JPII now baptised by proxy by LDS

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non-Christians who seek god. Of course it’s broad. There are so many “what ifs”. “following your conscience” isn’t enough either.
seek God with a sincere heart and, moved by grace, try to do His will as they know it through the dictates of conscience there’s a little more to it and God has to be involved for salvation to occur.
 
And of course, anyone who is saved under any of those categories is saved only through- and because of- the perfect once-for-all sacrifice of Jesus on the cross.
God bless,
Paul
 
And under which category would the people to whom the Bible refers to as “Heathen Nations” fall under, would it be unbaptized infants or non-Christians who seek God? I am having trouble with that last category. It seems to me to say that anyone who is following their conscience (with the notable exceptions mentioned) can be saved without baptism but that’s a pretty broad category.
Cardinal Arinze, president of the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue at the Vatican, offered reflections on how the Church sees herself and other religions, and “whether a friendly attitude towards other religions undermines the necessity of preaching Jesus Christ or puts Catholic identity at risk.”

“With reference to other religions, the Church sees a great difference between them and herself,” Cardinal Arinze said. “The other religions are expressions of the human soul seeking God, with some beautiful spiritual insights, but also not without errors. Christianity is rather God seeking humanity.” Noting that “Vatican II declares the Church … as necessary for salvation,” the former bishop of Onitsha, Nigeria, added that people who do not know Christ are nevertheless included in God’s plan of salvation.

“There are, however, conditions. They must be sincere in their seeking of God. They must be open to the secret but real action of the Holy Spirit in them. They should follow their conscience in all matters of right and wrong.” A human’s religious response to God should be free, he said, a principle the Church has not always respected. But he also said, “To say that every individual has the right to religious freedom is not to condone religious indifferentism or irresponsibility, nor is it to promote the installation of a supermarket of religions.”

To say that there is no salvation outside the Catholic faith should not be interpretted so strictly as to be limited to the visible institution. Rather, to the extent that the Holy Spirit works invisibly throughout the whole world to bring people to faith in Christ through Catholicism, the Church should be understood to extend much farther into the world than most non-Catholics would be willing to admit-- or even perceive for that matter.

In short, it must be stressed that the Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in other religions. The church has a high regard for their conduct in so far as she believes the Spirit is moving them according to the Lord’s will and calling them back to the Catholic faith.

For example, theologians have noted similarities in primitive beliefs in an All-Powerful God. On the subject of human religion, some scholars have claimed that human history exhibits an evolution in religion – from tribal gods to monotheism. These results, however, have been largely turned on their head.

Contrary to this ‘evolutionary’ position, the lifetime work of Wilhelm Schmidt (published in his Origin and Growth of Religion: English Ed. 1931) found that, thoughout the world, primitive cultures have a notion of a supreme god. This god has the following characteristics - remarkably uniformly across the world:
He lives in, or above, the sky – anthropologists refer to him as the “Sky-God”, although the name the peoples have for him is more commonly one meaning “Father” or “Creator”.
He is like a man, or a father.
However his form cannot be physically represented, and so there are almost never idols of him.
He is the creator of everything.
He is eternal (i.e. He existed before anything else, and He will never cease to be).
He is all-knowing.
All that is good ultimately comes from him.
He is the giver of moral law.
He is good, and abhors all evil.
He is all-powerful.
He judges people after their death.
People are alienated from him due to some misdemeanor in the past.
In tracing human history, it is generally believed that the primal knowledge of the Lord was often supplanted in religions by concepts of gods which are “more accessible.” In doing such, the gradual monotheistic knowledge of a monotheistic God seems to deteriorate into a pantheon of divinities whose attirbutes seems to be defined more by nature and/or human characteristics…or else lost entirely within atheism.
 
To say that there is no salvation outside the Catholic faith should not be interpretted so strictly as to be limited to the visible institution. Rather, to the extent that the Holy Spirit works invisibly throughout the whole world to bring people to faith in Christ through Catholicism, the Church should be understood to extend much farther into the world than most non-Catholics would be willing to admit-- or even perceive for that matter.
That makes sense and seems fair to me. And it seems to follow the verses from Romans 2:
14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
But there is the problem about the ordinance of baptism and that by the proper authority. I don’t want to push John 3:5 too far, (I’m not a Born-Again), this was a saying given to a believing people. If you don’t accept baptism for the dead, maybe it’s just one of those unknown things.
 
That makes sense and seems fair to me. And it seems to follow the verses from Romans 2:

But there is the problem about the ordinance of baptism and that by the proper authority. I don’t want to push John 3:5 too far, (I’m not a Born-Again), this was a saying given to a believing people. If you don’t accept baptism for the dead, maybe it’s just one of those unknown things.
But we as Catholics do beleive in a baptism of desire and a baptism of fire so to speak, as majick275 pointed out above.

To some extent that people are judged at the moment of death, I do think that the Lord can baptise them so to speak. But I don’t see anything where the church herself is enabled to baptise dead people. Praying for the dead is one thing. Baptising them from beyond the grave is entirely another thing-- and if it’s possible this seems to me a work that only Christ himself could do.

Interestingly, regardless of how one takes the idea of ‘baptising for the dead’, it seems clear to me that this discussion at least points towards the early churches belief in a purgation of the dead.

I’ll have to take another look at these passages.

Does anyone know if any of the Church fathers spoke about these passages in question?
 
Oaths sworn in blasphemous ceremonies have NO validity. One is bound in conscience to repudiate them.
In several threads about LDSers I have noticed many have referred to these “oaths” that were sworn… What kind of oaths do LDS members take that seem to greatly offend presently practicing LDSers so deeply? Just curious and I am sorry… probably way off topic of this thread.

Peace be with you all,

Regis University Student
 
I think I need to back up almost all the way. I was going to say something about baptism representing a change of heart and even though every knee shall bow and all tongues confess Jesus is the Christ, there still will be people who will not accept the gospel. Hence the necessity of baptism. But aren’t I off base in a Catholic forum where infant baptism is practised? I probably need a link to some very basics facts about baptism. Pretty please?
 
In several threads about LDSers I have noticed many have referred to these “oaths” that were sworn… What kind of oaths do LDS members take that seem to greatly offend presently practicing LDSers so deeply? Just curious and I am sorry… probably way off topic of this thread.

Peace be with you all,

Regis University Student
If oyu go back on this thread you can find some links to the “oaths” in question…hope that helps:)
 
I think I need to back up almost all the way. I was going to say something about baptism representing a change of heart and even though every knee shall bow and all tongues confess Jesus is the Christ, there still will be people who will not accept the gospel. Hence the necessity of baptism. But aren’t I off base in a Catholic forum where infant baptism is practised? I probably need a link to some very basics facts about baptism. Pretty please?
Here are some…hope they help.
catholic.com/library/Infant_Baptism.asp
catholic.com/library/Early_Teachings_of_Infant_Baptism.asp
catholic.com/library/Baptism_Immersion_Only.asp
catholic.com/library/Baptismal_Grace.asp
catholic.com/library/Necessity_of_Baptism.asp
catholic.com/library/Trinitarian_Baptism.asp
 
If oyu go back on this thread you can find some links to the “oaths” in question…hope that helps:)
Thank you very much Karin! I will check it out,

Peace be With You All,

Regis University Student
 
It would seem that the LDS has also baptised HITLER…wonder if he is a God yet:rolleyes:
You are sooooo wrong about Hitler, that was a really mean thing to say. Just because you don’t understand something, don’t dig up untruths to say about the thing you don’t understand. I think it is a very nice thing they are doing and for all the best reasons(Love and concern for all God’s Children) It is a sincere belief and it was practised in the early days of the church. The Bible tells us, yes even our Catholic Scriptures, that Jesus Christ came up out of the water after His baptism, so if they still believe in baptism by emersion as Jesus showed then what harm is it to make sure everyone who ever lived is baptized correctly? We pray for the souls of persons not of our faith and I hope we do it out of love and concern, not to be mean and spiteful. Besides if we don’t believe it is of value why should we care who they baptize.
My wife has done all my genealogy and found that I have LDS relatives who have had all of my Great-great and further back grandparents baptized and their childfen all sealed to them for eternity. I suppose if I pass away before my wife does she will do the same for me. It does not affend me in the least. It does not hurt and I don’t think it hurt my relatives, I am the only one who is Catholic as most of them were protestants. I am Catholic because I was taken to a Catholic Orphanage when I was 6 years old. It is a good thing to love each other and if our belief is so strong of course it is only natural to want to make sure everyone has the chance to make it to Heaven and to have their children and parents and all of their families together after death.
It is a beautiful concept and who actually knows until we die what heaven is like? Has anyone come back to tell us? I hope the Hitler remark was tongue in cheek. That was just like someone of other faiths saying we worship Mary, only worse.
Have a little courtesy and tolerance for other religions.
Grandpa Don
Grandpa D
 
Those were really good links, I think I can actually understand how different the Catholic & Protestant point of views are from reading those.

Of course, I’m going to tick you off again by telling you how similar the Mormon & Catholic churches are but for anyone else reading this post, it’s actually pretty interesting.

The Baptismal Grace link points out that the Protestant POV (point of view) is the baptism is an ordinance and represent a “change in heart”. The Catholic POV is that is a sacrament that infuses grace. The Mormon POV sits neatly between those two: baptism is always followed by another ordinance, confering the Gift of the Holy Ghost.

The Trinitarian Baptism points out the baptism must be in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost and claims that only the Catholic church does that. The words for a Mormon baptism are as follows:
The person who is called of God and has authority from Jesus Christ to baptize, shall go down into the water with the person who has presented himself or herself for baptism, and shall say, calling him or her by name: Having been commissioned of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.
 
You are sooooo wrong about Hitler, that was a really mean thing to say. Just because you don’t understand something, don’t dig up untruths to say about the thing you don’t understand. I think it is a very nice thing they are doing and for all the best reasons(Love and concern for all God’s Children) It is a sincere belief and it was practised in the early days of the church. The Bible tells us, yes even our Catholic Scriptures, that Jesus Christ came up out of the water after His baptism, so if they still believe in baptism by emersion as Jesus showed then what harm is it to make sure everyone who ever lived is baptized correctly? We pray for the souls of persons not of our faith and I hope we do it out of love and concern, not to be mean and spiteful. Besides if we don’t believe it is of value why should we care who they baptize.
My wife has done all my genealogy and found that I have LDS relatives who have had all of my Great-great and further back grandparents baptized and their childfen all sealed to them for eternity. I suppose if I pass away before my wife does she will do the same for me. It does not affend me in the least. It does not hurt and I don’t think it hurt my relatives, I am the only one who is Catholic as most of them were protestants. I am Catholic because I was taken to a Catholic Orphanage when I was 6 years old. It is a good thing to love each other and if our belief is so strong of course it is only natural to want to make sure everyone has the chance to make it to Heaven and to have their children and parents and all of their families together after death.
It is a beautiful concept and who actually knows until we die what heaven is like? Has anyone come back to tell us? I hope the Hitler remark was tongue in cheek. That was just like someone of other faiths saying we worship Mary, only worse.
Have a little courtesy and tolerance for other religions.
Grandpa Don
Grandpa D
Not tongue in cheek at all Grandpa D…the LDS have baptised Hitler and many other Nazi criminals.
as to understanding…there is nothing to understand…baptism of the dead is not supported by anything other than the skewed LDS doctrines:)
I really suggest you read up on what the LDS believe and practice…and then you tell me as a Catholic that you agree with what they are doing!
 
The Trinitarian Baptism points out the baptism must be in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost and claims that only the Catholic church does that. The words for a Mormon baptism are as follows:
*The baptism of the Mormons is not recognized as a valid baptism for a number of reasons. One of those reasons concerns the Mormon definition of the Trinity.

In the administration of the Sacrament of Baptism, a specific formula must be used as commanded by the Fourth Lateran Council. Those words are. “Being commissioned by Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.”

The formula applied by the Mormons might appear to be a Trinitarian formula. But in reality, while the formula of the Mormons is similar to the formula of the Catholic faith, there is no fundamental doctrinal agreement in its application. The Mormon invocation of the Trinity is not a true invocation of the Trinity because the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, according to them, are not three persons in which subsists the one Godhead, but three gods who form one divinity.

The Mormons believe that the divinity originated when three gods decided to unite and form the divinity in order to bring about human salvation. Furthermore, the Mormons believe that God the Father is an exalted man, a native from another planet, who has acquired his divine status through a death similar to that of human beings, this being a necessary way of becoming divine. God the Father has relatives and this is explained by the doctrine of infinite regression of the gods who initially were mortal. God the Father has a wife, the Heavenly Mother, with whom he shared the responsibility of creation. They procreated sons in the spiritual world. Their firstborn was Jesus Christ, equal to all men, who acquired his divinity in a pre-mortal existence. Even the Holy Spirit was the son of heavenly parents. The Son and the Holy Spirit were procreated after the beginning of the creation of the world known to mankind. Four gods were directly responsible for the universe, three of whom established a covenant and therefore formed the divinity.

As can be appreciated, the Mormon baptism does not in any way contain the doctrinal belief that is associated with the Christian doctrine of the Trinity. The words, “Father, Son and Holy Spirit,” have for the Mormons, a totally different meaning than that of the Christian faiths.

While this is only one reason, that being sufficient to affirm that the Mormon baptism is not valid, there are other reasons. Over and above the Mormon belief that there is no real Trinity, the Mormons do not believe in original sin, nor that Christ instituted baptism. Based on this, those who believe that they were baptized in the Mormon religion, must be baptized in the Catholic faith upon their conversion because they were never validly baptized as commanded by Jesus and taught by the Catholic faith.

This conclusion was handed down to the Catholic Church by The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in July, 2001.*
SOURCE
 
You are sooooo wrong about Hitler, that was a really mean thing to say. Just because you don’t understand something, don’t dig up untruths to say about the thing you don’t understand. I think it is a very nice thing they are doing and for all the best reasons(Love and concern for all God’s Children) It is a sincere belief and it was practised in the early days of the church. The Bible tells us, yes even our Catholic Scriptures, that Jesus Christ came up out of the water after His baptism, so if they still believe in baptism by emersion as Jesus showed then what harm is it to make sure everyone who ever lived is baptized correctly? We pray for the souls of persons not of our faith and I hope we do it out of love and concern, not to be mean and spiteful. Besides if we don’t believe it is of value why should we care who they baptize.
My wife has done all my genealogy and found that I have LDS relatives who have had all of my Great-great and further back grandparents baptized and their childfen all sealed to them for eternity. I suppose if I pass away before my wife does she will do the same for me. It does not affend me in the least. It does not hurt and I don’t think it hurt my relatives, I am the only one who is Catholic as most of them were protestants. I am Catholic because I was taken to a Catholic Orphanage when I was 6 years old. It is a good thing to love each other and if our belief is so strong of course it is only natural to want to make sure everyone has the chance to make it to Heaven and to have their children and parents and all of their families together after death.
It is a beautiful concept and who actually knows until we die what heaven is like? Has anyone come back to tell us? I hope the Hitler remark was tongue in cheek. That was just like someone of other faiths saying we worship Mary, only worse.
Have a little courtesy and tolerance for other religions.
Grandpa Don
Grandpa D
Well I wish we could do as you request Grandpa. But them’s the facts mam. LDS did baptise Hitler. It is in the computer. Sorry.
 
Oh, yeah…Sure, I can see it all now…There JP2 is, in Heaven with the Lord, & Mormons are going to offer him–what?? :rolleyes:
On the contrary! It is the faithful who the most offended, because the implication is that Mormons are the arbiters of everyone’s salvation. Which is, by the by, blasphemous.
No thank you. Why go through some nonsensical ceremony that is :whacky: enough when done by people who actually believe in it…

Really?? Really??? OK, Joseph Smith was no prophet, at all. !I reject Joseph Smith, the devil, & all his works.
His “message” was a piece of fiction that doesn’t even come up to L Ron Hubbard standards. He was a liar, a fraud, & a con man, and of dubious morals besides.

Does that mean you guys are going to stop tracking in mud on my porch, & bugging me to buy your books??*** Please***???

Sheeesh!!! Get a grip on yourself, Z. You are not going to find any takers. Not around these parts!!

I find it strange that you are so riled up by something that does not effect you one way or the other. In my experience with the missionaries coming to the door, they have been very polite and have never bugged me to buy a book, they give them away for free, if you want one. Although I have politely asked them not to come anymore, I am amazed that these young men spend two years at an age when most young men are doing drugs, drinking excessively and generally raising havoc among society. I am amazed at their faith, their ability to pray from the heart and preach from the heart. Their knowledge of the scriptures is to be envied by any religion. I saw them in Italy (I lived there for 20 years) two by two going around speaking fluent Italian. They were very well respected and received where ever they went. It is amazing that in only 176 short years there are 125 Temples and more being built worldwide and almost 13 million members of the LDS church. My wife has baptized my mother, father, grandparents and is still diligently working on the genealogy of myself and all my family and even some of our friends who have asked her to research their ancestors. She goes to the Temple at least one day a week and is up at an early hour doing the work, so that the dead who have never heard the gospel of Jesus Christ have the same chance as those of us who have heard it to be redeemed and go to heaven. There is no one left out except the ones who have committed unpardonable sins. Such as Hitler.
I threw that in because earlier in this thread it was mentioned that the writer thought that Hitler was right up there with the Pope in being one of those baptized by the LDS. I have only observed my wife in action and I know she prays about everything several times a day and is only interested in giving all souls the opportunity that they never had on earth to accept or not to accept baptism and the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I have no intention of joining the LDS, but have attended many times and also see a great resemblance in their beliefs and ours. One of the great differences is the pomp and circumstance that we have with robes and statues etc. where their buildings are very clean and simple and not ornate at all. And their services are conducted by laypersons, the Bishop in my wife’s ward is an insurance man, and donates his time to the church. My step-son’s Bishop is an emergency room doctor and comes from an all night shift to church without sleeping. Although I don’t believe the teachings, I do respect their dedication and love for the gospel and one another. When I was paralyzed by brain surgery, they came and built ramps for my wheelchair all at no charge, their help and concern has been a great support to me and my wife through this trial of our lives. I am impressed with all they do for others and they definitely are organized and inspired to give service where it is needed.
We need more citizens like the LDS in the world to set an example for the rest of us who have lost the concept of Love thy Neighbor.
Grandpa Don
 
I find it strange that you are so riled up by something that does not effect you one way or the other. In my experience with the missionaries coming to the door, they have been very polite and have never bugged me to buy a book, they give them away for free, if you want one. Although I have politely asked them not to come anymore, I am amazed that these young men spend two years at an age when most young men are doing drugs, drinking excessively and generally raising havoc among society. I am amazed at their faith, their ability to pray from the heart and preach from the heart. Their knowledge of the scriptures is to be envied by any religion. I saw them in Italy (I lived there for 20 years) two by two going around speaking fluent Italian. They were very well respected and received where ever they went. It is amazing that in only 176 short years there are 125 Temples and more being built worldwide and almost 13 million members of the LDS church. My wife has baptized my mother, father, grandparents and is still diligently working on the genealogy of myself and all my family and even some of our friends who have asked her to research their ancestors. She goes to the Temple at least one day a week and is up at an early hour doing the work, so that the dead who have never heard the gospel of Jesus Christ have the same chance as those of us who have heard it to be redeemed and go to heaven. There is no one left out except the ones who have committed unpardonable sins. Such as Hitler.
I threw that in because earlier in this thread it was mentioned that the writer thought that Hitler was right up there with the Pope in being one of those baptized by the LDS. I have only observed my wife in action and I know she prays about everything several times a day and is only interested in giving all souls the opportunity that they never had on earth to accept or not to accept baptism and the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I have no intention of joining the LDS, but have attended many times and also see a great resemblance in their beliefs and ours. One of the great differences is the pomp and circumstance that we have with robes and statues etc. where their buildings are very clean and simple and not ornate at all. And their services are conducted by laypersons, the Bishop in my wife’s ward is an insurance man, and donates his time to the church. My step-son’s Bishop is an emergency room doctor and comes from an all night shift to church without sleeping. Although I don’t believe the teachings, I do respect their dedication and love for the gospel and one another. When I was paralyzed by brain surgery, they came and built ramps for my wheelchair all at no charge, their help and concern has been a great support to me and my wife through this trial of our lives. I am impressed with all they do for others and they definitely are organized and inspired to give service where it is needed.
We need more citizens like the LDS in the world to set an example for the rest of us who have lost the concept of Love thy Neighbor.
Grandpa Don
I’ll pray for you Grandpa. You are in trouble.
 
I find it strange that you are so riled up by something that does not effect you one way or the other. In my experience with the missionaries coming to the door, they have been very polite and have never bugged me to buy a book, they give them away for free, if you want one. Although I have politely asked them not to come anymore, I am amazed that these young men spend two years at an age when most young men are doing drugs, drinking excessively and generally raising havoc among society. I am amazed at their faith, their ability to pray from the heart and preach from the heart. Their knowledge of the scriptures is to be envied by any religion. I saw them in Italy (I lived there for 20 years) two by two going around speaking fluent Italian. They were very well respected and received where ever they went. It is amazing that in only 176 short years there are 125 Temples and more being built worldwide and almost 13 million members of the LDS church. My wife has baptized my mother, father, grandparents and is still diligently working on the genealogy of myself and all my family and even some of our friends who have asked her to research their ancestors. She goes to the Temple at least one day a week and is up at an early hour doing the work, so that the dead who have never heard the gospel of Jesus Christ have the same chance as those of us who have heard it to be redeemed and go to heaven. There is no one left out except the ones who have committed unpardonable sins. Such as Hitler.
I threw that in because earlier in this thread it was mentioned that the writer thought that Hitler was right up there with the Pope in being one of those baptized by the LDS. I have only observed my wife in action and I know she prays about everything several times a day and is only interested in giving all souls the opportunity that they never had on earth to accept or not to accept baptism and the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I have no intention of joining the LDS, but have attended many times and also see a great resemblance in their beliefs and ours. One of the great differences is the pomp and circumstance that we have with robes and statues etc. where their buildings are very clean and simple and not ornate at all. And their services are conducted by laypersons, the Bishop in my wife’s ward is an insurance man, and donates his time to the church. My step-son’s Bishop is an emergency room doctor and comes from an all night shift to church without sleeping. Although I don’t believe the teachings, I do respect their dedication and love for the gospel and one another. When I was paralyzed by brain surgery, they came and built ramps for my wheelchair all at no charge, their help and concern has been a great support to me and my wife through this trial of our lives. I am impressed with all they do for others and they definitely are organized and inspired to give service where it is needed.
We need more citizens like the LDS in the world to set an example for the rest of us who have lost the concept of Love thy Neighbor.
Grandpa Don
Oh boy…there are so many fallacies in your post that it is really laughable…I am sorry that you have been hoodwinked by the LDS cult…I keep you in my prayers!
May I also suggest that you really research what the LDS believe and preach…because what your wife has you believing that they do is not ACCURATE!
 
I find it strange that you are so riled up by something that does not effect you one way or the other. In my experience with the missionaries coming to the door, they have been very polite and have never bugged me to buy a book, they give them away for free, if you want one. Although I have politely asked them not to come anymore, I am amazed that these young men spend two years at an age when most young men are doing drugs, drinking excessively and generally raising havoc among society. I am amazed at their faith, their ability to pray from the heart and preach from the heart. Their knowledge of the scriptures is to be envied by any religion. I saw them in Italy (I lived there for 20 years) two by two going around speaking fluent Italian. They were very well respected and received where ever they went. It is amazing that in only 176 short years there are 125 Temples and more being built worldwide and almost 13 million members of the LDS church. My wife has baptized my mother, father, grandparents and is still diligently working on the genealogy of myself and all my family and even some of our friends who have asked her to research their ancestors. She goes to the Temple at least one day a week and is up at an early hour doing the work, so that the dead who have never heard the gospel of Jesus Christ have the same chance as those of us who have heard it to be redeemed and go to heaven. There is no one left out except the ones who have committed unpardonable sins. Such as Hitler.
I threw that in because earlier in this thread it was mentioned that the writer thought that Hitler was right up there with the Pope in being one of those baptized by the LDS. I have only observed my wife in action and I know she prays about everything several times a day and is only interested in giving all souls the opportunity that they never had on earth to accept or not to accept baptism and the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I have no intention of joining the LDS, but have attended many times and also see a great resemblance in their beliefs and ours. One of the great differences is the pomp and circumstance that we have with robes and statues etc. where their buildings are very clean and simple and not ornate at all. And their services are conducted by laypersons, the Bishop in my wife’s ward is an insurance man, and donates his time to the church. My step-son’s Bishop is an emergency room doctor and comes from an all night shift to church without sleeping. Although I don’t believe the teachings, I do respect their dedication and love for the gospel and one another. When I was paralyzed by brain surgery, they came and built ramps for my wheelchair all at no charge, their help and concern has been a great support to me and my wife through this trial of our lives. I am impressed with all they do for others and they definitely are organized and inspired to give service where it is needed.
We need more citizens like the LDS in the world to set an example for the rest of us who have lost the concept of Love thy Neighbor.
Grandpa Don
Yeah…I REALLY loved the chairty mormons showed my teenaged son when he couldn’t play basketball because his mormon coach said he didn’t try hard enough. (But my son being very observant noticed he attended practice twice as much as the mormon players who started the games and finished the games.) Mormons take care of their own, and as long as you present the image that you like mormons and could possibly join, they’ll build you every ramp in the world. It’s nice they did that for you, but I guarantee that their charity exists as long as you are one of them. Of course, I only talk about my personal experience with them while I lived in Utah. Mormons are highly prejudicial…

The one good thing I can say about Mormons is that may of their societal values are decent, and for that, I won’t complain.

SG
 
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