Is man’s ego and the lack of personal humility the major cause of all Christian division?

[Jimmy_B]

Is man’s ego and the lack of personal humility the major cause of all Christian division?

I think so…

 

[paarsurrey]

Is man’s egos and the lack personal humility the major cause of all Christian division?

Hi

I think it is more because of wrong conceptions that are not reasonable, rational and logical. If they could make them reasonable, rational and logical then they would unite naturally.

I am for unity of all denomination into one united christendom.

Thanks

 

[Jimmy_B]

Is it an “ego” problem?

I believe Calvin and Luther’s ego’s and their lack of personal humility were the major motivators and primary causes of their dissention.

I also believe that many other individuals, who had an ego problem and lacked personal humility, caused the succeeding Christian divisions and sub-divisions (estimated at 36000+).

This would be 36,000+ different examples of individuals with an ego problem and a lack of humility.

Please tell me if you disagree.

 

[mathematician]

Is man’s ego and the lack of personal humility the major cause of all Christian division?

I think so…

I would say there is a good chance of that being the case. It applies to Catholic as well as Protestant egos of course.

 

[justasking4]

Is man’s ego and the lack of personal humility the major cause of all Christian division?

I think so…

Its false doctrines the divide. Thats why there can never be true unity in the church while Rome holds to doctrines not taught in Scripture.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Pride indeed is a major cause. This sin is usually listed the first of the 7 deadly sins and with good reason.

Blind pride further often causes us to ‘project’ our faults and failings onto others. . .accusing THEM of being the stumbling block. How often have I seen people whose OWN beliefs and actions show them guilty of major error claiming loudly that it is ‘somebody else’s fault’. . .

 

[Hisalone]

Pride indeed is a major cause. This sin is usually listed the first of the 7 deadly sins and with good reason.

Blind pride further often causes us to ‘project’ our faults and failings onto others. . .accusing THEM of being the stumbling block. How often have I seen people whose OWN beliefs and actions show them guilty of major error claiming loudly that it is ‘somebody else’s fault’. . .

So if you have two men with large egos ie Luther and the Pope then its easy for an impasse?

 

[paarsurrey]

Originally Posted by ralphinal

I would like to point out that as Jesus is risen, his body has its glorified form. He may or may not look anything like he did on earth. Also, as he is God, he can appear with any form he wills.

Its false doctrines the divide. Thats why there can never be true unity in the church while Rome holds to doctrines not taught in Scripture.

Hi

and Protestants hold to doctrines not taught by and practiced by Jesus either, in my opinion.

Only truthful doctrines would bind both Catholics and Protestants to Unity, and that is possible.

Thanks

 

[Jimmy_B]

Pride indeed is a major cause. This sin is usually listed the first of the 7 deadly sins and with good reason.

Blind pride further often causes us to ‘project’ our faults and failings onto others. . .accusing THEM of being the stumbling block. How often have I seen people whose OWN beliefs and actions show them guilty of major error claiming loudly that it is ‘somebody else’s fault’. . .

 

[AgnosTheist]

NO. The major cause of all christian divisions is the OBSCURE bible itself.

Look at the Islamic Koran. Its a thousand times more direct to the point. And thus Muslims dont need a Vatican to keep 99.99% of them united on core doctrinal beliefs.

 

[Hisalone]

NO. The major cause of all christian divisions is the OBSCURE bible itself.

Look at the Islamic Koran. Its a thousand times more direct to the point. And thus Muslims dont need a Vatican to keep 99.99% of them united on core doctrinal beliefs.

So you have no problems with** all **the problematic verses in the quaran?

 

[guanophore]

Its false doctrines the divide. Thats why there can never be true unity in the church while Rome holds to doctrines not taught in Scripture.

I agree with you that false doctrines do divide, but I think they arise and persist because of what the OOP has written. They spring forth from man’s ego and lack of personal humility.

None of the Catholic doctrine is derived from scripture, but from Jesus, who delivered it “once for all” to the saints. The saints then wrote down a portion of that Divine Revelation in the NT we now have. that is why there are no contradictions between the Teaching of the Church and the NT. They both come from the same infallible source, Jesus.

By way of reminder, not all Catholics are “Roman”. the Roman Rite is more common here in the west, but there are 22 other Rites of Catholicism that are not at all “Roman” in culture or language. Yet in doctrine, all agree on the Apostolic Teaching.

 

[po18guy]

Yes. Ego is the opposite of humility. Obedience is the child of humility.

Joshua 22:5 But be very careful to keep the commandment and the law that Moses the servant of the LORD gave you: to love the LORD your God, to walk in all his ways, to obey his commands, to hold fast to him and to serve him with all your heart and all your soul."

Luke 10:16 “He who listens to you listens to me; he who rejects you rejects me; but he who rejects me rejects him who sent me.”

There are those who rejected Peter. And, there are those who reject his successors. They reject not the successors, but the One Who sent them.

Let us pray for them.

 

[Hisalone]

Yes. Ego is the opposite of humility. Obedience is the child of humility.

Joshua 22:5 But be very careful to keep the commandment and the law that Moses the servant of the LORD gave you: to love the LORD your God, to walk in all his ways, to obey his commands, to hold fast to him and to serve him with all your heart and all your soul."

Luke 10:16 “He who listens to you listens to me; he who rejects you rejects me; but he who rejects me rejects him who sent me.”

There are those who rejected Peter. And, there are those who reject his successors. They reject not the successors, but the One Who sent them.

Let us pray for them.

So there is no egos from the Roman side that has contributed?

 

[AgnosTheist]

So you have no problems with** all **the problematic verses in the quaran?

I am not promoting Islam. We are discussing Unity and not the Teachings themselves.

The point is, the CLARITY of the Instruction Manual plays a factor in the unity or disunity of its readers. Right?

 

[reteeks21]

Is it an “ego” problem?

I believe Calvin and Luther’s ego’s and their lack of personal humility were the major motivators and primary causes of their dissention.

I also believe that many other individuals, who had an ego problem and lacked personal humility, caused the succeeding Christian divisions and sub-divisions (estimated at 36000+).

This would be 36,000+ different examples of individuals with an ego problem and a lack of humility.

Please tell me if you disagree.

I can agree, to an extent, with Calvin, but why Luther? I know he was not perfect, but does dissent equal ego? History makes it pretty clear that some Catholic leaders were pretty arrogant, but there were also many who represented purity (Pope Clement VII). Luther made it clear why he was dissenting, but that does not make him arrogant. If you read his 95 Theses it is pretty clear that he does have respect for the Pope, and he never set out to even leave the Catholic Church. He simply set out to hold some people accountable (not even the Pope, really). It is also important to keep in my mind that it was European princes who really kicked the in-fighting into high gear. In fact, Luther never intended to change the world, and he never called himself a Protestant. Being a reformer does not make one arrogant, at least I do not think so.

 

[AgnosTheist]

I also believe that many other individuals, who had an ego problem and lacked personal humility, caused the succeeding Christian divisions and sub-divisions (estimated at 36000+)

You blame human ego? How is then that other religions are nowhere near a quarter as fragmented as christianity?

Its not ego I blame. I BLAME SINCERITY AND FAITH.

Many people want to sincerely follow the bible…the obscure bible. and what you get are varying sincere opinions. The only way of keeping christianity united is through an iron fist.

 

[NDfan]

Is it an “ego” problem?

I believe Calvin and Luther’s ego’s and their lack of personal humility were the major motivators and primary causes of their dissention.

I also believe that many other individuals, who had an ego problem and lacked personal humility, caused the succeeding Christian divisions and sub-divisions (estimated at 36000+).

This would be 36,000+ different examples of individuals with an ego problem and a lack of humility.

Please tell me if you disagree.

Jimmy how are you my brother? I do think ego is a major problem and unfortunately it has propagated into Christianity. Christianity has become a new business venture for people who bare the title of bishop and drive around in Bentley’s wearing Armani suits claiming that if you give 10% to him and now even her, you will receive riches from GOD. It’s very disgusting.

As far as Luther and Calvin I disagree with you on your deductions. Many items that Luther addressed were brought up and changed in Vatican II. Augustine believed the same way Calvinists believe with respect to grace. Some early church fathers didn’t believe in infant baptism and believed that the person should choose baptism for themselves. The Didache (written by the Apostles) does not talk about the real presence. It was referred to as spiritual food. In looking at church history divisions always existed within the Catholic church and I still believe some of those same divisions still exist. We just don’t hear about it.

Maybe Luther and Calvin should have stayed within the church to effect change that way instead of making a public scene of it. This is what Francis did because he placed unity above division. Unfortunately that is not where we are today. Instead of focusing on who we think may have been right or wrong we should focus on how we unite. If all one is going to do is sit back and say nope we’re right 100% of the time, then conversations like this will never lead anywhere except to agree to disagree.

In the end Christianity is what is suffering. Statistically speaking Christianity in the USA is in a slight decline and I certainly don’t think in-fighting will help. Just my 1.5 humble cents.

PEACE brother

By the way it’s not 36,000 divisions and sub-divisions. The number is truly like 1500 denominations. The counting method you are referring to is majorly flawed. Not saying 1500 is good but it’s better than 36,000.

 

[reteeks21]

You blame human ego? How is then that other religions are nowhere near a quarter as fragmented as christianity?

Its not ego I blame. I BLAME SINCERITY AND FAITH.

Many people want to sincerely follow the bible…the obscure bible. and what you get are varying sincere opinions. *The only way of keeping christianity united is through an iron fist./*QUOTE]

Really? You checked out Islam lately?

 

[NDfan]

Originally Posted by ralphinal

Hi

and Protestants hold to doctrines not taught by and practiced by Jesus either, in my opinion.

Only truthful doctrines would bind both Catholics and Protestants to Unity, and that is possible.

Thanks

Can you give me an example please of what Protestants hold to that is not scriptural??