It's not "his problem"

[PartoftheBody]

Please forgive me if there are a lot of posts like this, but I need some anonymous advice in a Catholic light.

Since we got married last year, my husband has been emotionally abusive off and on. There are times he’s not, and he’s the sweet, considerate guy he was before we were married, but it never seems to last.
What do I mean by emotionally abusive? He does things like call me names “as a joke,” criticizes me often, gives me orders instead of asking me to do things, reveals embarrassing things about me to others if it will make him look better (or sometimes for no reason), makes up stories or lies just to see if he can trick me, blames me for his weight gain despite avoiding my cooking, and screams and curses at me if I criticize something he does, or sometimes even if I just disagree with him or play devil’s advocate.

He rarely takes responsibility for anything he does. Recently, we were flying on an airplane and he knocked over the drink on the tray in front of me. He blamed me for having my drink in his way. When I told him that his blaming me for something that was obviously not my fault upset me, he said I was too sensitive and I "make such a big [expletive] deal about everything." He often gets mad at me when I cry, saying I'm trying to manipulate him (which I'm not; often I'm at a loss for words or scared to express what I think or feel for fear it will make him angry).

If he apologizes, which is pretty rare, his apologies usually are something like “I’m sorry you got upset” not “I’m sorry for what I did.” Unfortunately, this lack of responsibility is not just with me. To my knowledge, he hasn’t gone to Reconciliation since last April. When I ask why he won’t go with me, he says “I don’t need to.”

I’ve tried many things on my own to help the situation. I’ve read a couple books on marriage and temperaments. I try very hard to treat him the way I want him to treat me, in spite of his behavior. After much coaxing several months back, we went on a Marriage Encounter weekend. These things helped for a few weeks, but nothing seems to last.
Things seem to have gotten worse over the last few months. I already see a therapist for depression (which has gotten worse in the last few months, too). I really would like to go to couples counseling, or have him go to individual counseling, but my husband adamantly refuses because he says “I do not have a problem, this is your problem.” When I calmly point out specific situations that indicate that we need help, he either says that I’m too sensitive, the situation didn’t really happen the way I remember, or the situation didn’t happen at all.

I don't want a divorce or annulment. All I want is the man he was before we married to come back to stay. At this point, I don't see how that can happen without professional help. Yet even asking for couples' counseling as a birthday present did not change his refusal. I'm beginning to think the only thing that will make him see this is in fact not just "my problem" is a trial separation.

So here’s where I need advice:

1. How do I convince him to go to counseling without resorting to separation?
2. If I do proceed with a trial separation, what do I tell my loved ones when they ask what is going on? I don’t want to ruin his reputation, but at the same time (and perhaps this is pride on my part) I don’t want it to seem like we had one little fight and I want to split up over it.
3. What do I do if he still refuses counseling after the trial separation?

Thanks for reading my long story

 

[EasterJoy]

You may be seeing the man he was before you married; you just didn’t know it at the time. I can’t say, especially since I am not a professional, but this all sounds far more like behavior that was hidden from you than behaviors that spontaneosly emerged after you married.

Marriage counsellors can help when only one spouse shows up to talk. Find someone to talk to about how to handle your marriage, so you can have someone ask you intelligent questions about all this. You’re describing some intolerable behavior, but teaching you how to navigate it is work for a professional. That’s the route I’d suggest.

 

[Tietjen]

Please forgive me if there are a lot of posts like this, but I need some anonymous advice in a Catholic light.

I feel for you and the situation that you find yourself in; however, I would suggest that rather than ask strangers on the internet what you should do about so important an issue, you speak to your parish priest about the situation and the possibility of a separation. I’ll say a prayer for both of you. God bless.

 

[underacloud]

Yes, please go discuss this with your priest.

Separation is very serious. It may be justified in the case of abuse, and your priest can advise you and help as needed. But it is not weapon to use against your spouse to elicit appropriate behaviour, which seems to be your suggestion. If you separate, you need to be realistic that this is the first step towards civil divorce, and perhaps annulment if appropriate. You say you don’t want these things, so think hard before you start down that road.

 

[Nelka]

Have you prayed a Novena of Rosaries for your marriage?

Prayer is stronger than any counselling you could ever get.

 

[Kindness]

Hi I am an anonymous Catholic on the internet :hey_bud: ! Yes, of course you speak to your PP but this behavior sounds very worrying and not something you can build a marriage upon if he refuses to change. You may end up having to confront the fact that you have to go the route of annulment if you separate. If his true personality and lack of commitment to the marriage were only reveled after the ceremony. I am not suggesting that’s what you do but as the other poster said, you have to think what purpose the separation is supposed to serve. Emotional blackmail won’t cut it, you are seeing your husband in the raw at his most relaxed, being on his best behavior for a few weeks after Marriage Encounter or a separation is unlikely to stick permanently. In fact if you keep going back you teach him it’s only a temporary blimp and then it’s business as usual. Pray, pray, pray and talk to your PP asap.

 

[lily20]

This sounds soo similar to my situation. Yes, my husband yells at me for his own problems. He actually damaged my car and blamed me for it in the same minute. I don’t even understand it.

It’s about control and not growing up. A person who doesn’t know how to take responsibility for their own actions.

So they blame the things around them because of guilt/shame over their error.

I think it’s actually some sort of bad spirit, a spirit of entitlement. I have this too— generationally as well.

You may be able to ward it off with love fasting and prayer. It returns though when you aren’t careful. I am thinking of separation from my husband again. I had a vision the other day of how God sees me and I was shocked. It was so much more beautiful than how my husband treats me. The value of spirit/humanity was indescribable. I was not seeking this revelation at the time, it just came to me. I think it was my guardian angel protecting me.

My husband flat out refused to admit fault after I separated from him last year. He harassed me in court until I was so poor I had no where to turn. The court allowed the harassment because lawyers made money.

God Bless you. Remember our loving spouse Christ who is always our protector even when people can’t always be there.

I wish I had more advice… leaving is tough and not for the faint of heart.

In Christ,
Lily

Please forgive me if there are a lot of posts like this, but I need some anonymous advice in a Catholic light.

Since we got married last year, my husband has been emotionally abusive off and on. There are times he’s not, and he’s the sweet, considerate guy he was before we were married, but it never seems to last.
What do I mean by emotionally abusive? He does things like call me names “as a joke,” criticizes me often, gives me orders instead of asking me to do things, reveals embarrassing things about me to others if it will make him look better (or sometimes for no reason), makes up stories or lies just to see if he can trick me, blames me for his weight gain despite avoiding my cooking, and screams and curses at me if I criticize something he does, or sometimes even if I just disagree with him or play devil’s advocate.

He rarely takes responsibility for anything he does. Recently, we were flying on an airplane and he knocked over the drink on the tray in front of me. He blamed me for having my drink in his way. When I told him that his blaming me for something that was obviously not my fault upset me, he said I was too sensitive and I "make such a big [expletive] deal about everything." He often gets mad at me when I cry, saying I'm trying to manipulate him (which I'm not; often I'm at a loss for words or scared to express what I think or feel for fear it will make him angry).

If he apologizes, which is pretty rare, his apologies usually are something like “I’m sorry you got upset” not “I’m sorry for what I did.” Unfortunately, this lack of responsibility is not just with me. To my knowledge, he hasn’t gone to Reconciliation since last April. When I ask why he won’t go with me, he says “I don’t need to.”

I’ve tried many things on my own to help the situation. I’ve read a couple books on marriage and temperaments. I try very hard to treat him the way I want him to treat me, in spite of his behavior. After much coaxing several months back, we went on a Marriage Encounter weekend. These things helped for a few weeks, but nothing seems to last.
Things seem to have gotten worse over the last few months. I already see a therapist for depression (which has gotten worse in the last few months, too). I really would like to go to couples counseling, or have him go to individual counseling, but my husband adamantly refuses because he says “I do not have a problem, this is your problem.” When I calmly point out specific situations that indicate that we need help, he either says that I’m too sensitive, the situation didn’t really happen the way I remember, or the situation didn’t happen at all.

I don't want a divorce or annulment. All I want is the man he was before we married to come back to stay. At this point, I don't see how that can happen without professional help. Yet even asking for couples' counseling as a birthday present did not change his refusal. I'm beginning to think the only thing that will make him see this is in fact not just "my problem" is a trial separation.

So here’s where I need advice:

1. How do I convince him to go to counseling without resorting to separation?
2. If I do proceed with a trial separation, what do I tell my loved ones when they ask what is going on? I don’t want to ruin his reputation, but at the same time (and perhaps this is pride on my part) I don’t want it to seem like we had one little fight and I want to split up over it.
3. What do I do if he still refuses counseling after the trial separation?

Thanks for reading my long story

 

[Litcrit]

Google Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Acting the role of Prince Charming before the wedding and then suddenly turning into an ogre is textbook for narcissists.

I’ll pray for you. Being around him can’t be good for your depression. They have that effect on the people around them.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

I also suggest you look into Narcissistic Personality Disorder. I immediately though that as I was reading your post. My father has it and your husband sounds just like him. It is a truly terrible thing to live with such a person, they cause serious damage. I’d never advise someone to leave their spouse if there is any chance of improvement of things, but if he indeed has NPD run for your life and don’t look back.

 

[Just_Lurking]

I’m beginning to think the only thing that will make him see this is in fact not just “my problem” is a trial separation.

Your husband already knows that it is not just “your problem”. That is why he is working so hard to convince you that it is your problem. It’s one of the many tools he uses to control you.

Read “Why Does He Do That?: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men” by Lundy Bancroft (see here) and you will understand your husband and his tricks much better. Then you can decide what course of action to take.

 

[mountee]

You have my prayers for a resolution to this that keeps your marriage in tact. But, I would suggest to you that you copy what you have written on you post and make an appointment with your parish priest. Show him your thoughts, theyt were very well stated and let him help you sort through the next steps. I will tell you that sometimes when you start down this road what happens next may not be pleasant but necessary for your marriage to get back on track. Getting ideas for possible solutions on the internet can be a beginning, but they will never be the entire solution. God bless you both, may the Holy Spirit fill you with the knowledge and courage you need to pursue your issues in a way that will bring a peaceful resolution.

 

[SurlyMermaid]

There seems to be a lot of NPD talk on this board (and my husband meet DSM criteria as well).

Is this a sign of a bigger societal issue??

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

There seems to be a lot of NPD talk on this board (and my husband meet DSM criteria as well).

Is this a sign of a bigger societal issue??

I think so. I’ve heard a number of horror stories over the last couple of years from people suffering because a close person has a personality disorder. Last time I checked the estimate for NPD was around 1%. But that is probably far from the truth because most people never seek councelling and thus can’t enter the statistical analysis.

 

[lily20]

I think so. I’ve heard a number of horror stories over the last couple of years from people suffering because a close person has a personality disorder. Last time I checked the estimate for NPD was around 1%. But that is probably far from the truth because most people never seek councelling and thus can’t enter the statistical analysis.

There are a lot of mental/personality disorders that I think satan is working through. many of these are gone once a person returns to Christ.

 

[lily20]

Google Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Acting the role of Prince Charming before the wedding and then suddenly turning into an ogre is textbook for narcissists.

I’ll pray for you. Being around him can’t be good for your depression. They have that effect on the people around them.

That’s exactly what happened to me. He turns back into mr. prince once I make plans to leave. then within 24 hrs later a mad man. A friend of mine (Christian) says it’s like multiple personality disorder. There’s names actually of evil spirits she said that date back to biblical times that can be responsible for such sickness. You’d have to look it up yourself, as i just heard it from her and did not look into it.

 

[louisak]

There are a lot of mental/personality disorders that I think satan is working through.

Certainly, the enemy seeks any possible weakness that he can exploit. I think these problems are more common in our time for two reasons: 1) the breakdown of the family, which means that so many people are entering adolescence and adulthood with deep emotional/psychological needs and disorders… 2) the widespread loss of faith, which means that so many people are now more vulnerable to Satan’s manipulations because they don’t know he exists and are not taking any steps to protect themselves.

 

[maltmom]

I will be praying for you and your husband.

 

[Litcrit]

There seems to be a lot of NPD talk on this board (and my husband meet DSM criteria as well).

Is this a sign of a bigger societal issue??

I think so. I’ve heard a number of horror stories over the last couple of years from people suffering because a close person has a personality disorder. Last time I checked the estimate for NPD was around 1%. But that is probably far from the truth because most people never seek councelling and thus can’t enter the statistical analysis.

There are a lot of mental/personality disorders that I think satan is working through. many of these are gone once a person returns to Christ.

It may not necessarily be a sign of the end times, or because “everything is worse now than it used to be” - it could be the opposite. People are more free to talk now. The anonymity of the Internet makes it possible for people to exchange experiences without being shunned by their surroundings.

My father was an abusive, manipulative narcissist and generally seen as a loving, doting father by others.

His parents were worse, but were even more respected members of the community. Their children never dared question them, even after their deaths.

Many adult children of narcissistic parents blog anonymously while never imagining it would be possible to talk openly to their extended families and friends about the same issues - the narcissist has most people fooled by his or her perfect facade, and only shows the real face to his “nearest” and “dearest”. For a narcissist, the ultimate sin is “airing the family’s dirty laundry” - exposing their crazy abuse to others.

Many narcissists are respectable church members. Their families look perfect on the outside.

Talking about it is what is more acceptable now - if only a little. Not accepting abuse, seeing it for what it is, realizing that just because you’re weaker (the wife or the child), or stronger (the husband) it doesn’t mean you just have to bear it and blame yourself, all that is a bit more acceptable now than it used to be.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Please forgive me if there are a lot of posts like this, but I need some anonymous advice in a Catholic light.

Since we got married last year, my husband has been emotionally abusive off and on. There are times he’s not, and he’s the sweet, considerate guy he was before we were married, but it never seems to last.
What do I mean by emotionally abusive? He does things like call me names “as a joke,” criticizes me often, gives me orders instead of asking me to do things, reveals embarrassing things about me to others if it will make him look better (or sometimes for no reason), makes up stories or lies just to see if he can trick me, blames me for his weight gain despite avoiding my cooking, and screams and curses at me if I criticize something he does, or sometimes even if I just disagree with him or play devil’s advocate.

He rarely takes responsibility for anything he does. Recently, we were flying on an airplane and he knocked over the drink on the tray in front of me. He blamed me for having my drink in his way. When I told him that his blaming me for something that was obviously not my fault upset me, he said I was too sensitive and I "make such a big [expletive] deal about everything." He often gets mad at me when I cry, saying I'm trying to manipulate him (which I'm not; often I'm at a loss for words or scared to express what I think or feel for fear it will make him angry).

If he apologizes, which is pretty rare, his apologies usually are something like “I’m sorry you got upset” not “I’m sorry for what I did.” Unfortunately, this lack of responsibility is not just with me. To my knowledge, he hasn’t gone to Reconciliation since last April. When I ask why he won’t go with me, he says “I don’t need to.”

I’ve tried many things on my own to help the situation. I’ve read a couple books on marriage and temperaments. I try very hard to treat him the way I want him to treat me, in spite of his behavior. After much coaxing several months back, we went on a Marriage Encounter weekend. These things helped for a few weeks, but nothing seems to last.
Things seem to have gotten worse over the last few months. I already see a therapist for depression (which has gotten worse in the last few months, too). I really would like to go to couples counseling, or have him go to individual counseling, but my husband adamantly refuses because he says “I do not have a problem, this is your problem.” When I calmly point out specific situations that indicate that we need help, he either says that I’m too sensitive, the situation didn’t really happen the way I remember, or the situation didn’t happen at all.

I don't want a divorce or annulment. All I want is the man he was before we married to come back to stay. At this point, I don't see how that can happen without professional help. Yet even asking for couples' counseling as a birthday present did not change his refusal. I'm beginning to think the only thing that will make him see this is in fact not just "my problem" is a trial separation.

So here’s where I need advice:

1. How do I convince him to go to counseling without resorting to separation?
2. If I do proceed with a trial separation, what do I tell my loved ones when they ask what is going on? I don’t want to ruin his reputation, but at the same time (and perhaps this is pride on my part) I don’t want it to seem like we had one little fight and I want to split up over it.
3. What do I do if he still refuses counseling after the trial separation?

Thanks for reading my long story

Welcome to Catholic Answers! Sorry you are coming for advice in this terrible situation.

I will just answer your last 3 questions. You told us right away that your husband is abusive.

You are not going to convince this man to do anything. He may go to counseling, and he may be charming, funny, and cooperative while in the session with the counselor. Good counselors can see through this act. He will not change his behavior outside of the sessions, because he believes that all the problems are yours. If you would only act like he tells you to, everything would be fine.

Second, you do not have to tell anyone anything you do not wish to. All you have to say is that the situation was very serious and you did not do this on a whim. And do not allow anyone to downplay the seriousness of your situation.

Third, you must decide that you are worth more than being abused, and stick to your guns. He will likely turn on the charm ray again, and may even crank it up a notch, in order to lure you back in. Know what to expect and you won’t think he’s truly changed. Trust me, he hasn’t. Once you drop the separation the abuse will increase. Do NOT make threats you don’t intend to carry out. In fact, it is my advice to get everything ready and leave him without any notice whatsoever, and go somewhere safe where you can think clearly and get your mind straight after all the abuse. It won’t be easy to do this, because this type of abuser knows your likely destinations and will pursue you there.

Talk to your priest, but don’t waste time thinking that this kind of man is going to change. You have seen the kind of change he will make, from charming to dangerous, and that’s all you are going to see. It is always other people who need to change, not him.

I am hopeful that you do not have children yet.

 

[mamaslo]

I agree with the posters who said to copy what you asked us, and if I were you, bring it to a therapist on your own. It is difficult to find a therapist who can see through the “charmer” in front of them. People really like those guys, but strangely enough, they don’t have friends.

Also, contact your priest with the same note you wrote us. You need support firstly. There may be things you can try with boundaries, but expect a reaction. That’s what I got. But stick to your guns. You are beautifully, and wonderfully made by God and deserve to be treated that way.

I don’t know about the enemie’s influence on society in this kind of thing or if it is just the lack of responsibility taught at home growing up…over generations.

Jesus did defeat sin and death. Now your challenge is to figure out what that looks like and what is acceptable treatment. LIke my daughter says “My Father is King of the Universe and I am His princess”. That statement is pretty affirming, don’t you think.

We all make mistakes, but a lot of what you are getting is just what you thought. Abuse.

(((HUGS))). You can do whatever you need to do.