Is traditional Catholicism on the rise?

[Freshman88]

Is orthodoxy on the rise? I think my generation hungers for it.

Sigh… if only the older generation would understand this.

 

[CradleCath]

My bishop, in response to the Motu Proprio, issued a one paragraph response in our diocesan newspaper that stated that he “acknowledged” the Motu Proprio. It was followed in the next issue by a scathing editiorial from the diocesan chancellor who stated that “nobody wanted it”…Very, very chilling effect.

Traditional Catholicism has been on the rise in my parish since 1992 when we celebrated our 200th anniversary and the Cardinal Archbishop of Lyons, France departed from the script and gave the Apostolic Blessing in Latin. It was embarassing. Only about six of us in a choir of 25 knew the responses and, sadly, there weren’t that many of the diocesan priests in attendance who knew either. That “gaff” ended our “Anglican exile” (up until that point we were forbidden from singing Latin. Sing my tongue the Savior’s glory from the 1940 hymnal is like taking a shower with a raincoat on. Happy to say we sing the full Pange Lingua on Holy Thursday).

My kids grew up in a reverent NO parish where they did hear chant and sacred motets. It was amplified at home, of course, I routinely play chant when I am at my calligraphy table and they’ve certainly heard me running around the house singing along with motets and Masses, etc.

**My oldest son (27) floored me two years ago. He took it upon himself to learn the plain chant for the Pater Noster and chanted it for me. **I have faith the size of a mustard seed. It won’t happen overnight, but, yes, that which I knew as a child will return.

I’d say that you have been an excellent Father (Mother?) & are now blessed with wonderful children.

 

[CradleCath]

I am so jealous of all of you who have the opportunity to attend the EF. Here I am, living in a very anti-Catholic, rural Ohio area where we might not even keep our parish open much longer. The irony in this is that my son is a deacon with the Institute of Christ the King and God willing he will be ordained next year. I really feel left out! I am excited tho, because the FSSP has recently started a monthly Mass an hour from where I live. I do not think my diocese is much interested in anything Latin from what I have observed. I haven’t heard anything positive about Latin Masses in my area. I am feeling a little left out as I read your posts.

And I’m feeling a little jealous of you that you have a son about to become a priest.
BTW., Pope Benedict’s goal is to make the Latin Mass made available to everyone who wants it. I believe that God will honor his desire. Don’ give up.

 

[Moonflower]

From what I know of our current pope, he seems to be more traditionally-minded than some. For example, I love that he approves wholeheartedly of receiving Communion on the tongue while kneeling. I know that this is how he distributes Communion when he celebrates Mass. I was ecstatic about the Motu Propio from last summer. But is this enough? I had thought that a pendulum might be swinging back, but I am having doubts now.

I was wondering if anyone could tell me, is it really possible that traditional Catholicism could be coming back? Or are these changes small in the grand scope of things and unlikely to ever be implemented on a large scale?

Hey just droppin by I am a Catholic myself been all my life well 22 years to be exact. I am called to the religious life. I try to kneel when taking communion but I have a bad lower back and have a hard time getting back up yea sucks I was in a car accident that ruined the lower spine more less gave me peircing pain! By all means I know what you mean on the traditionalism Pope Benedict is a traditionalist he is trying to bring the church back to the valid mass! I try to wear a veil when I can. I have a rosary that is 178 years old. It was from France and has the Miraclous image on the back of the cross-

But like I said I think we should focus more on what it means to be Catholic and on Christ!:byzsoc:

:grouphug:

 

[colleensarah]

As a teen, I prefer the more traditional masses to the lifeteen ones, and even the ones where a lot of modern music and style is introduced.

As a fellow teen, I second this! Young people who are serious about their faith much prefer full-fledged orthodoxy. We don’t want stuff watered down, we don’t want to come to church and hear music that sounds the same as what’s on the radio, we’re tired of youth groups that focus more on pizza parties than apologetics…yes, there are lots of reason to be excited about how God is taking care of His Church!
I went to Confession the other day (with a friend of mine, another teen). The parish we were at is the largest in our diocese, and yet there was a relatively short line (stereotypical in the extreme–a short Saturday morning time slot in an ugly, bare church built in the 1960’s). Of the perhaps 30 or 40 people I saw that day, probably 10 were young people, in their teens or twenties. We also just got a new priest, fresh from the seminary. He preached his first homily at our parish on Confession and really living the Christian life. If these are not good signs, I don’t know what are!

 

[Dragonslayer]

Wow… it is very heartening to hear of the desire for the reverence found in traditionalism, especially amongst the younger generation.

 

[Padraig1972]

I am planning to take ground classes in Latin this fall and hopefully move on from there, so i can understand the words and the meaning in the traditional latin mass fully, not just read, say and memorize them.

I wish so much to be able to pray in Latin and learn the rosary in Latin as well.
Going to a Traditional Latin Mass, witness the high altar, feel the smell of incense and just sense the holyness. It is such a gift and blessing.

Oh yes, traditional catholicism is on the rise and i welcome it so much.

 

[NorthTexan88]

I think it is slowly but surely making a comeback. I’m 22 and I love reverent Mass’ as do all of my friends. It gives me structure an makes me feel safe, it’s hard to explain but it just makes me feel closer to Christ and the Church. In sure y’all know what I’m talking about

 

[NewsTheMan]

It is on the rise - but relative to the neo-Catholicism that is rampant in most parishes today it is dying out. It’s sad, but I always smile when I see people saying that the Latin Mass is making a ‘comeback’ and that more and more people are discovering what true Catholicism is all about. I have no doubt this fact is true. However, the fact is that due to deep seated liberalism and modernism in the Church today for every 1 person who discovers TLM, 20 other people discover that they prefer a sort of protestantized-Catholicism and they will defend that version of Catholicism in much the same way that we do. I have seen it in my Parish, and I have seen it online.

I will quote something I read recently on a blog:

Many Traditional Catholics delude themselves with the claim that people will flock to Tradition once the Vatican II Folk Mass Generation passes away.

At the present time, congregations who attend Charismatic / Life Teen services are growing much more rapidly than Catholics who attend the Traditional Latin Mass. Many of these people are involved in Bible Studies, prayer groups, Medjugore, World Youth Day, the Pro-Life Movement, the Cathechism, the post-VC2 Magisterium, and the Catechism. They are enthusiastic and devout and as pictured, are often young.

While I don’t believe Bible studies are wrong, or prayer groups, or WYD, or the Pro-Life movement or the Catechism… the point of the above quote is that many who are getting involved are getting involved in a Catholicism that sits on the “Spirit of Vatican II” throne. They completely miss and give up on the idea of the “hermeneutic of continuity” or a love of Tradition.

 

[NorthTexan88]

If this neo-Cathicism we have now just started in the 60’s- early 70’s, then whose to say it won’t die out? With the amount of young people who are interested in the traditions of the church I think it could happen. It’s kind of funny bc we touched on this in RCIA last week when one of the people said that Mass was not like they pictured it, and pretty much the whole room, myself included, agreed. These were all people under 25. In the grand scheme this has only been 40 or so years in our 2,000 year history, so it’ll be interesting to see how it plays out in the next decade or so after the “liberal hippy” generation is gone.

 

[NewsTheMan]

If this neo-Cathicism we have now just started in the 60’s- early 70’s, then whose to say it won’t die out?

I pray it does. However, look around. The United States is lucky - you are quite ‘central’ and if your particular diocese is liberal you can look to the next diocese and see flourishing Latin Masses and such. Here in Africa things are different. We’re far, far removed. I always hear “Africa is where the next generation of Catholics will come from!”. If that’s true then you better welcome a generation of Catholics who don’t care about Tradition. Think about what is happening in Australia. In El Paso. In Canada. Call to Action. Women Priests United or whatever it’s called. I would absolutely love for these to be fringe groups and things that do not happen often but that’s just not the case.

I had to remove myself from a local Catholic student group for being a “papist” who - for wanting less abuses - was an “archaic Roman”.

I expressed Church teaching regarding homosexual marriage, abortion and women priests to a group of lecturers the other day and they called me a “radical Catholic” because the Catholics they know (young and old) don’t believe in any of those things.

All I’m saying is that there is reason to be hopeful, but the war won’t be win by thinking that the enemy is dying out. Oh no.

 

[kmuestwin]

It seems like the teens and young adults (18-30) are searching for a more traditional faith. I don’t see it as a bad thing but because I wasn’t around in the 50’s, I don’t know if it is the best thing.

Obviously, there was a reason for Vatican II. I don’t know if they were met or if the end product was the desire of church leaders but there was a reason for the changes. I am hoping that this new translation will bridge the gap for more people to feel like their liturgical needs are being met. If it draws more people to the beatuy of the Latin Mass, that is fine with me. If it draws people towards a beautiful and reverent Novus Ordo Mass, that is fine with me also. It inspires me to see more and more people drawn in to the beauty of our Church.

I hope that the people who insist and hope for a more traditional Catholic Church are able to find a closer relationship with Christ.

I just want people to find humble fear of the Lord.

The bottom line is that the CC has been around for 2000 years. If we aren’t Traditional aren’t we missing out on the centuries of knowledge and inspiration that we give up to “modernize” our faith?

 

[NorthTexan88]

I pray it does. However, look around. The United States is lucky - you are quite ‘central’ and if your particular diocese is liberal you can look to the next diocese and see flourishing Latin Masses and such. Here in Africa things are different. We’re far, far removed. I always hear “Africa is where the next generation of Catholics will come from!”. If that’s true then you better welcome a generation of Catholics who don’t care about Tradition. Think about what is happening in Australia. In El Paso. In Canada. Call to Action. Women Priests United or whatever it’s called. I would absolutely love for these to be fringe groups and things that do not happen often but that’s just not the case.

I had to remove myself from a local Catholic student group for being a “papist” who - for wanting less abuses - was an “archaic Roman”.

I expressed Church teaching regarding homosexual marriage, abortion and women priests to a group of lecturers the other day and they called me a “radical Catholic” because the Catholics they know (young and old) don’t believe in any of those things.

All I’m saying is that there is reason to be hopeful, but the war won’t be win by thinking that the enemy is dying out. Oh no.

I had no idea Africa was like that, I always pictured it as being a very conservative place. I guess Cardinal Arinze is not in the majority there then?

I agree with the post by kmuestwin, I just dont understand how we can throw away all of the beauty we have collected over 2,000 years. I am so thankfull to be accepted into the true church of Christ next month and cannot wait to partake in the true presence, but I have to admit, it is very discouraging to me the lack of reverence and tradition that occurs, I guess that makes me a traditionalist…or conservative?? I think a lot of people who are joining feel the same way that I do in RCIA. Cause I have to admit, if the Catholic Church was not the church that Christ founded and was truly present in the Eucharist, I would definently pass over the church for somewhere more conservative. But I am happy to be here and just pray things change or the better. I know things change over centuries…but I often ask myself if the early Catholics…or even Catholics from 100 years ago would recognize what we have now?

 

[NewsTheMan]

I had no idea Africa was like that, I always pictured it as being a very conservative place. I guess Cardinal Arinze is not in the majority there then?

It can be conservative in some respects. For the poor, unpriviledged Africans Catholicism is something different than it is for you and for me. I am sure many missionaries can attest to such a thing - but this is true even more so in the last 40 years with the diluting of the faith to the point where missionaries may not be presenting the truth of Catholicism. For the more privileged white and black class, Catholicism is just one denomination among money. I am sure this is not foreign to the American experience either. I think Africa has it particularly bad because (1) No access to information, so people cannot learn about their faith (2) No urgency, there are more pressing matters for Bishops than correcting liturgical matters (though as I see it, correcting liturgical matters comes first) (3) Being so far away from the ‘action’ and so wilfully or unwillfully ignorant of directives from Rome.

Cardinal Arinze is marvellous, but the minority. Many men here who become priests or religious’ do so to escape poverty and such. Their vocation can sometimes be less about service to Christ and utter sacrifice, and more about gaining a higher class status while performing the duties of a priest. I don’t doubt many, if not all, are holy and saintly, but there is a crisis. Our seminaries are terrible, and formation is horrid.

I agree with the post by kmuestwin, I just dont understand how we can throw away all of the beauty we have collected over 2,000 years. I am so thankfull to be accepted into the true church of Christ next month and cannot wait to partake in the true presence, but I have to admit, it is very discouraging to me the lack of reverence and tradition that occurs, I guess that makes me a traditionalist…or conservative?? I think a lot of people who are joining feel the same way that I do in RCIA. Cause I have to admit, if the Catholic Church was not the church that Christ founded and was truly present in the Eucharist, I would definently pass over the church for somewhere more conservative. But I am happy to be here and just pray things change or the better. I know things change over centuries…but I often ask myself if the early Catholics…or even Catholics from 100 years ago would recognize what we have now?

Don’t try politicize the faith too much. Don’t get carried away with words like conservative or liberal - yes, I use them, and yes they work well sometimes. However, in reality you are either a Catholic or not. You either follow Church teaching or not. You either do the right thing or you don’t. It’s also good to remember that the Church of Christ is Holy, but it’s members may be sinners. I am glad you are becoming Catholic. More importantly Christ is glad. Try live your faith fully and don’t let the politics get to you too much. I get involved probably a bit too much. I am far too opinionated. A poor sinner in need of help who has offended God more than others.

In any case, don’t let it get to you. Christ is the Head. He will sort His Church out. Just you watch.

 

[Etamin]

Here in Africa things are different. We’re far, far removed. I always hear “Africa is where the next generation of Catholics will come from!”. If that’s true then you better welcome a generation of Catholics who don’t care about Tradition.

I had to remove myself from a local Catholic student group for being a “papist” who - for wanting less abuses - was an “archaic Roman”.

I expressed Church teaching regarding homosexual marriage, abortion and women priests to a group of lecturers the other day and they called me a “radical Catholic” because the Catholics they know (young and old) don’t believe in any of those things.

All I’m saying is that there is reason to be hopeful, but the war won’t be win by thinking that the enemy is dying out. Oh no.

I think in this case, it is necessary to look abroad for trends in the future.

Know that you are not alone in South Africa, as far as conservative or traditional Catholicism is concerned, and we must act as the leaven in our land, to bring our country’s Catholics back in line with the magisterium of the Church, faithful to Rome.

Here in ZA we always seem to be 10 years or more, behind with international trends and ideas (just look at our history). Notice that even here when we search for Catholics who are serious about their faith, you will always find that they are rich in orthodoxy. In Christ lies our hope for the future.

 

[Etamin]

I had to remove myself from a local Catholic student group for being a “papist” who - for wanting less abuses - was an “archaic Roman”.

I expressed Church teaching regarding homosexual marriage, abortion and women priests to a group of lecturers the other day and they called me a “radical Catholic” because the Catholics they know (young and old) don’t believe in any of those things.

Many men here who become priests or religious’ do so to escape poverty and such. Their vocation can sometimes be less about service to Christ and utter sacrifice, and more about gaining a higher class status while performing the duties of a priest. I don’t doubt many, if not all, are holy and saintly, but there is a crisis. Our seminaries are terrible, and formation is horrid.

If you are in the SA National Seminary, you have my prayers tonight. May God watch over you and guide you.

Keep your head low, but remain strong in faith. The Church needs zealous and faithful priests, especially in SA.

 

[wisdomseeker]

I’m a nineteen-year-old convert to the ancient and holy Catholic Church, and I must say, the more reverent, mysterious (in the Christian sense) and glorious the Mass, the better. No Kitschy sing-songs, only solid, ancient hymns, no adlibbing by the priest, only the proper prayers, I prefer kneeling for Communion, and I believe the more incense, candles, statues, and traditional domestic Catholicism (i.e., family rosary and prayers, domestic altar, images of Christ and the saints, crucifixes in the bedroom, etc., things that make a Catholic home sacred).

I think young people are dying to have a Faith with “ancient stability”, I like to say. Something* real*, ancient, and sacred. I think this is why many young people in the Protestant sects go church-hopping and shopping all the time, because they cannot find the sacred.

But a reverent Catholic church can provide that.

Amen to that. You are Spiritually mature and understand the things God. I am not alone thanks be to God.
I too believe that the Church must be beautiful for the people to have the desire to come.

 

[wisdomseeker]

I pray it does. However, look around. The United States is lucky - you are quite ‘central’ and if your particular diocese is liberal you can look to the next diocese and see flourishing Latin Masses and such. Here in Africa things are different. We’re far, far removed. I always hear “Africa is where the next generation of Catholics will come from!”. If that’s true then you better welcome a generation of Catholics who don’t care about Tradition. Think about what is happening in Australia. In El Paso. In Canada. Call to Action. Women Priests United or whatever it’s called. I would absolutely love for these to be fringe groups and things that do not happen often but that’s just not the case.

I had to remove myself from a local Catholic student group for being a “papist” who - for wanting less abuses - was an “archaic Roman”.

I expressed Church teaching regarding homosexual marriage, abortion and women priests to a group of lecturers the other day and they called me a “radical Catholic” because the Catholics they know (young and old) don’t believe in any of those things.

All I’m saying is that there is reason to be hopeful, but the war won’t be win by thinking that the enemy is dying out. Oh no.

I so agree with you. Things are much worse than many think. I too have to avoid many Catholics because they seem to be from a totally different religion. Many have even stopped talking to me because I am a Traditional Catholic and believe in teh Church.

 

[wisdomseeker]

I had no idea Africa was like that, I always pictured it as being a very conservative place. I guess Cardinal Arinze is not in the majority there then?

I agree with the post by kmuestwin, I just dont understand how we can throw away all of the beauty we have collected over 2,000 years. I am so thankfull to be accepted into the true church of Christ next month and cannot wait to partake in the true presence, but I have to admit, it is very discouraging to me the lack of reverence and tradition that occurs, I guess that makes me a traditionalist…or conservative?? I think a lot of people who are joining feel the same way that I do in RCIA. Cause I have to admit, if the Catholic Church was not the church that Christ founded and was truly present in the Eucharist, I would definently pass over the church for somewhere more conservative. But I am happy to be here and just pray things change or the better. I know things change over centuries…but I often ask myself if the early Catholics…or even Catholics from 100 years ago would recognize what we have now?

We still have some beautifull Churces but they have been taking by the (modernists) while the Traditional Mass in many places are being celebrated in very small almost like old houses turned into a Church. It is very shameful.

The one Church I used to go to, they put up a sign wiht the name of the Church without the Catholic name on it. They removed the word Catholic.

 

[mrld20]

We must not abandon the “spirit of Vatican II.”

It’s nonsense to suggest that both liturgies can’t co-exist. I think the Church should leave liturgy options up to the parish priest. If a priest likes the latin mass; let him do the latin mass… But if a priest wants to do a vatican II mass let him do both…

This liturgy wars stuff is bull…

No one liturgy is above the other. I see no reason why they both can’t coexist. Ever since holy father brought back the latin mass all the traditionalists see it as their god given right to throw the church back to the middle ages where the inquisition was around and where we sold indulgences so dead dudes could get to heaven…

You want to be a traditionalist and have your latin mass?! Fine! But don’t force the moderate and liberal wings of the Church to conform to your narrow minded ideas of how Catholicism should be. You got what you wanted. You got your latin mass back. Stop trying to force oldness back down my throat!

Vatican II is hear to stay. The whole thing about moderates and liberal dying off is bull.

I just posted on in Apologetics a post about the evils of capitalism. So far more Catholics posting condemn it than support it.

Liberals and moderates dying off? bull. All of it. Take a ride over to some of the other forums and see for yourself how many other Catholics outside your little narrow minded traditionalist bubble there is.