Jesus vs Muhammad

[jakasaki]

qwerk,

Perhaps stating that so many Christians are ignorant isn’t the best way to prove your point. Yes I agree there are ignorant Christians out there and hopefully they can come to a better understanding of their own faith, and we should indeed be praying for them. But I think it is safe to say that we ALL can be put into this category at some point and are all ignorant to the faith is some way. Nobody is perfect.

I can understand where you are coming from, and can see your passion about this, but wouldn’t it be more Christian of you my friend, to realize that perhaps defending Mohammad’s actions isn’t exactly what is being done here…I believe more or less defending that Mohammad was a human, and all humans are of God, so even if someone was defending him couldn’t it in fact be out of Love for others? This is what I understand this defense of Mohammad by Christians to be…

Let’s take a look real quickly at the whole situation. God loves us all…God even loved Mohammad. Can we argue that? No of course not because we as Christians know better. We don’t however know how he was judged by the Lord, if we are true believers of Christ, we should be praying that God had mercy on his soul!

As stated above, I can understand your concern for the dangers of allowing the teachings of Mohammad, and Islam helping to turn people away from the Lord, and I couldn’t agree more with you on this point. BUT you have to realize that perhaps Mohammad really believed what he was being revealed, by whatever force, evil or not was showing him.

You see…even if as many have stated above, that Mohammad reveled something that was an evil inspiration, did he in fact know this? This is something we cannot say. We don’t know this, even with the things that history has told us about this man. If he in fact believed in his heart that what he was doing was right and correct, then how can you judge him on that? He may have been trying to be faithful to what he was being told by ‘his angel’ etc. in the best possible way he knew how. Was it the right way of course not, but that is not the point here.

This is where man, makes the mistake in trying to be as God…we cannot judge anyone, only their actions and we should be more importantly trying to help and correct those who have the wrong ideas and are committing bad actions. Take a look at the historical facts of Mohammad’s time…the Christians that he was around were ignorant themselves…how could he grasp the message of true Christianity when those Christians he was around didn’t even grasp it? The same goes for Muslims today…When we as Christians don’t live by the Word…how can we expect unbelievers to believe us when we try to tell them about it? It cannot be done, and that is exactly where the Evil one seeps through. It is a sad situation indeed. We need to be the true witnesses to our Lord and Love as He loved us.

So yes can it be seen and stated that some actions by Mohammad were in fact not very good ones, of course. BUT the same can be said about some actions of Christians…take a look at Peter for example. He denied the Lord three times…does this mean that he was a bad person of course not; it means that the Evil one tempted him into doing that. And if Satan can tempt the people closest to the Lord and even the Lord himself, then of course he can tempt others who came years later. It doesn’t though give you, me, or anyone permission to judge that person, it only gives us the opportunity to say “Ok what this person did was not correct, and God wouldn’t like it. So in an effort to act in a way that the Lord would want us to, we should one pray for these people, and two, try and correct the bad actions”

By bashing the leader of a very large community of people is not the way to win their favor. We need to calmly show these people that the message that Mohammad brought wasn’t the correct one, and then prove this true by LIVING OUT the right message. The message of the Lord Jesus Christ. Only when they see us doing this will they be able to comprehend the ideas of Christianity, and the true Divine message of God.

It is a struggle I know! And again I understand how it is frustrating it is to do this, but we are called to be living witnesses of Christ. This is how true love spreads, and this is how true TRUTH spreads. Thanks for reading!

May God Bless you and keep you in the palm of His hand. :hug3:

KS

There are many threads about islam/muslims/mohamad on here.

Please feel free to browse them, post and “preach to the muslims” about their mis-understanding and how you can “teach” them about the truth.

They deny the divinity of Our Lord Jesus! Full stop!

They will not question the koran, mohamad, islam or allah.

Talk to the muslims on this board about 112

Translation: Surah 112: Al-Ikhlas (The Unity, Sincerity, Oneness Of Allah)

In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful

1. Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;

1. Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;

1. He does not beget, nor is He begotten;

1. And there is none comparable to him.

And besides all of this, muslims think that mohamad could do no wrong no matter how horrible it is to us. He is their pillar, their example of life.

So, please, bring the dead threads foward and correct the muslims, correct their belief with your approach.

I’ll sit back and read & watch as they tell you we worship 3 gods and other nonsense.

 

[doughnut]

I actually posted this because Christians of so many Christians who are the ignorant ones. Who say that ‘Muhammad was a nice guy’, or something similar to that. They are the ones defending something they know nothing about. And I think that is very dangerous since it gives others the completely wrong idea about Muhammad and think it is ok to defend him too.

I want people to know what they are defending and I would prefer that they read Islamic texts themselves (something that the majority of Muslims don’t even do because they are told not to question).

My take on Muhammad is more like, he lead a live that is pretty much very ‘human’, very expected of somebody in leadership. Many Muslims are peaceloving, though in my opinion not so much of what Muhammad actually said, but because they do established a personal relationship with God, through their own devotions, and are inspired to be good. (Not all Muslims are particularly well-versed in their Quran either ~ ) It is considerably more difficult when one isn’t Christian, because one’s concept of God is ‘flawed’ (come to think of it, many Christians are ignorant of their own faith as well so im not so sure if it matters greatly now…)

I live in a community that has a significant amount of Muslims around me, and they are peaceful people; and many of them genuinely believed their God (Allah) wanted them to be peaceful and kind. Although I do read up a fair bit on this religion, I don’t feel ‘enlightened’ enough to bash them, because at the end of the day, anger and hatred stemmed mostly, from ignorance. By indulging ourselves in unloving qualities, we are going against what Jesus had stood for. I think He would be very hurt to know that we bore deep rooted venom towards our fellow brothers and sisters of human race.

 

[RockyRoad]

My take on Muhammad is more like, he lead a live that is pretty much very ‘human’, very expected of somebody in leadership. Many Muslims are peaceloving, though in my opinion not so much of what Muhammad actually said, but because they do established a personal relationship with God, through their own devotions, and are inspired to be good. (Not all Muslims are particularly well-versed in their Quran either ~ ) It is considerably more difficult when one isn’t Christian, because one’s concept of God is ‘flawed’ (come to think of it, many Christians are ignorant of their own faith as well so im not so sure if it matters greatly now…)

I live in a community that has a significant amount of Muslims around me, and they are peaceful people; and many of them genuinely believed their God (Allah) wanted them to be peaceful and kind. Although I do read up a fair bit on this religion, I don’t feel ‘enlightened’ enough to bash them, because at the end of the day, anger and hatred stemmed mostly, from ignorance. By indulging ourselves in unloving qualities, we are going against what Jesus had stood for. I think He would be very hurt to know that we bore deep rooted venom towards our fellow brothers and sisters of human race.

Okay…may I suggest pondering this.

Gabriel told Mary she would have the Christ. The Word made Flesh. Gabriel told mohammad that Jesus isn’t God. Who would have the most to gain from rejection of Christ? Could it be Satan? Could mohammad’s gabriel been from Satan? One of the Gabriels isn’t from God. The other is.

 

[qwerk]

There are many threads about islam/muslims/mohamad on here.

Please feel free to browse them, post and “preach to the muslims” about their mis-understanding and how you can “teach” them about the truth.

They deny the divinity of Our Lord Jesus! Full stop!

They will not question the koran, mohamad, islam or allah.

Talk to the muslims on this board about 112

And besides all of this, muslims think that mohamad could do no wrong no matter how horrible it is to us. He is their pillar, their example of life.

So, please, bring the dead threads foward and correct the muslims, correct their belief with your approach.

I’ll sit back and read & watch as they tell you we worship 3 gods and other nonsense.

Thanks Jakasaki, you have explained and clarified better than I did.

 

[KS_On_The_Rock]

Maybe understand that not everyone is going to say the same thing in the same way…

(Please read this post and the one after it together it would not allow me to fit it all in one. Thanks! )

qwerk,

 I am sorry if you took my response as me complaining about how you post. I wasn’t trying to come across like that but rather state maybe a better way to make your points clear.If I offended you, I offer my most sincere apology.  
 
 As mentioned above in previous posts. I totally understand the need to correct the ideas and teachings of Islam. I have no problem with that whatsoever. I pray every day that the Holy Spirit fills my heart and works through me to do this. Muslims do deny the divinity of Christ and that will leave them sorry later if they don't come to accept it as truth. I agree with you 100% on that idea. And I think that you are doing a fine job of showing your testimony to the truth by stating that particular point. I do however feel that many of us as Christians are not going about this correctly when trying to prove the real truth but producing much negativity towards Muslims beliefs. In no way am I trying to argue with anyone that is the last reason I would come to this forum and thread. I am simply trying to show others what I believe we need to be doing when dealing with this religion and its people as a whole.

 I can see your frustrations in that you are often encountering Christians whom you feel are defending Islam and the teachings of Mohammad. I won’t restate my views on what is actually being done in that regard, because obviously it isn’t necessary. I personally have never stated that Islam is a great religion. I do not claim to support Mohammad or the teachings of Islam, but I do support those Muslims who sincerely believe that they are practicing their religion the best way they have been taught. I support those Muslims who feel they are doing what God wants them to do. I support them because many of them have never even heard the true message of the Gospel and the Lord Jesus Christ. They also have never seen it practiced in the way that it was meant to be. I wholeheartedly believe that if we as Christians did in fact show them the real truth in a peaceful way and allow them the time to come to terms with the fact that the religion and belief system they previously knew was wrong, that they would have to accept the truth, especially if they were sincerely seeking it. I believe this because to me it is so obvious when analyzed correctly. 

 However, it is easy to say that Christianity is the only true way especially when you are a Christian, but think about it in their terms. They were not born Christians, they were not taught to live as Christians are supposed to, they were born to regard Christianity as wrong; in much the same sense that we believe Islam is wrong. To be told Christianity is the truth and Islam is not, is easily understood to be very hard to come to terms with. Especially if so much of your life has depended on that belief system. We need to be compassionate towards their situation. So I am proud to say that yes I support them because they need our support. They are strongly misguided and need us Christians to help point them in the right direction, and correct the wrongs Islam teaches. This is certainly not an easy task, especially when you yourself know the truth and others don’t see it as you do. 

 There are major issues when dealing with Muslims, as you have mentioned, especially in regards to them not being able to question their religion. This is even more of a concern in countries that practice Shari ‘a law. That is very understandable, and that is when we need to be even more careful of our tactics in trying to help them understand the truth.  Instead of pointing out all of the negative things, let’s start by telling them things which will in turn generate thinking, for example, “Why are they not allowed to question their religion?” Because they might discover that it is wrong?  “Why is the Quran only fully understood in its true language?” Because that is a way to silence non Arabic speaking people when they point out its contradictions?  “How is Islam said to be a universal religion, yet then only fully able to be understood if you're an Arabic speaking Muslim?” Because it isn’t really a universal religion? These are ways I feel are good tactics, let’s not point blankly tell them they are wrong. That will again only intimidate them, but let’s generate some thinking, and allow them the room (and the time) to come up with the answers that will ultimately lead them to the full truth of the Lord Jesus.

 

[KS_On_The_Rock]

Maybe understand that not everyone is going to say the same thing in the same way…

(Here is part 2 of my last post thanks for reading it all!

   I agree with you on the point that if you say something about their prophet Mohammad and Islam they get upset. I understand that they are not to criticize Islam, and that yes they may in fact only be here to spread their beliefs and the message of Islam…but regardless they are here!  They must have been brought here for a reason, now it is up to us to help that reason turn positive and help them along the way to the real truth. 

 Certainly Muslims get defensive when you start bashing their religion...to them it is correct. The same way we as Christians, or Jews, or any religion for that matter would feel if someone started telling us what we believe, and what many have grown up to believe was wrong. I know this because I have found myself in that position many times. I know from personal experience when a Muslim tells me that Jesus Christ is not the Lord, that I get upset...as most Christians would. So in that same regard by coming right out and stating that their most important prophet is wrong, of course that upsets them. They need to be shown in the most sincere and peaceful way that what Mohammad brought to the table is not right. We need to stop saying all the negative things, although I personally do agree with some of those things, they might even come to agree with you on those points later on but for now we need to prove to them in a way that doesn't immediately put them on a defensive and close off the possibility of changing their lives for the better. By doing that we arent intimidating them. I’m sure we all have been intimidated in our lives and who doesn’t get defensive when this occurs, it’s only natural. 

 We have no way of knowing what each Muslim knows or does not know. You’re right we can’t assume that they are not practicing religiously sanctioned deception as you have stated. Understanding that they may indeed feel victimized though is something different. Regardless if they feel that it is for their life or the fact that they are not advancing their religion. It is very difficult to deal with the fact that someone is telling you that what you believe is not correct. It's VERY personal and affects us in a very personal way. That is also only natural. 

 I agree that when trying to prove Islam wrong that the very best place to go is to their own sources. I fully understand that these sources are highly contradictory as you obviously do to, but do they? No, they have no way of knowing this because they have been taught no such thing. They are taught to not question the divine revelation of the Qur’an. So again we have to be even more careful in the tactics that we use when sharing Christianity with them. Do not bash their book instead show a respect for what they believe and then prove it wrong by showing them the real truth; the truth in the Bible, but even more importantly, the truth in the Divine message of Jesus Christ. I also agree 100% that many Muslims are ignorant to their own texts, this is where we come into play and I like the way you have such a passion for doing this, but understand that they will in turn, turn around and point out to you what they feel is contradictory in the Bible. And let me remind you, many Christians my friend, are also ignorant to the teachings of our own book, and this could be considered a failing of Christianity to many Muslims, that is where the importance of our actions comes even more into play. I do want to point out as I have mentioned above I understand your passion and zeal for this topic because I myself also feel it. I feel the need to help Muslims learn the truth and want them to know God the way we as Christians know him. We are all His creation, and we all have a right to know Him the way He intended us to know Him.

One last side note: I do not want to be the one that you all do not want around on this thread, so if you would like I can go my own ways and find somewhere else to converse. I sincerely hope that is not the case because I find comfort in the fact that I am not the only one who wants to show Muslims the Truth, but out of respect for your thread and what you are trying to do here I will leave if you want me to.

Thanks for taking the time to read what I have to say I do appreciate it! And please consider joining my group on CAF, Praying for Muslims. Thank you!

May God Bless you and keep you in the palm of His hand. :hug3:
KS

 

[KS_On_The_Rock]

There are many threads about islam/muslims/mohamad on here.

Please feel free to browse them, post and “preach to the muslims” about their mis-understanding and how you can “teach” them about the truth.

They deny the divinity of Our Lord Jesus! Full stop!

They will not question the koran, mohamad, islam or allah.

Talk to the muslims on this board about 112

And besides all of this, muslims think that mohamad could do no wrong no matter how horrible it is to us. He is their pillar, their example of life.

So, please, bring the dead threads foward and correct the muslims, correct their belief with your approach.

I’ll sit back and read & watch as they tell you we worship 3 gods and other nonsense.

Jakasaki,

I am not quite sure how to respond to your post because I honestly can’t recognize if you are being sarcastic or not. I fully understand that there are many threads on here regarding this topic, and I can see many arguments breaking out because of them. This is sad because this should in fact be a unifying topic. Bringing others to Christ that is. As humans obviously we aren’t always going to agree on points about things especially regarding religion, but I think it is safe to say that you get farther with honey than vinegar.

I am not trying to put anyone of my fellow Christians down in any way for defending their faith, I am only trying to get them to see that it is much easier to start to try to spread the Gospel with love. I feel it is absolutely necessary to share the Gospel with Muslims, and other non-Christians alike. But I am not one to try and talk to people by insulting them, and what they have grown up with, or have been taught their entire lives. I think it’s also safe to say that most people are not going to be receptive to that approach.

For ideas on good ways to share the Gospel message please visit the following link it may be useful. catholic.com/thisrock/2003/0301fea5.asp

As for your comments on bringing the dead threads forward and correcting the Muslims with my approach, I could only hope that the Holy Spirit will work through me in that regard. I don’t however have to even log on to see this happening. The Holy Spirit works through me daily, because I live in a very Muslim dominated area. For those who are not familiar with it, Metro-Detroit houses the largest concentrated community of Arab Muslims in the Unites States. In Particular the Dearborn area. I also am married to a Lebanese Muslim and work in a predominantly Muslim environment.

Many of my closest friends are in fact Muslim; this is probably why I feel such a strong passion for this sharing of the Gospel. I can see this approach working more and more every day. I won’t however lie and say that at times I myself do not get intimidated, because there have been many times where I am at a loss for what to say, or how to say it, because this does happen to me, and it happens often. I do find though that many Muslims find a curiosity in the idea of love that Christians share with others, and are receptive to it. So I truly believe that God has the power to work through us, and ultimately God is Love, so feel free to sit back and watch me try, but I wish rather that you wouldn’t and instead try it for yourself as well!

The Lord said it himself, Matthew: 5: 43 “You have heard it said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, love your enemies, and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your heavenly Father, for he makes his sun rise on the bad and the good, and causes rain to fall on the just and the unjust. *For if you love those who love you, what reward is there in that?” *

I think that we all need to pray for these people. These Muslims who may in fact, as you have stated, tell us that we worship three gods, and other false accusations about Christianity. Let’s try to correct these misconceptions in a proper way. Do you not believe that the Holy Spirit is capable of opening their eyes? Their hearts? Their minds? Do you not have faith in Him? Please don’t give up my friend, and just sit back and watch faithlessly, because through the Lord ALL things are possible!

May God Bless you and keep you in the palm of His hand. :hug3:

KS

 

[elwill]

 “Why are they not allowed to question their religion?” Because they might discover that it is wrong?  “Why is the Quran only fully understood in its true language?” Because that is a way to silence non Arabic speaking people when they point out its contradictions?  “How is Islam said to be a universal religion, yet then only fully able to be understood if you're an Arabic speaking Muslim?” Because it isn’t really a universal religion? These are ways I feel are good tactics, let’s not point blankly tell them they are wrong. That will again only intimidate them, but let’s generate some thinking, and allow them the room (and the time) to come up with the answers that will ultimately lead them to the full truth of the Lord Jesus.

i like your words KS_On_The_Rock
may can i answer some of your questions here if you don’t mind

“Why are they not allowed to question their religion?
this knowledge is wrong , may can i give you some sites where muslims and nonmuslims can ask whatever they want about islam

“Why is the Quran only fully understood in its true language?”
not only the quran , i think that any book will be fully understood in its true languge rather than it’s translation

How is Islam said to be a universal religion, yet then only fully able to be understood if you’re an Arabic speaking Muslim?”
i think that quran is understandable in other languges as well

isn’t bible will be only fully able to be understood if you are hebrew/ greek speaking christian ?

 

[elwill]

Okay…may I suggest pondering this.

Gabriel told Mary she would have the Christ. The Word made Flesh. Gabriel told mohammad that Jesus isn’t God. Who would have the most to gain from rejection of Christ? Could it be Satan? Could mohammad’s gabriel been from Satan? One of the Gabriels isn’t from God. The other is.

but muslims believes allready that jesus is the christ , the word made flesh

 

[RockyRoad]

but muslims believes allready that jesus is the christ , the word made flesh

but you don’t believe that Jesus is God. That is where salvation comes from.

 

[pwl]

“Jesus vs Muhammad”

Sound like a boxing match !!

SO who won or is the fight still on.

I wouldnt worry about it - you will find out when you are dead.

pwl

 

[RockyRoad]

“Jesus vs Muhammad”

Sound like a boxing match !!

SO who won or is the fight still on.

I wouldnt worry about it - you will find out when you are dead.

pwl

We know who won.

Satan can’t win over Jesus…and that’s who misguided Mo.

 

[jakasaki]

~ snip ~ …

KS

I wasn’t being sarcastic - if I was I would have done one of these —>

You are a Catholic and you are married to a muslim woman, so what.

According to their faith & sunna, she cannot marry a “man of the book” <— which is you, and still remain a muslim.

Anyway this thread is not about you, your muslim wife and Dearborn Michigan which is flooded by muslims. It’s about the comparison of Our Lord Jesus vs mohamad.

There is no comparison at all.

We on this board have tried a bazzilion times to “correct their misconceptions in a proper way” regarding Christianity/Jesus/The Holy Spirit/God The Father… etc… etc…

If their mind is not willing to accept what we tell them in a charitable way and they come back with the same old arguments all you have is this —> :banghead:

Stick around my friend and try to educate Planten, Hamba, Elwill and the other muslim member posters we have on here.

We had many knowledgeable Catholics/Christians in this Non-Catholic sub forum who tried and tried to educate the muslim members as you are trying.

Each and everyone of them failed to get the message across to the muslims.

You can be the greatest teacher in the world, however, if your student is unwilling to listen and understand your teaching, the teaching task has failed.

TGIF!

 

[doughnut]

Okay…may I suggest pondering this.

Gabriel told Mary she would have the Christ. The Word made Flesh. Gabriel told mohammad that Jesus isn’t God. Who would have the most to gain from rejection of Christ? Could it be Satan? Could mohammad’s gabriel been from Satan? One of the Gabriels isn’t from God. The other is.

If pondering over this leds me to hating my fellow Muslim brothers and sisters, then I shall question the purpose of doing so. If Islamic Faith is pure violence, then they were not particularly that successful, considering the world population of Muslims, the troublemaker jihads does not belong to the majority…just like we knew that pedophilic priests arent really the catholic church’s fault. One will argue that the priests’ conduct does not stem from doctrine ~ but, realised that even if the said doctrine is ‘evil’, our fellow human beings are all God’s creation, and most remained steep in their peaceful and loving nature. Now if Islam came from Satan, he isn’t winning either.

 

[RockyRoad]

If pondering over this leds me to hating my fellow Muslim brothers and sisters, then I shall question the purpose of doing so. If Islamic Faith is pure violence, then they were not particularly that successful, considering the world population of Muslims, the troublemaker jihads does not belong to the majority…just like we knew that pedophilic priests arent really the catholic church’s fault. One will argue that the priests’ conduct does not stem from doctrine ~ but, realised that even if the said doctrine is ‘evil’, our fellow human beings are all God’s creation, and most remained steep in their peaceful and loving nature. Now if Islam came from Satan, he isn’t winning either.

I don’t remember using the word “hate” toward anybody. At least we know where you’re coming from. Islam not violent. You’ve got to be kidding. Perhaps you need to take a course in western Civilization and the attacks by your muslim friends through the many centuries. Oh let me give you a link that I just received. Maybe you can start your history lesson there. You don’t have to read…just watch for 3 minutes.

lucianne.com/article/?pageid=marines_usually_have_the_answer

Hmmm…the crusades…were those wars of offense or defense by Christians?

Lepenta…hmmm…Christian battle of offense or defense?

9/11…offense or defense?

I’ll tell ya what. I’ll put together a list of battles for ya. Okay? Then we’ll talk about violent religions and peaceful religions. But more importantly…we can talk about what religion teaches peace and what religions teaches to kill those that don’t follow Mo.

I’ve gotta laugh out loud to your Satan isn’t winning comment. It show your lack of knowledge right down to the very basics. Who has the most to gain from the rejection of Christ as God. SATAN!!! Who has been mislead away from Christ. About 1 billion current day muslims. And now back to the original question to ponder. Which Gabriel do you believe. Mary’s Gabriel or Mo’s gabriel. They both tell a different story. One proclaims Christ as God. The other proclaims Christians as dogs and pigs who elevated Christ to God and corrupted the bible. You’re choice. One Gabriel is from God and one isn’t…that is of course unless you believe that God lied the first time around. Or worse yet…that the first Gabriel was not from God.

 

[KS_On_The_Rock]

I wasn’t being sarcastic - if I was I would have done one of these —>

You are a Catholic and you are married to a muslim woman, so what.

According to their faith & sunna, she cannot marry a “man of the book” <— which is you, and still remain a muslim.

Anyway this thread is not about you, your muslim wife and Dearborn Michigan which is flooded by muslims. It’s about the comparison of Our Lord Jesus vs mohamad.

There is no comparison at all.

We on this board have tried a bazzilion times to “correct their misconceptions in a proper way” regarding Christianity/Jesus/The Holy Spirit/God The Father… etc… etc…

If their mind is not willing to accept what we tell them in a charitable way and they come back with the same old arguments all you have is this —> :banghead:

Stick around my friend and try to educate Planten, Hamba, Elwill and the other muslim member posters we have on here.

We had many knowledgeable Catholics/Christians in this Non-Catholic sub forum who tried and tried to educate the muslim members as you are trying.

Each and everyone of them failed to get the message across to the muslims.

You can be the greatest teacher in the world, however, if your student is unwilling to listen and understand your teaching, the teaching task has failed.

TGIF!

Jakasaki,

Just to correct you, I am a Catholic woman, married to a Muslim man. And according to my faith, and his we are in fact allowed to marry, and did in fact marry in the Catholic Church. This however as you have previously stated is not what this thread is about, and i totally agree. I also only mentioned this and the fact that I live in a predominantly Muslim area because I was trying to prove the point that I have seen the Holy Spirit working in my life and in those Muslims around me. This was in an effort to put it out there for others on the thread that you should have hope and no, it is not a dead end.

Can you imagine if Jesus had given up the effort to teach those around Him because he got frustrated? Of course not because that would not be the right thing to do, and totally against His purpose entirely.

I AGREE with you and the other Christians on this forum who have stated numerous times that there are no comparisons between Jesus and Mohammad because Jesus is the Lord our God. In no way am I trying to or have I tried to state that at all.

It is easy to assume that many Muslims have no possibilities of changing their hearts, or minds and sadly that is the conclusion of many on this forum. I can totally understand that there is just cause for believing this way, but I personally do not find it to be that way because I know the power of the Holy Spirit, and I know that nothing is impossible for God. Trust Him and you too will find this to be true.

If my fellow Muslim posters would allow me the opportunity to speak with and to them, then I have no intention of giving up this fight. You should feel the same vicar for the Lord and His true message.

I also am deeply saddened when you mention the knowledgeable Christians and Catholics you have had here in the past who have “failed” (your words not mine) at this task at hand. From a negative viewpoint it is easy to say that they failed, but maybe if only getting the Muslims to read their own texts in an effort to prove their points then indeed they may not have “failed” at all.

To quote you specifically you said, “You can be the greatest teacher in the world, however, if your student is unwilling to listen and understand your teaching, the teaching task has failed.” Has the Lord failed in his ability to teach? Many people of the world do not even know the message of the Gospel yet is this a failing? Some have even heard the message or part of the message and blatantly refuse to believe, does this mean that the Lord failed? Did the Apostles fail when the preached the message of the Lord to the Gentiles and Jews and come to realize that not everyone accepted it? Of course not, because many did. And the most important idea I am trying to express here is that Jesus didn’t give up…the Apostles didn’t give up…we shouldn’t give up either. If only one Muslim can begin to see the truth then there is no failing in that. In fact I would say that is a great victory.

Everything is possible through the Lord. With the help of the Holy Spirit we can accomplish anything, and as a Christian you should know that. We all should know that. Does it mean that it isn’t going to be hard? Of course not, we know the hardships and frustrations of the battle well, but do not lose faith simply because it is hard. So as I mentioned above, I am not trying to be the one that everyone doesn’t like around here, and I am not here to argue with anyone. I can only hope that in an effort to bring others to the Lord we can become a unified body of Christ, and work at this task, knowing that it is a hard one but not impossible.

May God Bless you and keep you in the palm of His hand. :hug3:

KS

 

[doughnut]

I don’t remember using the word “hate” toward anybody. At least we know where you’re coming from. Islam not violent. You’ve got to be kidding. Perhaps you need to take a course in western Civilization and the attacks by your muslim friends through the many centuries. Oh let me give you a link that I just received. Maybe you can start your history lesson there. You don’t have to read…just watch for 3 minutes.

lucianne.com/article/?pageid=marines_usually_have_the_answer

Hmmm…the crusades…were those wars of offense or defense by Christians?

Lepenta…hmmm…Christian battle of offense or defense?

9/11…offense or defense?

I’ll tell ya what. I’ll put together a list of battles for ya. Okay? Then we’ll talk about violent religions and peaceful religions. But more importantly…we can talk about what religion teaches peace and what religions teaches to kill those that don’t follow Mo.

I’ve gotta laugh out loud to your Satan isn’t winning comment. It show your lack of knowledge right down to the very basics. Who has the most to gain from the rejection of Christ as God. SATAN!!! Who has been mislead away from Christ. About 1 billion current day muslims. And now back to the original question to ponder. Which Gabriel do you believe. Mary’s Gabriel or Mo’s gabriel. They both tell a different story. One proclaims Christ as God. The other proclaims Christians as dogs and pigs who elevated Christ to God and corrupted the bible. You’re choice. One Gabriel is from God and one isn’t…that is of course unless you believe that God lied the first time around. Or worse yet…that the first Gabriel was not from God.

Are one billion Muslims evil? chances are, not all of them are. I don’t mind if I’m viewed as ignorant, lack of knowledge, maybe you’re right. I don’t know enough. But these Muslims ‘rejected Christ’s divinity’ due to the way they were brought up in. Born into Islamic faith - not by choice for most. I didn’t want to argue further about whether the faith itself is violent or peaceful, you’re right, I’m ignorant - but I’m not muslim, I just lived in a community with a significant population of Muslims. but the people, most of them are the average person, striving to do good, and you’re condemning a whole lot of them just like that.

We must have faith in God, and continue to pray for the lost souls, that they might come to know God someday.

 

[RockyRoad]

Are one billion Muslims evil? chances are, not all of them are. I don’t mind if I’m viewed as ignorant, lack of knowledge, maybe you’re right. I don’t know enough. But these Muslims ‘rejected Christ’s divinity’ due to the way they were brought up in. Born into Islamic faith - not by choice for most. I didn’t want to argue further about whether the faith itself is violent or peaceful, you’re right, I’m ignorant - but I’m not muslim, I just lived in a community with a significant population of Muslims. but the people, most of them are the average person, striving to do good, and you’re condemning a whole lot of them just like that.

We must have faith in God, and continue to pray for the lost souls, that they might come to know God someday.

I’m not condemning the whole lot of them. I’m saying that Islam teaches violence…hatred… lying…deceit…stealing…slavery…murder…rape…torture amongst other things in order to get what it wants in the name of allah. I’m sure many muslims are fine people. We are fortunate to have been born into Christianity. Even if islam teaches we are dogs and pigs. Get my point. It’s the religion that is false. Anyone following it is following a false religion. Most refuse to learn about the Christ of the bible and instead hold onto the Jesus of the koran. The 2 Jesus’ are not remotely similar.

And I didn’t say 1 billion muslims are evil. I said 1 billion muslims have been mislead by Mo…who was inturn mislead by Satan.

 

[jakasaki]

Jakasaki,

Just to correct you, I am a Catholic woman, married to a Muslim man. And according to my faith, and his we are in fact allowed to marry, and did in fact marry in the Catholic Church. This however as you have previously stated is not what this thread is about, and i totally agree. I also only mentioned this and the fact that I live in a predominantly Muslim area because I was trying to prove the point that I have seen the Holy Spirit working in my life and in those Muslims around me. This was in an effort to put it out there for others on the thread that you should have hope and no, it is not a dead end.

Can you imagine if Jesus had given up the effort to teach those around Him because he got frustrated? Of course not because that would not be the right thing to do, and totally against His purpose entirely.

I AGREE with you and the other Christians on this forum who have stated numerous times that there are no comparisons between Jesus and Mohammad because Jesus is the Lord our God. In no way am I trying to or have I tried to state that at all.

It is easy to assume that many Muslims have no possibilities of changing their hearts, or minds and sadly that is the conclusion of many on this forum. I can totally understand that there is just cause for believing this way, but I personally do not find it to be that way because I know the power of the Holy Spirit, and I know that nothing is impossible for God. Trust Him and you too will find this to be true.

If my fellow Muslim posters would allow me the opportunity to speak with and to them, then I have no intention of giving up this fight. You should feel the same vicar for the Lord and His true message.

I also am deeply saddened when you mention the knowledgeable Christians and Catholics you have had here in the past who have “failed” (your words not mine) at this task at hand. From a negative viewpoint it is easy to say that they failed, but maybe if only getting the Muslims to read their own texts in an effort to prove their points then indeed they may not have “failed” at all.

To quote you specifically you said, “You can be the greatest teacher in the world, however, if your student is unwilling to listen and understand your teaching, the teaching task has failed.” Has the Lord failed in his ability to teach? Many people of the world do not even know the message of the Gospel yet is this a failing? Some have even heard the message or part of the message and blatantly refuse to believe, does this mean that the Lord failed? Did the Apostles fail when the preached the message of the Lord to the Gentiles and Jews and come to realize that not everyone accepted it? Of course not, because many did. And the most important idea I am trying to express here is that Jesus didn’t give up…the Apostles didn’t give up…we shouldn’t give up either. If only one Muslim can begin to see the truth then there is no failing in that. In fact I would say that is a great victory.

Everything is possible through the Lord. With the help of the Holy Spirit we can accomplish anything, and as a Christian you should know that. We all should know that. Does it mean that it isn’t going to be hard? Of course not, we know the hardships and frustrations of the battle well, but do not lose faith simply because it is hard. So as I mentioned above, I am not trying to be the one that everyone doesn’t like around here, and I am not here to argue with anyone. I can only hope that in an effort to bring others to the Lord we can become a unified body of Christ, and work at this task, knowing that it is a hard one but not impossible.

May God Bless you and keep you in the palm of His hand. :hug3:

KS

Very well KS, Catholic woman married to a muslim man, living in Dearborn Michigan ~

I know by asking this question I am “derailing” Qwerks thread, ~ I’m sorry Qwerk ~ but out of curiosity KS, is your muslim husband now a Catholic or is he still a follower of islam?

Also, how many Dearborn muslims have you converted to Christianity?

 

[hamba2han]

I do not quite understand why people should have :banghead: as an expression when talking to those of other faiths.

I think that they may have lost the plot as to their purpose in participating in this forum.

I would suggest that they view success and failure on these message boards in the following terms:

Has reading the various responses to your posts helped strengthened your own faith?

If you answer ‘YES’, that may indeed be considered a success.

On the other hand, if your answer is ‘NO’, that in turn could well be the start of the greatest success that you will ever achieve in life, only the Almighty would know for sure.