Islam as a system of life

[Aydan]

if that is true then please send that message to the government’s of Saudi Arabia and Iran as well as every other Muslim country and tell them to quit killing Christians and people who convert to Christianity and leave Islam.

**The original post was about the Muslims taking over the world. I know that the Muslims have many wrong beliefs and notions. All they need is a freedom to practice their faith fully without any restrictions. But at the same time the Muslims should not try for any political upheaval. In fact they need not organise against any established Government.

If ever they do, they will be in much trouble. It would be illegal to do any subversive act. They need not demand anything in the western countries but rather accept whatever is offered and whatever is allowed. They are like guests in those countries. It is not fit for any guest to demand anything. I will soon describe another scenerio, different to the one that OP had presented. (Continued…)**

 

[Aydan]

How are you supposed to distinguish what is real and what is fake? No thanks I would rather stake my eternal life on the word of Jesus the son of God rather than the words of Mohammed.

**The subject is drifting to the coming of the Messiah. That is mentioned in the Hadith with an oath of Allah that Messaih (son of Maryam) wiil come in the Ummah of Muhammad. But the rest of that Hadith indicates that it will not be the same Messiah (Jesus son of Mary). It will be some one else from the Ummah of Muhammad.

This can easily be proved by seeing the words of that authentic Hadith. All the works mentioned in that hadith about the coming of the Messiah are symbolic (not literal). So Messiah is also symbolic. The prophet told his companions “By the One in whose hands is my life, Surely the Isa son of Mary will land amongst YOU…” That word you is also symbolic because it does not mean the companions of the prophet.

About Imam Mahdi, it is necessary to know that Mahdi will not wage any bloody war. Also, the Hadith that I mentioned above tells that when the Messiah will come then there will be no wars (Yadha al Harb.). It does not mean that there will be no wars after a big battle with the anti-christ.

So the proper Islamic teachings are telling that the same old Jesus, the messenger of God to the Israelis, will never come back in this rotten world again. He was a Messiah to the Israelis. Now only a Messiah is needed for the muslims and he will be from the muslim Ummah. It is the Muslims who are mostly misled. So they need guidance. The other nations will also be guided in time when Muslims are guided. (More later).**

 

[R_not]

Muslims do believe that Jesus is only a prophet but they call him Messiah because they believe although he wasn’t begotten from God his birth was still a miracle. According to Islam it is not Jesus who will be the final judge it is God himself. I actually heard a Muslim say that God will actually ask Jesus if he told people to worship him and they claim that Jesus will say no I never told them to do that and they claim that Jesus never actually said he was the son of God they claim he only said he was a Son of Man. Actually I heard a Muslim say that every prayer said to Jesus on the day of judgment will be worthless and as he put it blow away like tissue paper. I guess with the implication being we are all going to hell because we prayed to Jesus as the son of God so that’s why Muslims are not Christian and it’s also why I am not a Muslim. There is also one more important distinction here Muslims believe that Jesus was only sent to bring the message of God to the Jewish people and not anyone else and they claim that is why God sent Mohammed as a final messenger to bring the message of God in the form of the Koran to everyone who is not Jewish. By the way I heard all this from a former Christian who converted to Islam so that’s how I know all of this information. The guy tries to convince people to leave Christianity and become Muslim.

To tell you the truth - islam has predestination - so even their prayers might be for naught. This is why their whole community celebrates over shahid (martyrs dying while killing infidels) because they can claim up to 70 people to be saved. I guess that bypasses predestination.

 

[R_not]

How are you supposed to distinguish what is real and what is fake? No thanks I would rather stake my eternal life on the word of Jesus the son of God rather than the words of Mohammed.

Here is the guideline for what is real and what is fake - if the muslim you are discussing with at the time doesn’t like something then that is fake. If they do like it then it is real.

The muslims doing da’wa don’t like you to post the violent, nasty passages of the koran and hadiths - so those will be fake. They don’t want to have to defend the imperialistic nature of islam. They don’t want to have to say 'your infidel lands are dar al harb - the lands of war - and war is ‘opening up the world to islam’ and not really that bad…

 

[Aydan]

Oh yeah there’s one more important thing I forgot. Muslims also believe in Resurrection but in their version God resurrects everyone on the day of judgment and then judges them on the basis of all the good deeds they’ve done as well as the bad deeds. If a person has more good deeds they go to heaven if they don’t they go to hell. Muslims believe that every person has two angels one to record your good deeds and one to record your bad ones.

Muslims do believe that Jesus is only a prophet but they call him Messiah because they believe although he wasn’t begotten from God his birth was still a miracle. According to Islam it is not Jesus who will be the final judge it is God himself. I actually heard a Muslim say that God will actually ask Jesus if he told people to worship him and they claim that Jesus will say no I never told them to do that and they claim that Jesus never actually said he was the son of God they claim he only said he was a Son of Man. Actually I heard a Muslim say that every prayer said to Jesus on the day of judgment will be worthless and as he put it blow away like tissue paper. I guess with the implication being we are all going to hell because we prayed to Jesus as the son of God so that’s why Muslims are not Christian and it’s also why I am not a Muslim. There is also one more important distinction here Muslims believe that Jesus was only sent to bring the message of God to the Jewish people and not anyone else and they claim that is why God sent Mohammed as a final messenger to bring the message of God in the form of the Koran to everyone who is not Jewish. By the way I heard all this from a former Christian who converted to Islam so that’s how I know all of this information. The guy tries to convince people to leave Christianity and become Muslim.

 

[Aydan]

interesting I’ve never heard that before. Although I have heard that martyrs themselves go straight to heaven.

To tell you the truth - islam has predestination - so even their prayers might be for naught. This is why their whole community celebrates over shahid (martyrs dying while killing infidels) because they can claim up to 70 people to be saved. I guess that bypasses predestination.

 

[Aydan]

Here is the guideline for what is real and what is fake - if the muslim you are discussing with at the time doesn’t like something then that is fake. If they do like it then it is real.

The muslims doing da’wa don’t like you to post the violent, nasty passages of the koran and hadiths - so those will be fake. They don’t want to have to defend the imperialistic nature of islam. They don’t want to have to say 'your infidel lands are dar al harb - the lands of war - and war is ‘opening up the world to islam’ and not really that bad…

Well that’s convenient I’ve never heard of that one either. One of the things that always gets me is they say that Jesus never actually says that he is the son of God in the Bible instead he says he is the son of man which they use for justification to say he is not the son of God. I’ve heard a lot of former Christians who are now Muslims make that argument and I am never quite sure how to respond to that. It strikes me as funny how Muslims say that God is all-powerful but then Jesus can not be God and my question is if God is all-powerful and can do anything he wants then why can’t Jesus be divine?

 

[R_not]

interesting I’ve never heard that before. Although I have heard that martyrs themselves go straight to heaven.

This is an hour long - but worth it. Walid is a Palestinian ex-muslim (PLO) born and raised in the environment and is the best source I know for what is going on with the Palestinians.

Walid Shoebat Shoebat’s experiences with what he was taught in islam..
Select the program that says, Talking It Over, PART 1 December 13, 2008.

There are obviously other sources for this information on predestination, but here is one source: islam_doc

It also goes into the other theological things in islam.

You won’t hear this from the muslims on these threads. I am surprised - they must be ashamed of it - or else they would have brought it up quite often.

Keep in mind that all of their theological ‘things’ are not very clear.

Good works are a part of it and it doesn’t specify how many, what kind or if doing them bypasses predestination.

This is part of the reason why islam can be debunked so easily. There are many more reasons, but this is something I found interesting.

To me this is just one of many reasons why they don’t want muslims reading their texts. If they did a lot more would be leaving islam.

 

[Aydan]

I just finished listening to the show and all I can say is WOW! I was stunned when he said your job is to kill me because I left Islam and the Muslim goes yeah that’s right. My jaw hit the floor. I thought it was funny that they’re sending the truck driver a copy of the book. I was astonished that somebody called in from Saudi Arabia too! Everybody should hear this show.

This is an hour long - but worth it. Walid is a Palestinian ex-muslim (PLO) born and raised in the environment and is the best source I know for what is going on with the Palestinians.

Walid Shoebat Shoebat’s experiences with what he was taught in islam..
Select the program that says, Talking It Over, PART 1 December 13, 2008.

There are obviously other sources for this information on predestination, but here is one source: islam_doc

It also goes into the other theological things in islam.

You won’t hear this from the muslims on these threads. I am surprised - they must be ashamed of it - or else they would have brought it up quite often.

Keep in mind that all of their theological ‘things’ are not very clear.

Good works are a part of it and it doesn’t specify how many, what kind or if doing them bypasses predestination.

This is part of the reason why islam can be debunked so easily. There are many more reasons, but this is something I found interesting.

To me this is just one of many reasons why they don’t want muslims reading their texts. If they did a lot more would be leaving islam.

 

[R_not]

I just finished listening to the show and all I can say is WOW! I was stunned when he said your job is to kill me because I left Islam and the Muslim goes yeah that’s right. My jaw hit the floor. I thought it was funny that they’re sending the truck driver a copy of the book. I was astonished that somebody called in from Saudi Arabia too! Everybody should hear this show.

That is exactly what it says in the koran and the muslims on these threads are NOT being honest about that.

But we should not be surprised about that when the koran sanctions deception! and commands them to make us not understand the koran.

intentionally deceiving us to know the koran: 6:25 6:110 17:45-76

 

[Aydan]

I have read the entire koran. with the exception of the last chapter so I knew that phrase was in there but I always assumed I was misinterpreting the meaning of it. You know the same way that some Christians think Catholics worship Mary or saints because they misunderstand our teachings. So I always assumed I was not aware of its actual meaning.

That is exactly what it says in the koran and the muslims on these threads are NOT being honest about that.

But we should not be surprised about that when the koran sanctions deception! and commands them to make us not understand the koran.

intentionally deceiving us to know the koran: 6:25 6:110 17:45-76

 

[R_not]

I have read the entire koran. with the exception of the last chapter so I knew that phrase was in there but I always assumed I was misinterpreting the meaning of it. You know the same way that some Christians think Catholics worship Mary or saints because they misunderstand our teachings. So I always assumed I was not aware of its actual meaning.

heh heh heh - ya gotta read this!! Make sure you are firmly in your seat - this one is a kicker!

hypocracies in islam

The above website is an article that really goes into some of the depravities of islam! I mean there is stuff in there that I just learned by reading it recently - they actually believe the black stone is conscious - I mean how many times have we heard that WE worship statues and tried to explain to them that we do not and those statues and pictures are art (sometiems poor art, but art nonetheless!).

We hear Muslims believe the Black Stone circled in Mecca is conscious and will testify for and against them on Judgment Day (though they will deny it, the stone and ritual is based on a pagan deity). Meanwhile Muslims all over the world gleefully bring down ‘un-Islamic’ idols, statues, and figures representing deities in other religions. The physical manifestation of Allah, in the form of a conscience stone, is an important core of Muslims’ connection with deity

I almost fell off my seat when I read this.

But, read the whole thing - and the violence and depravity in islam while they put good and virtuous words around these actions and thoughts is just mind-boggling.

 

[Aydan]

Say WHAT? I can not wait to read the rest of this web site! I can not believe I almost converted to Islam prior to becoming Catholic mainly because I was baptized Catholic but not raised in the faith at all so I had no concept of who Jesus was or even God for that matter until five years ago when my friend brought me into the church. The funny part of it is at the time when I was considering Islam the only thing that kept me from converting was that I didn’t think disabled people could be Muslims thanks be to God I did not convert and for good friends!

heh heh heh - ya gotta read this!! Make sure you are firmly in your seat - this one is a kicker!

hypocracies in islam

The above website is an article that really goes into some of the depravities of islam! I mean there is stuff in there that I just learned by reading it recently - they actually believe the black stone is conscious - I mean how many times have we heard that WE worship statues and tried to explain to them that we do not and those statues and pictures are art (sometiems poor art, but art nonetheless!).

I almost fell off my seat when I read this.

But, read the whole thing - and the violence and depravity in islam while they put good and virtuous words around these actions and thoughts is just mind-boggling.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

Salaam/peace

… I would rather stake my eternal life on the word of Jesus the son of God rather than the words of Mohammed.

That’s fine

There is no compulsion is religion.

To you be your Way, and to me mine ( Quran: 109:6)

btw , Quran is not the words of Muhammed (p) , it’s the final holy book of God Almighty.

 

[Aydan]

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

Salaam/peace

That’s fine

There is no compulsion is religion.

To you be your Way, and to me mine ( Quran: 109:6)

btw , Quran is not the words of Muhammed (p) , it’s the final holy book of God Almighty.

yeah I’m aware that’s what Muslims believe. But if you read what your fellow Muslim wrote which is in fact what I was responding to and that reference I was not referring to the Koran at all I was referring to Mohammed’s writings I forget the Arabic word for them right now but you and I both know that these sayings are also used in Islam as sources. So if you believe I responded incorrectly take it up with your fellow Muslim since I was merely responding to what he had written as I said before I’ve studied Islam So of course I know the Muslims believe their holy book came from God

 

[R_not]

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

Salaam/peace

That’s fine

There is no compulsion is religion.

To you be your Way, and to me mine ( Quran: 109:6)

btw , Quran is not the words of Muhammed (p) , it’s the final holy book of God Almighty.

Once again - ‘there is no compulsion in religion’ is totally not true.

That is what it says in the koran - but the goals of islam is not necessarily to convert us - but to subjugate us. And that is compulsory in islam in order to have their so called ‘peace’. (I don’t see muslim countries as being that peaceful - if you are a woman you are nothing but a thing that is owned by males, if you are subjugated - you have absolutely no rights except to have one’s own religion IF it is accepted by mohammed which is ‘people of the book’ everyone else has to convert or die, and then the issue of slavery - those people have absolutely no rights and if they capture little boys they are castrated either fully or partially)

‘honor killings’ go with no pursuit of the perpetrators because sharia laws don’t care about women being ‘taken care of’ by their male owners.

From the DVD, The Third Jihad, muslim Dr. Zuhdi Jasser:

Abu Jahya al-Libi, Al Qaeda leader
‘According to our belief, the whole world must be under the rule of islam without exception, even a single grain of soil.’

Islamic Law Rally 2007.

• 70,000 to 80,000 turned out in support of sharia

Yousef Khattab, supporter
-‘islam will dominate, this is what it will be.’
-‘We want to see sharia here and it will be. The flag of , “there is no god other than allah, muhammed is the messenger of god”, will be (god willing) on the White House, if thats where we choose it to be. It just takes time, the American people are waking up now.’
-‘There is no compulsion in islam, that means, we cannot force it on you, but we will force islamic (sharia), god willing.’

Abu Mujahid, spokesperson islamic Thinkers Society (ITS)
‘allah does say that the whole world will eventually be under his rule. The rule will come down to where everyone obeys the laws of god (sharia), as simple as that.’

(my comment: all these guys have the same goals as Al Qaeda)

Dr. Zakir Naik
‘In some islamic countries, eg: saudi arabia, etc propogation of other religions is prohibited. Even construction of any place of worship is also prohibited. in koran 3:85, it is mentioned that allah will never accept any religion other than islam therefore knowing that islam is the only true religion we do not allow propogation of any other religion.’

HONOR KILLINGS
-not in the koran, but it is practiced in all countries with sharia and also in muslim communities in our countries.

Shiulie Ghosh, Host, Everywoman, (Al Jazeera, 2007)
‘5,000 girls/women around the world are victims of ‘honor killings’, whether it is because they have been seen talking to a man, refusing an arranged marriage, or even suffering rape. They are murdered for one reason only - they are perceived to have brought shame on their family. And it is after the family that carries out the sentence.’

TWO JIHADIST STRATEGIES

• Violent
• Cultural, or Stealth
  both have the same end goals for non-muslims - sharia laws and subjugation

 

[R_not]

God didn’t have anything to do with the koran - mohammed did.

The koran is full of errors which prove it was thought up by a man who was full of error.

The koran is incoherent and inconsistent.

Understanding the koran

 

[R_not]

Say WHAT? I can not wait to read the rest of this web site! I can not believe I almost converted to Islam prior to becoming Catholic mainly because I was baptized Catholic but not raised in the faith at all so I had no concept of who Jesus was or even God for that matter until five years ago when my friend brought me into the church. The funny part of it is at the time when I was considering Islam the only thing that kept me from converting was that I didn’t think disabled people could be Muslims thanks be to God I did not convert and for good friends!

YES!! Thanks be to God that you did not ‘revert’ to islam.

They actually call it ‘reverting’ to islam.

I say, yes that does make sense. To revert to the state of sin!! And why do I say that - mohammed claimed islam was an Abrahamic religion (which it really is not, but… ) and he broke most of the 10 commandments! So, he redefined sin - halal, haram and shirk. And muslims try to emulate the ‘perfect man’ that they claim mohammed was.

And to emulate him means that it is ok to be…

Muslim spokespersons claim moral purity in their fight against ‘decadent’ Westerners. Indeed, if a Muslim is told an infidel slept with a nine years old girl, they would condemn him for being a pedophile. But mention the Prophet Mohammed slept with a girl of the same age, and watch him overact with all kinds of rationalizations such as ‘girls in those days matured fast’ or ‘it was normal and acceptable in that culture’, etc. Apparently it was also normal in those days to rape a widow the same night you slaughtered her beloved husband in an unprovoked raid. To normal thinking feeling human beings, the phrase ‘most merciful’ would not seem to apply to either of these divinely sanctioned acts by Muhammad, yet somehow that contradiction is lost to Muslims.

hypocracies in islam

here are some more of his traits that they find ‘perfect’.

Adulterer, Bandit, Immoral, Inhuman, Looter, Lecher, Misogynist, Murderer, Materialistic, assasin, Narcissist, Pedophile, Raider, Slavetrader, Sexmaniac, Terrorist, Torturer, Vengeful Warlord.

 

[chrisse]

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

Salaam/peace

That’s fine

There is no compulsion is religion.

To you be your Way, and to me mine ( Quran: 109:6)

btw , Quran is not the words of Muhammed (p) , it’s the final holy book of God Almighty.

Pity that verse is abrogated.

The qur’an is a created book with errors, contradictions and abrogations. And as mohammet himself gave you clue that it was a fake, I’m surprised you’re still falling for it. He said there could be no contradictions/abrogations and be from God Almighty.

Peace

 

[planten]

Pity that verse is abrogated.

The qur’an is a created book with errors, contradictions and abrogations. And as mohammet himself gave you clue that it was a fake, I’m surprised you’re still falling for it. He said there could be no contradictions/abrogations and be from God Almighty.

Peace

**Who says that verse (about no compulsion in religion) is abrogated? God is revealing something and you are abrogating it??.

The only problem is that Muslims are not practicing it. They permit perple to come into the fold of Islam. But the Muslims do not allow any one to leave Islam. That means, they act on the verse of no compulsion only 50%, to their own advantage. But that is a very bad bad practice. The Muslims should mend their understanding of Islam. There is no order (in the Quran) to kill any apostate.

Those who want to leave Islam should be freely allowed to do so, openly and happily, niether in fear nor with unhappy feelings.

**