ergo]

John 8:7
Let him who is without sin, cast the first stone.
Donohue has been casting all kinds of stones at liberals, whereas is it true that he himself has taken an oath before God to be with his wife in marriage until death and that he has broken that oath? It seems to me that this reflects on his credibility as a super duper Catholic defending the Catholic teachings against all enemies.

So Sid, all those people there were prohibited from ever making a statement on morality ever after? I don’t THINK so.

Unfortunately, you’ve built up this fine strawman argument and have apparently no wish to actually discuss either the topic at hand (is Bill Donohue bad for the Catholic Church) but instead wish to make this into a ‘he throws stones at liberals but he’s a foul sinner’ libelous screed. If you ever DO wish to talk about the actual Mr. Donohue and the topic at hand, and not your erroneous ‘take’ on the subject, let us know, thanks K bye.

 

[Guyonthestreet]

Hmm – well, just when you may think we don’t don’t need someone like Bill Donahue, something like this comes along…

catholicleague.org/release.php?id=1861

FEMINISTS FROM NOW ATTACK CATHOLIC CHURCH

God bless

Tony

For a guy who claims to be educated to Ph.D level, it’s a shame Donohue never feels the need to reference the ‘‘data’’ he refers to in his bombastic retorts.

 

[Guyonthestreet]

Jesus said that whatever you do the least of His brethren you do to HIm…

So those disrespectful unruley teens were distracting Him, because they were distracting me and the other worshipers in their immediate vacinity.

 

[johns58w]

No, he is not bad for the Catholic Church. Most of what he says should not even have to be an issue. If Catholics were treated with the same courtesy that other groups are given in this age of political correctness, then Donohue would not be doing what he does. Peter Kreeft is no radical yet he called anticatholicism the last socially acceptable prejudice.

It is National Catholic Reporter I think does a horrible job or representing the Catholic faith. For me, their criticism is point of approval for any good Catholic.

In these days of “Catholic bashing” Bill donohue lets the public know if they have a problem with the Catholic Church to bring forth their views in “Full Truth”. The problem is always the “world’s” lies and deep sinfulness to smear the Catholic Church and other Christians.

National Catholic Reporter. I saw their website late last year. So “KUMBAYAH”. Kind of reminds me of certain parishes that “hide the Tabernacle in the closet” and “tell the priests and bishops to get rid of the kneelers”. I have been told in my parish NCR is not a credible Catholic news source.

cont’d

 

[johns58w]

I used to get mail from Catholic League. Not any more. My interests in my faith media have gone elsewhere like here at Catholic Answers.

I saw the article on National Catholic Reporter on “Billy the Bully”. Bill has his sins problems, struggles and a great cross to bear.

I’m not writing to play a “tennis match” with anyone on Bill’s dispositions. Neither am I to play “Philadelphia Lawyer” to defend and vindicate him. Religious and us layity have more than enough of our sinfulness to deal with.

“CONFESSION” “RECONCILIATION” “PENNANCE”
I made an appointment and saw my parish priest for Confession.

National CatholicReporter and its forum group have gone great lengths to bash Bill Donohue. Now there are things about Bill I may not agree with or approve of his certain personalties/ behavior. That’s my personal opinion.

Now back to NCR. How do they see the speck in Bill Donohue’s eye when they can’t see the plank covering their own. How do they think they can be a credible Catholic news source when they have problems following Church Magisterial Teaching. Smearing their own Catholic brothers and sisters? Promototion of “liberalist theology”? What’s next? push for pro-choice? contraception? abortion? “So-called women priests”?

Steve Wood has even told me to not read National Catholic Reporter. Now I know why.

 

[adrift]

Jesus preached against divorce: "When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went into the region of Judea to the other side of the Jordan. Large crowds followed him, and he healed them there. Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?” “Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator made them male and female', and said, For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let no man put asunder” QUOTE]

Don’t stop complete the scripture.

In the house the disciples again questioned him about this.

 

[sidbrown]

sidbrown;6652811:

Jesus preached against divorce: "When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went into the region of Judea to the other side of the Jordan. Large crowds followed him, and he healed them there. Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?” “Haven’t you read,” he replied, “that at the beginning the Creator made them male and female', and said, For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let no man put asunder” QUOTE]

Don’t stop complete the scripture.

So it is not just divorcing but then marrying someone else that Jesus is condeming.

Really? So you don;t beleive what the Catechism of the Catholic Church says about divorce?
2384 Divorce is a grave offense against the natural law. It claims to break the contract, to which the spouses freely consented, to live with each other till death.

 

[adrift]

adrift;6659695:

Really? So you don;t beleive what the Catechism of the Catholic Church says about divorce?
2384 Divorce is a grave offense against the natural law. It claims to break the contract, to which the spouses freely consented, to live with each other till death.

I don’t know why you think you must attack. I will turn the question on you. Do you believe what is in the Catechism or do you just pull out what you agree with. Much more is said. Look at 2383 and 2386.

Divorce is a grave disorder but sometimes necessary as the above canons show. An annumlment cannot be begun until a divorce is obtained.

Did you really mean to disagree with Jesus when you asked Really?