Is it weird for Roman Catholic to switch?

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dochawk said:
I ended up at my first Divine Liturgy quite by accident. I went to a different RC church for the different time due to juggling Masses with my wife when kids were sick, had the time wrong, and saw that the BC church behind was about to start.

It all but knocked me off my feet in awe . . .
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Which is proof positive to all my dyslexic atheist friends that there IS a doG!

🙂 geo 🙂
 
XXI_4 said:
As far as I know, there is no mass/liturgy of the catechumens in any rite, post VII, where non-Catholics are excluded from the liturgy of the Eucharist.
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I was referring to the structure of the Liturgy being a re-presentation of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and a participation in the eternal ongoing Liturgy at the Throne of the Lamb…

geo
 
XXI_4 said:
As far as I know, there is no mass/liturgy of the catechumens in any rite, post VII, where non-Catholics are excluded from the liturgy of the Eucharist.
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Today, I think that’s correct.

Both of the referenced eastern liturgies, though, contain the deacon’s call of “The doors!”, which was the signal/order to remove them . . .
 
dochawk said:
Both of the referenced eastern liturgies, though, contain the deacon’s call of “The Doors!”, which was the signal/order to remove them . . .
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This departure of the catechumens is still practiced in many Traditional Orthodox Monasteries, but not so much in the local Parishes… It reflects the Early Church’s practice of keeping in the Narthex, and outside the Nave, all except the Communicants, including the Criers who in those early days were given the Penance for returning to their sins in transgression of fully preparing for each Communion Service and spending their time in tears and fasting outside the Doors begging as common beggars each Communicant to remember them in their Communicant Prayers during the Great Entrance… That God would forgive them, and they would be granted re-entry into Communion… And by this, the Catechumens would see first hand how important repentance from one’s sins is…

By early Church standards, we are all a bunch of sissies…

geo
 
Jragzz123 said:
I’m Roman Catholic but I’ve felt more called to the east over the last two years. From the vestments to the liturgy I think it’s all so beautiful. I’ve been attending mass at a ruthenian church every once in a while. I know there’s a big cultural significance to eastern Catholicism so is it bad or frowned upon for a Roman Catholic to switch?
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It’s not necessarily bad for a Roman Catholic to switch to a Byzantine sui iuris Church, so long as you are doing it for a reason that is coherent, and not just sentimental. If you have prayed about it for a while, talked with a Byzantine priest, and think that you are called to Byzantine theological, liturgical, and devotional life; start going to the Byzantine parish regularly. If, after a year or two of attending your local Byzantine parish, feel called to canonically switch to the Ruthenian Greek Catholic Church, speak with the priest, and he can help you with the process.

God leads us down strange paths sometimes. I was born Roman Catholic, converted to the Greek Old Calendarists (I was rebaptized and everything), and eventually returned to the Greek Byzantine Catholic Church (I still use the old calendar privately), although since there are only Greek Byzantine Catholic parishes in Greece, I attend a Melkite parish right now.

Just trust God, pray often, and He will show you the way forward.
 
My RO cousins are in their 60s & 70s and still keep the traditional fasts plus the traditional Eucharistic Fast from midnight (which I’m working on).
 
As I understand it, most of the Orthodox, the Melkites, and maybe a couple of the other EC keep the traditional fast.

Other EC have alleviated it to various amounts.
 
I’m working my way up to keeping the traditional fasts. This is what the Orthodox Church near me posted in their bulletin:

Nov 15 –
Dec 12

DAYS THE HOLY CANONS SPECIFY THE FOLLOWING:
Sunday.
Monday
Tuesday
Thursday
Saturday

Abstinence of:
Meat & Meat products
Dairy products

No Abstinence of:
Fish, Shellfish, Olive Oil,
Vegetables & vegetable
products, Fruit, Wine

During these days [Dec. 13 - 24 - they have a mixed calendar], the Fast becomes stricter:
• Olive oil and wine are permitted only on Saturdays and Sundays.
• Fish is not permitted on any day during this period. (Idk why - can @George720 help?)
• Dec 24 is a strict fast day. [Jan. 5 is also a strict fast day - we have these in the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church too.)

I always thought there was no fast or abstinence on Sunday because of the Resurrection. Apparently in the EOC, one must still abstain & fast on Sundays. I can understand fasting on Sunday if a feast like the Exaltation of the Holy Cross or the Beheading of St. John fell on that day. I don’t quite understand why one would still fast & abstain on Sundays.
 
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dochawk said:
I frequently refer to my jurisdiction as “the fasting wimps of Eastern Christianity” 😝

(Pittsburgh metropolia)
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Yeah, I’ve heard that. In the Greek Byzantine Catholic Church, we are required to observe all of the traditional Orthodox fasting rules, including the midnight Eucharistic fast.

I was a Greek Old Calendarist before converting, and we were pretty hardcore with regards to the fasting canons (and all the other canons too!), so it feels pretty normal for me.
 
TheMortenBay said:
But most of it is EXTRA compared to the relatively lax rules of the Roman Catholics.
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But wait! There’s more! “Laxity” relates to minimums. There is no limit to the maximum amount of love and devotion one may show - regardless of the Rite.
 
The western approach is to prescribe a minimum, under penalty of sin.

The eastern is to prescribe an ideal, understanding that not all can go that far.
 
It is good indeed that we are, at some level, encouraged to exceed both standards, with God’s grace. And, the west does seem to have lost focus at the hierarchical level. But, as with all pendulums, it will swing back. I believe that it has already begun - the recent excesses perhaps stimulating that move.
 
dochawk said:
The western approach is to prescribe a minimum, under penalty of sin.

The eastern is to prescribe an ideal, understanding that not all can go that far.
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Bravo! I’ve always known this, but never knew how to phrase it quite so pithily.
 
Margaret_Ann said:
During these days [Dec. 13 - 24 - they have a mixed calendar], the Fast becomes stricter:
• Olive oil and wine are permitted only on Saturdays and Sundays.
• Fish is not permitted on any day during this period. (Idk why - can @George720 help?)
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We are in the middle of this last period now, Dec 18th - I am not sure of the reason for the tightening up of the fast with no fish consumption… My Priest says it begins on the 19th, and simply reflects the proximity of the total fast coming on Dec 24th… This Sunday fast from fish is because it falls after the 19th, in the stricter praxis of the last 6 days - A true Lenten Fast…

The Sunday fast is not a Sunday fast so much as a pre-Communion fast for the 6 hours prior to receiving Communion on any day of the week… It is an NPO fast - A sip of water and we are not to receive that day…

The other good news is that spineless creatures can still be eaten - Cockroaches, spiders and worms… Not to mention shrimp, lobster, and conch…

geo
 
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dochawk said:
The western approach is to prescribe a minimum, under penalty of sin.

The eastern is to prescribe an ideal, understanding that not all can go that far.
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Actually, the Eastern fasting only prescribes minimums, but not under penalty of sin… The only strictly enforced one is the 6 hour nothing by mouth prior to Communion, and this is self-enforced… It’s not like we have spies gathering intel for the Fasting Police… And we have liberal Churches that have no fasting rules at all… So their clergy have to pick up their slack, I should imagine, and fast strictly in their stead… Interestingly, the non-fasters are the Church in Minneapolis that came in from one of the Latin EC Communions…

And we are free to get an obedience to fast more rigorously - Many Saints did not eat until the 9th hour - 3pm… Then one small, Lenten meal…

Ethopians and Copts all fast - Most of the Orthodox keep the Fasts, according to strength…

geo
 
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Thank you, George, for the explanation and expanding my Latin vocabulary! 😊

P.S. How do you fast on Nativity Eve?
 
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