Tell us the controlled (name removed by moderator)uts that would lead one to jump on the hood of their truck then let their friend do donuts on a gravel street. Or if you like tell us the results of these said controlled (name removed by moderator)uts.The world I present is one based on logic and experience - a world where if you control the (name removed by moderator)uts you control the result. What I get from your statement is that the nature of free will doesn’t fit into a logical framework.
You say yourself that Adam ate the apple due to his desire to be like God. He didn’t choose that desire did he? In fact, we don’t choose any of our desires. We don’t blame an infant for eating something it shouldn’t because a baby’s desire is to explore, test, and taste things.
Imagine if as a parent I said, “son, it doesn’t matter why you put teeth marks on Dad’s remote control. I told you not to do it and you disobeyed. Now you must suffer the consequence.” That would be unreasonable. Of course it matters why we do what we do.
I know the guy downstairs is messing with me, I hate him and want protection from him.Why do you think that you have many imperfections? That could be demons temptations if you are tempted a lot. They are very strong and can manipulate your mind and thoughts and feelings. Stronger you become harder they become at you until you finish the duty.
Let’s test this. Then why are we not in the Garden of Eden?God doesn’t blame us.
If we were held responsible for the sins of Adam and Eve, then that would mean you deny his death on the cross for forgiveness of our sins, and I know, and Least I hope you believe that he paid for all of our sins in full.Let’s test this. Then why are we not in the Garden of Eden?
Answer: He holds us temporally responsible for the sins of Adam and Eve.
So clearly God blames us.
And in order to be in heaven you must die a physical life in this world to enter into a everlasting life in the next. If of course you believe in God and obey his word.Let’s test this. Then why are we not in the Garden of Eden?
Answer: He holds us temporally responsible for the sins of Adam and Eve.
So clearly God blames us.
There is alot of truth to this, God did give the devil the power to tempt us. But God also did not give the devil any power that we ourselves cannot overcome. God never gives us more then we can handle. All we have to do is go to him for help and the devil will run away.Why do you think that you have many imperfections? That could be demons temptations if you are tempted a lot. They are very strong and can manipulate your mind and thoughts and feelings. Stronger you become harder they become at you until you finish the duty.
This is incorrect for were were not predestined for the Garden of Eden, only Adam and Eve were. God is omniscient so knows that Adam and Eve would choose and loose their gifts. Mankind could potentially inherit them but God knew that would not happen. Responsibility requires a free will choice.Let’s test this. Then why are we not in the Garden of Eden?
Answer: He holds us temporally responsible for the sins of Adam and Eve.
So clearly God blames us.
by the way we have a God who does not blame us, we have a God who forgives us. How could God forgive us if he blames us?Let’s test this. Then why are we not in the Garden of Eden?
Answer: He holds us temporally responsible for the sins of Adam and Eve.
So clearly God blames us.
Have you ever seriously encounter to Devils? We cannot overcome them. They have mercy on us in most of the case.There is alot of truth to this, God did give the devil the power to tempt us. But God also did not give the devil any power that we ourselves cannot overcome.
Apparently He give more to Bob that he could handle.God never gives us more then we can handle. All we have to do is go to him for help and the devil will run away.
Devils have mercy on no one. And no thank God I never had a serious encounter with them. But if I ever did I would go to a Priest, because he has power over the devil by the power of the Holy Spirit given to him by God.Have you ever seriously encounter to Devils? We cannot overcome them. They have mercy on us in most of the case.
Apparently He give more to Bob that he could handle.
Not true the word of GOD tells us God will never give you more then you can handle.Have you ever seriously encounter to Devils? We cannot overcome them. They have mercy on us in most of the case.
Apparently He give more to Bob that he could handle.
Cause and effect describes and applies to everything we do. I wouldn’t say it’s a laboratory, I would say the entire universe in all its vastness is a result of cause and effect. It is majestic, sometimes tragic, but always filled with anticipation of what’s to come. From our perspective how our decisions play out is unknown because we are not omniscient or all powerful.The world you describe is a laboratory.
That’s not how most things work. Are you married?
The concept of desire speaks to our broken nature.
The way it is used in your question suggests that they externally control us.
Desire represents that to which we aspire. We choose from a number of goods what we want.
Sin fragments us, robbing us of our freedom as these wants will eventually come to control us.
Gambling, substance abuse, pornography and the like end up taking hold of us, more and more, as we give in.
God doesn’t blame us. In fact He sacrificed His son that we might be saved.
There are consequences as you acknowledge.
One consequence to biting the remote is a broken tooth, maybe a shock, or an inability to get to the cartoon channel.
Unlike a child unaware of the consequences, Adam heard quite well what he would be getting himself into.
He chose to disobey, not trust God, run from the truth, blame the woman he had loved until he denied Love, and so on.
You may wish to contemplate further on the matter. I prefer not to argue, but perhaps I can clarify more what I mean, when I have more time.
There are an enormous amount of (name removed by moderator)uts that go into every decision we make. Often we aren’t even conscience of these (name removed by moderator)uts.Tell us the controlled (name removed by moderator)uts that would lead one to jump on the hood of their truck then let their friend do donuts on a gravel street. Or if you like tell us the results of these said controlled (name removed by moderator)uts.
So where all those crimes in humanity comes from?Not true the word of GOD tells us God will never give you more then you can handle.
1 cor 10:13
Not asking for God’s help.So where all those crimes in humanity comes from?
So you never commit a sin or crime if you ask for God’s help?Not asking for God’s help.
Assuming one accepts the help, yes. With God’s help all sin can be avoided.So you never commit a sin or crime if you ask for God’s help?
Thank you for your reply!There are an enormous amount of (name removed by moderator)uts that go into every decision we make. Often we aren’t even conscience of these (name removed by moderator)uts.
Regarding your example of someone who jumps on a car hood while it is doing donuts, the first thing that comes to mind is teenager. Why? Because teenagers are usually filled with a sense of invincibility, and lack awareness of the consequences of their actions. Usually this is related to brain development and hormones. Another (name removed by moderator)ut could be desire to impress or fit into part of a group. A third (name removed by moderator)ut could be disregard for their own worth, someone who has nothing to lose. A fourth (name removed by moderator)ut could be a thrill seeker who finds the safe path to be a dull existence. I could go on and on.
We aren’t omniscient, but if we were we would know the exact (name removed by moderator)uts.
As a former teenager, I admit to doing some foolish things without really accounting for the risk I was taking. But that is only one possible (name removed by moderator)ut scenario of many.Thank you for your reply!
I would like to think most teenagers would be aware of the consequences of doing such things.
As a Christian one believes God to omniscient. With God knowing these (name removed by moderator)uts, did He also cause them to be?
As a result of all these (name removed by moderator)uts the two persons were not free to say “hey man that doesn’t seem like a bright idea”?
Christ’s sacrifice only took care of the SPIRITUAL consequences of sin. If Christ’s sacrifice took care of the temporal consequence, as you claim, please tell me what time is the next flight to the Garden of Eden?If we were held responsible for the sins of Adam and Eve, then that would mean you deny his death on the cross for forgiveness of our sins, and I know, and Least I hope you believe that he paid for all of our sins in full.
A free will without taking away imperfections, is meaningless.Now he has given us free will to make our choice.
.But again if we are to pay for the sins of Adam and Eve, then it makes the cross useless