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vsedriver
Guest
if there are, I bet they never get dirty…
the reference is a vision. Not all visions imply that what is seen exists exactly as seen ie, white horse in heaven. Revelation isn’t a news report of actual events happening in real time.
(former owner of two white arabians, current owner of a solid black pony)
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Annie
Guest
There will be something in Heaven which we will understand to be that which was described as white horses.
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EndTimes
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Historical revisionism… manufactured to cast seeds of Doubt?
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SeekerOfTruth7
Guest
Thought it was about Islam, not about white horses…
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JSRG
Guest
Presumably, yes.Annie:
So are there white horses in heaven?
So this would be independently creating horses in heaven without following the laws of biological evolution?
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AlNg
Guest
The thread was about whether or not Islam is true. Someone says no, but Christianity is true and Christian Scriptures are inerrant but that there were some issues with Islamic Scriptures. The discussion then went on about whether or not the Christian Scriptures were inerrant as there were citations that were either contradictory or difficult to believe.
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quies
Guest
Not sure.
However, the Daily Racing Form assures me that gray mares appear in the winners circle after distaff races more frequently than their chestnut filly counterparts?!
There. I hope that helps.
The flag is up…
The sūrah you refer to is called ‘Al-Nisa’. It is Medinan, and contains several themes, one of which concerns the intrigues of those it calls ‘hypocrites’.
There is peril in ripping a verse out of its context. Here is verse 89, in its proper setting (my emphasis):
‘(Believers), why are you divided in two about the hypocrites, when Allāh Himself has rejected them because of what they have done? Do you want to guide those Allāh has left to stray? If Allāh leaves anyone to stray, you (Prophet) will never find the way for him. They would dearly like you to reject faith, as they themselves have done, to be like them. So do not take them as allies until they migrate (to Medina) for Allāh’s cause. If they turn (on you)*, then seize and kill them wherever you encounter them. Take none of them as an ally or supporter. But as for those who seek refuge with people with whom you have a treaty, or who come over to you because their hearts shrink from fighting against you or against their own people, Allāh could have given them power over you, and they would have fought you. So if they withdraw and do not fight you, and offer you peace, then Allāh gives you no way against them. (Al-Nisa: 88-90).
- The intended meaning is clear from the context; it is to ‘turn with aggression’; to ‘attack’.
However, should the hypocrites turn against the Muslims and attack them, then they may be resisted, even if this requires the use of deadly force (as it most certainly would have done).
Verse 90 imposes strict limitations upon the Muslims (should fighting break out): They may not continue to fight those aggressors who, faced with defeat, seek refuge with other tribes; nor may they continue to fight those who cease their aggression – for whatever reason – and who offer peace.
There is no authorisation in these verses for aggressive violence on the part of Muslims; not for the Muslims of Medina at that time; and not for Muslims today.
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Catfinger77
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It’s a matter of faith, which you can get through prayer. To me, the words and actions of Jesus while he lived as a man prove who He is, and the willingness of believers for centuries to work themselves to death to help the poor and save souls, along with the martyrs who died horribly for their faith in Jesus is proof enough for me.
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TMC
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Serious question - why do you find the centuries-long beliefs and actions of Christian believers to be proof of Christianity, but not the centuries-long beliefs and actions of those of other faiths? There are other faiths with similarly long and fruitful histories, why should that not be convincing to the adherents of those faiths?
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historyfan81
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unlike judaisim and chirstianity which claim to be inspired by god islam claims that the koran was written by allah .
since it was ,you only need to find one mistake in the book and the whole religion is false .
and speaking about the trinity in the old testament many times god speaks in plural nouns. like in genesis
the only thing i agree is that some catholic arguments are ciruclar but thats another debate
since it was ,you only need to find one mistake in the book and the whole religion is false .
and speaking about the trinity in the old testament many times god speaks in plural nouns. like in genesis
the only thing i agree is that some catholic arguments are ciruclar but thats another debate
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Catfinger77
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Putting aside faith and the character and holiness of Jesus, and as I said in my first post, I don’t know of any other faiths with such a sustained global impact in helping the poor in the world. And If you know of any faiths with founders that can compare to Jesus of Nazareth, and with a similar history of martyrdom and charitable histories, let me know. I know of none.
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historyfan81
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any good cop or investigator will tell you no 2 eyewitness acount is the same , in fact if they are its most likely fake since it they got togher and planed it out or something
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TMC
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Quantifying charity is not what I thought your were getting at, I was thinking more about centuries of sincere belief, sacrifice and martyrdom. I think all long standing religions have centuries of belief and sacrifice to their credit.
But as to your point on good works, that is a pretty hard thing to quantify. Do you have any data that suggests that Christianity has a better history in that regard than other long standing religions, such has Hinduism? I certainly agree that Christianity has done a lot of good, charitable works for many centuries. But I am not sure that other long-standing religions don’t have similar track records. It may be that Christians are materially more charitable than other faiths, but I think that most faiths are pretty charitable.
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Catfinger77
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Nah. I’m done with this thread.
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Annie
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Hinduism teaches that people are working off past-life transgressions and that charity would undermine that, so they traditionally have not done much for the poor.
It was Catholics who set up hospitals and educational facilities through the university level not only in their own lands but through missionaries throughout the world.
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historyfan81
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Well budishim and even shamanisim also do good works and even the muslims build similar things in their gold age
So …its not the action but the motive
So …its not the action but the motive
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