John Lennon’s Imagine is ‘heart-chilling’, says bishop in Christmas homily

[LordHaveMercy]

When I hear a song like that, I picture Our Blessed Mother standing at the foot of the cross, silently watching Her Son suffer and die for my sins, and I turn it right off.

 

[FollowChrist34]

When I hear a song like that, I picture Our Blessed Mother standing at the foot of the cross, silently watching Her Son suffer and die for my sins, and I turn it right off.

Let It Be is a nice one for that.

I don’t like the lyrics of Imagine, but I love the melody. The song reminds of me of when I was a kid, so it is kind of bittersweet. And it reminds me of the assassination of Lennon; how sad that was. The anti-religion lyrics bother me - that is true - but no more than what I hear from left wing secular culture, every which way - and have done all my life.

 

[simple_soul]

Yes, Harrison wrote “My Sweet Lord”.
“I was inspired by the Edwin Hawkins Singers’ version of ‘Oh Happy Day,’” Harrison said.

It did not occur to me that there were two songs very much alike. I’ve heard them both and like them both.

I was unfamiliar with George Harrison. Although I have heard this song over the years I just never knew the origins of it. I like bothe songs too.

 

[Lion_IRC]

“…more popular than Jesus.”

What an ego!

#karma

 

[LongingSoul]

“…more popular than Jesus.”

What an ego!

#karma

That is so horrible. You mean his death was karma?

I think some people need to get a life even this long 50 years or so later. When he said it was an off the cuff expression of an irony and of the fickleness of the crowd. The Americans went all crazy Christian on him for it and made it into something it was not. Here is him explaining without any ego. But anyway still 50 years later people are going to use it. Talk about dishonesty.

youtube.com/watch?v=kZ6NL3iNNMs

 

[Beautiful]

It pays to keep an open mind but not so open your brains fall out.

 

[FollowChrist34]

That is so horrible. You mean his death was karma?

I think some people need to get a life even this long 50 years or so later. When he said it was an off the cuff expression of an irony and of the fickleness of the crowd. The Americans went all crazy Christian on him for it and made it into something it was not. Here is him explaining without any ego. But anyway still 50 years later people are going to use it. Talk about dishonesty.

youtube.com/watch?v=kZ6NL3iNNMs

:sad_yes: Indeed, indeed. Lennon bashing at this point in time gives a whole new spin to the phrase “spiritual poverty.”

 

[Lion_IRC]

It’s not Lennon bashing to point out the ‘heart-chilling’ implications of a song which glorifies the idea of a world without religion.

Nor is it dishonesty or spiritual poverty to call out someone who temps fate by likening himself to Jesus Christ - claiming to be bigger than Jesus in fact!

Karma? You tell me.

*"…Instant Karma’s gonna get you
Gonna knock you right on the head
You better get yourself together
Pretty soon you’re gonna be dead
What in the world you thinking of
Laughing in the face of love" *

• John Lennon

 

[Lion_IRC]

Jesus is the face of love.
Lennon was having a laugh at Jesus.

 

[Lion_IRC]

Cee Lo Green outrages John Lennon fans by altering the lyrics from “no religion” to “all religion”.
LOL
Rolling Stones Magazine

 

[philipl]

Finally someone has the gumption to tell it like it is.

Whatever the social protest mentality that led to this song, it was a paean to atheism and communism.

I honestly don’t know why nonatheists and noncommunists love it so much, except the romanticization of the Beatles and the sixties generally.

ICXC NIKA.

The was an episode of WKRP in which the song was reffered to as communistic. I remember think how stupid was the comment. But then I listen to the lyrics and had to agree.

Here are the lyrics:

"Imagine"

Imagine there’s no heaven
It’s easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today…

Imagine there’s no countries
It isn’t hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace…

You may say I’m a dreamer
But I’m not the only one
I hope someday you’ll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world…

You may say I’m a dreamer
But I’m not the only one
I hope someday you’ll join us
And the world will live as one

I am willing to bet that most liberal catholic would only disagree with the first 6 lines and the 10th. The rest they would agree with in total. I love the sound of the song, I disagree 100% with its message.

But lets look at the message.

there’s no heaven or hell because it cant be proven.

Above us only sky, or just the stuff we can measure and prove its real.

What if all the people only worried about today?

if we could get rid of all the country borders?

Then there would be Nothing to kill or die for ever.

And no religion too as its the reason for all the problems in the world

no one owned any possessions

That way there would be No need for greed or hunger and we could all be brothers and sister we just need to learn to share and we could have just one world

Living life in peace if we just do all these things. If this world came to be it would really be an awful place to live.

 

[simple_soul]

I guess some people love being greedy while others are dying the slow agonizing death of starvation. I guess some thrive on the dog-eat-dog mentality that is so prevelent to our human nature. I guess some people like living in fear of hell and some people must like thinking heaven is a place that they can earn someday. Some like to live every moment fretting over the past and worrying about the future.

While there are others who would give the shirt off their backs so that some one else has that shirt and does not go naked. Not to earn something but because they simple love their fellow man so much that they would rather give everything they have even their lives just so that their fellow mankind will not have to do without. And I guess some people like to live in the moment not fretting about the past and not hording for the future or worrying about every single mistake they make for fear of ending up in hell or obsessing over weather one is holy enough or not to merit heaven but a simple loving trust in God and and his fellow mankind that God has his back no matter what. For they have learned that God is found in the moment and His Kingdom is at hand and among us. If we would only choose to accept Him and Live in His Kingdom. Not fretting about the past or pinning away for the future. But simple loving trust of God and keeping ourselves in His Merciful Loving Peace. I know. It’s a struggle and a journey that so many spiritual masters have tried to teach us…and yet we are still controlled by so much of this world and ourselves that we spend our days fretting over weather or not we are going to heaven or hell because of this or that and yet we could just simply choose to be in heaven right now. Right in this moment! We should be living for today. For this moment. It is were we find God. Maybe when mankind finally learns to do this we will be as one Just as Jesus prayed we would be as one with Him as He is with the Father.

But I suppose some people just don’t want to live in peace of heart mind or soul. They prefer to be continually and eternally tormented and restless.
Yeah, maybe John Lennon was just a dreamer, but I am lead to believe he was more than just a dreamer, I am lead to believe he was just trying to help people see something he was beginning to grasp…imagine that…

 

[FollowChrist34]

Jesus is the face of love.
Lennon was having a laugh at Jesus.

And, as the face of love, Jesus forgave the people who spat on him and nailed him to a cross - and wished his followers to live and act by the same principles in order to gain eternal life.

Secondly, I would plea for a little perspective here on an artist who touched the lives of millions and was violently assassinated.

So how is the Christian to evaluate Lennon?

The Vatican weighs in:

Vatican forgives The Beatles for ‘bigger than Jesus’ comment
In a front page article the Vatican’s official newspaper L’Osservatore Romano, offers a glowing assessment of The Beatles’ achievements 40-years after they split, heralding their “beautiful melodies” and begging the question “what would pop music have been like without the Beatles?”

In an astonishing turnaround the Church dismisses previous moral outrages including blasphemous remarks, drug taking and even the dissemination of Satanic messages through their music.

While recognising that John, Paul, George and Ringo, were no saints during their time in The Beatles, the Vatican assures followers they were by no means the worst behaved rock and rollers of their generation.

Offering the band complete absolution, the article, entitled Seven Years That Shook Music, L’Osservatore Romano said: “Its true they took drugs, lived life to excess because of their success, even said they were bigger than Jesus and put out mysterious messages, that were possibly even Satanic.

“They may not have been the best example for the youth of the day but they were by no means the worst. Their beautiful melodies changed music and continue to give pleasure.”

It went on: “Forty years later the Beatles still astound with their originality and they are a
consolation against the continual assault on music lovers by the record industry.”

And referring to the band’s acrimonious split in April 1970, the article added: “Rather then expressing regret at their break up perhaps the question should be what would pop music have been like without the Beatles?”

The glowing praise may come as a surprise to many Catholics, given the band’s very public attacks on organised religion.

 

[philipl]

Yeah, maybe John Lennon was just a dreamer, but I am lead to believe he was more than just a dreamer, I am lead to believe he was just trying to help people see something he was beginning to grasp…imagine that…

He was also extremely rich, he didnt pratice what he preached, thats for sure.

 

[zz912]

I guess some people love being greedy while others are dying the slow agonizing death of starvation. I guess some thrive on the dog-eat-dog mentality that is so prevelent to our human nature. I guess some people like living in fear of hell and some people must like thinking heaven is a place that they can earn someday. Some like to live every moment fretting over the past and worrying about the future.

While there are others who would give the shirt off their backs so that some one else has that shirt and does not go naked. Not to earn something but because they simple love their fellow man so much that they would rather give everything they have even their lives just so that their fellow mankind will not have to do without. And I guess some people like to live in the moment not fretting about the past and not hording for the future or worrying about every single mistake they make for fear of ending up in hell or obsessing over weather one is holy enough or not to merit heaven but a simple loving trust in God and and his fellow mankind that God has his back no matter what. For they have learned that God is found in the moment and His Kingdom is at hand and among us. If we would only choose to accept Him and Live in His Kingdom. Not fretting about the past or pinning away for the future. But simple loving trust of God and keeping ourselves in His Merciful Loving Peace. I know. It’s a struggle and a journey that so many spiritual masters have tried to teach us…and yet we are still controlled by so much of this world and ourselves that we spend our days fretting over weather or not we are going to heaven or hell because of this or that and yet we could just simply choose to be in heaven right now. Right in this moment! We should be living for today. For this moment. It is were we find God. Maybe when mankind finally learns to do this we will be as one Just as Jesus prayed we would be as one with Him as He is with the Father. ������

But I suppose some people just don’t want to live in peace of heart mind or soul. They prefer to be continually and eternally tormented and restless.
Yeah, maybe John Lennon was just a dreamer, but I am lead to believe he was more than just a dreamer, I am lead to believe he was just trying to help people see something he was beginning to grasp…imagine that…

1. No, we shouldn’t be living for today. The Catholic faith teaches us to live for eternity.
2. We will never create utopia or “heaven on earth”. This is something God has revealed to us.
3. Peace only comes through God. Wishing away God (as Lennon was) will never lead to peace.
4. Caring for peoples’ material needs while ignoring the spiritual is a waste of time and actually harmful to them in the long run.

 

[simple_soul]

He was also extremely rich, he didnt pratice what he preached, thats for sure.

Never said he did. Doesn’t change what I said about the song. For all I know the song was about him realizing how he should be. Not how he was.

 

[simple_soul]

1. No, we shouldn’t be living for today. The Catholic faith teaches us to live for eternity.
2. We will never create utopia or “heaven on earth”. This is something God has revealed to us.
3. Peace only comes through God. Wishing away God (as Lennon was) will never lead to peace.
4. Caring for peoples’ material needs while ignoring the spiritual is a waste of time and actually harmful to them in the long run.

By this post of yours, you have made it very clear to me that you don’t want to even try to understand what I am saying or trying to say so…I’ll just leave it alone and wish you well on your journey home.

God’s Peace and His Blessings to you and yours on your journey to Him.

 

[LongingSoul]

1. No, we shouldn’t be living for today. The Catholic faith teaches us to live for eternity.

34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own. Matthew 6:34

1. We will never create utopia or “heaven on earth”. This is something God has revealed to us.

20 Once, on being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, Jesus replied, “The coming of the kingdom of God is not something that can be observed, 21 nor will people say, ‘Here it is,’ or ‘There it is,’ because the kingdom of God is in your midst.” Luke 17:21-22

1. Peace only comes through God. Wishing away God (as Lennon was) will never lead to peace.

5 “When you enter a house, first say, ‘Peace to this house.’ 6 If someone who promotes peace is there, your peace will rest on them; if not, it will return to you. Luke 10:5-6

1. Caring for peoples’ material needs while ignoring the spiritual is a waste of time and actually harmful to them in the long run.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’ Matt 25:34-40

 

[zz912]

34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own. Matthew 6:34

I said nothing about worry. I said living. I would refer you to Jesus’ comments about profit and gaining the whole world.

20 Once, on being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, Jesus replied, “The coming of the kingdom of God is not something that can be observed, 21 nor will people say, ‘Here it is,’ or ‘There it is,’ because the kingdom of God is in your midst.” Luke 17:21-22

You realize this actually makes my point, right? It’s not something that can be observed.

5 “When you enter a house, first say, ‘Peace to this house.’ 6 If someone who promotes peace is there, your peace will rest on them; if not, it will return to you. Luke 10:5-6

This has nothing whatsoever to do with what I wrote.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’ Matt 25:34-40

Did you misread my comment and think I was arguing against this teaching? Please find me where Jesus says to ONLY care for material needs.

 

[simple_soul]

I said nothing about worry. I said living. I would refer you to Jesus’ comments about profit and gaining the whole world.

The really sad thing is…this is exactly what I took the song Imagine to be saying. The song is like an anthem speaking against profiting and trying to gain the whole world.
And, from the little bit I do know of John Lennon, this seems to be exactly what he was trying to convey through his music.

And for some reason…you don’t see it…for whatever reason it may be… You don’t see it or don’t want to see it.