Is there such a thing as an atheist worldview?

[BartholomewB]

It doesn’t even mean they’re convinced one doesn’t exist.

Strictly speaking, that’s what it does mean. Atheism is the belief that there is no God, while agnosticism is the belief that it’s impossible to know whether there is a God or not.

 

[Freddy]

Dan123:

It doesn’t even mean they’re convinced one doesn’t exist.

Strictly speaking, that’s what it does mean.

I don’t believe in ghosts. But I might be wrong. I don’t believe that little green men have visited earth. But I might be wrong. I don’t believe in God. But…

 

[Dan123]

Strictly speaking, that’s what it does mean. Atheism is the belief that there is no God, while agnosticism is the belief that it’s impossible to know whether there is a God or not.

Belief and knowledge aren’t the same, but you casually switched between them, which is usually where this confusion originates. I lack a belief in God, that is well within the definition of atheism. I also don’t believe it can be proven either way, which fits agnosticism. They aren’t mutually exclusive because one deals with belief and one deals with knowledge.

 

[StudentMI]

George H. Smith for one differentiated between agnostic atheism and agnostic theism. It’s an interesting subject.

 

[Dan123]

I appreciate the sentiment as expressed in the two quotes on the page blow.

Agnostic atheism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[IanAG]

Or maybe getting enjoyment and fulfillment in life. The finite nature of life is part what makes it valuable.

But that is still based on some existential presuppositions. Do you believe in God or not? That in itself shapes your behaviour and actions. Does life have any purpose? If so, what is it? The answer to that question will determine your choices. If you are not answering these existential questions then you are running on a programme learned from your parents, so not really living a life of your own choosing.

 

[IanAG]

I’m not going to say that that is the most convoluted illogical statement I’ll read this week. But there’s only two day left, so it’s in with a good chance.

I think that’s very unkind. The sentence made perfect sense to me and struck me as a truism.

 

[IanAG]

I appreciate the sentiment as expressed in the two quotes on the page blow

That provides an answer to only one of the core existential questions - Does God exist? What your position is on the others determines your worldview. From what I understand most agnostic atheists in the West are materialists.

 

[IanAG]

I don’t believe in ghosts. But I might be wrong. I don’t believe that little green men have visited earth. But I might be wrong. I don’t believe in God. But…

So what do you believe in Freddy?

 

[BartholomewB]

Belief and knowledge aren’t the same, but you casually switched between them, which is usually where this confusion originates.

I picked my words carefully. I am drawing a clear distinction between the verbs “believe” and “know”. No “casual switching” at all.

 

[NormalBeliever]

You also lack disbelief in God by that logic. Which wouldn’t be compatible with atheism as is usually understood - and most people understand atheistm as a positive negation of God. It’s only in modern times that the lack of belief version is being propagated, and IIRC this definition of atheism wasn’t successful in academia.

It would be more accurate for people who don’t positively believe there is no God to call themselves agnostics - either because they don’t affirm anything either way about God, or believe one can’t know either way currently or in principle.

 

[JMMJ]

Why do Catholics, or anyone of any faith, feel like they get to tell atheists and agnostics what they (the atheist or aniston) believe???

 

[Dan123]

You also lack disbelief in God by that logic. Which wouldn’t be compatible with atheism as is usually understood - and most people understand atheistm as a positive negation of God.

As someone who is an atheist and knows many atheists I simply don’t find this to be true, I know very few people who will tell you they ‘know’ God doesn’t exist. This, to me, is only a definition I hear from Christians. And to be fair that’s likely part of why the atheists who are on these forums are here, to try and help correct misrepresentations of us that seem to spread in communities.

But people can use different definitions as long as they define their terms. If that’s the definition you and others want to use, then we shouldn’t hear anything more about Richard Dawkins, as while he doesn’t believe in God, thinks the idea is absurd and that teaching it sometimes amounts to child abuse, he doesn’t claim certainty God doesn’t exist.

 

[Dan123]

That provides an answer to only one of the core existential questions - Does God exist? What your position is on the others determines your worldview. From what I understand most agnostic atheists in the West are materialists.

When this thread was much younger and wanting to be able to help answer your question I did look into what worldviews were, how they were used, etc. I only ever found ‘the 7 questions’ in Christian sources, in academic sources the topic seems much, much deeper. That is, your view of what a worldview is seems heavily influenced by your worldview, which makes sense really.

Is your goal in this thread to find out how atheists would answer those 7 questions? I believe some have done so, some in pieces more fully.

As for being a materialist, I would simply add some nuance. I don’t claim to know if there’s more than the physical world, but so far I haven’t been shown enough reason to believe there is. A component of my worldview, though not one of your 7 questions, would likely be skepticism, which I’m using to mean that the strength of believe in a proposition should be proportional to the evidence presented. I don’t believe I’ve ever been shown evidence or reason to believe in any of the variety of supernatural things people claim, and when you multiply anything by 0 you know what you get.

So I might say ‘practical materialist’? I may work on a better term but the idea I’d like to convey is I live my life as if the material world is all there is. I’m open to information that changes that, but have yet to find anything compelling presented.

It’s not much different than the distinction between philosophical and methodological naturalism.

 

[IanAG]

Hi Dan, since I wrote this post I’ve dug out some of my old notes and understand what you’re saying.

I’ve found a more objective set of binary questions which enables us to better understand worldview (or schema as it’s sometimes called). They go something like this…

Do you have the power to make free choices?
Is there an objective truth?
Is it possible to know the truth?
Is anything objectively good or bad?
Is there a God?
Is there more than one valid religion? *
Is everything ultimately one?
Is everything ultimately material in nature?
Is everything ultimately mental in nature?
Is God a personal being? *
Is the universe God? *
Is the universe within God? *
Is God a perfect being? *
Is there only one God? *
Has God communicated with humans? *
Has God communicated openly to humans? *

I can’t reproduce the flowchart here, but needless to say it’s not a question of answering all the questions, as the answer to one ultimately leads to another until your worldview can be identified. Those marked with a star are only valid if you answered is there a God in the affirmative.

On further reflection I think that ‘atheist worldviews’ is a category rather than a discrete worldview.

Under that category would be the worldviews of atheistic dualism, atheistic idealism, materialism, modernism, nihilism, naturalism, relativism and scepticism, for example.

I don’t want to make assumptions about anyone’s worldview, that’s the whole point of asking…as I said I’m just interested to discover where atheists are coming from, how they/you view the world.

 

[IanAG]

Why do Catholics, or anyone of any faith, feel like they get to tell atheists and agnostics what they (the atheist or aniston) believe???

No one is telling you what to believe, they are just asking what you do believe.

 

[JMMJ]

I meant they act like they are in a place to define what an atheist and/or agnostic’s foundation of belief or disbelief is.

 

[Dan123]

I’ve found a more objective set of binary questions which enables us to better understand worldview (or schema as it’s sometimes called). They go something like this…

Those are indeed a bit better, though it still comes from a very monotheistic/judeochristian bias. A lot of the terms would need defining, e.g. I find a lot of the time when people saying objective good/bad they mean something closer to what I understand absolute good/bad to be; and a lot of the questions I think are just confusing to a nontheist. Like what does “Is the universe God?” mean? How would one distinguish between a universe that was god, a universe that was inside God, and a universe that was neither?

Honestly a lot of my answers would be “I have no way of determining that”. Perhaps it’s meant to be assumed each question is about the person’s belief not knowledge? As in, to me the question “Do you believe God exists?” and the question “Does God exist?” are not the same question.

 

[IanAG]

You seem to be highly sceptical. What makes you think it comes from a monotheistic or Judeo Christian worldview? It actually comes from a renowned textbook used in the secular psychotherapy course I took.

As I said, concurrence with the most common atheistic worldviews can be determined by answering the first set of questions without an asterisk.

The questions with an asterisk are only applicable if you answered ‘yes’ to ‘Does God exist’, and are there to determine what ‘theistic’ worldview you have, e.g. monotheistic, pantheistic, panentheistic, universalism and so on.

 

[IanAG]

A lot of the terms would need defining, e.g. I find a lot of the time when people saying objective good/bad they mean something closer to what I understand absolute good/bad to be; and a lot of the questions I think are just confusing to a nontheist.

Hi Dan, you say that a ‘lot of terms need defining’. To me the questions seem perfectly clear, so maybe you could take a look in a dictionary for any words you don’t understand.

Focus only on the questions with an asterisk, as I’ve said, the others are only applicable to theists.