Is sociopathy evil or a mental disorder? Can a sociopath be healed?

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You’re confusing “feelings” and “conscience”.

Sociopaths don’t have an innate “feeling” of right and wrong.

However, psychologists say there are sociopaths out there who have formed their consciences in a purely intellectual way – they decide to learn and follow the rules, they decide they don’t want to harm others, and they ask others for advice if they can’t decide what’s right. These people often have as good a conscience, for all practical purposes, as a normal person, and thus live completely normal and blameless lives.

It’s part of the mystery of human nature and sin why some sociopaths work out this way and others are completely opposite.
 
I think I was accidently cited for other’s statements.

I guess what I am wondering if sociopathy can even exist given Catholic teaching. It would seem not. The Church teaches that everyone has a conscience–the law of God written in our hearts. And that all can be saved.

Given this, there can’t be a person with no conscience at all–who is capable of no remorse, right?
This really weird thing happened 2 me: I read the book about sociopathy (The Sociopath Next Door). The author lost credibility w/me because she is, apparently, pro-abortion. Yet she has the nerve to talk about how wrong murder is. Then, 2 make matters worse, she bemoans the fate of animals (@ the hands of sociopaths) 2 much… Also, the book wasn’t written very well, but whatever… The weird thing was, i then found this book i’ve had 4 a long time but hadn’t read - about the Estella Ruiz, who was visited by Mary. I was confused about the nature/nurture argument concerning sociopathy and a whole lot of other things, just as u seem 2b (the idea that some don’t have a conscience). After reading that book & Mary’s statements, i am convinced this is one of those times we need to (virtually) choose God’s word (etc) over psychology. If a person is sociopathic, it is because he/she made a choice long ago to go against conscience, then it became easier & easier until the conscience (the Holy Spirit) went away. Maybe it should rightfully b called “blashphemy of the Holy Spirit”? I do agree w/ another Poster about how a child is not really “born” w/ a conscience, per se… We r all born selfish, but ignorantly so… Then we learn… and some (the sociopaths) un-learn… or whatever. But in any case, does knowing WHY really matter? All sin must b purged off one’s soul 2 enter Heaven… It doesn’t matter what excuse a person makes 4 his or her sin… Sin stains the soul no matter how it got there…
 
I do agree w/ another Poster about how a child is not really “born” w/ a conscience, per se… We r all born selfish, but ignorantly so… Then we learn… and some (the sociopaths) un-learn… or whatever. But in any case, does knowing WHY really matter? All sin must b purged off one’s soul 2 enter Heaven… It doesn’t matter what excuse a person makes 4 his or her sin… Sin stains the soul no matter how it got there…
Children are born without a conscience. They first learn trust, because their mother meets their needs as best she can. Then they learn empathy, the ability to put themselves in another’s place. But infants whose mothers neglect them don’t learn that lesson, or those that follow, very well. While everyone has the ability to form a conscience, neglect or abuse will not allow it to develop.

Knowing why may help people figure out how to help children with these problems.
 
Children are born without a conscience. They first learn trust, because their mother meets their needs as best she can. Then they learn empathy, the ability to put themselves in another’s place. But infants whose mothers neglect them don’t learn that lesson, or those that follow, very well. While everyone has the ability to form a conscience, neglect or abuse will not allow it to develop.

Knowing why may help people figure out how to help children with these problems.
i was emotionally neglected as a child/adolescent… yet i am far from sociopathic. Even so, i do believe it is more nurture than nature…
I know a young man who was once a normal, happy child/pre-adolescent until he was taken away from his mother by the state & eventually separated from his siblings also. The mother’s only crime was that she was poor - on welfare and without a husband (she also made some poor judgments, etc., but none involving drugs & none involving abuse or neglect of her children…). Anyway, this boy was fairly well-adjusted w/ only the normal problems boys have - until this trauma occurred. Now he is sociopathic. From what i can tell, his siblings exhibit sociopathic traits as well (don’t know enough at this point to say, but stronly suspect…).
It makes me think that maybe sociopathy is a way of surviving…After all, there’s a certain logic to the question they may subconsciously have asked themselves: Why have feelings when no one cares about me? This boy was bounced around to over 10 foster placements, abused in some… At first he cried all the time… Then he got hard… His mother has always been there for him, but was eventually “phased out of his life” by the system… (long, weird story…).
I have seen this hardening take place in others who have been traumatized…
It seems to me that in any given person’s life, there comes a time when he/she begins to stop & take a look at his/her life - choices, etc… &… as the saying goes “The unexamined life is not worth living”. I pray for that to happen in this “boy’s” life. Could you also pray for him/them??
Part of the problem is age… Obvoiusly, young people think/feel/process things differently than older people do - they have different values… In the end, we all have to trust God to judge people w/ perfect justice. There’s some scripture that says something about how a person who deserves a lot of “stripes” will receive less of them than the one who does the same thing but knew better… “To whom more is given, more is required.”
For those who worry about the souls of their loved ones who are sociopathic, this should bring some comfort… Sometimes its hard to trust God (it is 4 me anyway)… but trusting - & prayer - is all we can do.
Also, its interesting to note that sociopathy occurs far less in Asian countries… where there is more of a community spirit (a sense of the “group”, the common good…) than in America, where it is virtually all about “me”…
 
Hi, I am writing an account of my life with a sociopath so whoever is out there married to someone like this or in a relationship- will know what is in store if they continue and be warned…I am married to a sociopath ( I am Asian & he is an American)now for the fourth torturing year and I can say for sure now that sociopaths cannot change their ways but they are great at adjusting their behavior to show to others tht they have indeed changed and thus succeed in conning those closest to them. I was raised to be compassionate and caring. I think my husband was able to gauge this from the first time we met and he went on to charm me into marrying him despite our huge age gap. He lied to me about having a stable career and that had always been unlucky in love and had only married once ( despite the fact that he had been married thrice already)before but his wife was cruel and he could not find love all the years after that failed until he laid eyes on me. But the day we got married everything changed in an instant- he got into a terrrible fist fight with one of the guests at our wedding reception, yelled at me publicly and got drunk and slept off without even looking at me once. Since then everyday has mostly been a nightmare, he loves to drink and then blame me for whtever is wrong with the world and that I am responsible for him loosing all his money which he basically spent in gambling, drinking and indulging in indecent activities with women of ill repute and profession. Except the first three months after marriage, he has not even touched me and blames it on ill health, stress etc. Whenever I find out about his illicit affairs, he makes my life hell at first by yelling, threatening me with bodily harm and then blaming me for imagining it all up and hence being the cause of his anger. Then when I try to leave him, he begs to change and would remain sober and well behaved for a couple of months till the cycle starts again. Since I married him against my family’s wishes, it has been hard to plan to move out of this marriage as I was so far mortally afraid of him. However, after reading about sociopathic behavior and undertsanding how he fits every description, I feel the only way out for me would be to just vanish into thin air one day. So far, I have not lived at all these four years… he shows affection in public and boredom at home, respect at our common workplace and immense direspect at home blaming even the company’s loss of revenue on me! He even gave up working for 2.5 years in between and insisted that I take care of him and be his retirement plan. During this time, whenever he felt I was having a great time at work and getting recognition, making friends- he would come up with a medical emergency( cut himself up and say he fainted and woke up in a pool of blood) right in the middle of an important meeting tht he knew abt so I would have to leave the office n go home to tend to him. This resulted in my not getting promoted in two major positions I held and yet I continued on to save my marriage and getting sucked into his stories of his mother’s untimely death which impacted him so that he has become like this. His family has ostracized him and he has no connection at all with anyone, no friends and I only found out recently that he even has a major criminal history and cannot return to the US and hence I was the ideal victim to bank on for life in Asia. He is currently a top executive in a mid size company and no one would believe what he is in life outside the office. He even refuses the desire to have anychildren which I believe is more so from the fact that he hates sharing his money with anyone-even me most of the time and says" He is truly the love of his own life". I am emotionally scarred, verbally abused and become underconfident despite being considered good looking and intelligent in the real world by most. All this has left me hating & being distrustful of all men. Thanks to my husband, I owe banks and friends a lot of money which has gone into his high lifestyle and medical care during the years he did not work and he does not show any desire of paying back using his own money and I am tired of reminding him. He often conveniently forgets to get his wallet or have any change when its time to pay for meals, cab rides and even chooses the most expensive Christmas presents for himself that I need to buy and buys me things that make me look unattractive & grubby.
Sociopaths have a knack for numbing their victims into whatever they want them to do and I am a living example and am ashamed that despite all the education and good upbringing, I have been unable to move out of the mess I got myself into. Prayer is my only strength and resort.
 
Ashley, I’m so sorry for your situation. Obviously, this man is incapable of making a sacramental marriage. You should talk to your priest asap.

I hope you find comfort in your faith.

May God in his mercy save this man’s soul.
 
Thank you for your message and support. I shall speak to a priest at the earliest. God bless
 
Hi, I am writing an account of my life with a sociopath so whoever is out there married to someone like this or in a relationship- will know what is in store if they continue and be warned…I am married to a sociopath ( I am Asian & he is an American)now for the fourth torturing year and I can say for sure now that sociopaths cannot change their ways but they are great at adjusting their behavior to show to others tht they have indeed changed and thus succeed in conning those closest to them. I was raised to be compassionate and caring. I think my husband was able to gauge this from the first time we met and he went on to charm me into marrying him despite our huge age gap. He lied to me about having a stable career and that had always been unlucky in love and had only married once ( despite the fact that he had been married thrice already)before but his wife was cruel and he could not find love all the years after that failed until he laid eyes on me. But the day we got married everything changed in an instant- he got into a terrrible fist fight with one of the guests at our wedding reception, yelled at me publicly and got drunk and slept off without even looking at me once. Since then everyday has mostly been a nightmare, he loves to drink and then blame me for whtever is wrong with the world and that I am responsible for him loosing all his money which he basically spent in gambling, drinking and indulging in indecent activities with women of ill repute and profession. Except the first three months after marriage, he has not even touched me and blames it on ill health, stress etc. Whenever I find out about his illicit affairs, he makes my life hell at first by yelling, threatening me with bodily harm and then blaming me for imagining it all up and hence being the cause of his anger. Then when I try to leave him, he begs to change and would remain sober and well behaved for a couple of months till the cycle starts again. Since I married him against my family’s wishes, it has been hard to plan to move out of this marriage as I was so far mortally afraid of him. However, after reading about sociopathic behavior and undertsanding how he fits every description, I feel the only way out for me would be to just vanish into thin air one day. So far, I have not lived at all these four years… he shows affection in public and boredom at home, respect at our common workplace and immense direspect at home blaming even the company’s loss of revenue on me! He even gave up working for 2.5 years in between and insisted that I take care of him and be his retirement plan. During this time, whenever he felt I was having a great time at work and getting recognition, making friends- he would come up with a medical emergency( cut himself up and say he fainted and woke up in a pool of blood) right in the middle of an important meeting tht he knew abt so I would have to leave the office n go home to tend to him. This resulted in my not getting promoted in two major positions I held and yet I continued on to save my marriage and getting sucked into his stories of his mother’s untimely death which impacted him so that he has become like this. His family has ostracized him and he has no connection at all with anyone, no friends and I only found out recently that he even has a major criminal history and cannot return to the US and hence I was the ideal victim to bank on for life in Asia. He is currently a top executive in a mid size company and no one would believe what he is in life outside the office. He even refuses the desire to have anychildren which I believe is more so from the fact that he hates sharing his money with anyone-even me most of the time and says" He is truly the love of his own life". I am emotionally scarred, verbally abused and become underconfident despite being considered good looking and intelligent in the real world by most. All this has left me hating & being distrustful of all men. Thanks to my husband, I owe banks and friends a lot of money which has gone into his high lifestyle and medical care during the years he did not work and he does not show any desire of paying back using his own money and I am tired of reminding him. He often conveniently forgets to get his wallet or have any change when its time to pay for meals, cab rides and even chooses the most expensive Christmas presents for himself that I need to buy and buys me things that make me look unattractive & grubby.
Sociopaths have a knack for numbing their victims into whatever they want them to do and I am a living example and am ashamed that despite all the education and good upbringing, I have been unable to move out of the mess I got myself into. Prayer is my only strength and resort.
 
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contramundum7:
I know what u are going through because once i was involved w/ someone just like that. I know it isn’t always easy to just get out… I couldn’t 4 a long time… but eventually i did get out permanently.
You are right to pray about this. That is what i did. I prayed the rosary and even though things got worse b4 they got better, well, @ least i got “free” eventually. The only problem is, there are always after-effects (Post traumatic stress disorder, etc.) but those are a walk in the park compared 2 dealing with that kind of “moral idiot”.
This forum has gone into a lot of reasons as to why people are like this… but in the end, it doens’t really matter - what matters is taking care of Number 1. Number 1 is all you have… (and God. You have God, but these people seem 2 have the power 2 take even God from you… by stealing your peace, etc…).
I will definitely pray for you.
I began looking @ my situation as a form of reparation for sins i committed in my past that led up to the involvement w/ him… But i also realized that i was (still am) paying for the sins of others also. :ehh: But you know, that’s just life. The world is full of sin… & it is going to be like that until the end…
Anyway, another thing i began to do was compare my sufferings to those of Christ on the Cross (and b4 he was on eht Cross). Jesus (like u) did not deserve what He went thorugh. And he loved the people who crucified Him (…How He did that is beyond me…😦 ).
I still do this thing of lining up my sufferings with those of HIs whenever something painful, seemingly unbearable comes into my life… It is so wonderful to be close to Jesus & closeness comes in a very special way because i know (1st hand) what he went through… (more or less…).
Sometimes i find myself feeling sorry for myself. I think of Jesus in his sufferings and with a big sigh, I say, in resignation: “JESUS!! Now i know how you felt…!”
God bless…
 
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contramundum7:
I am wondering if you could answer some questions about the sociopath u are married to. I am not a psych student, but maybe i am, informally…
I would like to know such things as:
  1. Was he “over-indulged” by one or both of his parents? It seems that s-p always have at least one parent who thinks he/she can do no wrong… or virtually no wrong… as in: even when/if the person does wrong, its treated as not that big a deal…
    Also, 2) Was he left alone a lot? I have this theory that s-p’s r left alone a lot, unsupervised (neglect…). Neglect is actually the worst kind of child abuse…
    Also: 3) What religion, if any, was he raised in? I think most of them r not raised with any clear concept of Hell… and as another Poster said, “None” (?) are Catholic… (something to that effect).
    Of course, those fallen-away Catholics are the worst of the worst in many ways…
    Anyway, God bless. We are praying 4 u. 🙂
 
Thank you for your message and support. I shall speak to a priest at the earliest. God bless
If he was cheating at the time of your marriage, u are entitled 2 an annulment… Don’t know if you knew that?
 
You’re confusing “feelings” and “conscience”.

Sociopaths don’t have an innate “feeling” of right and wrong.

However, psychologists say there are sociopaths out there who have formed their consciences in a purely intellectual way – they decide to learn and follow the rules, they decide they don’t want to harm others, and they ask others for advice if they can’t decide what’s right. These people often have as good a conscience, for all practical purposes, as a normal person, and thus live completely normal and blameless lives.

It’s part of the mystery of human nature and sin why some sociopaths work out this way and others are completely opposite.
I am wondering if u can say where u got this info? And how can one know that the aforementioned kind of person is/was a sociopath? I mean, if they act “right”, then how do we know??:confused:
 
One question has not been addressed much: Can sociopaths be healed?
I feel anyone can be healed if he puts himself into the Presence of Christ. Jesus died 2 forgive ALL sins, all sinners… The problem is: do sociopaths ever really get a notion to be with Christ? I guess we should invite them?
Its sad that i was pretty old b4 i even learned of the Presence of Christ (Blessed Sacrament) in the Church and how sitting there iwth HIm 4 long periods of time can help so much…
I was raised “Catholic”… but not catechized…😦
 
Dear contramundum7, thank you for your messages. It really helps to talk on this forum. Now to answer your questions: I had no idea he was cheating on me at the time we got married and maybe I even ignored any signs as I was so lost in love:rolleyes:
  1. He was not pampered by either parent and his mom n dad were constantly fighting since he was born(tht is wht he tells me) He told me he still has nightmares of someone locking him in a closet and tht he is trapped and terrified. His mother became an alcoholic after his birth and his father used to beat her up. His father was cheating on her and eventually soon after she was found dead on a pavement in the city one night with all her jewellery gone from her body ofcourse, he quickly moved on and married another woman he was having an affair with.
  2. as a child while his parents were bickering and going through divorce he was bounced bk n forth between the two of them and apparently neither of them wanted anything to do with him so he was often sent on camps and to relatives who wantd nothing to do with him .
  3. as per his accounts, his elder brother was always cherished by his parents and while he would have to wait till late evenings sitting outside the school in snow fr someone to come pick him up, his brother was gifted fancy cars while he was just in college. He says he has strong resentment for being abandoned like this and hence without really knowing it, he started resenting everyone and became an evil child who wntd to hurt everyone. he used to get into fights with kids all the time and grew up a lonely man- as per his story.
  4. he often tells me (nw again i dont knw if this is a fact or an act to keep me) tht he destroys everything tht is good in his life eventually. I hv seen this happen myself tht when things are going good- I find him deliberatley tryin to rock the boat at work and home mayb just to get a thrill out of it as I have read tht s-ps do.
    5)He has gone thru a lot of therapy but nothing seems to work
    6)His behavior is like night and day- when he is good he is an angel- he will nurse me when i am sick, but when he is evil- he is sooo bad tht I cannot even describe and I feel so much hatred for him at tht point.
  5. He was raised a Presbyterian by his mother as long as she lived(till he was 10)but he has never been to church and does not believe in God.
    I can tolerate his temper and work with him on every issue but his addiction to alcohol & women he picks from cheap bars and continues to communicate with. He does nt have one night stands with them and move on. Also considering he has erectile dysfunction, I cannot imagine what gratification can this bring to him- his driver once told me tht even the women he used to bring before we got married were frustrated as he does nt do anything with them but talks dirty and they feel as if they wasted their time. I found him cheating on me just last week and stopped talking to him but he yet again yelled at me for imagining this. Now he behaves as if nothing happened and tht I shud stop imagining and accusing the BEST Husband any women can ask for .:confused: Now I am actively applying for jobs outside the country to get away frm him. Going back to my parents would crush them so I have to find other ways- thankfully I have a large friend circle whom I can bank my life on which he resents. He is 51 now with no friends, no family & he does not seem to care that should I move on who will take care of him since his health is not the same and one day he will have to retire. Wonder what goes through the minds of s-ps…
 
Those who attack the Catholic Church would do well to remember the story of Uzzah & what happened when he touched the Ark of the Covenant - against God’s express commands… Even though he did so (?) more or less out of ignorance, he died. The Catholic Church is the New Ark of the Covenant because Jesus’ True Presence abides there 24/7…
AMEN 🙂
've been thinking about what a completely Catholic world would be like, where ALL people were well catechized in the faith.
All the various cultures of the world would exist and flourish.
The economies of the world would be VERY similar to what they are now, except that there would be more “HEART” in it.
.
Amen, yes folk would consider the other person when looking to satisfy their own needs. In fact if they were true to catholic teaching, meeting the needs of others IS a large way to satisfying their own aspirations 🙂
All people would have a common way of relating to each other, on the personal, community and national levels.
There would still be squabbles between individuals and groups, but handling those squabbles would be more “civil”
Yes, ‘nowt so queer as folk’ as we say in my part of UK. But we would be equally quick to say ‘sorry’. Catholics in my experience have a great propensity to say sorry after an altercation. Now it does not undo the harm that can come from such an action but it goes a long way towards healing it.🙂
“Mental health” would be handled ENTIRELY differently, and infinitely more effectively
The famous Karl Yung father of psychoanysis said ‘if secular society had the equivalent of the Roman Confessional, there would be no need for the clinicians couch’. 🙂

Sorry I cannot remember where I read it now, it was a long time ago and in one of my set readers as an undergraduate. But I think there is an essential truth in what he said:)
 
Dear contramundum7, thank you for your messages. It really helps to talk on this forum. Now to answer your questions: I had no idea he was cheating on me at the time we got married and maybe I even ignored any signs as I was so lost in love:rolleyes:
  1. He was not pampered by either parent and his mom n dad were constantly fighting since he was born(tht is wht he tells me) He told me he still has nightmares of someone locking him in a closet and tht he is trapped and terrified. His mother became an alcoholic after his birth and his father used to beat her up. His father was cheating on her and eventually soon after she was found dead on a pavement in the city one night with all her jewellery gone from her body ofcourse, he quickly moved on and married another woman he was having an affair with.
  2. as a child while his parents were bickering and going through divorce he was bounced bk n forth between the two of them and apparently neither of them wanted anything to do with him so he was often sent on camps and to relatives who wantd nothing to do with him .
  3. as per his accounts, his elder brother was always cherished by his parents and while he would have to wait till late evenings sitting outside the school in snow fr someone to come pick him up, his brother was gifted fancy cars while he was just in college. He says he has strong resentment for being abandoned like this and hence without really knowing it, he started resenting everyone and became an evil child who wntd to hurt everyone. he used to get into fights with kids all the time and grew up a lonely man- as per his story.
  4. he often tells me (nw again i dont knw if this is a fact or an act to keep me) tht he destroys everything tht is good in his life eventually. I hv seen this happen myself tht when things are going good- I find him deliberatley tryin to rock the boat at work and home mayb just to get a thrill out of it as I have read tht s-ps do.
    5)He has gone thru a lot of therapy but nothing seems to work
    6)His behavior is like night and day- when he is good he is an angel- he will nurse me when i am sick, but when he is evil- he is sooo bad tht I cannot even describe and I feel so much hatred for him at tht point.
  5. He was raised a Presbyterian by his mother as long as she lived(till he was 10)but he has never been to church and does not believe in God.
    I can tolerate his temper and work with him on every issue but his addiction to alcohol & women he picks from cheap bars and continues to communicate with. He does nt have one night stands with them and move on. Also considering he has erectile dysfunction, I cannot imagine what gratification can this bring to him- his driver once told me tht even the women he used to bring before we got married were frustrated as he does nt do anything with them but talks dirty and they feel as if they wasted their time. I found him cheating on me just last week and stopped talking to him but he yet again yelled at me for imagining this. Now he behaves as if nothing happened and tht I shud stop imagining and accusing the BEST Husband any women can ask for .:confused: Now I am actively applying for jobs outside the country to get away frm him. Going back to my parents would crush them so I have to find other ways- thankfully I have a large friend circle whom I can bank my life on which he resents. He is 51 now with no friends, no family & he does not seem to care that should I move on who will take care of him since his health is not the same and one day he will have to retire. Wonder what goes through the minds of s-ps…
 
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contramundum7:
Thank you for the info. That is some story - about his past life and all. I guess it confirms that s-ps (@ least some) are abused/neglected… I think it goes back to that thing about survival… People do what they have to or what thye think they have to in order to survive…
I am also wondering how you were raised? I think htat s-p’s prey on those who are capable of nurturing… And yet the person in my life i suspect of being that way, seems to have a girlfriend who is also somewhat s-pathic…
Anyway, i’m sure with all the sexual loose-ness in our society, there are going to be more and more cases of sociopathy… I say this because of your husbands’ parents’ history, etc… A lot of people these days get involved sexually far too soon… and then, by the time they have a clue who their “significant other” is, its too late… they have children… etc.
Sin begets sin begets more sin… a viscious cycle…
Anyway, i am praying for you. There is a way out.
I know u probably feel sorry for this guy and so do i… But as you probably know, you have to think of yourself 1st… Besides…
Sociopaths cannot accept love. w/ them, You are damned if you do and damned if you don’t…
It is so hard to tell what a person should do in these kinds of situations. I believe in my own situation, it was God and God only that worked. He intervened when i had lost all hope… I prayed the rosary and amazing things began to happen… (i have to say, though, some of what happened wasn’t too “good”… but at least i did get away from him…). i learned some hard lessons on who to let into my life and who not… Now i don’t trust anyone… which is probably a “good” thing, even though its a bad thing also… ’
Every situation is different, so i don’t know what to tell you… Only God knows the way out (though you may have a few clues?? I pray you do…).
Have u ever prayed the St. Jude Novena? He is the patron of Hopeless cases…
God bless…
 
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