Is traditional Catholicism on the rise?

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Etamin said:
Lex orandi, lex credendi.
How we pray shapes how and what we believe.

The return of the EF is hoped to have a positive effect on the development of the OF. The first venacular translation of the OF, particularily in English, has been banal at best, and many good and holy practices and prayers were almost abandoned at the transition to the OF. The new translation, Advent 2011, is another step being taken to help bring us closer to our Latin roots.

As this greatest prayer of the Church, the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, was simplified in the OF transition, we also appear to have lost our strong Catholic culture, the pious practices that protected many generations of Catholics in the past.

Come Holy Spirit, fill the hearts of your faithful and incindle in them the fire of your love.

The encouragement and assistance given by Bl. John Paul the Great and Pope Benedict XVI to the celebration of the traditional Latin Mass will, we pray, with time help repair the many errand and heretical beliefs that have crept into the hearts of some, who say they profess the Catholic faith, but in practice dissent from many of her teachings. Many adults in the Church still need to receive a True Catechesis of the faith. Lord have mercy on us.
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I will add a hearty “Amen!” to this prayer.

:highprayer:
 
Matariel said:
I’m a nineteen-year-old convert to the ancient and holy Catholic Church, and I must say, the more reverent, mysterious (in the Christian sense) and glorious the Mass, the better. No Kitschy sing-songs, only solid, ancient hymns, no adlibbing by the priest, only the proper prayers, I prefer kneeling for Communion, and I believe the more incense, candles, statues, and traditional domestic Catholicism (i.e., family rosary and prayers, domestic altar, images of Christ and the saints, crucifixes in the bedroom, etc., things that make a Catholic home sacred).

I think young people are dying to have a Faith with “ancient stability”, I like to say. Something* real*, ancient, and sacred. I think this is why many young people in the Protestant sects go church-hopping and shopping all the time, because they cannot find the sacred.

But a reverent Catholic church can provide that.
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I realize this is an older thread.

I agree with this poster. I am 25, raised Protestant, but I have also searched through every religion to make sure I was where I was supposed to be. I have peace with the Church. I do believe that the attempts to 'appeal" to younger generations just do not work. Orthodox Christianity is on the rise, also, I might add, likely for the same reason. People need stability now more than ever.

I appreciate the posts made by some of the other members who were around for the change. Thank you for your (name removed by moderator)ut. 🙂
 
QUOTE=mrld20;8498388]I’ve said it time and time again… If you would stop saying the latin mass is the only valid mass and I would stop saying the local vatican II mass is the only one then there’d be no liturgy wars…
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I’ve met you half way by saying both can exist. Don’t you dare accuse me of division! It’s you traditionalists who argue we have to only allow the latin mass!
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I’m willing to compromise and allow both as the holy father… I’ve got no problem with traditionalists… What I have a problem is the “my way or the highway” attitude so many of you have. You got your latin mass! But you can’t force the entire Church to readopt the latin mass after 50 years of mass in local languages.
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Your posts, on this thread are quite hateful. You sound very angry about the Pope’s decision to revive the Mass of '62.
You got what you wanted! Isn’t that enough for you people?!
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It is this attitude that makes me wonder about the efficaciousness of the Novus Ordo Church. BTW. Traditional Catholicism is about more than the Liturgy.

It is about “undoing” the blending of the ordained priesthood & the laity. Father is not your “friend”, he is your priest. He carries, at least part of the responsibility for your soul,

Traditional Catholicism is about kneeling to receive our Savior, silence & reverence in Church & the family rosary every evening.

It’s about frequent confession. It’s about Spiritual Bouquets, novenas,
& Angelus Bells. It’s about holy water fonts in your Catholic home…it was filled with reminders of who you are & why you’re on this earth. You have NO IDEA what has been taken from you. I spent my first 28 yrs. in the Church I have described above. These last 40 years in the Church that you follow. I doubt that you’ve even attended the Mass that Catholics prayed for 1500 yrs. (And yes, I know there were some changes, but they were organic & that’s for a whole 'nother thread.)The efficaciousness of the Traditional Latin Mass has been proven over & over again. The effectiveness of the Novus Ordo hasn’t.

Who knows what the future will bring, but at this point, the fruits of the Novus Ordo Church have not been ‘all that great!’
 
CradleCath said:
Your posts, on this thread are quite hateful. You sound very angry about the Pope’s decision to revive the Mass of '62.

It is this attitude that makes me wonder about the efficaciousness of the Novus Ordo Church. BTW. Traditional Catholicism is about more than the Liturgy.

It is about “undoing” the blending of the ordained priesthood & the laity. Father is not your “friend”, he is your priest. He carries, at least part of the responsibility for your soul,

Traditional Catholicism is about kneeling to receive our Savior, silence & reverence in Church & the family rosary every evening.

It’s about frequent confession. It’s about Spiritual Bouquets, novenas,
& Angelus Bells. It’s about holy water fonts in your Catholic home…it was filled with reminders of who you are & why you’re on this earth. You have NO IDEA what has been taken from you. I spent my first 28 yrs. in the Church I have described above. These last 40 years in the Church that you follow. I doubt that you’ve even attended the Mass that Catholics prayed for 1500 yrs. (And yes, I know there were some changes, but they were organic & that’s for a whole 'nother thread.)The efficaciousness of the Traditional Latin Mass has been proven over & over again. The effectiveness of the Novus Ordo hasn’t.

Who knows what the future will bring, but at this point, the fruits of the Novus Ordo Church have not been ‘all that great!’
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This discussion is dangerously close to violating the forum rules.
thomas casey:
It is unfortunate that we are unable to discuss the liturgy and speak charitably to each other or about others. In other words, it seems that every time this subject comes up, it eventually ends up in arguing, labeling people, and labeling the forms of the mass as if they can be pitted against each other like football teams.

Such behavior is beneath the intentions of this forum, the reverence due to the subject and the respect due to others. Therefore, all threads about the OF and EF that derail into name calling, labeling people or dishonor the liturgy by pitting one form over the other shall be closed and the posters run the risk of having their accounts moderated or even closed.

If you want to discuss this topic:
  1. speak about the liturgy with due honor, regardless of what form you prefer;
  2. DO NOT pit one form against the other;
  3. Refrain from labeling either the form or the individuals who appreciate one or the other.
  4. Bullying will not be tolerated.
If you encounter any problem of this sort in future discussions, please inform me ASAP.

In the unlikely event that it is too difficult to observe these rules, we can always place a moratorium on all discussions about EF and OF, on the TC forum, until cooler heads prevail.
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In response to many of these comments regarding the No and TLM, I can only tell you how my love affair with Catholicism began. In 1956, I was 12 years old and had been raised in the New Age tradition. I knew nothing about Catholicism. A revolution had just occured in Hungary, crushed by the Soviet Union and forcing many people to flee for their lives. A Hungarian friend of my mother(also Hungarian) had a 12 year-old nephew who took part in the revolution and was under sentence of death by the Russians. He had gotten out of Hungary, leaving his parents behind and fleeing through Austria, eventually reaching the United States. My mother’s friend was elderly and could not take care of a 12 year-old. So, she asked my parents if he could stay with us. So Geza (his name) came to live with us. He spoke no English, I, no Hungarian. But, as children often do, we were somehow able to communicate. In spite of being born and raised under Communism, he was devoutly Catholic. He got himself up early every Sunday and walked three miles to Our Lady of Sorrows in Palm Springs, California. One Sunday, he asked me if I wanted to go too. I was curious, so I agreed. Our Lady of Sorrows was an old-fashioned Catholic Church. Statues, candles, altar rail and it smelled of incense and prayer. I was fascinated. To shorten the story, seeds were planted and after years of professed athieism, I was challenged by a good friend about my faith (or lack of it) and the incredible yearning in my heart for God, was brought home by my memories of the comfort and safety that I had experienced in that Church, so many years ago. The reverence and mystery of the Latin Mass, the holiness of that space, all came rushing back and I went from believing nothing…to believing everything. In my athiesm, I had studied the Faith diligently, to disprove it. Now it all made sense and I believed. The Latin Mass still evokes those feeling within me, and though the OF is certainly valid, the Latin Mass is still, for me, the very heart of Catholicism. Sorry for the long post, but for very many of us older folk, it is a matter of the heart.
 
hosemonkey said:
In response to many of these comments regarding the No and TLM, I can only tell you how my love affair with Catholicism began. In 1956, I was 12 years old and had been raised in the New Age tradition. I knew nothing about Catholicism. A revolution had just occured in Hungary, crushed by the Soviet Union and forcing many people to flee for their lives. A Hungarian friend of my mother(also Hungarian) had a 12 year-old nephew who took part in the revolution and was under sentence of death by the Russians. He had gotten out of Hungary, leaving his parents behind and fleeing through Austria, eventually reaching the United States. My mother’s friend was elderly and could not take care of a 12 year-old. So, she asked my parents if he could stay with us. So Geza (his name) came to live with us. He spoke no English, I, no Hungarian. But, as children often do, we were somehow able to communicate. In spite of being born and raised under Communism, he was devoutly Catholic. He got himself up early every Sunday and walked three miles to Our Lady of Sorrows in Palm Springs, California. One Sunday, he asked me if I wanted to go too. I was curious, so I agreed. Our Lady of Sorrows was an old-fashioned Catholic Church. Statues, candles, altar rail and it smelled of incense and prayer. I was fascinated. To shorten the story, seeds were planted and after years of professed athieism, I was challenged by a good friend about my faith (or lack of it) and the incredible yearning in my heart for God, was brought home by my memories of the comfort and safety that I had experienced in that Church, so many years ago. The reverence and mystery of the Latin Mass, the holiness of that space, all came rushing back and I went from believing nothing…to believing everything. In my athiesm, I had studied the Faith diligently, to disprove it. Now it all made sense and I believed. The Latin Mass still evokes those feeling within me, and though the OF is certainly valid, the Latin Mass is still, for me, the very heart of Catholicism. Sorry for the long post, but for very many of us older folk, it is a matter of the heart.
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Thank you for sharing this story. It’s impressive that the 12 year old who stayed with your family would get up early and walk three miles to Mass. I can understand how you would be fascinated and attracted to the mystery, holiness and prayer of an old-fashioned Catholic church and Latin Mass. I like the OF, but the great holiness, mystery and prayerfulness (and devotion) is what attracts me as well to the Latin Mass. I think that the Latin Mass, or certain aspects of it, will slowly make a comeback - God willing. 🙂
 
guanophore said:
You are accused by the words of your own mouth, dear sister. It is you who are so hostile in defending liberalism and modernism. These concepts divide Christ’s One Body.

This is a mighty grand concession of you.

:bowdown:

Your posts appear to indicate otherwise.

It is a good start, for sure, but the purging of modernism will take some time, and a lot more work. Educating persons like yourself who are misinformed about their faith is a tall order. Especially when such persons are quick to find fault with others.

Yes, but modernism and liberalism are not, and never will be.
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Dude I’m a guy… And modernism isn’t going to die…
 
Yeah it will, eventually, when people lift the veils from their eyes to see what terrible damage it’s done.
 
Coming from outside the Church and going through the process of education myself about the faith, I have come to find 2 things:
  1. Vatican II was not meant to be what it has become. It was the local priest/bishops who have gone away with it.
  2. It seems that because of these things, the faith has been watered down. This is the first thing that I noticed when I started coming to the Church. I knew more than the priest did…
 
NorthTexan88 said:
Coming from outside the Church and going through the process of education myself about the faith, I have come to find 2 things:
  1. Vatican II was not meant to be what it has become. It was the local priest/bishops who have gone away with it.
  2. It seems that because of these things, the faith has been watered down. This is the first thing that I noticed when I started coming to the Church. I knew more than the priest did…
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EXACTLY the same way with me. I was disappointed how un-Catholic the Church seemed. It was only after digging in the recesses of the internet and coming to find gems of tradition did I finally make the decision to become Catholic. Yeah, I guess it is a little… selfish of me to have not made my final decision until I found out that there are parts of the Church that are still traditional, but I was merely an uneducated Candidate.

The religions that lose their traditional outward appearances and “extras” are the religions that have no identity, and therefore shrink. Our identity is based ultimately on our faith, but if we can’t “see” that faith through the appearances of it, then our religion, like it or not, fades.
 
YoungTradCath said:
The religions that lose their traditional outward appearances and “extras” are the religions that have no identity, and therefore shrink. Our identity is based ultimately on our faith, but if we can’t “see” that faith through the appearances of it, then our religion, like it or not, fades.
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As long as the “Mass of the Ages” exists, the Church will live. Christ Himself promises it. The “modernist” agenda will fade and die with those who promulgate it. History and time have always proven that the harder the Church is oppressed, the stonger it becomes, wether the opression comes from within, or without. Those who would hope that that the Church would become “less Catholic” will be disappointed, because people will always yearn for the majesty and mystery of God. Those are luke-warm will fade away and create new religions for themselves, even call themselves “Catholic.” But they are not Catholic, they are only protestants in their hearts. May God protect and preserve our Holy Father. He sees what is needed, we should pray for him and Bishops like him, and may the enemies of the Church, both within and without, perish in oblivion. I will, of course, pray for their conversion, before it is too late.
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YoungTradCath said:
EXACTLY the same way with me. I was disappointed how un-Catholic the Church seemed. It was only after digging in the recesses of the internet and coming to find gems of tradition did I finally make the decision to become Catholic. Yeah, I guess it is a little… selfish of me to have not made my final decision until I found out that there are parts of the Church that are still traditional, but I was merely an uneducated Candidate.

The religions that lose their traditional outward appearances and “extras” are the religions that have no identity, and therefore shrink. Our identity is based ultimately on our faith, but if we can’t “see” that faith through the appearances of it, then our religion, like it or not, fades.
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Well we think the exact same way lol. I am actually planning to go to my first Latin Mass next Sunday. I already pray the Rosary/Divine Mercy in Latin so it shouldnt be that foreign 😃

I agree, I think if we dont try to change some things, eventually it will just feel like we are another protestant denomination in feel and in attitude…even though we are much, much, much more than that. Uncovering the traditions of the church is also a big reason why I decided to totally commit, and also having the support of many other tradional Catholics my age around me.
 
hosemonkey said:
As long as the “Mass of the Ages” exists, the Church will live. Christ Himself promises it. The “modernist” agenda will fade and die with those who promulgate it. History and time have always proven that the harder the Church is oppressed, the stonger it becomes, wether the opression comes from within, or without. Those who would hope that that the Church would become “less Catholic” will be disappointed, because people will always yearn for the majesty and mystery of God. Those are luke-warm will fade away and create new religions for themselves, even call themselves “Catholic.” But they are not Catholic, they are only protestants in their hearts. May God protect and preserve our Holy Father. He sees what is needed, we should pray for him and Bishops like him, and may the enemies of the Church, both within and without, perish in oblivion. I will, of course, pray for their conversion, before it is too late.
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Very well said:)

Especially the last part, I pray for that more than anything else.
 
Thank you for your support. If you are on a journey into the Catholic Church, or if you are re-discovering your Faith, you will find wonders that you have merely dreamed of. The Church has a store of spiritual riches for you that you cannot imagine. She is a Home and a Mother and a Mother that takes care of her children. Please, explore these riches, both in the Ordinary Form and in the Mass of the Ages, and discover for yourself. Study, study, study. Know what the Holy Church teaches, and why. If you do this, your Faith will never be shaken. I pray for you and all young people in the Church, that you may treasure the heritage that you have received. You are the hope of the Church and the ones who will right the wrongs.God bless you.
 
What really hurts my heart is when people on other threads constantly say, “you’re just a small minority” as if that means traditional Catholics don’t matter.

I know it won’t always be that way.
 
TrueLight said:
What really hurts my heart is when people on other threads constantly say, “you’re just a small minority” as if that means traditional Catholics don’t matter.

I know it won’t always be that way.
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I know we’re a minority, but I wouldn’t say a small one. That’s just my personal (name removed by moderator)ut though. I think there are more of us than meets the eye, we just all to often don’t seem to speak up.
 
TrueLight said:
What really hurts my heart is when people on other threads constantly say, “you’re just a small minority” as if that means traditional Catholics don’t matter.

I know it won’t always be that way.
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It is a sad truth that traditional/orthodox Catholics are not only a small minority in societym, but also in the Church. However, God began His fledgling Church with a small minority, and it grew into a giant mustard tree. Remember the words of our Holy Father, that the Church may be smaller in days to come, but more pure. God will spit the lukewarm out of His mouth, and those who do not embrace the doctrines of the faith will, through persecution, be shown before all to be false. Better a small minority of those true to the One Faith, than the millions who call themselves 'catholic" yet reject the Teachings of the Apostles.
 
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