Jesus: 100% God and 100% Man

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Xiaahmad said:
So to put it short:
like TRINITY this is another unexplainable mystery?
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Bishop Fulton Sheen explained the trinity as follows: Consider water in its various forms: liquid, solid (ice) and gaseous (steam). Three different forms of exactly the same chemical compound. Each has a different appearance, but the same nature.

Think of this: If you melt an ice cube in a pan on a burner, you may observe all three forms simultaneously, yet they remain one.

And yes, it remains a mystery to us while on earth.

Peace.
 
I will eat my hat is I get an answer on my question from a Muslim in the next 24 hours.

Is God held bound by the rules of Creation?
 
PeteVZ said:
What kind of hat? Is it one of those cheese head hats?😃
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I would have to buy a hat, first. I do have several ball caps, but that is not the same. 😃

In any event, I think I shall go hungry
 
ralphinal said:
I will eat my hat is I get an answer on my question from a Muslim in the next 24 hours.

Is God held bound by the rules of Creation?
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Hi

I think it will spare your hat.

A 100% God; knowing what is going to happen in future won’t make such rules to start with,which he has later to revise for a mistake done in the past;at the most this could be done by a defective deity. Similarly a 100% powerful king won’t make such a defective rule. It is not a merit; it is rather a demerit and a blemish both for God and man, in my opinion.

I love Jesus and Mary as I do love Buddha and Krishna

Thanks
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

I think it will spare your hat.

A 100% God; knowing what is going to happen in future won’t make such rules to start with,which he has later to revise for a mistake done in the past;at the most this could be done by a defective deity. Similarly a 100% powerful king won’t make such a defective rule. It is not a merit; it is rather a demerit and a blemish both for God and man, in my opinion.

I love Jesus and Mary as I do love Buddha and Krishna

Thanks
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I don’t understand your answer.

Are you saying that God could make a rule in creation that he had to obey?
 
People topic is being diverted let stick to it.

Thing is saying its mystery, mircles or Jesus was both is not proper answer.

as thing here is that it is SELF CONTRADICTORY

IF he is FULLY GOD that will Contradicts with FULLY MAN
and IF FULLY MAN that will Contradicts with FULLY GOD

so lets stick to topic and talk about this belief(which I believe is self contradictroy and as I showed it above that it is)

peace
 
Xiaahmad said:
People topic is being diverted let stick to it.

Thing is saying its mystery, mircles or Jesus was both is not proper answer.

as thing here is that it is SELF CONTRADICTORY

IF he is FULLY GOD that will Contradicts with FULLY MAN
and IF FULLY MAN that will Contradicts with FULLY GOD

so lets stick to topic and talk about this belief(which I believe is self contradictroy and as I showed it above that it is)

peace
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It is only contradictory if God is required to follow the laws of creation. If God can do as he wishes in Creation, then God can do this.

Either God has powers over creation or he does not.
 
ralphinal said:
It is only contradictory if God is required to follow the laws of creation. If God can do as he wishes in Creation, then God can do this.

Either God has powers over creation or he does not.
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Again ur saying that God do contradictory stuff its like same question:

Can God create another Uncreated GOD?

so the thing that I was trying to point out and u missed totally is that Fully GOD cancels out FULLY and viceversa.

and remeber this is one of major belief of Christianity
 
Xiaahmad said:
Again ur saying that God do contradictory stuff its like same question:

Can God create another Uncreated GOD?

so the thing that I was trying to point out and u missed totally is that Fully GOD cancels out FULLY and viceversa.

and remeber this is one of major belief of Christianity
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God cannot create another uncreated anything. By creating, you have created, and the result will never be uncreated.

I know that this is central to Christianity. What I am trying to do is walk you through why it is not self-contradictory.

If God has full authority over creation, then he can CHOOSE to do this. If he does not have full authority over creation, then he cannot.

The fact that Jesus was fully Human does not mean that the Eternal, Immortal, unchanging God could Die. NOt in the least. What it does mean is that the Human Body that the Second person of the Trinity entered the World in was truly human and able to die, but the Fully God part of Jesus was not able to be destroyed. However, in becoming Flesh and Dwelling amongst us, Jesus was not less than God, nor was he diminished in his authority over creation.

It is through the passion, death and ressurection of Jesus that we are saved.

Now, HOW it works is a mystery. I cannot and will not be able to explain it. As I have pointed out before, I do not understand women, but I cannot deny that they exist.
 
ralphinal said:
God cannot create another uncreated anything. By creating, you have created, and the result will never be uncreated.

I know that this is central to Christianity. What I am trying to do is walk you through why it is not self-contradictory.

If God has full authority over creation, then he can CHOOSE to do this. If he does not have full authority over creation, then he cannot.

The fact that Jesus was fully Human does not mean that the Eternal, Immortal, unchanging God could Die. NOt in the least. What it does mean is that the Human Body that the Second person of the Trinity entered the World in was truly human and able to die, but the Fully God part of Jesus was not able to be destroyed. However, in becoming Flesh and Dwelling amongst us, Jesus was not less than God, nor was he diminished in his authority over creation.

It is through the passion, death and ressurection of Jesus that we are saved.

Now, HOW it works is a mystery. I cannot and will not be able to explain it. As I have pointed out before, I do not understand women, but I cannot deny that they exist.
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God cannot create another uncreated anything. By creating, you have created, and the result will never be uncreated.

this was my point that it is self contradictory like this belief.

and Its not only about Death only but all other things, Depedencey on stuff, birth, Death, Knowledge, Power, etc.

coz same Jesus is suppose to be both (like uncreated, created)

Peace.
www.thetruecall.com
www.youtube.com/islamandfriends
www.youtube.com/coverted2islam
 
Xiaahmad said:
God cannot create another uncreated anything. By creating, you have created, and the result will never be uncreated.

this was my point that it is self contradictory like this belief.

and Its not only about Death only but all other things, Depedencey on stuff, birth, Death, Knowledge, Power, etc.

coz same Jesus is suppose to be both (like uncreated, created)

Peace.
www.thetruecall.com
www.youtube.com/islamandfriends
www.youtube.com/coverted2islam
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For some reason, I am having trouble seeing what you are trying to get me to see.

The Word of God was with God, and Was God, and through him all things were created. The Word then became flesh and dwelt among us, like us in all things but sin.

Jesus is the Word made Flesh.

The second person of the Trinity is not a creation, he is the creator. He CHOSE to come to earth as a true human, not in a form or an avatar. This was not an illusion.

What is the issue that you are having? Is it that God can’t choose to do this? Is it that you cannot understand how Jesus can be both God and Man?

Jesus was God before he was man. He saw that the only way to save us was to perform the ultimate Sacrifice. In his Divine form, however, he cannot die. Therefore, he had to empty himself and be born of a woman. Then, his HUman form could suffer, die and rise again.
 
I think perhaps the simplest way to put it is thus:

Jesus spirit is 100% God. That Spirit lived in the form of a 100% human body.

While in that body, He was bound by the laws of man. In other words, He could not be in two places at once, the human brain in which His divine spirit dwelt could not fully grasp all the Divine Mysteries, His body could feel pain, joy, fear and He could die.

At the same time, because His eternal essence or being was God, He could still work miracles, was able to glimpse and see the most perfect vision of God’s plan that the human mind can comprehend, and was able to communicate with the father in a more personal way than any other human could prior to that point.

He was fully human, and was as perfect as a human could be. His divine essence couldn’t just leave the body and travel back to Heaven, His body was a part of Him. At the same time, He is, was, and always will be God, and His humanity couldn’t just drop the divine essence.
 
It has been insenuated here that because Jesus suffered death He is imperfect.
**God’s plan is always perfect. Death is not an imperfection, but a transcendance of mortal life. Death, in order to be imperfect would have to be an “end result” and THAT is the exact opposite of the message of Christ and the Gospels. **
Mortal death is not final. Christ came here to prove that point with the most revealing way God’s Will has to offer.
God became man to prove to us that if we do His Will, we too will ascend to Him in Heaven.
**Christ’s death is perfect in every way. If we do God’s Will our death will also be perfect. 🙂 **
 
This would be sufficient lesson for the day. If this is understood I think you will make easier headway to explain the rest. 🙂
ralphinal said:
The fact that Jesus was fully Human does not mean that the Eternal, Immortal, unchanging God could Die. NOt in the least. What it does mean is that the Human Body that the Second person of the Trinity entered the World in was truly human and able to die, but the Fully God part of Jesus was not able to be destroyed. However, in becoming Flesh and Dwelling amongst us, Jesus was not less than God, nor was he diminished in his authority over creation.
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Xiaahmad said:
People topic is being diverted let stick to it.

Thing is saying its mystery, mircles or Jesus was both is not proper answer.

as thing here is that it is SELF CONTRADICTORY

IF he is FULLY GOD that will Contradicts with FULLY MAN
and IF FULLY MAN that will Contradicts with FULLY GOD

so lets stick to topic and talk about this belief(which I believe is self contradictroy and as I showed it above that it is)

peace
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Why do you think that God must be the opposite of Man? Man is created with the image of God. Of course there is a limitation. Such as, George W Bush can be in disguise (with whatever technology) to be a common white American and stay within the neighborhood. But, a common white American cannot be in disguise of George W Bush and enter the white house.

So, God’s word can and had came down from heaven and became man and dwell within human. But, human being cannot become God and enter heaven under his/her own power. There is no contradictory.
 
Xiaahmad said:
People topic is being diverted let stick to it.

Thing is saying its mystery, mircles or Jesus was both is not proper answer.

as thing here is that it is SELF CONTRADICTORY

IF he is FULLY GOD that will Contradicts with FULLY MAN
and IF FULLY MAN that will Contradicts with FULLY GOD

so lets stick to topic and talk about this belief(which I believe is self contradictroy and as I showed it above that it is)

peace
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Peace be you all Muslim friends!

All the difficulty in accepting this mystery starts with this:

Fully God has the capacity to become Fully Man.

If you are able to accept the above we will be able to proceed with less trouble!
 
Chancellare said:
Fully God has the capacity to become Fully Man.
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Hi

There is no fully God who would like to become a man. How could a Creator become a created? It is a blemish. It is paradoxical and mythical, in my opinion.

I love Jesus and Mary as I do love Buddha and Krishna.

Thanks
 
Reuben_J said:
This got to do with the Quran where it teaches that the Trinity consists of a father, son and a mother. Muslims mind derives from what the Quran teaches them. Some are so ingrained in this teaching that nothing will make them understand what’s outside it. It’s quite sad but that’s how it is with some Muslims.
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That’s well worth knowing. Thanks 🙂​

 
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