Is Worshipping Allah Idolatrous for Catholics?

[Darryl_B]

I don’t see how we can leap from CC 841 to the conclusion that it’s appropriate to join in Islamic worship - which I think is where the OP was heading.

To the OP, if you pray in English, why would you not use the English word for God? I don’t see the motivation for this.

I very much agree with you on this. The matter of fact of CC 841 should not be used as a license, (no semi automatic gun license granted), it is reading more into than was intended. It would be my faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour that I should be considering in this case.

 

[ephesians2]

A Christian’s God is a Trinitarian God. Father, Son, Holy Spirit.

A Muslim’s god is not. (A practicing Jew’s god is not either. They are blinded and deny Christ as Messiah.)

As a Christian, I do not worship Allah- the false god of a Muslim. Muhammad was Allah’s prophet. The Qu’ran was revealed to Muhammad. A revelation from Allah. The Qu’ran denies Christ deity, His death and His resurrection. Why would Allah, who (as a Roman Catholic would say) is the same God as a Roman Catholic worships, bear false testimony against God the Son and God the Holy Spirit? A Muslim denies Christ as God. You deny Christ, you deny the Father. You deny the Father, you deny the Spirit. You deny God.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

A Christian’s God is a Trinitarian God. Father, Son, Holy Spirit.

A Muslim’s god is not. (A practicing Jew’s god is not either. They are blinded and deny Christ as Messiah.)

As a Christian, I do not worship Allah- the false god of a Muslim. Muhammad was Allah’s prophet. The Qu’ran was revealed to Muhammad. A revelation from Allah. The Qu’ran denies Christ deity, His death and His resurrection. Why would Allah, who (as a Roman Catholic would say) is the same God as a Roman Catholic worships, bear false testimony against God the Son and God the Holy Spirit? A Muslim denies Christ as God. You deny Christ, you deny the Father. You deny the Father, you deny the Spirit. You deny God.

So Jews who stay faithful to the Old Covenant due to their ignorance of Christ are not actually worshipping God? That the Church’s teachings on this is incorrect?

 

[ProdigalSun]

According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Muslims worship the same One God of Catholicism.

That means that Allah and God are the same Point of Adoration for Muslims and Catholics alike.

Anyone who insists on saying anything different to you is going against the official teachings of the Catholic Church … They are whispering evil suggestions to stain your soul with hatred.
Beware those people, no matter what religious affiliations they have…

It is true that the Church teaches that Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the God of Abraham. But don’t stop there Servant19, The Church also teaches that although Jews and Muslims worship the God they do not have a correct understanding of who God is. The Jewish faith still has a Old Trestament understanding of God not the revealed truth of the New Testament God that the Christian CHurch has. As for the Islamic understanding of God it is a very corrupt understanding of who God is. So no do not worship within a Islamic context for it is not correct and may create errors in your own thinking if you are not firm in your faith. If you are (firm in your faith) and wish only to observe I don’t think there is anything wrong with that as long as this act does not bring on scandal to others.

Anyone who insists that it is alright to worship God in an Islamic Context is whispering evil suggestions that will stain your soul with sin and cause you to move away from Christ.

Beware of this type of person for they are wolves in sheeps clothing.

Peace:thumbsup:

 

[oldcatholicguy]

It is true that the Church teaches that Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the God of Abraham. But don’t stop there Servant19, The Church also teaches that although Jews and Muslims worship the same God they do not have a correct understanding of who God is. The Jewish faith still has a Old Trestament understanding of God not the revealed truth of the New Testament God that the Christian CHurch has. As for the Islamic understanding of God it is a very corrupt understanding of who God is. So no do not worship within a Islamic context for it is not correct and may create errors in your own thinking if you are not firm in your faith. If you are and wish only to observe I don’t think ther is anything wrong with that as long as this act does not bring on scandal.

Anyone who insists that it is alright to worship God in an Islamic Context is whispering evil suggestions that will stain your soul with sin and cause you to move away from Christ.

Beware of this type of person for they are wolves in sheeps clothing.

Peace:thumbsup:

Agreed. The Church teaching that Muslims the same God we do does not equate to the Church teaching that Islam is as valid or truthful as Catholicism. Those are two different subjects with two completely different answers.

 

[ProdigalSun]

Agreed. The Church teaching that Muslims the same God we do does not equate to the Church teaching that Islam is as valid or truthful as Catholicism. Those are two different subjects with two completely different answers.

Cheers brother:thumbsup:

From a middleagedcatholicguy

 

[ephesians2]

So Jews who stay faithful to the Old Covenant due to their ignorance of Christ are not actually worshipping God? That the Church’s teachings on this is incorrect?

Do the practicing Jews worship Christ as their Lord and Savior? No. That is why those who received the Gospel of Jesus Christ were told to Go and Preach it when Christ pronounced the Great Commission. Jesus Christ did not say, “Go and Preach the gospel only to the people who *aren’t *ignorantly serving a god they think is Me because all the rest of the people are atleast *ignorantly *worshipping me even though they reject me.” “And remember to only baptize in the name of the Father if you come across a practicing Jew or Muslim because that is good enough to get them into heaven.” But I think I am getting off topic as there were warnings already.

God can save whom He chooses. He can save a Muslim or practicing Jew by revealing Who He is, but then the Muslim or practicing Jew would cease to be those religions as they deny WHO God really is and they deny the Way, Truth and Life-the ONLY way to the Father. Personally, I have a great love and desire for Muslims (and all who reject Jesus) to come to know Jesus as their Lord and Savior. I do not wish to spread hate or to be hateful towards any religion, as some have suggested in this thread. (I think sometimes disagreeing is mistaken for intolerance in today’s day) I just want to spread the reason for the hope that is within me- Jesus and His work on the Cross and His victory over death. Because I bear the name Christian, I am called to do just that. I am not ashamed.

But to stay on OP topic, I would think it would be idolatrous for a Catholic to worship a God that supposedly spoke against the Savior Jesus Christ.

 

[Matthew_Light]

But to stay on OP topic, I would think it would be idolatrous for a Catholic to worship a God that supposedly spoke against the Savior Jesus Christ.

It would be idolatrous if that were the case.

But the Qur’an praises Jesus, calls Him the Word of God and the Spirit of God, proclaims the reality of the virgin birth, raises His mother Mary to the highest station among women, and recognizes Christians as followers of the One True God.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

Do the practicing Jews worship Christ as their Lord and Savior? No. That is why those who received the Gospel of Jesus Christ were told to Go and Preach it when Christ pronounced the Great Commission. Jesus Christ did not say, “Go and Preach the gospel only to the people who *aren’t *ignorantly serving a god they think is Me because all the rest of the people are atleast *ignorantly *worshipping me even though they reject me.” “And remember to only baptize in the name of the Father if you come across a practicing Jew or Muslim because that is good enough to get them into heaven.” But I think I am getting off topic as there were warnings already.

God can save whom He chooses. He can save a Muslim or practicing Jew by revealing Who He is, but then the Muslim or practicing Jew would cease to be those religions as they deny WHO God really is and they deny the Way, Truth and Life-the ONLY way to the Father. Personally, I have a great love and desire for Muslims (and all who reject Jesus) to come to know Jesus as their Lord and Savior. I do not wish to spread hate or to be hateful towards any religion, as some have suggested in this thread. (I think sometimes disagreeing is mistaken for intolerance in today’s day) I just want to spread the reason for the hope that is within me- Jesus and His work on the Cross and His victory over death. Because I bear the name Christian, I am called to do just that. I am not ashamed.

But to stay on OP topic, I would think it would be idolatrous for a Catholic to worship a God that supposedly spoke against the Savior Jesus Christ.

So in other words the Church’s teachings that Jews worship the same God we do is wrong. I’ll get on the phone and let the Holy Father know.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

It would be idolatrous if that were the case.

But the Qur’an praises Jesus, calls Him the Word of God and the Spirit of God, proclaims the reality of the virgin birth, raises His mother Mary to the highest station among women, and recognizes Christians as followers of the One True God.

Not recognizing Christ as the Son of God is a rather biggie that can’t really be ignored.

 

[Bannan]

I’m not sure if Allah and God are the same maybe somebody can clarify that for me. Would it be idolatrous for Catholics to worship Allah in Islamic rituals? For example is it wrong to use a prayer quilt and practice Islamic prayer?

Back to the source of the question.
“I’m not sure if Allah and God are the same maybe somebody can clarify that for me.”

According to the catechism, on a basic level, yes.

Muslim’s Allah and Catholic’s God are the same insomuch as both phrases indicate the same entity. But, the metaphorical image of God that muslim belief paints is indeed “muddier” than what the Catholic faith paints. This is primarily because muslim faith does not recognize Jesus or the Holy Spirit, and many other errors besides.

“Would it be idolatrous for Catholics to worship Allah in Islamic rituals?”

Following from our earlier train of thought, since Allah and Catholics worship the same God, no it is not “idolatrous” to worship “Allah” in Islamic rituals. Idolatry is putting another idol before God, and obviously since Allah is the same as God (in the context of your question) idolatry would not be the sin committed here.

“For example is it wrong to use a prayer quilt and practice Islamic prayer?”

I’ll assume by “is it wrong” you mean “is it sinful”. Sin ultimately is choosing a lesser good, and I’m sure you’ve heard it said, “The road to hell is paved with good intentions.” God left heavens with a thundering voice which commands the mountains to enter into Mary a helpless babe, incarnate of the Holy Spirit. He who cannot be contained, yet was alive in Mary’s womb became fully human to show us how to love, live, die, to show us who he is and what’s more, to fulfill his Holy Catholic Church by giving us the sacraments. Out of sheer volume of love for us, he determinedly pursued his human life for this one purpose.

It’s not wrong to use a prayer quilt and practice Islamic prayer if this expression is the most Catholic ( means “universal” ) expression of worship you are capable of. But, as a Roman Catholic, you should have a greater good which should be chosen, and I would add, be accountable for in judgement. If you do not have this understanding then you are not accountable for it. However you pray ask for guidance and do not harden your heart. Those who seek him will find him, but I think many who think they are seeking him have lied to themselves and are instead seeking their own pursuits.

I believe that as a Catholic, if you are diligent you can come to know and understand who God is better than most. This understanding serves as a help against misunderstanding sown by the evil one, but “understanding” in this context does not equate to theoretical knowledge or mathematical equation. By “understanding” I mean to imply a disposition of your heart in relation to God and to others, for the more you know God the more humble and obedient to his will you become, and the less you follow your own will. I hope this helps, and please do keep me in your prayers.

Oh yeah, and “Pray always, without ceasing.”

Good luck.

 

[hasantas]

Muslims believe in a god, but not Thee True God. They do not worship the Triune God, they worship a false god. A god that denies Christ as Savior.

Jesus was explaining to the Jewish leaders WHO He was when He said, “I am going away, and you will seek me, and you will die in your sin. Where I am going, you cannot come.”

The leaders were perplexed, so Christ explained His statement, "“You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. I told you that you would die in your sins, for *unless you believe that I am he *you will die in your sins.”

Jesus goes on in the passage to claim that if one holds to His teaching, the person is "truly [His] disciple and the person would “know the truth”. What “truth”? Christ dialogs with the leaders who claim to be “children of Abraham”. They said, “Abraham is our father.” Christ replies, ““If you were Abraham’s children, you would be doing the works Abraham did…” Jesus goes on to say, ““If God were your Father, you would love me…” He finishes with, " Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear [the words of God] is that you are not of God.”

A little further down Christ talks about His sheep hearing His voice- His sheep know His voice. A Muslim denies Christ’s deity and they deny the Cross. They deny the resurrection. They make the Savior out as a liar. Are they hearing His voice? No. So they are not His sheep and do not know the “truth” therefore they are not set free by Him.

A Muslim can be drawn to Christ by the Father and receive Him as Savior (and cease to be Muslim), but without Christ there is no salvation. You deny the CHRIST the Son, you deny the Father. I as a Christian, do not worship the god of Islam.

Muslim do not deny Jesus. Jesus is savior as other prophets. İf someone reject Jesus he will lose his faith that this is so obvious. But Gospels were written by saints after Jesus. Saints are humanbeing. Even some Haidths writer could mix and add their apprehension to Hadiths that can be understand by a carefuly look. And verses from God are so wide that everyone can understand in different ways. So we do not understand Gospels as you do.

Muslims do not deny cross and resurrection. We see cross in a different way which is explained in Quran. Resurrection is valid for all mankinds. For Jesus is also that Jesus will come world again and do his job and work for faith.

The main ritual of İslam is Salat. İn fact Salat was a ritual for all prophets but in different way. There are all kinds of worshiping(physical, moral, spirit) in Salat which will take a long to tell here. Millions İslamic Saints(Evliya) see some kinds of Angels on ritual of Salat in Heavens that Salat is a High divine ritual. To perfom Salat would be your choice, you have no obligation. Because it is supposition for Muslims. Salvation is by faith but ritual make faith strong and alive. Perhaps for not being İslamic ritual but as main ritual for God.

 

[rinnie]

I’m not sure if Allah and God are the same maybe somebody can clarify that for me. Would it be idolatrous for Catholics to worship Allah in Islamic rituals? For example is it wrong to use a prayer quilt and practice Islamic prayer?

The word Allah means The One God. The One God is believed to be the God of Abraham to Jews, Christians and Muslims.

The problem is not the One God they worship it is the same One God we worship, simply because as we both know there is only One God, Jesus Christ the Father Almighty.

The problem is the only thing we really have in common with them is the One God we worship. It is how we go about living out our faith and what our faith teachers where the problems begin.

We go by the teachings of Christ and his Church, they go by a false prophet Muhammad.

We can only hope that some day we can be an example of Christ, enough to get them to truly investigate the truth of Muhammad and Christ. It is then they will come to realize through the true God they pray to, what his truth is.

And we can all come together in Christ and through Christ to become Christlike.

 

[Ontheway]

Logically speaking, if there are three monotheistic religions, ie religions that recognize that there is only one God, they all acknowledge that one God.
If only one God exists, and all three religions believe that there is only one God, then it stands to reason that they all believe in the same God. Since there is NO OTHER GOD, they all believe in the same God.

This is probably what the CCC is saying.
Claiming that the Muslims believe in a different God is suggesting that there are many Gods, and the CCC certainly cant’ state that.
One God and three monotheistic religions, hence they all believe in that one God.

What they do with this faith is a different matter.

 

[rinnie]

Muslims believe in a god, but not Thee True God. They do not worship the Triune God, they worship a false god. A god that denies Christ as Savior.

Jesus was explaining to the Jewish leaders WHO He was when He said, “I am going away, and you will seek me, and you will die in your sin. Where I am going, you cannot come.”

The leaders were perplexed, so Christ explained His statement, "“You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. I told you that you would die in your sins, for *unless you believe that I am he *you will die in your sins.”

Jesus goes on in the passage to claim that if one holds to His teaching, the person is "truly [His] disciple and the person would “know the truth”. What “truth”? Christ dialogs with the leaders who claim to be “children of Abraham”. They said, “Abraham is our father.” Christ replies, ““If you were Abraham’s children, you would be doing the works Abraham did…” Jesus goes on to say, ““If God were your Father, you would love me…” He finishes with, " Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear [the words of God] is that you are not of God.”

A little further down Christ talks about His sheep hearing His voice- His sheep know His voice. A Muslim denies Christ’s deity and they deny the Cross. They deny the resurrection. They make the Savior out as a liar. Are they hearing His voice? No. So they are not His sheep and do not know the “truth” therefore they are not set free by Him.

A Muslim can be drawn to Christ by the Father and receive Him as Savior (and cease to be Muslim), but without Christ there is no salvation. You deny the CHRIST the Son, you deny the Father. I as a Christian, do not worship the god of Islam.

Mulims believe in the One God the Father Almighty the maker of heaven and earth. The God of Abraham.

Do you believe in the God of Abraham, do you believe in the One God creater of heaven and earth.

If so how can he be different.

That is like saying if I pray to God the Father I deny God the Son, and God the Holy SPirit. It is impossible to do that. For there is ONE GOD.

The problem here is how do we explain to them God is one in three persons in the Trinity when we truly don’t even understand it perfectly. It is a Mystery revealed to us by Christ.

We know this to be true only because God revealed this to us through his Grace. That is the only way they will come to see it.

When God is ready to reveal it to them. But for now why can’t we come together especially through this Lenten Season, just once through our prayer to the ONE GOD they we both adore and worship and glorify.

God will reveal the truth to them when HE feels they are ready to hear it.

Det. 29:29

 

[rinnie]

Logically speaking, if there are three monotheistic religions, ie religions that recognize that there is only one God, they all acknowledge that one God.
If only one God exists, and all three religions believe that there is only one God, then it stands to reason that they all believe in the same God. Since there is NO OTHER GOD, they all believe in the same God.

This is probably what the CCC is saying.
Claiming that the Muslims believe in a different God is suggesting that there are many Gods, and the CCC certainly cant’ state that.
One God and three monotheistic religions, hence they all believe in that one God.

What they do with this faith is a different matter.

The CCC is not saying that if Muslims believe in a different God it suggests there are different gods. The Church knows there are different gods in many faiths. We call them false gods. Many people worship the devil and he is their god a false god.

You do not hear the CCC say Budda is the One God.

THe reason the CCC states they worship the one true God is because they do. The SAME God as us. Its quite clear.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

Muslim do not deny Jesus. Jesus is savior as other prophets. İf someone reject Jesus he will lose his faith that this is so obvious. But Gospels were written by saints after Jesus. Saints are humanbeing. Even some Haidths writer could mix and add their apprehension to Hadiths that can be understand by a carefuly look. And verses from God are so wide that everyone can understand in different ways. So we do not understand Gospels as you do.

For us Christians that is denying Jesus. The core of Christianity is that Jesus wasn’t just another prophet. Let me try it this way- I don’t hold that Muhammad was a prophet. I think he was a good man who tried to do what he thought was good things, but he wasn’t a prophet. According to what I understand about Islam I would be denying who Muhammad was even though I felt he was a good person and tried to do good things. What Islam teaches about Jesus is still a denial of who He was.

 

[rinnie]

Yes…I am aware of what the CCC says. All 841 says is that muslims are monotheistic.

God is our savior. If you could get a muslim to say that…it would convince many that they do worship the SAME God.

Read it again. It says TOGETHER WITH US worship the one true God.

 

[rinnie]

Yes but it does say “THE God” rather than “A God”

.

You are right servant. It says indeed together with us adore the ONE TRUE GOD.

They believe in the God of Abraham the same as us. They pray to the God of Abraham the same as us.

There is no wrong in the way they pray, or the prayers they pray to God our Father he hears and welcomes prayers from all.

The problem as I stated is the understand of the teachings of the One True God is where we differ. Not in our prayers and our Love and trust for our God.

 

[rinnie]

For us Christians that is denying Jesus. The core of Christianity is that Jesus wasn’t just another prophet. Let me try it this way- I don’t hold that Muhammad was a prophet. I think he was a good man who tried to do what he thought was good things, but he wasn’t a prophet. According to what I understand about Islam I would be denying who Muhammad was even though I felt he was a good person and tried to do good things. What Islam teaches about Jesus is still a denial of who He was.

This is true. They do not have the fullness of the truth of the One True God being the Father Son and Holy Spirit. But because they do not have the true understanding of who the One true God is in no means make him false.

The Jews do not see God as Christ. Does that make him false.

To be perfectly honest Father Abraham never even knew God in the Trinity. God was not revealed to us as the Father until Christ came and revealed it to us. Because if Father Abraham taught it to us the Jews would understand the Trinity also.

To say the Muslim God is false, and the Jewish God is false, would mean we also have a false god,

It was through God the Son that we got to know the fullness of the One God in the Trinity.

The easiest way I myself understand God in the Trinity is this. Not as plural gods which is impossible,. But I look at God in the Trinity this way. (again my private interpretation)

To me God the Father is showing me God as the keeper of the sheep, as a child sees her daddy, her protecter, who loves here beyond all means. No matter what. Will never leave you hanging.

To me God the Son is showing me a different side of the Father, the softer part of God, the one who suffers with us. Who is God not up there in the sky, but comming down and showing us the more human side of God.

God the Holy Spirit is the more private part of God who lives in me, who I carry night and day, Who I please, and displease. The Holy Spirit to me is the most hidden part of God who is not visible in sight, but is visible in our soul and our teaching of the Church. To me it is God the Holy Spirit who is more visible now teaching in the Church.

God could have been a flower if he chose to be. God can be anything he wants.

But God did not choose to be a flower, or car, or puppy. He revealed himself as the Father Son and Holy Spirit.

He revealed himself as the One true God to Abraham, to me the voice in the O.T.
In the N.T. he revealed himself as the voice that become flesh. As the bible says first the word then the word became flesh. God revealed himself as human and Divine.

Now he is Human, Divine and being carried in our heart and acts and comes alive through his Holy SPirit only if we let him.