Joesph Smith and the Civil War prophecy

[why_me]

Here are some interesting sites about JS and prophecies:

lightplanet.com/mormons/people/joseph_smith/prophesies.html

lightplanet.com/mormons/response/qa/false_prophesies.htm

These are mormon perspectives of course.

 

[RebeccaJ]

RAR;3281881:

I think that if people on this section of the forum would stop attacking the lds church, Zerinus would disappear quickly. He has no interest in converting catholics. But he does believe in defending the lds church. Of course this is only my opinion.

I think you are wrong. zerinus posts in more areas than mormon subjects. Nothing wrong with that, just pointing out that he participates outside of mormon subjects.

zerinus attempts to convert people on a daily basis. PM him and ask him how many people he has fellowshipped, how many missionary referrals he has given for people he met at CAF and how many resulted in baptisms.

 

[why_me]

why me;3282839:

I think you are wrong. zerinus posts in more areas than mormon subjects. Nothing wrong with that, just pointing out that he participates outside of mormon subjects.

zerinus attempts to convert people on a daily basis. PM him and ask him how many people he has fellowshipped, how many missionary referrals he has given for people he met at CAF and how many resulted in baptisms.

I didn’t know this. I thought that he only posts in this section.

 

[zerinus]

I think that if people on this section of the forum would stop attacking the lds church, Zerinus would disappear quickly. He has no interest in converting catholics. But he does believe in defending the lds church. Of course this is only my opinion.

I am here to do what Jesus did—to “bear witness to the truth:”

John 18:37 “To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”

zerinus

 

[RebeccaJ]

I am here to do what Jesus did—to “bear witness to the truth:”*John 18:37 **“To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”***zerinus

As I said, here to proselytize. “Every member a missionary!”

 

[RAR]

why me;3282839:

I think you are wrong. zerinus posts in more areas than mormon subjects. Nothing wrong with that, just pointing out that he participates outside of mormon subjects.

zerinus attempts to convert people on a daily basis. PM him and ask him how many people he has fellowshipped, how many missionary referrals he has given for people he met at CAF and how many resulted in baptisms.

For the record… that was not my post you referenced… not sure how that happend, but those weren’t my words.

Anyway, what is “PM”? And please save me the trouble… I’m not very 'puter savvy… how many has he then?

RAR

 

[RebeccaJ]

RebeccaJ;3282935:

For the record… that was not my post you referenced… not sure how that happend, but those weren’t my words.

Anyway, what is “PM”? And please save me the trouble… I’m not very 'puter savvy… how many has he then?

RAR

Yeah, I responded to whyme. pm=private message. I doubt zerinus would answer these questions publicly or to anyone who was not a card carrying mormon.

 

[BartBurk]

As I said, here to proselytize. “Every member a missionary!”

This would sure be a lousy place to proselytize. Too many of us came out of Mormonism and can expose it for what it is for anyone to make much headway proselytizing here.

 

[RAR]

RAR;3281881:

I think that if people on this section of the forum would stop attacking the lds church, Zerinus would disappear quickly. He has no interest in converting catholics. But he does believe in defending the lds church. Of course this is only my opinion.

Thank you, but two comments… I don’t think “questioning” is the same thing as “attacking.”

I do think some people are preoccupied with wanting to feel persecuted… which does not itself a legitimate church make.

And… are you two tag-teaming?

He clearly wants to win converts… I would if I were on an LDS site, too. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to win converts… if one is being sincere about it.

RAR

 

[RebeccaJ]

why me;3282839:

Thank you, but two comments… I don’t think “questioning” is the same thing as “attacking.”

I do think some people are preoccupied with wanting to feel persecuted… which does not itself a legitimate church make.

And… are you two tag-teaming?

He clearly wants to win converts… I would if I were on an LDS site, too. There’s nothing wrong with wanting to win converts… if one is being sincere about it.

RAR

I am not a mormon, lol. Raised as, left, atheist for a couple of decades, now in RCIA.

Questioning is not the same as attacking. Pointing out facts is not attacking. Pointing out logical inconsistencies is free entertainment.

me and who tag-teaming? But no, I am not tag teaming with anyone.

Well, the rules of this forum clearly state that proselytizing is not allowed. And if you went trolling for converts at mormon sites, they would kick you off. Discussion is one thing, trying to convert someone is something else.

 

[RAR]

Sorry Rebecca,

That last post was from me… RAR, and it was directed to ol’ WhyMe… it seems there is a bit of a glitch in the forum.

Glad to have you in the Catholic Church… Welcome Home!

RAR

 

[RebeccaJ]

Sorry Rebecca,

That last post was from me… RAR, and it was directed to ol’ WhyMe… it seems there is a bit of a glitch in the forum.

Glad to have you in the Catholic Church… Welcome Home!

RAR

Or maybe its a glitch with me.

I’m done.

 

[zerinus]

Sorry Rebecca,

That last post was from me… RAR, and it was directed to ol’ WhyMe… it seems there is a bit of a glitch in the forum.

RAR

It is not a glitch. It is how you post. If you take care and do it right, it won’t happen. Learn how it works, and you will know how to do it right.

zerinus

 

[RAR]

It is not a glitch. It is how you post. If you take care and do it right, it won’t happen. Learn how it works, and you will know how to do it right.

zerinus

Trial and error, I guess.

 

[Elric]

No, but I would say that free will and agency plays a part in god’s plan. In this case, the man was killed by men who claimed their ‘free agency’ to murder.

So you are saying that God is unable to anticipate what people will do.

Sounds pretty fallable to me.

Why don’t god stop murders? Do you think that life is so preordained for you? We are all affected by our decisions and the decisions of others.

I guess that means that making prophecies impossible to do, it turns it into a guessing game that everyone has an equal shot at doing. So you cant really call anyone a prophet but rather a “good guesser”.

 

[Jerusha]

I like the phrase “vain imaginings” A false prophet makes good guesses in order to be recognized. It is an activity of vanity.

We take a look at Jonah, and how he fought against his call to become a prophet. He feared doing what God wanted him to do, because others would become angry at his warnings.

Joseph Smith enjoyed “prophesying”, because it gave him recognition, and respect among his followers, and license to do whatever he wanted to do.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

… Yes, I do. I am also aware of how Moses (or rather God) distinguished between his own calling and that of an ordinary prophet. You might have forgotten that, so I will quote it here:

Numbers 12:6 And he said, Hear now my words: If there be a prophet among you, I the Lord will make myself known unto him in a vision, and will speak unto him in a dream.7 My servant Moses is not so, who is faithful in all mine house.8 With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently , and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the Lord ** shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?Joseph Smith was such a man as Moses was. He was no ordinary prophet.

zerinus

Actually, i was speaking of this passage:

You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the LORD ?” If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him."*(Deuteronomy 18:21-22)*The way i see it, Moses was saying that the true test of a prophet is that when he predicts the future, it always comes true. I understand you do not wish to answer any of my questions about why you believe or about the Book of Mormon, but perhaps you will answer my questions about Joseph Smith?

If you will not answer my questions, perhaps someone else will: Are there any prophecies made by Joseph Smith that have proven to be false?

http://www.standardslearn.org/images/Lesson/163/Question-icon.gif

 

[zerinus]

Actually, i was speaking of this passage:

You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the LORD ?” If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him."(Deuteronomy 18:21-22)

I know you were. And I was also showing you how Moses’ station was far greater than that of an ordinary prophet. Joseph Smith was one such as Moses was.

The way i see it, Moses was saying that the true test of a prophet is that when he predicts the future, it always comes true. I understand you do not wish to answer any of my questions about why you believe or about the Book of Mormon, but perhaps you will answer my questions about Joseph Smith?

If you will not answer my questions, perhaps someone else will: Are there any prophecies made by Joseph Smith that have proven to be false?

No.

zerinus

 

[Rbt_Southwell]

Actually, i was speaking of this passage:

You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the LORD ?” If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him."(Deuteronomy 18:21-22)

 

[Elric]

Are there any prophecies made by Joseph Smith that have proven to be false?

Probably not (they change all the time), but I wouldnt get him to translate anything from ancient Egyptian.