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hazcompat
Guest
Satan will sift them all. Jesus has prayed for one (Simon) not to fail. Then He must build up His brothers. In time he becomes Bishop of Rome. It has been the plan from the beginning.
peace
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peace
C
Cavaradossi
Guest
St. Peter was never the bishop of Rome, nor was he ever the bishop of Antioch, for that matter. He did, however, ordain the first bishop of both of those sees.
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Nine_Two
Guest
Yes, Peter specifically was first among equals. As a Petrine See, and due to its reputation, Rome also carried that distinction. In the later case, however, it was a matter of practice, rather than a theological command.
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Art321
Guest
You know, this is a really bold statement. Do you mind telling me where you got your info?
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hazcompat
Guest
1Peter 5 :13The chosen one* at Babylon sends you greeting, as does Mark, my son.
HISTORY OF THE PATRIARCHS OF THE
COPTIC CHURCH OF ALEXANDRIA
S. MARK TO THEONAS (300)
ARABIC TEXT EDITED, TRANSLATED, AND ANNOTATED
BY B. EVETTS
‘…Peter and Mark went to the region of Rome, and preached there the word of God.
And in the fifteenth year after the Ascension of Christ, the holy Peter sent Saint Mark, the father and evangelist, to the city of Alexandria , to announce the good tidings there, and to preach the word of God and the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ, to whom is due glory and honour and worship, with the Father and the Holy Ghost, the one God for ever. Amen.’
Irenaeus Against Heresies
all the Churches, we do put to confusion all those who, in whatever manner, whether by an evil self-pleasing, by vainglory, or by blindness and perverse opinion, assemble in unauthorized meetings; [we do this, I say,] by indicating that tradition derived from the apostles, of the very great, the very ancient, and universally known Church founded and organized at Rome by the two most glorious apostles, Peter and Paul; as also [by pointing out] the faith preached to men, which comes down to our time by means of the successions of the bishops. For it is a matter of necessity that every Church should agree with this Church, on account of its pre- eminent authority, that is, the faithful
everywhere, inasmuch as the apostolical tradition has been preserved continuously by those [faithful men] who exist everywhere.
3. The blessed apostles, then, having founded and built up the Church, committed into the hands of Linus the office of the episcopate. Of this Linus, Paul makes mention in the Epistles to Timothy. To him succeeded Anacletus; and after him, in the third place from the apostles, Clement was allotted the bishopric. This man, as he had seen the blessed apostles, and had been conversant with them, might be said to have the preaching of the apostles still echoing [in his ears], and their traditions before his eyes. Nor was he alone [in this], for there were many still remaining who had received instructions from the apostles. In the time of this Clement, no small dissension having occurred among the brethren at Corinth, the Church in Rome despatched a most powerful letter to
the Corinthians, exhorting them to peace, renewing their faith, and declaring the tradition which it had lately received from the apostles, proclaiming the one God, omnipotent, the Maker of heaven and earth, the Creator of man, who brought on the deluge, and called Abraham, who led the people from the land of Egypt, spake with Moses, set forth the law, sent the prophets, and who has prepared fire for the devil and his angels. From this document, whosoever chooses to do so, may learn that He, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, was preached by the Churches, and may also understand the apostolical tradition of the Church, since this Epistle is of older date than these men who are now propagating falsehood, and who conjure into existence another god beyond the Creator and the Maker of all existing things. To this Clement there succeeded Evaristus. Alexander followed
Evaristus; then, sixth from the apostles, Sixtus was appointed; after him, Telesphorus, who was gloriously martyred; then Hyginus; after him, Pius; then after him, Anicetus. Soter having succeeded Anicetus, Eleutherius does now, in the twelfth place from the apostles, hold the inheritance of the episcopate. In this order, and by this succession, the ecclesiastical tradition from the apostles, and the preaching of the truth, have come down to us. And this is most abundant proof that there is one and the same vivifying faith, which has been preserved in the Church from the apostles until now, and handed down in truth.
peace
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Paul_theApostle
Guest
How could we be so bold
…shame on us Catholics
…to assume such a thing…we never thought how the Orthodox would react to their church possibly not being the True church
oh well…
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Paul_theApostle
Guest
and/so?
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PeterJohn
Guest
Our holy father the pope is not a dictator. The position of bishop of Rome is a seat of Holy leadership, not a seat of command. The bishops in my country are working towrds reforming the conservatively liberal changes made by egar bishops years ago. Changes made in the mass were small. From the earliest writen recordings of the earliest mass’s I recognize the very same mass I attend in rural USA every Sunday. We are all Christians who receive and believe the true presence in the Holy Eucharist. We confess to our priests who have apostolic authority handed down by apostolic succession. We all wish to come to resside in Heaven with the God of abraham and issac. Jesus saved all of our souls. In abiding by Christs teachings, we love each other, for the love of Him. Now let us pray together as Christ prays " 22 I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one— 23 I in them and you in me—so that they may be brought to COMPLETE UNITY. Then the world will know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me."
I will always love my orthodox brotheren and yearn to reunite as one and I will work within my parish to promote positive emotions of reuniting soon. Please do the same for my fellow Catholics. We need each other. May God bless everything your hands touch. May He warm every heart yours Reaches out towards and may the Holy Spirit bring the grace of God to us all, and keep us safe from the evil one.
I will always love my orthodox brotheren and yearn to reunite as one and I will work within my parish to promote positive emotions of reuniting soon. Please do the same for my fellow Catholics. We need each other. May God bless everything your hands touch. May He warm every heart yours Reaches out towards and may the Holy Spirit bring the grace of God to us all, and keep us safe from the evil one.
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Wisely
Guest
So if preaching in a place makes you bishop of that place, then St.Mark is Co-Bishop of Rome.
If establishing a line of successors makes you Bishop then St.Paul is Co-Bishop of Rome with Universal Jurisdiction and Infallibility because both Peter and Paul “committed into the hands of Linus the office of the episcopate.”
Why downplay Paul?
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Nine_Two
Guest
Therefore that is what you have to show in order to show the Catholic Church is the true Church. If your verses don’t show that, then you haven’t made the case.
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gus
Guest
Of the many Orthodox Churchs
Which ones claim Apostalic origin?
Which ones claim Apostalic origin?
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Paul_theApostle
Guest
i already mentioned the verses in the bible…which catholics use…
you dont think that they have any relation to the Pope or papacy whereas Catholics are pretty sure they do…
i think the Orthodox believe that each and every bishop carries on the mission of Peter right?
so there is really no difference to your local Greek Orthodox bishop down the road and the Pope /bishop of Rome …?
both have equal divine power and authority in Christ and St Peters eyes …?
is that what you believe?
:hypno:
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Vico
Guest
Many are listed below:
Assyrian Church of the East
Oriental Orthodox:ArmenianCoptic
Ethiopian Tweahedo
Eritrean Tweahedo
Syriac
Malankara Orthodox
Syrian ChurchEastern Orthodox: Constantinople
Poland
Albania
Czech & Slovokia
Greece
Bulgaria
Georgia
Serbia
Cyprus
Russia
Romania
Jerusalem Alexandria
Antioch
Catholic:Latin
Russian
Belarusian
Ukrainian Greek
Melkite Greek
Romanian Greek
Ruthenian Byzantine
Hungarian Byzantine
Slovak Greek
Italo-Albanian Byzantine
Krizevci Byzantine
Macedonia Byzantine
Bulgarian Byzantine
Albanian Byzantine
Greek Byzantine
Syro-Malabar
Chaldean
Maronite
Syro-Malankara
Syrian
Armenian
Ethiopian/Eritrean
Coptic
Other
olish National Catholic
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Nine_Two
Guest
Which don’t make your case.
They have relation, but I would assert that you have to use eisegesis to get them to mean what you say.
Yes.
Not quite. While a bishop is a bishop is a bishop, and an Archbishop or a Metropolitan are not over other bishops, they do hold positions of greater responsibility and honour.
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Cavaradossi
Guest
And furthermore, that would mean that Peter was also the bishop of Antioch, and that Paul was the bishop of Thessaloniki, Athens, Corinth, Philippi, and Malta, a true absurdity. The very nature of the Apostles’ mission (being ‘sent out’, as opposed to an episcopos, who was ordained by the apostles to run the church in a particular city) meant that they were not included on the very first lists of bishops of a particular city. This is a later custom (from maybe the fifth century), which is pious but historically inaccurate.
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Paul_theApostle
Guest
There are plenty of quotes that express the Peter and his succesors as the Rock of the church which ‘the gates of hell will never overcome’
and that this church ‘cannot err in the faith’…
should i believe the writings of Saints …or yourself and others like you who consider the Pope a heretic…?
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hazcompat
Guest
Are we down to Peter, Paul and Mark. (The primacy of Rome being recognized at 1st Constantinople 381.)
peace
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DKO
Guest
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hazcompat
Guest
It is truly meet to bless thee, the Theotokos, ever blessed and most blameless, and Mother of our God. More honorable than the Cherubim, and beyond compare more glorious than the Seraphim, who without corruption gavest birth to God the Word, the very Theotokos, thee do we magnify.
Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit, both now and ever, and unto the ages of ages. Amen.
Lord, have mercy. (Thrice)
O Lord, Bless.
O Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, for the sake of the prayers of Thy most pure Mother, of our holy and God-bearing fathers, and all the saints, have mercy on us and save us, for Thou art good and the Lover of mankind. Amen.
peace
Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit, both now and ever, and unto the ages of ages. Amen.
Lord, have mercy. (Thrice)
O Lord, Bless.
O Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, for the sake of the prayers of Thy most pure Mother, of our holy and God-bearing fathers, and all the saints, have mercy on us and save us, for Thou art good and the Lover of mankind. Amen.
peace
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Alexander_Roman
Guest
That St Peter, although he had the powers of a bishop, was not himself one since to be a bishop would have meant to remain within a See as its pastor. St Peter and the Apostles didn’t do that as they went from one place to another, setting up Churches and consecrating bishops for those places.
This is how the Christian East has always understood the role of the Apostles, so Peter was never “pope or bishop of Rome” but he was the Roman Church’s founder, together with St Paul, and consecrated its earliest hierarchs.
Alex
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