Joint Discussion between ATHEIST and CATHOLIC

[LogisticsBranch]

It’s known for certain that the mind does affect the brain and the brain affects the mind.

Hello inocente This is a really great website to explore:
International Mind, Brain and Education Society (IMBES)
*Our mission is to facilitate cross-cultural collaboration in biology, education and the cognitive and developmental sciences. As an organization, our objectives are to:

Improve the state of knowledge in and dialogue between education, biology, and the developmental and cognitive sciences;
Create and develop resources for scientists, practitioners, public policy makers, and the public; and
Create and identify useful information, research directions, and promising educational practices.*
imbes.org/

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Unable to prove it, but it stands to reason that atheism is rooted in materialism, or vice versa.

Scratch most atheists, you find a materialist. Scratch most materialists, you find an atheist.

Which comes first in consciousness is anybody’s guess.

Question:

Why do most atheists demand proof for the existence of God, but demand no proof whatever for the non-existence of God?

 

[Vic_Taltrees_UK]

God is more than an immaterial concept, since the impact of His interaction is experienced.

Abstracts are symbolised by specific material objects and vice versa, hence although I don’t understand what is meant by “empirical” I think the answer is yes.

As God works through peoples and landscapes, as I look into history and the beliefs of the peoples, over the ages, my faith is strengthened. I love to do so and have never been of the mindset described. My parents weren’t either.

 

[Nixbits]

Charlemagne III, I don’t agree with the assertion in your question. In my experience, most atheists would require proof, or at least compelling evidence, before accepting the existence of a god. They would equally require proof or compelling evidence before accepting that no gods exist.

For ‘soft’ atheists (those who do not believe in the existence of a god or gods, but make no assertion about gods not existing), evidence that gods do not exist is of less interest. Such evidence would require little or no change to their way of thinking. Evidence that a god or gods do exist, on the other hand, would require a very major shift in outlook.

Also, I would suggest that atheists are seldom confronted by people who base their opinions on the non-existence of gods. I don’t see much conflict on social or moral issues between soft atheists and hard atheists. The same cannot be said for some interactions between atheists and theists.

Question: Which single doctrine of the Catholic faith, or aspect of Catholic life perhaps, do you think has tipped most doubting theists over the edge to become atheist or agnostic?

 

[ynotzap]

Charlemagne III, I don’t agree with the assertion in your question. In my experience, most atheists would require proof, or at least compelling evidence, before accepting the existence of a god. They would equally require proof or compelling evidence before accepting that no gods exist.

For ‘soft’ atheists (those who do not believe in the existence of a god or gods, but make no assertion about gods not existing), evidence that gods do not exist is of less interest. Such evidence would require little or no change to their way of thinking. Evidence that a god or gods do exist, on the other hand, would require a very major shift in outlook.

Also, I would suggest that atheists are seldom confronted by people who base their opinions on the non-existence of gods. I don’t see much conflict on social or moral issues between soft atheists and hard atheists. The same cannot be said for some interactions between atheists and theists.

Question: Which single doctrine of the Catholic faith, or aspect of Catholic life perhaps, do you think has tipped most doubting theists over the edge to become atheist or agnostic?

Belief that Jesus Christ is God-man, and His ways seem so repugnant to the present condition of human nature, it seems so contrary to our dispositions for happiness and pleasures, so contrary to our expectations, His ways are not our ways.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Question: Which single doctrine of the Catholic faith, or aspect of Catholic life perhaps, do you think has tipped most doubting theists over the edge to become atheist or agnostic?

The Catholic doctrine that we are accountable to God for our morals.

Rampant egotism, the desire to be in charge and accountable to no one but one’s self, naturally leads to atheism/agnosticism.

Question:

Which single aspect of atheism do you think has tipped most atheists over the edge to
become Christians?

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Charlemagne III, I don’t agree with the assertion in your question. In my experience, most atheists would require proof, or at least compelling evidence, before accepting the existence of a god. They would equally require proof or compelling evidence before accepting that no gods exist.

I don’t agree with this at all. When I was an atheist it never even occurred to me that I needed proof that there is no God. I think this is true of most atheists, and I have rarely found an atheist who has even begun to look for such proof.

 

[ynotzap]

Charlemagne III, I don’t agree with the assertion in your question. In my experience, most atheists would require proof, or at least compelling evidence, before accepting the existence of a god. They would equally require proof or compelling evidence before accepting that no gods exist.

Proof that God exists is within the reach of a mind that is open, a mind that desires to know the truth. But it may not be disposed to knowing the truth, if it implies undesirable obligations, or interferes with one’s life style which blinds one to the truth. If this is the case the mind is closed. But even an atheist has a conscience that is aware of some truth, and this can cause a certain amount of doubt as to whether God exists or not, and if he can find evidence that God does not exist, this would ease his conscience. Of course this will never happen. He may experience that there is something missing in his life, or he may continue to live a dissipated life

 

[Nixbits]

It’s notoriously difficult to ‘prove’, or even find compelling evidence for, a negative assertion. I agree that not many atheists will have searched for evidence that no gods exist. But that’s hardly surprising. What sort of evidence would that be?

It’s precisely because evidence for no gods existing is so unlikely to be found, and so most atheists have not searched for it, that many atheists, if questioned closely, do not assert that they believe that no gods exist. This is what is sometimes referred to as ‘soft atheism’.

Question: Which single aspect of atheism do you think has tipped most atheists over the edge to become Christians?

Fear of death being the end.

 

[inocente]

Hello inocente This is a really great website to explore:
International Mind, Brain and Education Society (IMBES)
*Our mission is to facilitate cross-cultural collaboration in biology, education and the cognitive and developmental sciences. As an organization, our objectives are to:

Improve the state of knowledge in and dialogue between education, biology, and the developmental and cognitive sciences;
Create and develop resources for scientists, practitioners, public policy makers, and the public; and
Create and identify useful information, research directions, and promising educational practices.*
imbes.org/

Hi, long time no speak. Thanks . You may enjoy watching this, it’s a really cool research project - bbc.com/future/story/20141111-the-code-that-may-treat-blindness

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

Question:

Which single aspect of atheism do you think has tipped most atheists over the edge to
become Christians?

The desire for negative experiences to mean something. Death of friends, family, bad things happening to good people, and one’s own mortality. To say we live and then we die and face away is not a suitable answer for many.

Question to Christians:

Do you honestly feel that your belief that God is always watching makes you a moral* or kind person? Would it change if He wasn’t watching?

*moral as in being honest, fair, and considerate. Not lying, stealing, cheating, etc when able.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Fear of death being the end.

I agree with this. It is better to hope for something than to be resigned to nothing.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Do you honestly feel that your belief that God is always watching makes you a moral* or kind person? Would it change if He wasn’t watching?

If God isn’t watching what is God doing? It’s not possible to believe God isn’t watching.

Do you believe that if there is no God nobody is watching, there are no ultimate consequences to your acts, and you are therefore free to get away with whatever you can get away with?

 

[ynotzap]

The desire for negative experiences to mean something. Death of friends, family, bad things happening to good people, and one’s own mortality. To say we live and then we die and face away is not a suitable answer for many.

Question to Christians:

Do you honestly feel that your belief that God is always watching makes you a moral* or kind person? Would it change if He wasn’t watching?

*moral as in being honest, fair, and considerate. Not lying, stealing, cheating, etc when able.

A negative reason is not a good reason, but it is a reason (fear of death) and the unknown.
A greater reason would be to consider the possibility of continuing to exist eternally and that you blew all the chances for happier existence and possibly reap a life of eternal loneliness, unfulfillment, and despair.

Question for atheists:
Do you really think that people who believe in life after death, and Heaven are completely out of touch with reality? Did you bring yourself into existence?

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

Do you believe that if there is no God nobody is watching, there are no ultimate consequences to your acts, and you are therefore free to get away with whatever you can get away with?

Depends. For example a sociopath who commits evil acts yet evades detection, probably.

For most everyone else, no. I believe that guilt, shame, etc will follow most people and are part of our internal moral compass if you will. However, I’ve heard many believers state that without God there is no reason to be good or even a way to determine good.

They phrase it as if they would be immoral if there was no ultimate consequence.

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

Question for atheists:
Do you really think that people who believe in life after death, and Heaven are completely out of touch with reality?

No, because what you refer to is outside of the reality I can sense. I consider it unknowable, hence faith.

Did you bring yourself into existence?

No. As to who, what, or how that works my answer is simply “I don’t know.”. I enjoy my existence more so then attempting to figure out it’s origin.

 

[ynotzap]

No, because what you refer to is outside of the reality I can sense. I consider it unknowable, hence faith.

No. As to who, what, or how that works my answer is simply “I don’t know.”. I enjoy my existence more so then attempting to figure out it’s origin.

Is there anything in your life that you can’t sense, but you know is real Do you believe that life after death can be reasoned outside of faith? Or is it that you do not desire to know?

Question to atheists: Is it that it is possible that you can reason to God’s existence but that you do not desire to do so? Or just ignore the challenge and see no importance in doing so.

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

Question to atheists: Is it that it is possible that you can reason to God’s existence but that you do not desire to do so? Or just ignore the challenge and see no importance in doing so.

I don’t speak for other atheists, but there could be a God almost as much as most other explanations. I believe one believes our spent believe as I’ve attempted various things in the past to believe.

For a long time I simply ignored the challenge as there was no perceivable downside for most of my adult life. I tried to be open to God for a while but I can not make myself believe just as I suspect you couldn’t make yourself not believe.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

For most everyone else, no. I believe that guilt, shame, etc will follow most people and are part of our internal moral compass if you will. However, I’ve heard many believers state that without God there is no reason to be good or even a way to determine good.

They phrase it as if they would be immoral if there was no ultimate consequence.

The Marquis de Sade was a deeply immoral person who tied his immorality to his atheism. That is, he fully expected to die without any fear of eternal consequences for his evil life. He encouraged others to think the same way.

 

[ynotzap]

I don’t speak for other atheists, but there could be a God almost as much as most other explanations. I believe one believes our spent believe as I’ve attempted various things in the past to believe.

For a long time I simply ignored the challenge as there was no perceivable downside for most of my adult life. I tried to be open to God for a while but I can not make myself believe just as I suspect you couldn’t make yourself not believe.

You will never make yourself believe, you will be frustrated inevitably. Christian Faith is a gift, a supernatural one. It comes only from Jesus Christ, God-man. One must have an encounter with Him and receive His Spirit. Then Faith will become real, and fruitful You and I were created to be united to God forever, even in this life. Once this is experienced, one’s life will change for the best with God’s blessings. My beliefs have been confirmed for me, and if I denied them, I would be a liar, not true to myself. I am thankful to God for this great gift of Truth and love.