Is Billy Joel song offensive?

[surfinpure]

2shelbys:

That’s agreeing to disagree? Wow. Strangest interpretation of the phrase I’ve ever encountered.

I do not understand you here. There is no “interpretation”. It is merely a way to say that any further argument is pointless.

Look. This thread isn’t about you or me. It isn’t about judgment, condemnation, sin, retribution, or fire and brimstone. For crying out loud, it’s a thread about BILLY JOEL and why or why not his music is appropriate.

This thread (which I did not start) is exactly about judgement and condemnation. Judgement and condemnation of Billy Joel. I only posted to it to make the point (as you do) that it is only a song (with many possible interpretations) and is not important enough to be so negative about. Punch him in the face?

Please note: if you want to get along well in a forum, any forum, it pays to be considerate of others

**I have been considerate. I do not think that asking people to be civil is impolite. Do you? I admit that my last response to the attack on me was a little forceful but it was just that, a response. I did not initiate the attack. **

If, on the other hand, you’ve been in discussion with us for a time already then you have at that point earned the right to speak to the matter.

Again trying to be polite…are you kidding? Do you actually believe that people have to “earn the right” to speak here?
I spoke when I did because that is when I first visited here and noticed the nasty, violent comments. I do agree with you that a thread about a song is simply not that important, but this whole arena is not important enough that someone has to earn the right to participate. Who would have thought that asking a group of Catholics to refrain from making nasty, violent comments would provoke so much anger. As I said earlier, amazing stuff.

sigh

This grows tedious. And redundant.

1. Your interpretation of agreeing to disagree seems to mean slamming the other person with two very large paragraphs. Sounds more like agreeing to argue.
2. The thread is, I repeat, about a Billy Joel song, believe it or not. Judgment and Condemnation are just down the hall in Moral Theology, a fascinating little forum which I believe you will find quite suitable.
3. I, as you will no doubt find when you read the thread in its entirety, never used the phrase “punch him in the face.”
4. Yes, I do believe that the way you approached this thread was impolite. Highly impolite.
5. In any social setting, one earns the right to be heard. It’s called rapport. Gaining such is as simple as stepping into the conversation with an air of respect for those present. This is a fundamental law of communication.

 

[fix]

The entire song is about some creep trying to deflower some young girl, while at the same time mocking her faith. Gimme a break.

 

[MooCowSteph]

CinciMom:

I have to apologize but when I saw that last quote, I had to laugh. Not at you, but the whole idea of “family friendly” radio stations. I often think of the songs they play and think “My gosh, that sounds worse today than when I first heard it in 1980 something”.

have to agree with you on that one…I turned on what was supposed to be “family-friendly” radio this morning, and a caller was talking about how “cool” an IUD is.

 

[2shelbys]

1. The thread is, I repeat, about a Billy Joel song, believe it or not. Judgment and Condemnation are just down the hall in Moral Theology, a fascinating little forum which I believe you will find quite suitable.

I am not surprised you know about it since it is indeed you who judge and comdemn. I never quoted you as making the comment about punching, I just stated that that was one of the comments I found distasteful. Again I say it is amazing that asking a group of Catholics to refrain from using nasty or violent remarks results in so much anger from some of them. I am going to stick to the threads where people maintain a polite, professional atmosphere and leave you to your bashing. I should have known that anyone who could get so agitated over a mere song would react harshly to being asked to exibit a little self control.

 

[rastell]

adstrinity:

Okay, maybe it’s just me, but, it implies homosexuality, I think. Remember, if something CAN be interpreted a certain way, it will be.

The first guy who “never had time for a wife” indicates that he’s probably middle age at least, and, what was the indication about single middle age men back in the day? And, that he’s talking to a guy in the navy, “and probably will be for life.” Doesn’t the navy have a history of homosexuality in general? That these two are talking TO EACH OTHER, both single men, kinda struck me as a budding relationship. I thought it was subtle, but clever, the way he worded this.

I doubt that many people would see your connections. As a matter of fact, even after reading your explanation, I still do not see a concrete connection.

 

[Jesus4Me]

I haven’t even read any of the other posts, but I can say without a doubt that this song is offensive to me. I’ve heard people come to his defense and say “It’s harmless and all in fun.” Well, I don’t like the words one bit and don’t see anything funny or fun about it.

The answer to your questions is a resounding YES!!! :yup: But then again there are so many secular songs that are either offensive or send the wrong message.

This song just gives me one more reason to listen to Christian music.

 

[rastell]

By the way, Joel released this song 28 years ago and has often used Catholic words and phrases in his lyrics. He is a brilliant artist but does sometimes use his familarity with Catholic terms in a despicable way. It’s too bad his talents can’t be used always for what is good.

 

[Faustina]

Giannawannabe:

I’m pretty much what some would consider a “prude”. However, I just don’t see what the fuss is over this song. Now, I have to admit, I’m a BIG Billy Joel fan and have been to several concerts. The song, IMO, is about a guy trying to get some pure Catholic girl in bed, but HE FAILS. Honestly, that’s how I always interpreted the words to this song. It’s really not that bad. Much, much worse out there, if you ask me.

God Bless
Giannawannabe

Thank You !!

The song is based on experiences as young man. He fell for a girl who was devout as well as her family. Read the lyrics again.
I see a young man trying to convince the girl to give it up, but she doesn’t because of her faith. Now, ladies…how many times has that happened to you. When I was in my twenties, while I liked to have a good time, I was not promuscious (sp?) and there was also the expectation from the guy of some time between the sheets, when I said no, there was always the “convincing” lines that came next.
Billy Joel just put the desire and angst in song. No different than what other musicians have done for centuries

 

[surfinpure]

2shelbys:

I am not surprised you know about it since it is indeed you who judge and comdemn. I never quoted you as making the comment about punching, I just stated that that was one of the comments I found distasteful. Again I say it is amazing that asking a group of Catholics to refrain from using nasty or violent remarks results in so much anger from some of them. I am going to stick to the threads where people maintain a polite, professional atmosphere and leave you to your bashing. I should have known that anyone who could get so agitated over a mere song would react harshly to being asked to exibit a little self control.

This response is so over-the-top that it defies logical response. I’m through with this banter. I will, however, continue to talk about Billy Joel.

 

[surfinpure]

Faustina:

Thank You !!

The song is based on experiences as young man. He fell for a girl who was devout as well as her family. Read the lyrics again.
I see a young man trying to convince the girl to give it up, but she doesn’t because of her faith. Now, ladies…how many times has that happened to you. When I was in my twenties, while I liked to have a good time, I was not promuscious (sp?) and there was also the expectation from the guy of some time between the sheets, when I said no, there was always the “convincing” lines that came next.
Billy Joel just put the desire and angst in song. No different than what other musicians have done for centuries

You have a sound point. The song certainly could be viewed in this light. Of course, the only way he’s not the villian in this picture is if he wrote the song as some sort of very roundabout way of encouraging young Catholic girls. I’m not sure I believe that, but it is possible.

 

[fix]

Faustina:

Thank You !!

The song is based on experiences as young man. He fell for a girl who was devout as well as her family. Read the lyrics again.
I see a young man trying to convince the girl to give it up, but she doesn’t because of her faith. Now, ladies…how many times has that happened to you. When I was in my twenties, while I liked to have a good time, I was not promuscious (sp?) and there was also the expectation from the guy of some time between the sheets, when I said no, there was always the “convincing” lines that came next.
Billy Joel just put the desire and angst in song. No different than what other musicians have done for centuries

He is mocking her faith. It is a bash to Catholics.

 

[MooCowSteph]

surf(name removed by moderator)ure:

This response is so over-the-top that it defies logical response. I’m through with this banter. I will, however, continue to talk about Billy Joel.

I know the two of you went back and forth a bit, but were you just trying to get in the last word with this post? I’m not attacking or trying to start my own debate, just making an observation and wondering if it’s true.

 

[MooCowSteph]

Faustina:

Thank You !!

The song is based on experiences as young man. He fell for a girl who was devout as well as her family. Read the lyrics again.
I see a young man trying to convince the girl to give it up, but she doesn’t because of her faith. Now, ladies…how many times has that happened to you. When I was in my twenties, while I liked to have a good time, I was not promuscious (sp?) and there was also the expectation from the guy of some time between the sheets, when I said no, there was always the “convincing” lines that came next.
Billy Joel just put the desire and angst in song. No different than what other musicians have done for centuries

This is how I see it and the point I’ve been trying to make. Well said.

 

[wabrams]

fix:

He is mocking her faith. It is a bash to Catholics.

No, it’s about a guy trying to get into bed with a girl, so he’ll attack anything that she’s using to stop him. In the case of one of his experiences, it was a Catholic girl.

 

[fix]

wabrams:

No, it’s about a guy trying to get into bed with a girl, so he’ll attack anything that she’s using to stop him. In the case of one of his experiences, it was a Catholic girl.

Yes, he is trying to seduce her and in doing so is mocking the Catholic faith.

 

[drforjc]

Chickamauga:

My radio and television habits have changed dramatically since I began my journey into Catholicism. I want less and less to do with what the world seems to think is acceptable or "normal. " Thank you, Lord!

You sound a lot like me!

BTW, yes the song is offensive.

 

[surfinpure]

MooCowSteph:

I know the two of you went back and forth a bit, but were you just trying to get in the last word with this post? I’m not attacking or trying to start my own debate, just making an observation and wondering if it’s true.

chuckle I hadn’t really thought of it that way, but I suppose it’s possible. I was a bit agitated. My intention, or so I thought it to be, was to redirect the focus of the thread to Billy Joel. Ah, well. In either case, I hope that’s what is accomplished.

 

[wabrams]

fix:

Yes, he is trying to seduce her and in doing so is mocking the Catholic faith.

And if the girl from his past had been Jewish, he would have mocked her Jewish Faith. At certain ages, guys will say anything or mock anything to get a girl into bed. You grow up and cease to do those things. And then musicians alot of times write songs about their youthful experiences. Don’t believe me, go pick up a Dave Mathews CD.

 

[surfinpure]

wabrams:

And if the girl from his past had been Jewish, he would have mocked her Jewish Faith. At certain ages, guys will say anything or mock anything to get a girl into bed. You grow up and cease to do those things. And then musicians alot of times write songs about their youthful experiences. Don’t believe me, go pick up a Dave Mathews CD.

Dave Matthews … shudder

 

[fix]

wabrams:

And if the girl from his past had been Jewish, he would have mocked her Jewish Faith. At certain ages, guys will say anything or mock anything to get a girl into bed. You grow up and cease to do those things. And then musicians alot of times write songs about their youthful experiences. Don’t believe me, go pick up a Dave Mathews CD.

Two points.

1. It was not about a Jewish girl. It was specfically Catholic. That is relevant.
2. The fact that something may have happened does not magically make it good and noble that it is performed as a song that offends many, no matter how many did it or are doing it.

I remember when the song came out. There was much discussion about it and it was banned from the radio in some markets. The controversy was such because the song is offensive.