I've been born again to a living hope through Jesus Christ. I have an inheritance in heaven that is imperishable. By God's power, it is being guarded

[ccolley2]

How do you figure that the Catholic faith existed before the Word of God. I was taught that the Catholic church didn’t begin until the 5th or 6th century. Can you provide scripture please. Please do not give the Peter the stone case. That has already been established as Christ being the Rock. Thanks God Bless

Well, you have been misinformed. You can say that the Catholic Church began at the cross, when blood and water flowed from Christs side, you can say that the Catholic Church began with Pentecost, but you are badly misinformed if you think that the Catholic Church did not begin until the 5th or 6th Century. We have always had a Church, but we have not always had a Bible. God’s Word? yes.The Bible? NO!

BTW if Jesus was going to build his church on himself, then why didn’t he just say so? Why use the term “Rock”? Why use the Aramaic term for “rock”. (Greek has the feminine and Masculine terms for Rock/Stone. Aramaic -which Jesus spoke- and Hebrew had just one word for Rock). In Aramaic, rock is rock is rock is rock!

Why call Peter aside and give him this “cryptic message”? Why did Jesus ask Peter three times to feed his sheep? Shepherd his flock? Feed his lambs?
We have seen that the Apostles weren’t the best and brightest scholars of the time. Jesus was always having to explain things to them. So why would Jesus leave them to fend for themselves without leaving a way to lead the church, to build the church that has Christ Jesus as it’s head? No, the passage that you so blithely dismiss is a critical one.

You are ROCK and on this ROCK I will build my church! Amen, Alleuia!
CC

 

[freedomwriter]

Well, you have been misinformed. You can say that the Catholic Church began at the cross, when blood and water flowed from Christs side, you can say that the Catholic Church began with Pentecost, but you are badly misinformed if you think that the Catholic Church did not begin until the 5th or 6th Century. We have always had a Church, but we have not always had a Bible. God’s Word? yes.The Bible? NO!

BTW if Jesus was going to build his church on himself, then why didn’t he just say so? Why use the term “Rock”? Why use the Aramaic term for “rock”. (Greek has the feminine and Masculine terms for Rock/Stone. Aramaic -which Jesus spoke- and Hebrew had just one word for Rock). In Aramaic, rock is rock is rock is rock!

Why call Peter aside and give him this “cryptic message”? Why did Jesus ask Peter three times to feed his sheep? Shepherd his flock? Feed his lambs?
We have seen that the Apostles weren’t the best and brightest scholars of the time. Jesus was always having to explain things to them. So why would Jesus leave them to fend for themselves without leaving a way to lead the church, to build the church that has Christ Jesus as it’s head? No, the passage that you so blithely dismiss is a critical one.

You are ROCK and on this ROCK I will build my church! Amen, Alleuia!
CC

I am the true freedomwriter, someone else wrote that but i totally agree with their statement. Jesus is the true rock peter is the small stone. Did scripture mean that peter would be the cornstone? No it is Christ. Do you believe that the Word of God is totally true or partial?

 

[AwGusTeen]

I am the true freedomwriter, someone else wrote that but i totally agree with their statement. Jesus is the true rock peter is the small stone. Did scripture mean that peter would be the cornstone? No it is Christ. Do you believe that the Word of God is totally true or partial?

And that would be YOUR interpretation.

 

[distracted]

Made up? Really.

Catholic questions if an unborn baby is a life:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=5707299&postcount=54

Catholic claims Jesus came to lead the Jews to the Gentiles:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=5382749&postcount=12

Catholic claims Jesus was ‘‘produced’’ to be led to the gentiles:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=5423006&postcount=123

As I said, they’re all there if you care to look.

big deal … some say 54% of Catholics voted for you know who…

Jesus said there are few who find the narrow road to eternal life… How many is few? 46%?

30% are supposed to believe in Transubstantiation…

from all i have read and observed in life… and from the words of Jesus most pepole go to Hell…

so like, of course Catholics are going to do stupid, un Christian things.,…

but uh… there are a few non-Catholics in Hell as well…

 

[Guyonthestreet]

big deal …
30% are supposed to believe in Transubstantiation…

…

I think thats a very big deal.

If only 30% of catholics believe in the real presence and transubstantiation, then 70% of people claiming to be catholic are not catholic are they?

If you reduce the approximate claimed membership of over 1 billion, by 70% you get a church made up of true catholics, ie people who are totally loyal and adherents to all of the catholic faiths teachings, with a population of 300 million.

That severely reduces its position in global affairs I would suggest.

So yeah, to me, who believes in the real presence of Jesus in the Eucharist, and Im neither baptised or churched, then to find a catholic admitting that 70% of adherents of the church I am discerning to belong to, the Catholic Church, actually DONT believe in a core teaching of the church, is both shocking and a big deal.

Especially when you consider than one of the things thrown out at non catholics by catholics is the fact that thei church has the Real Presence !!!

You cannot be a catholic and not believe in the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist.

 

[josie_L]

I think thats a very big deal.

If only 30% of catholics believe in the real presence and transubstantiation, then 70% of people claiming to be catholic are not catholic are they?

If you reduce the approximate claimed membership of over 1 billion, by 70% you get a church made up of true catholics, ie people who are totally loyal and adherents to all of the catholic faiths teachings, with a population of 300 million.

That severely reduces its position in global affairs I would suggest.

So yeah, to me, who believes in the real presence of Jesus in the Eucharist, and Im neither baptised or churched, then to find a catholic admitting that 70% of adherents of the church I am discerning to belong to, the Catholic Church, actually DONT believe in a core teaching of the church, is both shocking and a big deal.

Especially when you consider than one of the things thrown out at non catholics by catholics is the fact that thei church has the Real Presence !!!

You cannot be a catholic and not believe in the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist.

Are you saying that apart from the Catholics and Orthodox, the real presence is also found in other Churches? Furthermore, I don’t think we should be basing ourselves on statistics or the like as we don’t know how truly accurate the data is. I also think that the reasons that some Catholics have lost their faith in the eucharist is that the eucharist tends to be ridiculed (above all other dogmas) by secular and protestant (some) forces, who refer to it as a cookie or cannibalism. Catholics are pressured as much as any group, probably more so, to do away with superstitious beliefs, and how more superstitious can it get when one claims to be eating the flesh and blood of a once dead but since risen man/God 2000 years ago? If anything because it’s so true and vital a belief to our faith and well being the Devil and his minions will make absolutely certain they destroy that central truth so that Catholics are denied the wonderful, curative, spiritual life-giving force the eucharist has to offer.

 

[Guyonthestreet]

Are you saying that apart from the Catholics and Orthodox, the real presence is also found in other Churches? Furthermore, I don’t think we should be basing ourselves on statistics or the like as we don’t know how truly accurate the data is. I also think that the reasons that some Catholics have lost their faith in the eucharist is that the eucharist tends to be ridiculed (above all other dogmas) by secular and protestant (some) forces, who refer to it as a cookie or cannibalism. Catholics are pressured as much as any group, probably more so, to do away with superstitious beliefs, and how more superstitious can it get when one claims to be eating the flesh and blood of a once dead but since risen man/God 2000 years ago? If anything because it’s so true and vital a belief to our faith and well being the Devil and his minions will make absolutely certain they destroy that central truth so that Catholics are denied the wonderful, curative, spiritual life-giving force the eucharist has to offer.

I didnt make the claim that 70% of people who call themselves catholic dont believe in the real presence.

distracted did - Im simply reponding to his comment about ‘‘big deal’’ and asserting that if what he claims is correct, it is a big deal.

A very big deal.

It means the actual numbers of people who claim to be catholic in the world today can be reduced by two thirds.

Because the Eucharist is central to the catholic faith.

You cannot be a catholic if you dont believe in the Real Presence.

Whether thats the work of the devil, secularism or whatever is another issue.

 

[Zundrah]

I didnt make the claim that 70% of people who call themselves catholic dont believe in the real presence.

distracted did - Im simply reponding to his comment about ‘‘big deal’’ and asserting that if what he claims is correct, it is a big deal.

A very big deal.

It means the actual numbers of people who claim to be catholic in the world today can be reduced by two thirds.

Because the Eucharist is central to the catholic faith.

You cannot be a catholic if you dont believe in the Real Presence.

Whether thats the work of the devil, secularism or whatever is another issue.

I might just add to that; about 10% of the people of my parish actually leave before the Eucharist is given out. some sundays they take it, and some sundays they don’t.

 

[ccolley2]

I am a former catholic mr. confused lol. I know the doctrine of the catholic church that is why I left after 33 yrs. I got tired of all the misinterpretations of the Word of God what the catholic church teaches. Just like the catholic church being the only true church and peter being the first pope. Don’t you understand that you are just as guilty of spreading these lies as the church when you post them here. James says many should not be teachers because there is a greater responsibility and accountability in sharing Gods Word. Don’t be distracted study the Word of God before posting. God Bless and have a blessed day

I find it hard to believe that you claim to know the TRUE doctrine of the Catholic Church when you say that it is spreading lies. Peter WAS the first Pope and we have Apostolic succession all the way to the present pontiff. When you deny these things and say they are lies, then you are calling all the Apostles liars, the Early Church Fathers liars and the martyrs of the church liars because they are the ones who passed Sacred Scripture and Sacred Traditions down to us.

There is nothing in Scripture that is contrary to Catholic teaching and nothing in Catholic Teaching that is contrary to Scripture.

BTW, 2Peter 1:20 “No passage of scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation…”
AND
How does the Bible tell us that we will know the spirit of error from the Spirit of Truth?

1John 4:6 “We are of God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and he who is not of God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of error from the Spirit of Truth.” The WE is the Church, not the Scriptures. so the Scriptures lead us back to the Church not the other way around.

BTW, you were “born-again” at your Confirmation. You were sealed with the oil of chrism and received the gifts of the Holy Spirit. We continue to be “born-again-anew” whenever we receive the Eucharist and we are given the zeal and fire of the faith. Unfortunately, so many choose to ignore those gifts. The sacraments of the Church are truly the “gifts that keep on giving”. I am a convert since 1990. I have been a member of several Protestant churches and just don’t understand why anyone would leave the Catholic Church.

CC

 

[guanophore]

As I told you before, you cant just snap your fingers and become a catholic. There is a process to be gone through, and Im going through it I thought you would have known that It’s called RCIA

I have been away from the thread for a few days, so forgive my stumbling to catch up. I am glad that you are investigating.

Do you think making a statement on a public forum that I do not have the Holy Spirit in me is Christ like behavior?

She may come to regret it later. I know that I regret some of my early posts. I may have missed some posts, and don’t know what you are supposed to have been done that was “mean and obnoxious”. My experience with OTCA has been that she is judgemental and narrow minded. Bigots occur in all places!

If it’s not the Holy Spirit that is leading me to enquire further into the catholic church, do you think it’s an evil spirit then?

The truth is that, in your quest to find where God wants you, you will encounter people who are intolerant, and who do not actually represent the faith they claim to espouse. This is part of the testing process, to see of we are serious!

Do you see any irony in the last quote above?

At least you do!

Ive had some very supportive PMs and will continue in RCIA despite your pronouncements on me personally.

I will keep you in my prayers

Good for you!

 

[guanophore]

I find it amazing how all the protestant faiths vary so much… Look at how the Amish live for example compared to the Episcopalians…

complete opposite.

Could it be that groups from the past chose to mold their faith around their preferred lifestyles, rather than choosing to mold their lifestyles around their faith? I say yes.
It’s called the “watering-down” of faith!

I don’t think so. I lived in Amish country for many years. They are very serious about their faith,and desire to conform their lives to what they believe God wants of them.

I don’t deny that each new division loses some of the Truth, and things are “watered” down to the point of near unrecognizeablity. However, I think it usually happens with all sincerity.

 

[qui_est_ce]

I am the true freedomwriter, someone else wrote that but i totally agree with their statement. Jesus is the true rock peter is the small stone. Did scripture mean that peter would be the cornstone? No it is Christ. Do you believe that the Word of God is totally true or partial?

The question is do YOU believe it? NOWHERE does anybody here say Peter is the cornerstone. NOWHERE in the Bible does Jesus say Peter is the “small” stone. Jesus and his desciples spoke Aramaic. Did you ever see “The Passion of the Christ?” The Word of God is 100% true. Read the Early Church Fathers, the students of the Apostles.
Ignatius of Antioch in "Letter to Smyrnaeans:

Chapter 7. Let us stand aloof from such heretics
They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they confess not the Eucharist to be the flesh of our Saviour Jesus Christ, which suffered for our sins, and which the Father, of His goodness, raised up again. Those, therefore, who speak against this gift of God, incur death in the midst of their disputes. But it were better for them to treat it with respect, that they also might rise again. It is fitting, therefore, that you should keep aloof from such persons, and not to speak of them either in private or in public, but to give heed to the prophets, and above all, to the Gospel, in which the passion [of Christ] has been revealed to us, and the resurrection has been fully proved. But avoid all divisions, as the beginning of evils.

Chapter 8. Let nothing be done without the bishop
See that you all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as you would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is [administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church.** It is not lawful without the bishop either to baptize or to celebrate a love-feast; but whatsoever he shall approve of, that is also pleasing to God, so that everything that is done may be secure and valid.

Protestantism is a false teacher. They changed the teachings of Jesus. They took 7 inconvenient books out of the Bible so they could preach a false gospel.

 

[freedomwriter]

The question is do YOU believe it? NOWHERE does anybody here say Peter is the cornerstone. NOWHERE in the Bible does Jesus say Peter is the “small” stone. Jesus and his desciples spoke Aramaic. Did you ever see “The Passion of the Christ?” The Word of God is 100% true. Read the Early Church Fathers, the students of the Apostles.

Protestantism is a false teacher. They changed the teachings of Jesus. They took 7 inconvenient books out of the Bible so they could preach a false gospel.

Bunch of hogwash. Study the bible and some greek before posting your foolish comments. If Jesus said it then i believe it to be true. Peter is a small stone. No one changed the teachings of Jesus. The 7 books are historical books. Thats why they are not in the Protestant bible. But that is whole other subject. I cannot believe someone like yourself can be so foolish of God’s Word and then have the gall to post it.

 

[fbl9]

Bunch of hogwash. Study the bible and some greek before posting your foolish comments.

If Jesus said it then i believe it to be true.
Peter is a small stone.
No one changed the teachings of Jesus.
The 7 books are historical books. Thats why they are not in the Protestant bible. But that is whole other subject.
I cannot believe someone like yourself can be so foolish of God’s Word and then have the gall to post it.

Such blind love.
That piont is very debatable for your kind has to “interpit” many of His words to come up with some of the strangeness followed by your kind.
Big stone small stone is a easy arguement to lose there bud for in the original lanuage of Christ there was no small stone big stone meaning.

Yep and you sure can’t argue with history.

 

[nuntym]

Bunch of hogwash. Study the bible and some greek before posting your foolish comments. If Jesus said it then i believe it to be true. Peter is a small stone. No one changed the teachings of Jesus. The 7 books are historical books. Thats why they are not in the Protestant bible. But that is whole other subject. I cannot believe someone like yourself can be so foolish of God’s Word and then have the gall to post it.

And the testimony, wisdom, knowledge of so many Catholic theologians for the past two thousand years from the Early Church Fathers? Were they foolish? Were what they said full of hogwash?

 

[distracted]

To accuse those who are not catholic and asking honest questions here of pretending to be ignorant to annoy catholics, is being judgemental.

In my view.

Youre free to disagree.

show me where i said that.

 

[distracted]

I am a former catholic mr. confused lol. I know the doctrine of the catholic church that is why I left after 33 yrs. I got tired of all the misinterpretations of the Word of God what the catholic church teaches. Just like the catholic church being the only true church and peter being the first pope. Don’t you understand that you are just as guilty of spreading these lies as the church when you post them here. James says many should not be teachers because there is a greater responsibility and accountability in sharing Gods Word. Don’t be distracted study the Word of God before posting. God Bless and have a blessed day

you didn’t study Catholicism and if you did, you probably had bad comprehension or something…

i never eve KNEW the word of God until i became a catechized Catholic… daily Mass attendance, etc. and what little i did know, i did NOT understand… Now i do… it’s like scales fell off my eyes

one time a protestant set out to find out what percent of the time Catholics and various protestants spent in sciptutre reading at every service or Mass… With Baptists it was about 6% … others were about 2% (I mean reading from the Bible, word for word, not reading a psg here and a psg there… etc). The average was about 4% of the time.

In the Catholic Church it was 26% of the time… not to mention the words said during consecration and other parts of the mass that incorporate Scripture…

so don’t tell me Catholics are not exposed to the Word… get tired of hearing it…

(and i am not a mr.)

 

[distracted]

I am the true freedomwriter, someone else wrote that but i totally agree with their statement. Jesus is the true rock peter is the small stone. Did scripture mean that peter would be the cornstone? No it is Christ. Do you believe that the Word of God is totally true or partial?

those who know Greek and Aramaic (the language Jesus spoke) know that this is a false interpretation.

Jesus is NOT the cornerstone… He is the Church… Peter is the cornerstone of that Church

 

[distracted]

I think thats a very big deal.

If only 30% of catholics believe in the real presence and transubstantiation, then 70% of people claiming to be catholic are not catholic are they?

That severely reduces its position in global affairs I would suggest.

and your point is?? hardly anyone does everything Jesus says. I don’t know anyone who does St Lk 10:17: Give up all you own to the poor and [focus only on] Jesus…
Again, the Bible tells us in so many words that most people end up in Hell… .so if you want to follow humans…(the alleged 70%) Good luck… .

…

You cannot be a catholic and not believe in the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist.

well, then maybe you are more Catholic than most Catholics… Congratulations.

 

[distracted]

Bunch of hogwash. Study the bible and some greek before posting your foolish comments. If Jesus said it then i believe it to be true. Peter is a small stone. No one changed the teachings of Jesus. The 7 books are historical books. Thats why they are not in the Protestant bible. But that is whole other subject. I cannot believe someone like yourself can be so foolish of God’s Word and then have the gall to post it.

the poster you respond to is totally correct.

Luther wanted to throw out not just the ones he DID throw out… but 4 from the New T as well… He wanted to throw out Hebrews, 2Peter, Revelation and James… The only reason he didn’t was because his colleagues pestered him and he finally relented.

He spoke very irreverently of the book of James, saying that we should “throw Jimmy in the stove”…

Yes those are the words of the Father of Protestantism…

What wasthat Jesus said to the (i think) Pharisees??

something about “your father” being… uh… that other supernatural entity spoken of in the Bible…