Is capitalism a special form of slavery?

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Third World countries don’t have capitalism. They have very corrupt governments that oppress the people. Capitalism calls for less government not more.
Capitalism is an economic system characterized by privately owned means of production, wage labour, the accumulation of capital, etc. It has nothing to do with the level of government. Plenty of authoritarian regimes have been capitalist.
 
Third World countries don’t have capitalism. They have very corrupt governments that oppress the people. Capitalism calls for less government not more.
Only in the realm of business dealing; not in other areas.

And even then, only initially. Many aspects of civil society affected by business require governmental oversight for the general good (eg. Labor conditions, pollution).

ICXC NIKA
 
Because the Fortune 500 corporation is not a person (despite being a legal “body”) and so cannot commit sin.

ICXC NIKA
People run these companies though, boards are made up of human beings, who decide what direction to take the company and decide every facet of its operation, from what to charge for products to where they are made.

These people are capable of sinning ‘on the job’ too, its not like they get a free pass when they clock in at work, same rules apply to everyone no matter what you are doing.

I see this a big problem in christianity right now, many people sort of set their beliefs aside while on the job, as to meet the demands of a secular world.
 
Go tell that to the Scandinavian countries, who somehow manage to combine a level.of taxation and governmental control of services that most Americans would definitely class as socialist with consistently incredibly high levels of material prosperity and, dare it be said, happiness (by pretty much every measure that can be used to measure such a thing.)
Scandinavian countries are not socialist countries - or did you think IKEA was government owned? They are capitalistic countries with high tax rates and have relatively homogeneous and small populations .
 
Scandinavian countries are not socialist countries - or did you think IKEA was government owned? They are capitalistic countries with high tax rates and have relatively homogeneous and small populations .
Methinks you and she are defining “socialist” differently.

ICXC NIKA
 
When you see all the poverty in Third-World countries while the elite grow fat, it’s hard to deny. It is us, the Western World, that takes resources from the poor countries, and pay next to nothing to the workers. Having 9,500 children dying each day of starvation, with few lifting a finger to help, is nothing less than barbaric on the part of capitalists. Child laborers are common, with nobody caring enough to stop this awful crime.
  1. Therefore, those whom fortune favors are warned that riches do not bring freedom from sorrow and are of no avail for eternal happiness, but rather are obstacles;(9) that the rich should tremble at the threatenings of Jesus Christ - threatenings so unwonted in the mouth of our Lord(10) - and that a most strict account must be given to the Supreme Judge for all we possess. The chief and most excellent rule for the right use of money is one the heathen philosophers hinted at, but which the Church has traced out clearly, and has not only made known to men’s minds, but has impressed upon their lives. It rests on the principle that it is one thing to have a right to the possession of money and another to have a right to use money as one wills. Private ownership, as we have seen, is the natural right of man, and to exercise that right, especially as members of society, is not only lawful, but absolutely necessary. “It is lawful,” says St. Thomas Aquinas, “for a man to hold private property; and it is also necessary for the carrying on of human existence.”" But if the question be asked: How must one’s possessions be used? - the Church replies without hesitation in the words of the same holy Doctor: “Man should not consider his material possessions as his own, but as common to all, so as to share them without hesitation when others are in need. Whence the Apostle with, ‘Command the rich of this world… to offer with no stint, to apportion largely.’”(12) True, no one is commanded to distribute to others that which is required for his own needs and those of his household; nor even to give away what is reasonably required to keep up becomingly his condition in life, “for no one ought to live other than becomingly.”(13) But, when what necessity demands has been supplied, and one’s standing fairly taken thought for, it becomes a duty to give to the indigent out of what remains over. “Of that which remaineth, give alms.”(14) It is a duty, not of justice (save in extreme cases), but of Christian charity - a duty not enforced by human law. But the laws and judgments of men must yield place to the laws and judgments of Christ the true God, who in many ways urges on His followers the practice of almsgiving - ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive";(15) and who will count a kindness done or refused to the poor as done or refused to Himself - “As long as you did it to one of My least brethren you did it to Me.”(16) To sum up, then, what has been said: Whoever has received from the divine bounty a large share of temporal blessings, whether they be external and material, or gifts of the mind, has received them for the purpose of using them for the perfecting of his own nature, and, at the same time, that he may employ them, as the steward of God’s providence, for the benefit of others. “He that hath a talent,” said St. Gregory the Great, “let him see that he hide it not; he that hath abundance, let him quicken himself to mercy and generosity; he that hath art and skill, let him do his best to share the use and the utility hereof with his neighbor.”(17)
    – Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum
I am highly surprised to see that Distributism, the normative teaching of the Church has not been mentioned yet. There are obligations, particularly incumbent on the well-off to alter how they act in a way that is inconsistent with the main capitalist drive: to accrue maximum profit.
Capitalism comes under scrutiny from the Church precisely because of this slavery aspect which the Church (and Marx) have rightly diagnosed. The Church, however distinguishes itself against Marx, by seeking a balance between private and public. As the local Father says “personal but not private” seems to be the motto of the Church – personal sin is personal, but not private so is the social sins of harming others economically.

Pax Christi,
Riani
 
When you see all the poverty in Third-World countries while the elite grow fat, it’s hard to deny. It is us, the Western World, that takes resources from the poor countries, and pay next to nothing to the workers. Having 9,500 children dying each day of starvation, with few lifting a finger to help, is nothing less than barbaric on the part of capitalists. Child laborers are common, with nobody caring enough to stop this awful crime.
There are many error in this post.

9,500 children are not dying daily from starvation. In fact, children are only dying from starvation in war regions, were the factions won’t let aid through. When there is famine but not war, the international community readily provides aid.

Child labor is normal and appropriate in basic agricultural economies. My dad grew up on a farm and all the kids pitched in with chores to make the farm function. The only legal slave labor I’m aware of is ‘prison labor’, which we actually have in the 1st world as well.

If third world countries are not progressing economically, it’s because of their corrupt local leadership, not because of the 1st world holding them back.
 
There are many error in this post.

9,500 children are not dying daily from starvation. In fact, children are only dying from starvation in war regions, were the factions won’t let aid through. When there is famine but not war, the international community readily provides aid.

Child labor is normal and appropriate in basic agricultural economies. My dad grew up on a farm and all the kids pitched in with chores to make the farm function. The only legal slave labor I’m aware of is ‘prison labor’, which we actually have in the 1st world as well.

If third world countries are not progressing economically, it’s because of their corrupt local leadership, not because of the 1st world holding them back.
A) + 1. In the “We are the World” famine of 1984, although concerts and other efforts raised millions in aid, aid packages rotted in the sun before they could get through the Ethiopian warzone of that time. The First World did not cause that.

B) True, but one needs to distinguish between childhood work in familial agriculture situations, which was the norm even in NA well into the 1900s (and is why the school calendar of NA has the form that it does) and “child labor” of the commercial type, which led to children being beaten to keep them awake (Victorian England) or being chained to workbenches (Southeast Asia, modern). The first is not a problem, the second can easily be.

C). True.

ICXC NIKA
 
There are many error in this post.

9,500 children are not dying daily from starvation. In fact, children are only dying from starvation in war regions, were the factions won’t let aid through. When there is famine but not war, the international community readily provides aid.

Child labor is normal and appropriate in basic agricultural economies. My dad grew up on a farm and all the kids pitched in with chores to make the farm function. The only legal slave labor I’m aware of is ‘prison labor’, which we actually have in the 1st world as well.

If third world countries are not progressing economically, it’s because of their corrupt local leadership, not because of the 1st world holding them back.
It’s nice for people to try and sweep the problem under the rug by denying that large numbers of children die from starvation each and every day. I just did a quick Internet search and found the estimated death rate to be 18,000 children dying from starvation each and every day!

usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/world/2007-02-17-un-hunger_x.htm

It’s also nice to place blame on corrupt government, as if it’s all their fault and is not our responsibility.
 
There are many error in this post.

9,500 children are not dying daily from starvation. In fact, children are only dying from starvation in war regions, were the factions won’t let aid through. When there is famine but not war, the international community readily provides aid.

Child labor is normal and appropriate in basic agricultural economies. My dad grew up on a farm and all the kids pitched in with chores to make the farm function. The only legal slave labor I’m aware of is ‘prison labor’, which we actually have in the 1st world as well.

If third world countries are not progressing economically, it’s because of their corrupt local leadership, not because of the 1st world holding them back.
We are interconnected whether we see it or not.
Part of the chain is deliberate and corrupt,but it is also unawareness on our part. Or indifference sometimes.
Much of it comes in the news and leaves us speechless.
Children and their suffering is a hard topic.

un.org/en/globalissues/briefingpapers/childlabour/
 
It’s nice for people to try and sweep the problem under the rug by denying that large numbers of children die from starvation each and every day. I just did a quick Internet search and found the estimated death rate to be 18,000 children dying from starvation each and every day!

usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/world/2007-02-17-un-hunger_x.htm

It’s also nice to place blame on corrupt government, as if it’s all their fault and is not our responsibility.
Interesting that one of the countries with the largest number of malnourished children is China, a communist country .
 
It’s nice for people to try and sweep the problem under the rug by denying that large numbers of children die from starvation each and every day. I just did a quick Internet search and found the estimated death rate to be 18,000 children dying from starvation each and every day!

usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/world/2007-02-17-un-hunger_x.htm

It’s also nice to place blame on corrupt government, as if it’s all their fault and is not our responsibility.
I have researched the topic in-depth before, which is why my response was so specific. There is no documented support for 9-18k daily starvation deaths.

Poor nutrition does play a role in diseases which leads to preventable deaths, but that is a much more complicated topic.
 
I have researched the topic in-depth before, which is why my response was so specific. There is no documented support for 9-18k daily starvation deaths.

Poor nutrition does play a role in diseases which leads to preventable deaths, but that is a much more complicated topic.
So the UN and other organizations are lying about the starvation statistics in children? I pray that you’re correct, but I still find the statistics that I presented to be accurate. Can you provide a source from a credible institution for your figures?
 
So the UN and other organizations are lying about the starvation statistics in children? I pray that you’re correct, but I still find the statistics that I presented to be accurate. Can you provide a source from a credible institution for your figures?
A quote from a 2007 speech is hardly evidence. Please provide a substantiated figure (with supporting detail).

When I researched the issue,
  • most childhood deaths in the stats were actually attributed to death by disease, not starvation.
  • they assumed/claimed the illnesses were caused/exacerbated by malnutrition that prevented healthy maturation.
  • analysis showed the root issue was poor nutrition during pregnancy.
  • better nutrition after birth could not correct nutrition deficiency during womb developmental
Further analysis showed the bottom line root cause was social, not economic.
  • The families had food resources but were making the wrong decisions.
  • diet emphasized cereals instead of greens & basic protein
  • food was prioritized for the man instead of the pregnant wife during critical development of the baby in the womb.
Thus, the way to prevent these disease deaths is better education on nutrition and changing the culture to prioritize the needs of the pregnant mother. Money spent on these topics would be well spent and yield a long term improvement in health for the people.
 
A quote from a 2007 speech is hardly evidence. Please provide a substantiated figure (with supporting detail).

When I researched the issue,
  • most childhood deaths in the stats were actually attributed to death by disease, not starvation.
  • they assumed/claimed the illnesses were caused/exacerbated by malnutrition that prevented healthy maturation.
  • analysis showed the root issue was poor nutrition during pregnancy.
  • better nutrition after birth could not correct nutrition deficiency during womb developmental
Further analysis showed the bottom line root cause was social, not economic.
  • The families had food resources but were making the wrong decisions.
  • diet emphasized cereals instead of greens & basic protein
  • food was prioritized for the man instead of the pregnant wife during critical development of the baby in the womb.
Thus, the way to prevent these disease deaths is better education on nutrition and changing the culture to prioritize the needs of the pregnant mother. Money spent on these topics would be well spent and yield a long term improvement in health for the people.
I need to correct myself and say that undernourishment (starvation of nutrients) is responsible for the deaths. Yes, many of the deaths are from disease, but the cause of the disease is malnourishment. The same goes for fetal growth restrictions caused by the malnourishment.
Children and hunger
Children are the most visible victims of undernutrition. Black et al (2013) estimate that undernutrition in the aggregate—including fetal growth restriction, stunting, wasting, and deficiencies of vitamin A and zinc along with suboptimum breastfeeding—is a cause of 3·1 million child deaths annually or 45% of all child deaths in 2011 (Black et al. 2013). Undernutrition magnifies the effect of every disease, including measles and malaria. The estimated proportions of deaths in which undernutrition is an underlying cause are roughly similar for diarrhea (61%), malaria (57%), pneumonia (52%), and measles (45%) (Black 2003, Bryce 2005). Malnutrition can also be caused by diseases, such as the diseases that cause diarrhea, by reducing the body’s ability to convert food into usable nutrients.
worldhunger.org/articles/Learn/world%20hunger%20facts%202002.htm
Nearly half of all deaths in children** under 5** are attributable to under-nutrition. This translates into the unnecessary loss of about 3 million young lives a year.
Every 10 seconds, a child dies from hunger-related diseases.
thp.org/knowledge-center/know-your-world-facts-about-hunger-poverty//
 
I need to correct myself and say that undernourishment (starvation of nutrients) is responsible for the deaths. Yes, many of the deaths are from disease, but the cause of the disease is malnourishment. The same goes for fetal growth restrictions caused by the malnourishment.
Yes, the evidence shows poor nutrition during pregnancy and the first year is the root cause. Their immune systems never became strong enough to fight off normal childhood diseases.

As I said earlier, fixing it is fundamentally a cultural issue, they have the food resources but don’t understand what is proper nutrition and don’t prioritize their pregnant and newborn over mature males.
 
Yes, the evidence shows poor nutrition during pregnancy and the first year is the root cause. Their immune systems never became strong enough to fight off normal childhood diseases.

As I said earlier, fixing it is fundamentally a cultural issue, they have the food resources but don’t understand what is proper nutrition and don’t prioritize their pregnant and newborn over mature males.
What do you mean it’s a cultural issue issue. Do you mean it’s their problem, not ours? If so, you sweep the problem under the rug. It’s everyone’s problem, and we are all responsible.
 
So the UN and other organizations are lying about the starvation statistics in children? I pray that you’re correct, but I still find the statistics that I presented to be accurate. Can you provide a source from a credible institution for your figures?
Why is the UN not acting to relieve these children? Don’t we give them money for such emergencies???
I heard one leader in an African country came to the UN to petition for funds to counteract global warming. Said if his country wasn’t affected by global warming now it soon would be and he wanted billions…

Does the UN have billions to counter global warming? Wouldn’t that money be better spent on hungry children around the world??? I don’t get it…
 
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