Is sleeping with a friend a sin?

[WoundedIcon]

First, I should state that I’m the man she’s going to be moving in with. Although I understand the concern coming from some of you, and most certainly find it a bit uncouth for two opposite-sex friends to sleep together (which is why I won’t), I don’t appreciate the insinuations of deception, lust, ungentlemanliness, and unrighteousness set upon me by some of you. I simply don’t believe that there is any need to be concerned in this situation concerning two friends living together. Honestly, I’m more concerned about rubbing her the wrong way with some of my unbecoming habits than anything! There would be scandal, there would be an occasion of sin, if there were any sinfulness involved in the first place. However, there is not and I do not believe in being overly-righteous. If I were to bend to some of the cultural mores of certain Christians and refuse to move in with her I would lose her outright for perhaps the rest of my life. Her family are Jehovah’s Witnesses, they are accusing her of bring demons into their lives and persecuting her and keeping her from even getting anywhere near a church (nonetheless actually partaking in the RCIA classes), and they are unkind towards her and are planning on dragging her off to California together with them and taking her SSI money from her. So in all honesty, mores be damned, I’m helping her out of there.

We are not attracted to each other. On my side I can say that she is most absolutely not my type. She’s a big, tough, black Gothic chick and I’m in to delicate fair skinned cutesy white girls LOL. And she has a man too.

When we move in together there will be separate rooms for us to sleep in, and when she’s at my grandmother’s home we will all be present simultaneously due to us all being a bunch of disabled nutters. And gma’s old fashioned so yeah…

 

[tlimon]

We already accomplished that we weren’t going to sleep in the same bed, but we’re going to sleep in the same room. Didn’t have to say the same thing over and over.

Did I mention that you shouldn’t sleep in the same bed?

 

[TheBibleAddict]

did i mention that you shouldn’t sleep in the same bed?

LOL! Hehe

 

[Bookcat]

…everyone…

We already accomplished that we weren’t going to sleep in the same bed, but we’re going to sleep in the same room. Didn’t have to say the same thing over and over.

(taking into account what I have already noted…)

Now …it is great that you have decided not to sleep in the same bed…but the same room is also where you should not be…

your not husband and wife…nor sister and sister or brother and brother…

and the other person involved noted: "When we move in together there will be separate rooms for us to sleep in, and when she’s at my grandmother’s home we will all be present simultaneously due to us all being a bunch of disabled nutters. And gma’s old fashioned so yeah… "

So now I am a little confused. I must have misunderstood some aspects. I thought you were talking of just staying with your Grandma out of some preceived necessity? …and if you are both later “just moving into together” really …I do not understand even the reasoning (not to mention agree with the idea…it is can be argued that a family member “Grandma” can have two house guests in separate rooms visiting for a while…but “moving in together” later is certainly a different matter )…even if ones family is JW. They do not have the ability to kidnap someone…and the thought that he will loose you forever is rather dramatic…for you have* free will* …so I do not see a reason for such thinking.

In any case I would advise you call Catholic Answers and lay out to the Priest there all the details (ask to speak with him)…including the fact of the plan to completely move in together later…It is much better to have someone “live” to discuss thing with then a forum of persons whose only contact with you is a screen and key board…no voice etc…

(by the way nice quote you have added at the bottom! )

 

[Bookcat]

(taking into account what I have already noted…)

Now …it is great that you have decided not to sleep in the same bed…but the same room is also where you should not be…

your not husband and wife…nor sister and sister or brother and brother…

and the other person involved noted: "When we move in together there will be separate rooms for us to sleep in, and when she’s at my grandmother’s home we will all be present simultaneously due to us all being a bunch of disabled nutters. And gma’s old fashioned so yeah… "

So now I am a little confused. I must have misunderstood some aspects… I thought you were talking of just staying with your Grandma out of some preceived necessity?..but now I see you said eariler “Until we find a bigger place” so the confusion was my fault.

…and if you are both later “just moving into together” really …I do not understand even the reasoning (not to mention agree with the idea…it is can be argued that a family member “Grandma” can have two house guests in separate rooms visiting for a while…but “moving in together” later is certainly a different matter!! )…even if ones family is JW. They do not have the ability to kidnap someone…and the thought that he will loose you forever is rather dramatic…for you have* free will* …so I do not see a reason for such thinking.

In any case I would advise you call Catholic Answers and lay out to the Priest there all the details (ask to speak with him)…including the fact of the plan to completely move in together later…It is much better to have someone “live” to discuss thing with then a forum of persons whose only contact with you is a screen and key board…no voice etc…

(by the way nice quote you have added at the bottom! )

 

[Bookcat]

Ok I see I missed that you noted you and he were looking for a bigger place to move into…

I would advise seeking to find other ways to for the one to help the other. ie. find them a female roommate to share the expenses etc. Or other low housing situations.

There are various programs etc…contact Catholic Charities.

I do not think planning to “live together” by seeking a “bigger place” than the visit at Grandma’s would involve …is the right solution. Even from the likelihood of scandal it is not a good idea…for most will presume you are shacking up…and may even find out your Catholics seeking to live your Faith (or in the case of the one …in RCIA on the way to becoming Catholic).

Instead of spending time looking for “bigger place” …he can spend the time helping her f find an affordable situation for her to live in…

Spend your time wisely

 

[x1980x]

You commit no personal sin by merely sleeping in the same bed as someone. But it’s an occasion of sin - meaning it’s a situation that provides an incredible temptation for each of you to sin. The wise man knows he is weak and that there are situations where he is likely to cave into temptation. Even if you feel it poses no temptation for you, consider that it may be an incredible temptation for him. In general it’s easier for women to see men as just friends, but men are more likely have to have a romantic attraction to female friends.

You also create scandal for others, even if you aren’t doing anything wrong, if others know you’re sleeping in the same room together and make the quite natural assumption in our culture that you’re doing more than just sleeping…

This is wise advice. While your average man may be able to handle sleeping in the same bed as his sister, mother (or other ancestor), daughter, girl cousin, or other close relative, anything more than that is playing with fire and is putting yourself in a near occasion of sin (am I using that term right?).

Sure, you MIGHT not end up sinning - but being loose with such risks can lead you to be looser about the practice in general and could lead to sin in the future.

Do remember that the other person has their temptations too - it isn’t just to what degree it would put YOU into temptation.

 

[formerlysure]

I think you posted this question because you know you’re in iffy territory. While you and your friend may have discussed a thousand times whether or not there is an attraction, keep in mind that people lie - particularly to avoid embarassment and to avoid putting their feelings “out there” if they do not think they are reciprocal. You may be very happy that the relationship is in the friend zone, but despite his representations to the contrary, your friend may well want more with you.

While he may be like a brother to you or another relative, I have to say I would neither share a bed with my 16 old son, nor with my 50 year old brother. That’s a weird violation of a certain boundary as well. And while I have many platonic male friends, though I would feel less weird sharing a bed with them than with a relative, I still wouldn’t do it.

You can buy an air mattress pretty cheap - one of you should, and just sleep on the living room floor in a separate room until you are able to work out another arrangement.

Also, when managing such stressful concerns as mental illness and poverty/potential homelessness, there is a certain dignity in having your own space, privacy and bed. You both owe this to yourselves. Ideally you should not plan to live together on a long-term basis, either. It creates complications for either of you to date and with or without a physical attraction, you are probably fulfilling one anoher’s emotional needs for opposite-sex companionship. When that need is already filled, nobody will come along to fill it who’s more appropriately a potential spouse for you, so it’s just not really a good idea.

 

[mwncheesehead]

First, I should state that I’m the man she’s going to be moving in with. Although I understand the concern coming from some of you, and most certainly find it a bit uncouth for two opposite-sex friends to sleep together (which is why I won’t), I don’t appreciate the insinuations of deception, lust, ungentlemanliness, and unrighteousness set upon me by some of you. **I simply don’t believe that there is any need to be concerned in this situation concerning two friends living together. **Honestly, I’m more concerned about rubbing her the wrong way with some of my unbecoming habits than anything! There would be scandal, there would be an occasion of sin, if there were any sinfulness involved in the first place. However, there is not and I do not believe in being overly-righteous. If I were to bend to some of the cultural mores of certain Christians and refuse to move in with her I would lose her outright for perhaps the rest of my life. Her family are Jehovah’s Witnesses, they are accusing her of bring demons into their lives and persecuting her and keeping her from even getting anywhere near a church (nonetheless actually partaking in the RCIA classes), and they are unkind towards her and are planning on dragging her off to California together with them and taking her SSI money from her. So in all honesty, mores be damned, I’m helping her out of there.

We are not attracted to each other. On my side I can say that she is most absolutely not my type. She’s a big, tough, black Gothic chick and I’m in to delicate fair skinned cutesy white girls LOL. And she has a man too.

When we move in together there will be separate rooms for us to sleep in, and when she’s at my grandmother’s home we will all be present simultaneously due to us all being a bunch of disabled nutters. And gma’s old fashioned so yeah…

WoundedIcon, I get that you’re not attracted to each other as you say. But it’s just overall an inappropriate setup when you’re opposite sex roommates. You may be “like brother and sister” but you’re not. By sharing the same living space *like a husband and wife would, *there can be a tendency to start getting into the intimacy realm. It happens, and why chance it?

 

[Jaguar]

Just to add. I have a couple of friends & acquaintances (male & female) who claimed they were not attracted to each other, romantically. One couple is now married. The other, married and divorced.

People do change in these ways. It happens all the time.

 

[Jim_Roberts]

It does not matter if you are both Catholic.

This is very simple: you are a woman and he is a man and you want to sleep together?

Are you going to tell me it’s like brother and sister? NO

If you are a woman and he is a man, then, very simply you know sex will take place because the temptation is so severe. You are placing this situation in both of your hands.

Was this question for real?

Ip sum et patriarch deum

 

[RosaryFan]

Hey all,

I’m moving in with a friend in the next few days, and was wondering if sleeping with him in the same bed is a sin.

We’ve been best friends since 10th grade (I’m female and he’s male), and we’ve never ever had a romantic attraction towards each other. The bed is King sized, and there will be 4 feet between us. We’ll have to sleep on it for a few weeks until we find a bigger place. Again, nothing sexual is there, and never ever will be shudders.

Is this okay? (We consider each other brother and sister and he’s also Catholic)

Thanks.

King sized bed with 4 feet between you??? I happen to think that even if you don’t share the same bedroom it is still sinful. Scandal, scandal, scandal! You are making everyone around you believe that you’re having a sinful relationship and, therefore, setting a bad example (especially for any kids in your neighborhood). Then, there is the matter of killing the other’s reputation. You should have more respect for each other than to “shack up” and make everyone think you’re living in sin. Doesn’t it bother you that you’d be the cause of someone thinking such thoughts about your friend, and visa versa?

 

[VonDerTann]

I second the opinions of those who advise against living together, even if “as brother and sister.”

Moreover, there’s another harmful aspect to such an arrangement, beyond the scandal (which is real) and the poor example it sets for others, and, oddly, arises more noticeably if OP and roommate really DON’T have romantic feelings for one another. That aspect is the impact that the living arrangement may have upon potential suitors for either one. IMHO, virtually any self-respecting guy will not seriously look at OP as a potential girlfriend if he learns that she’s living with a guy, no matter how much she professes that there really is no relationship. between OP and roommate. The same is true for the “cute white girls” OP’s roommate says he’s attracted to. Moreover, whether it’s sinful or not is only half the issue; the other is whether it will simply be viewed as weird, or off-putting, etc., by suitors.

Also, there is something seriously intimate – but non-sexual – about living with a person of the opposite gender. You see then do their laundry, including their underwear. You hear them take a shower at a time you need to use the bathroom. You walk around in a towel. Or whatever. Exactly what, doesn’t matter, but something happens of a private, personal nature, wherein boundaries get crossed, and I’d worry that – precislely because they are such good friends - that sets up expectations. For example, what happens when male roommate meets a nice girl but OP’s living habits are more to his liking? Or if he – even subconsciously – compares her to OP? That can, and surely will, happen, at least to some extent, if living together occurs.

Lastly, I’m sorry, but I also note that despite all the OP’s and roommate’s protestations that they are repulsed by one another, the fact remains that the roommate acknowledged that he “didn’t want to lose” OP, and that loss would clearly mean something to her as well – why all this if it didn’t?. His exact words were these:

[If I don’t move in with her] “I would lose her outright for perhaps the rest of my life”

–Does that sound like someone with no emotional feelings for OP? I say no. So I’m sorry, call me cynical, but my sense is that there’s more feelings there than either want to admit, maybe not even to themselves. That’s all the more reason I think the shared living quarters are a really, really bad idea.

 

[Claire_from_DE]

Couldn’t she temporarily sleep on the floor in granny’s room in a sleeping bag?

In my neck of the woods there’s a homeless shelter run by Catholic Charities and others run by other groups that would provide more room and privacy for 30 days. There’s a benedictine priory where the sisters would take someone in for a couple weeks. Don’t you have any sympathetic woman friends who could help her out? Ask your parish priest for suggestions. He might know of someone who could rent her a room cheaply. Could you sleep at a buddy’s house while she is staying at your grandmother’s? Or pitch a tent in your back yard? Could she look for a house sitting job while a family’s on vacation? Or check out Social Services to see what they could offer? If you pray and brainstorm you may come up with alternatives.

I’ve worked at two homeless shelters and I’ve seen what it is to be homeless. I’ve known people to sleep under bushes and in sheds, in cars, in storage lockers, even in the woods in the summer. I wouldn’t like to think of a woman in those circumstances. But do your best not to sleep in the same room; it’s a bad idea.

 

[Veritatis3]

“Be sober, and watch: because your adversary, the devil, as a roaring lion, goeth about, seeking whom he may devour: Whom resist ye, strong in faith; knowing that the same affliction befalleth your brethren who are in the world.” - 1 Peter 5:8

 

[JRRTFAN]

Hey all,

I’m moving in with a friend in the next few days, and was wondering if sleeping with him in the same bed is a sin.

We’ve been best friends since 10th grade (I’m female and he’s male), and we’ve never ever had a romantic attraction towards each other. The bed is King sized, and there will be 4 feet between us. We’ll have to sleep on it for a few weeks until we find a bigger place. Again, nothing sexual is there, and never ever will be shudders.

Is this okay? (We consider each other brother and sister and he’s also Catholic)

Thanks.

You can’t rent a cot and an air mattress? You’re asking for trouble.

 

[TrueLight]

I second the opinions of those who advise against living together, even if “as brother and sister.”

Moreover, there’s another harmful aspect to such an arrangement, beyond the scandal (which is real) and the poor example it sets for others, and, oddly, arises more noticeably if OP and roommate really DON’T have romantic feelings for one another. That aspect is the impact that the living arrangement may have upon potential suitors for either one. IMHO, virtually any self-respecting guy will not seriously look at OP as a potential girlfriend if he learns that she’s living with a guy, no matter how much she professes that there really is no relationship. between OP and roommate. The same is true for the “cute white girls” OP’s roommate says he’s attracted to. Moreover, whether it’s sinful or not is only half the issue; the other is whether it will simply be viewed as weird, or off-putting, etc., by suitors.

Also, there is something seriously intimate – but non-sexual – about living with a person of the opposite gender. You see then do their laundry, including their underwear. You hear them take a shower at a time you need to use the bathroom. You walk around in a towel. Or whatever. Exactly what, doesn’t matter, but something happens of a private, personal nature, wherein boundaries get crossed, and I’d worry that – precislely because they are such good friends - that sets up expectations. For example, what happens when male roommate meets a nice girl but OP’s living habits are more to his liking? Or if he – even subconsciously – compares her to OP? That can, and surely will, happen, at least to some extent, if living together occurs.

Lastly, I’m sorry, but I also note that despite all the OP’s and roommate’s protestations that they are repulsed by one another, the fact remains that the roommate acknowledged that he “didn’t want to lose” OP, and that loss would clearly mean something to her as well – why all this if it didn’t?. His exact words were these:

[If I don’t move in with her] “I would lose her outright for perhaps the rest of my life”

–Does that sound like someone with no emotional feelings for OP? I say no. So I’m sorry, call me cynical, but my sense is that there’s more feelings there than either want to admit, maybe not even to themselves. That’s all the more reason I think the shared living quarters are a really, really bad idea.

Excellent, excellent post!

 

[TrueLight]

Lastly, I’m sorry, but I also note that despite all the OP’s and roommate’s protestations that they are repulsed by one another…

A lot of times friends will say they are not attracted to one another while the truth is, it is one friend that is not attracted to the other and the rejected one becomes resigned to that fact.

As the OP says,

Let me put it this way, he’s not attracted to me in any way, shape, or form as we have confirmed this many, many years ago. We feel downright disgusted by the thought considering we see each other as siblings under God and by our familial values.

I don’t know why WoundedIcon had to go into specifics of why he is not attracted to her:

We are not attracted to each other. On my side I can say that she is most absolutely not my type. She’s a big, tough, black Gothic chick and I’m in to delicate fair skinned cutesy white girls LOL. And she has a man too.

As a woman, I would be extremely offended that my friend would come online and state why he is not attracted to me, especially if it invoved race and especially if it involved pretty much stating I’m not feminine.

So OP, I really do hope you are not really attracted to him. My advice is to not put yourself in a situation where you start to like him more than a brother.

Now I may be completely wrong, but when it comes to matters of the heart, I am usually spot on.

 

[TheBibleAddict]

I don’t need anymore advice. I ended this discussion last night, why is it still going? Thanks for the opinions, but we’re not going to commit sin nor is there temptation (you guys are making me sick) - so please STOP assuming that there could be. This is the last post I’m going to make on this thread. Thanks.

 

[formerlysure]

Wow- I have a little trouble with your last post, Bibleaddict! You and your friend/roomate came on this site and asked the opinions, Catholic opinions that, about plans to cohabitate and share a bed as non-romantic, unmarried, opposite sex partners. You asked, we answered. I think pretty much across the board - forgive me if I missed a supportive post in there somewhere for this idea- all of us thought that it’s a bad idea and not in either of your best interests. I don’t know any of these other people - it’s not like we’re trying to gang up on you - we’re just speaking from our heart, knowledge and experience. That’s the hard thing about living the Catholic way (or per the teachings of any religion, for that matter). Sometimes, your faith advises against doing what you want or think is best or most practical.

Ultimately we all do what we want in our lives, but a lot of people on here are telling you, “this doesn’t sound good - we advise against this” and you might want to give that advice more serious consideration before you do something that is not healthy nor appropriate for either you or your friend.

Best wishes whatever you do - the whole intent behind this is to provide support of you and your faith as Catholics.