Jews who became Catholics: some commonalities

[deb1]

You’re a riot, LOL! Personally I like Eastern European Jewish food because I (partly) grew up on it. I also grew on up Italian food (made kosher, of course), because my mom was an Italian Jew.

Ever had a pizza knish? They are to die for, trust me!

There used to be a wonderful Jewish Italian cookbook that my hubby and I once borrowed. The food was delicious!

 

[dessert]

I have posted to explain how I first ended up on this site. It had to do with some questions I had about things my late mother told me about Catholic legends (she was a Catholic who converted to Judaism.) I ended up sticking aorund for a bit.

You need to understand something: I do not consider Jews who become Catholics as “Catholics”: they are Jews who apostasized. In the eyes of Judaism, they are no more “Catholic” than a man who puts on woman’s clothing is a woman.

But your religion sees it the same, in reverse: to Catholicism, once someone is baptized a Catholic, they can never be anything else.

So at least we agree on that!

Actually if your mother converted then she was baptised a Catholic. And she was still one and she was apostizised by Judaism. I was baptized Catholic and proselyted by my protestant husband Peace on him, and am now back but not pushing him ( in fact encourage him to seek the methodist again in order to have closure with some things he disagreed with ) to join me because after all this is the USA. I am open to anything, My heritage may be Prussian but that doesn’t have to go all the way back for that. If all the proselyted Catholics were to come back there would be another billion more than likely. A lot less Protestants atheists etc. and a heck of a lot less Jews.

 

[Freshman88]

If it is true that Jewish converts to the Holy Faith have died suddenly, then it can only be interpreted as a great blessing. What greater joy can a Christian have, then to be taken home by their Heavenly Father, so soon after washing their sins away in the Holy waters of Baptism.

Perhaps God is so pleased with their conversion, that He could not wait to receive them.

Eternal Memory to any such converts, if they do indeed exist.

 

[AlegreFe]

It seems you are trying to be complacent or ‘lukewarm’ just to try to please everyone.

I agree that nothing is gained by attacking the Jewish faith. I also think that nothing is gained by attacking Jewish people especially.

Again, you seem to be complacent; “I’m okay, you’re okay.” Do you think many religions are okay or valid? Valid faith? What exactly do you mean by that?

I’m afraid you’re wrong on that. The Catholic faith has the Word of God who is Jesus Christ. Jesus said, no one comes to the Father except through me. So you cannot say “just as the Catholic faith is” because the faiths are not the same. We might have our roots in Judaism but our faith is not the same as Jesus came to fulfill Judaism with Catholicism.

There is only one path to God and that is Jesus Christ.

Surely ones who are ignorant of Jesus or Christianity but who lead a good life and believe in the one God can surely get to God. But you cannot say there are many paths to one end because there is only one end as there is only one beginning and that is God. That path is narrow and only a few go through that narrow gate.

 

[AlegreFe]

Do yo think this is hate coming from Catholics?

Catholic Church to beatify Hungarian nun who saved Jews in World War II

A Hungarian nun who helped saved the lives of dozens of Jews during World War II will be beatified by the Catholic Church, officials said Monday.

Sara Salkahazi was killed by the Arrow Cross - the Hungarian allies of the Nazis - on December 27, 1944 for hiding Jews in a Budapest building used by her religious order, the Sisters of Social Service.

Salkahazi was taken along with several other occupants of the home and shot, their bodies falling into the Danube River and never recovered.

The beatification rite will take place September 17 at Budapest’s St. Stephen Basilica.

“Sara Salkahazi heroically exercised her love of humanity stemming from her Christian faith,” said Cardinal Peter Erdo, who will celebrate the beatification mass. “This is for what she gave her life.”

Salkahazi was born in the city of Kassa in 1899, at the time in Hungary but now known as Kosice and part of Slovakia.

The beatification will be the first in Hungary since 1083, when Hungary’s first king, St. Stephen, was beatified along with his son, St. Imre, and St. Gellert, an Italian bishop who had a key role in converting Hungarians to Christianity.

Changes introduced by Pope Benedict XVI again allow beatification rites to be held around the world, instead of just in the Vatican, as was the norm for centuries.

Church officials highlighted Salkahazi’s modest middle-class roots, saying she will be first Hungarian to be beatified who is not royalty or a member of the country’s aristocracy.

Before taking her religious vows in 1930, Salkahazi worked as a bookbinder, journalist and newspaper editor.

Salkahazi’s deeds were recognized in 1972 by Yad Vashem.

Here’s another article;
When Rome’s Religious Houses Saved Jews ← full article

Interview With Historian Sister Grazia Loparco

ROME, JAN. 21, 2005 (Zenit.org).- Testimonies and documents reflect that Pius XII gave ecclesial institutions instructions to shelter and help Jews in Rome when Nazi persecution broke out during World War II.

No one knows exactly how many Jews were hidden and saved by the Church, but according to “Three Popes and the Jews” by Jewish historian Emilio Pinchas Lapide, then consul general in Milan, “the Holy See, the nuncios, and the Catholic Church saved between 740,000 and 850,000 Jews from certain death.”

 

[AlegreFe]

In Judaism we do not see any other religion as a “fulfillment” of our religion. Our religion is fine in and of itself.

Of course you wouldn’t see it that way because you don’t believe that Jesus is the Massiah. If you did then you would fully understand how the Catholic faith is the fulfillment of the Jewish faith.

As for my mother, she passed away this past March.

So sorry. May perpetual light shine upon her and may her soul through the mercy of God rest in peace. Amen.

My family and I were reniniscing about things she had once told us, which is what prompted my online Googling of some old Holy Week legends she’d told us about, hence my original finding of this site.

Can I ask what those “holy week legends” were of which your mother spoke?

 

[AlegreFe]

Here is a good article;

Why Jews Are Better Off in the Catholic Church Than in the Jews for Jesus

 

[Eden]

Believe it or not, I’ve also been very active offline in Jewish-Christian ecumenical relations work. I have met and befriended some well-known people in this work, including the late John Cardinal O’Connor, whom I counted as a good friend of mine and with whom I shared much correspondence. Cardinal O’Connor, as I’m sure you will agree, was a great man and a prince of the church. Yet not once did he ever try to convert me. And he helped a Jewish man named Stephen Dubner in his return to Judaism from the Catholicism in which he had been raised.

It actually was not until I ended up here that I began to really meet adult Catholics who harbor bitterness and a conversionary mentality toward Jews (not all of you, but many of you).

How do many Catholics feel about Jack Chick, due to his constant efforts to convert Catholics and misinterpret their beliefs? Not very friendly, I’m sure. Well, its like that.

So, you mock Catholics and claim we are idolaters holding hands with statues and talking to them because you met a few anonymous people on a forum who claim to be Catholic and said vicious things? It sounds like most of your real-world experiences with Catholics have been positive. Wow. That’s a really nice way to return the favor, by mocking us and our beliefs on this forum…

 

[HashemEchad]

If it is true that Jewish converts to the Holy Faith have died suddenly, then it can only be interpreted as a great blessing. What greater joy can a Christian have, then to be taken home by their Heavenly Father, so soon after washing their sins away in the Holy waters of Baptism.

Perhaps God is so pleased with their conversion, that He could not wait to receive them.

Eternal Memory to any such converts, if they do indeed exist.

One of the Ten Commandments says, “Honor thy father and thy mother, that thy days may be long…” The NT calls this “the commandment with promise”.

The Bible associates a long life with godliness, not a short life.

 

[HashemEchad]

So, you mock Catholics and claim we are idolaters holding hands with statues and talking to them because you met a few anonymous people on a forum who claim to be Catholic and said vicious things? It sounds like most of your real-world experiences with Catholics have been positive. Wow. That’s a really nice way to return the favor, by mocking us and our beliefs on this forum…

With one exception, my experiences offline with Catholics has been tremendously positive. But if you want a clue as to why I have sounded so upset on this forum, see post #85, last paragraph. He “gets it”.

I think the anonymity of the internet allows some to say what they really felt all along, but would never dare to say to a Jew’s face.

 

[HashemEchad]

Of course you wouldn’t see it that way because you don’t believe that Jesus is the Massiah. If you did then you would fully understand how the Catholic faith is the fulfillment of the Jewish faith.

So sorry. May perpetual light shine upon her and may her soul through the mercy of God rest in peace. Amen.

Can I ask what those “holy week legends” were of which your mother spoke?

The belief that it always rains on Good Friday was one. See the thread about “Holy Week Legends”.

 

[HashemEchad]

Here is a good article;

Why Jews Are Better Off in the Catholic Church Than in the Jews for Jesus

I don’t agree. I think Jews are better off in Torah Judaism, because that is the Covenant God ordained for all of us.

Tell me, those of you who think it is your duty to try to convert Jews. Are you better Catholics than the late John Cardinal O’Connor?

He was a good friend of mine and a long-time correspondent. I met him via my activity in the pro-life movement.

NOT ONCE did he ever even try to convert me to Christianity. And, he also assisted a former Catholic of Jewish birth to return to Judaism, by facilitating a meeting with the man’s mother, to assure her her son was doing what was best for him.

Read: stephenjdubner.com/journalism/051500.html

Are you somehow a better Catholic than the Cardinal was?

 

[AlegreFe]

The belief that it always rains on Good Friday was one.

Huh? I never heard that. I remember when I was a kid and even as an adult that it did rain sometimes on Good Friday and even with thunder & lightening. But I don’t remember it raining every single Good Friday and I never heard of any such “legend” like that. I didn’t even know there was such “legends” that Catholics believed.

 

[Eden]

The belief that it always rains on Good Friday was one. See the thread about “Holy Week Legends”.

I’ve never heard that. It may have been a “folk belief” amongst a certain group of people (?) but has certainly never been a teaching of the Church.

 

[Eden]

With one exception, my experiences offline with Catholics has been tremendously positive. But if you want a clue as to why I have sounded so upset on this forum, see post #85, last paragraph. He “gets it”.

I think the anonymity of the internet allows some to say what they really felt all along, but would never dare to say to a Jew’s face.

So, some people are rude to you on an anonymous internet forum and that justifies your rude behavior? Oh, right, “turn the other cheek” is in the *New *Testament. :doh2:

 

[HashemEchad]

I’ve never heard that. It may have been a “folk belief” amongst a certain group of people (?) but has certainly never been a teaching of the Church.

…which is why I referred to it as a legend when I first came here.

 

[AlegreFe]

I don’t agree. I think Jews are better off in Torah Judaism, because that is the Covenant God ordained for all of us.

If there was no Catholic faith then you would be correct. If Jesus had not come yet as the Messiah then you would be right in saying what you say. But since Jesus did come to deliver us then you are wrong. But since you do not believe that Jesus is the Messiah perhaps because of your ignorance God will have mercy on you and you could still be saved when that time comes. I have nothing to say about that as I have no right to say whether you would be saved or not. Only God knows your heart and only He can decide whether He wants you in Heaven with Him at the end of your time here on earth.

Tell me, those of you who think it is your duty to try to convert Jews. Are you better Catholics than the late John Cardinal O’Connor?

I never tried to convert a Jew. As far as the late John Cardinal O’Connor, he was a great Catholic and I cannot say that I am a better Catholic than he is. I can’t even say that I’m a better Catholic than a lot of Catholics who are good, faithful, staunch, devout Catholics.

Are you somehow a better Catholic than the Cardinal was?

I am better than no one. Especially not better than the late Archbishop of New York. May he rest in peace.

 

[HashemEchad]

If there was no Catholic faith then you would be correct. If Jesus had not come yet as the Messiah then you would be right in saying what you say. But since Jesus did come to deliver us then you are wrong. But since you do not believe that Jesus is the Messiah perhaps because of your ignorance God will have mercy on you and you could still be saved when that time comes. I have nothing to say about that as I have no right to say whether you would be saved or not. Only God knows your heart and only He can decide whether He wants you in Heaven with Him at the end of your time here on earth.

I never tried to convert a Jew…

Your comments contradict each other.

You say you never tried to convert a Jew, yet I am a Jew and your first statement is a direct wish for my conversion.

What galls me about Christians is when they refer to their beliefs as if they are FACTS. I do not refer to my religious beliefs as facts, even though I believe 100% in them. I consider that rude and an affront to those who do not share my beliefs.

Maybe I’ve been in ecumenical work too long…because we try to be respectful of the beliefs of others by always prefacing what we say about our faith with “I believe…”

I believe that because I am a Jew who keeps Torah, that God will lead me into the Olam Ha’Ba; I am 100% certain of that and have no doubts whatsoever. God has worked so many miracles in my life and in the life of my family (especially lately), that I am convinced He loves me and blesses me for doing what He commanded.

Christians like to try to scare people with tales of everlasting hellfires and gruesome demons…but I know better as a Jew. I know that any religion that has to depend on such horror stories is an insecure faith with little to recommend it to outsiders.

If you need to try to scare and intimidate people into your religion, then its not worth the paper its beliefs are written on, frankly…in my opinion.

 

[Eden]

…which is why I referred to it as a legend when I first came here.

I wouldn’t refer to it as a “Catholic legend”, which is inaccurate. A legend is a story coming from the past that has already occurred, versus being recurring, that may or may not be historically accurate. You are not referring to a specific incident in time, but a belief in something recurring. This would fall into the category of “folk beliefs”.

 

[AlegreFe]

Your comments contradict each other.

You say you never tried to convert a Jew, yet I am a Jew and your first statement is a direct wish for my conversion.

What galls me about Christians is when they refer to their beliefs as if they are FACTS. I do not refer to my religious beliefs as facts, even though I believe 100% in them. I consider that rude and an affront to those who do not share my beliefs.

Maybe I’ve been in ecumenical work too long…because we try to be respectful of the beliefs of others by always prefacing what we say about our faith with “I believe…”

I believe that because I am a Jew who keeps Torah, that God will lead me into the Olam Ha’Ba; I am 100% certain of that and have no doubts whatsoever. God has worked so many miracles in my life and in the life of my family (especially lately), that I am convinced He loves me and blesses me for doing what He commanded.

Christians like to try to scare people with tales of everlasting hellfires and gruesome demons…but I know better as a Jew. I know that any religion that has to depend on such horror stories is an insecure faith with little to recommend it to outsiders.

If you need to try to scare and intimidate people into your religion, then its not worth the paper its beliefs are written on, frankly…in my opinion.

No comment about this quote here, except that you should read my post again, and then read your reply to my post. It seems as if its a reply to some other post and not mine.

I was once going to defend you when people seemed to be attacking you. But now I have no reason to defend you.

You are right in one thing, God does love you but I know I don’t have to tell you that, you already know.