Jesus a "great teacher"

[Peter_Plato]

I like the road you are taking this to Peter. However, I never had any anticipation about how I would come into existance. I think we are close in thought, but when you speak of purpose, you would be right to say we just don’t see it the same way.

It is possible, that we are not so far apart in thinking. I am open to what might be. And I leave that openess when it contridicts the physical world. Yet I still keep a part of me open for that stranger I have not yet met.

Doesn’t just the fact that you, as you, are in the world, give you pause? How can material simply bring about the “I” that is you? Your very self? Would that in itself not mean that some kind of “I” preconceived you? How can matter bring about, not just consciousness as a possibility, but the individual I that gives you your unique identity?

 

[StrawberryJam]

Doesn’t just the fact that you, as you, are in the world, give you pause? How can material simply bring about the “I” that is you? Your very self? Would that in itself not mean that some kind of “I” preconceived you? How can matter bring about, not just consciousness as a possibility, but the individual I that gives you your unique identity?

It is already tomorrow and I need to get at least 4 hours of sleep before work. Or I would be very reckless with others if I did not at least get that much.

I understand how we can ask this question and wonder about it. I do not understand why we feel we are so very unique and that we were the pinnicle of creation. Maybe I am tired and will remember why we ought to think so of ourselves.

In the meantime, I do apprieciate your thoughts about this, and will give it more consideration.

 

[Peter_Plato]

I understand how we can ask this question and wonder about it. I do not understand why we feel we are so very unique and that we were the pinnicle of creation. Maybe I am tired and will remember why we ought to think so of ourselves.
.

Being unique does not make anyone the pinnacle of creation, it merely gives you an identity - who you are in creation

 

[PRmerger]

Why don’t you just go back to the 18th century, Mizzzzz Merger! [If that is your real name…]

Hah!

Methinks the lady doth protest too much.

 

[belorg]

Without seeking aid from Google or anyone except your own memory?

:coffeeread:

Yes

 

[PRmerger]

Yes

Very well, then.

I stand corrected. You do know the Catholic faith very well.

Where was it that you learned it?

 

[belorg]

Very well, then.

I stand corrected. You do know the Catholic faith very well.

Where was it that you learned it?

I was born and raised a Catholic. Went to Mass every week until I was 23. Received communion every week too.Went to Catholic high school and had courses in Catholic religion at school from my sixth until my eighteenth.
Went to a Catholic university and took a compulsory course in Catholic religion.
Stll have lots of Catholic friends. My mother and brother are still devout Catholics (but probably more progressive than you).
So, I do not need Google for simple questions of faith as those regarding Immaculate Conception of Scripture in Mass.

 

[PRmerger]

I was born and raised a Catholic. Went to Mass every week until I was 23. Received communion every week too.Went to Catholic high school and had courses in Catholic religion at school from my sixth until my eighteenth.
Went to a Catholic university and took a compulsory course in Catholic religion.
Stll have lots of Catholic friends. My mother and brother are still devout Catholics (but probably more progressive than you).
So, I do not need Google for simple questions of faith as those regarding Immaculate Conception of Scripture in Mass.

Ok.

However, your story is the same as a zillion Catholic folks. And almost all of them haven’t a clue about the faith they left. They will even add, “I was an altar boy until 14!”

BTW, the answers to those basic Catholic questions could be found by doing a search here on the CAFs. I didn’t specify that you had to use only Google.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Being unique does not make anyone the pinnacle of creation, it merely gives you an identity - who you are in creation

What creation is the pinnicle of creation if not the human in a Catholic view?

 

[belorg]

Ok.

However, your story is the same as a zillion Catholic folks. And almost all of them haven’t a clue about the faith they left. They will even add, “I was an altar boy until 14!”

I have never been an altar boy, PR. And if zillions of Catholic folks haven’t a clue about the faith they left, there seems to be something basically wrong with Catholic education.
It is also a fact that zillions of Catholic folks who are still Catholic ahevn’t got a clue of what exactly this entails.The other day I had a chat with a friend of mine who teaches Catholic religion in high school and she e.g. does not believe in transubstantiation or the Immaculate Conception. Yest she calls herself a Catholic.
Anyway, **I **do have a clue about the faith I left, and the more time I spend here on this forum, the more clues I get.

BTW, the answers to those basic Catholic questions could be found by doing a search here on the CAFs. I didn’t specify that you had to use only Google.

Of course the answers could be found here. But I already knew the answers

 

[PRmerger]

And if zillions of Catholic folks haven’t a clue about the faith they left, there seems to be something basically wrong with Catholic education.

Indeed. The Church has done an abysmal job in the past providing nourishing catechesis for her flock.

It is also a fact that zillions of Catholic folks who are still Catholic ahevn’t got a clue of what exactly this entails.

Indeed.

The other day I had a chat with a friend of mine who teaches Catholic religion in high school and she e.g. does not believe in transubstantiation or the Immaculate Conception. Yest she calls herself a Catholic.

Sadly, this seems to be more the rule rather than the exception.

Anyway, **I **do have a clue about the faith I left, and the more time I spend here on this forum, the more clues I get.

How can that be? I thought you already knew it front and back. As you say.

Of course the answers could be found here. But I already knew the answers

As you say.

 

[Peter_Plato]

What creation is the pinnicle of creation if not the human in a Catholic view?

How about all of it? Well, except the moral evil part, but that too will be transformed. :yup:

 

[lynnehelen]

Someone asked at the beginning of this thread who told me that Jesus was a “great teacher” merely–my father, of course! A once-Catholic, still Catholic in his heart, but confused, had a stroke, very bright, very mixed up. Mixed up even while I was young, showed me the picture of the crucifixion in his Rembrandt Bible, which he prized–without explanation–it terrified me! I was just a little girl. I want to say that I posted this thread to show that this teaching is dangerous to true faith, even where it exists, it becomes distorted, for instance, nobody has addressed here (I admit I skipped some pages) that if you say that Jesus was “merely” a great teacher you are calling Mary a liar… And THAT, I realized, was a horrible stumbling block for me, a painful one, from a very early age, like I said I was exposed to some advanced problems with the faith in my father at an early age, so soiling. I am happy to say that I am completely over it. My father on the other hand…needs help.

I realized that I invoke His Holy Name with every other breath, even while–when my mind interferes–I had trouble with perseverant irreverance. I think it may have something to do with the Britishness and WWII and the downfall of the British empire–irreverance general, witness, Monty Python, “The Holy Grail,” “The Life of Brian.”

But when you import these problems/issues with Jesus to America (how many words would it take to talk about that), you run into serious problems in your head as to faith and in your life as to evil.

I hope to switch from secular counseling to a Catholic Charities counselor, my secular but Catholic psychologist is all for it.

This was brought to you by a rose from St. Therese, according to the Novena Rose Prayer card which my Project Rachel counselor gave me, who is recommending the same thing.

 

[lynnehelen]

The gospels make it so clear that Mary’s story was true, the angel appearing to St. Joseph in a dream is what it came down to for me. And Jesus’s life and works, also, testify so clearly. But recently, not that recently, there was a discussion, I can’t remember, my mother told me about it, where the Bible was described as a “work of fiction”, “fictional literature.”!!! Now this is just so absurd. It is a work of history, much documentable, as well as the Living Word if you actually read it.

This comment reminds me of a surge a couple of years ago when persons were spreading a rumour that the “Holocaust” (WWII concentration camps) NEVER HAPPENED. It actually affected me in my mind, weak as it is!. Thank you, Morley Safer, I believe he passed away recently?, for standing up to clearly and definitively correct this absurdity–wich was actually spreading! in his spot on 60 Minutes.

“It happened.” That’s all he had to say.

That’s all I have to say about HOLY Jesus. It happened.

 

[atheistgirl]

What creation is the pinnicle of creation if not the human in a Catholic view?

I quite like microbes and bacteria

If humans were wiped off the face of the earth the earth would continue on just fine until that momentous day heading our way when the sun burns out.

If microbes and bacteria were wiped off the face of the earth, the earth will die a lingering death and humans will not be able to survive.



We like to think we’re the top dogs, but actually, we’re pretty lame and insignificant and vulnerable as a species.

Which is one good reason we need to show a lot more respect to the land the animals and the environment we’ve assumed stewardship over.

We can’t survive without them, but they sure as heck can survive and thrive just fine without us.

Sarah x

 

[stewstew03]

I quite like microbes and bacteria

If humans were wiped off the face of the earth the earth would continue on just fine until that momentous day heading our way when the sun burns out.

If microbes and bacteria were wiped off the face of the earth, the earth will die a lingering death and humans will not be able to survive.



We like to think we’re the top dogs, but actually, we’re pretty lame and insignificant and vulnerable as a species.

Which is one good reason we need to show a lot more respect to the land the animals and the environment we’ve assumed stewardship over.

We can’t survive without them, but they sure as heck can survive and thrive just fine without us.

Sarah x

Ah… The brutish worldview that is atheism.

This view offers the cold, hard facts of humanity without all the pomp and circumstance.

 

[Portofino]

We like to think we’re the top dogs, but actually, we’re pretty lame and insignificant and vulnerable as a species.

I like your thoughts there, Sarah They are the opposite of brutish, in my estimation.

It’s a fact that not only other human beings , but also our fellow creatures, have suffered greatly as a result of human rapaciousness and cruelty. From a Christian standpoint, this is possibly an added dimension to the problem of evil – animals did not commit original sin, yet they have been permitted to suffer at the hands of sinful humanity (animal cruelty, for example).

There is ironic nobility, though, in human beings who have the self-awareness and the moral sense to be highly self-critical, and to acknowledge that human beings are not the axis on which the universe revolves. It reminds me of two quotes from rather famous philosophers: “he who despises himself nonetheless still respects himself as one who despises” (Friedrich Nietzsche); and “man is a reed, the weakest in nature; but he is a thinking reed” (Blaise Pascal).

 

[PRmerger]

There is ironic nobility, though, in human beings who have the self-awareness and the moral sense to be highly self-critical, and to acknowledge that human beings are not the axis on which the universe revolves.

Indeed. This is a very Catholic POV.

The axis on which the universe revolves is the Triune God.

“man is a reed, the weakest in nature; but he is a thinking reed” (Blaise Pascal).

If this were Blaise Pascal’s Facebook I’d click “Like!”

We are indeed, “thinking reeds” (or, at the very least, potentially thinking reeds) and by virtue of the fact that The Thinking Reed deigned to become one of us, our “reediness” becomes sanctified.

 

[LynJohn1023]

How about all of it? Well, except the moral evil part, but that too will be transformed. :yup:

According to every denomination of the Christian faith and the Catholic Church, evil is NOT part of God’s Creation. Man, not God allowed evil into the Creation.

 

[LynJohn1023]

:

I quite like microbes and bacteria

If humans were wiped off the face of the earth the earth would continue on just fine until that momentous day heading our way when the sun burns out.

If microbes and bacteria were wiped off the face of the earth, the earth will die a lingering death and humans will not be able to survive.



We like to think we’re the top dogs, but actually, we’re pretty lame and insignificant and vulnerable as a species.

Which is one good reason we need to show a lot more respect to the land the animals and the environment we’ve assumed stewardship over.

We can’t survive without them, but they sure as heck can survive and thrive just fine without us.

Sarah x

You know Sarah, if I’m wrong and after this life it’s just over, I suffer nothing and live believing in something great. If you’re wrong, and there is a God, I wonder what will become of you. I know, I’ll pray that God will have mercy on you since Christ came to redeem you too. Do me a favor, pray I’ll be granted mercy too. God knows I’ll need it too!

By the way Sarah, I recognize my obligation to be a good steward because God has so commanded (Gen 2). What moral standard makes you think you should? That’s not a rhetorical question. I’m always curious wherefrom an atheist obtains their moral imperative. If there is no God, from what moral authority does your conscience proceed. If you say innate, then who bore it in you at your conception? These are real questions that I would not be able to answer.